craftsman1412

Should we accept this door?!

Craftsman Lover
July 10, 2019

Our kitchen door got installed and we weren’t impressed with the detail work. It’s a true divided light door and you can see the inconsistency in the adhesive behind the grids.. the black/white contrast make it even more noticeable. Our door company already replaced it once and the second door is even worse (see pics below). Now they are saying this is actually normal for true divided light window panes and it wouldn’t have been an issue if we just ordered the simulated light. We think there was lack of attention to detail and they just don’t want to deal with it anymore. We can’t fix these inconsistencies since they are between the glass so we will have to live with this forever. The door cost over $4,000!!

Is this normal and are we being nit picky or should we push back??? The door company is offering their painter to finish the door. But that won’t fix the problem between the panes which is what really bug us.

Comments (36)

  • Anne Duke

    Just no. Do not accept at any price. That would really irritate me too.

  • PRO
    Windows on Washington Ltd

    What is folded down in this case to create that look? Is that glazing tape messed up or is that in the actual frame of the door.

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  • scottie mom

    It’s hard to see what’s going on because of the reflections (love that tile floor, btw!!) It looks like an SDL not TDL, and the spacer bar is silver. But I can’t see it very well. Can you try pics in different light and from a different angle?

    Do you have a copy of the door order?

  • PRO
    A1 handy pros llc

    I would not accept it.


  • Shannon_WI

    Better photos please without all the reflection. You also must live in a very safe neighborhood and have no fear of break-ins, lucky you!

  • zmith

    That looks like drips of the paint or primer on the backside of the pieces that trim out each lite (don't know the technical word for them). The trim should have been painted on the front and back.

  • Chessie

    No way. That looks awful.

  • Windowmaster

    What is the door brand ?

    most higher end doors come with a pre finished interior/ exterior as well as a pre finished jamb. This paint/ stain process is MUCH bettervthan having a contractor or painter do it.

    if its inside the glass and it is an “ actual issues”, the door manufacturer can change out the glass. That would NOT be the fault of the installer.

    there was also some detailed trim work involved which more than justified the price which is actually on the lower end of the spectrum for that kind of work believe it or not. Thats a $5000 job with that kind of door unless it was bought at lowes or home depot.

  • nidnay

    No way would I accept that (and not at $4000). There are plenty of manufacturers out there who make doors. After two tries, I would get a refund and find a different manufacturer.

  • Craftsman Lover

    Thanks for the advice! We are waiting to hear back from the rep. The door manufacturer is Rogue Valley. Here’s a few more pictures in day light.

  • nidnay

    Just as a FYI, I have simulated divided light doors that also have the black sealant, and they are all nice and even with no dips and defects like you have in your photos. I find it hard to believe though that on a $4000 true divided light door one would expect an inferior product. Makes no sense. If you cannot get any satisfaction from your door rep, I would call the manufacturer directly and also send them pics of this defect.

  • Newhome2018

    Why in the world does that door cost $4,000?????????

  • Craftsman Lover

    Our eyes popped out when it came to over $4,000 too. We did opt for their premium solid wood door with true divided light. It’s actually very sturdy - just the detail work that we weren’t impressed with.

    Yes, we are sure it is not the exterior paint. Well, they primed both sides of the front and back of the grids. What you are seeing is the black adhesive not covering the entire back of the grid that is against the window pane. So we can’t just touch it up - it is literally behind the glass pane and we can’t reach it.

  • nidnay

    Thing is, if both doors came out of the factory with that particular defect, you might have a difficult time getting a good door from them. That’s why I would contact them directly and ask them specifically if there are any they have produced that don’t have this issue. If they say “yup, they all look like this”, then I would find a different manufacturer, because you should not be seeing this issue in between your glass.....very unsightly.

  • Sammy

    Now they are saying this is actually normal for true divided light window panes and it wouldn’t have been an issue if we just ordered the simulated light.

    That makes absolutely no sense.

  • Bunny

    I have a Simpson front door very similar to yours (solid fir, painted white) except my single 3/4 lite is not divided into panes. It cost $1000 in 2015 (not including installation). But with yours I see the "drip" things along the outside edge, not just the inner divisions. Mine has none of that and it's double-glazed.

  • PRO
    HomeSealed Exteriors, LLC

    Before seeing the pics I thought for sure this would be in the "nit-picky" category, but no. Perhaps the pics are doing strange things, but that looks pretty bad. Its either extremely carelessly placed glazing tape, or a wet glaze (sealant) where they use black for some reason. If the latter, it should be clear IMO. Either way, if that's what it looks like in person, I wouldn't accept.... The only caveat to that being: Did you view and approve before being installed? If not, given that you already rejected one door for the same reason, I'm surprised that you and the installer didn't arrange a preview of the product prior to installation of the second unit... If you a consider a third version of this door, I'd recommend it the next time around

  • Windowmaster

    Bunny,

    no offense but $1000 for a simpson door is too much. Simpson are on the very low end. Did you actually purchase the door? If not, look for a better brand.

    Rogue Valley looks like a very basic door and made of wood. That said, it could be oak or another hardwood which are very expensive Unlike a cheap wood door made of pine.

  • Windowmaster

    Also, did you sign off on the door?

  • Bunny

    Windowmaster, my post indicates I bought it in 2015. It’s been my front door since then. I don’t regret what I paid for it. I ordered it from a local independent door dealer. Another dealer in town quoted about the same price. Sorry, but your post was kinda offensive.

  • fridge2020

    Looks pretty bad to me.


    @Bunny, please don't question the window master. Without him this site wouldn't have such deep insights as: "Looks like a basic door made of wood".


    Just kidding of course. I'm sure he didn't mean to offend nor do I.

  • Craftsman Lover

    Update:

    Door manufacturer is saying this is normal and not defective for a solid wood door. See email screenshots below of their explanation. Is this industry standard? Not sure if we’re overreacting but the comments above suggest other people would have an issue with it too... is there anything we can do to fix it?

  • lkbum_gw

    I'd call a glazier or window company and get a different opinion.

  • PRO
    HomeSealed Exteriors, LLC

    Craftsman, is the sloppy looking sealant exposed on the opposite side of the door where it can be trimmed off? If so, I’d retract my previous thoughts and agree with the manufacturer commentary. That is common on wood doors and windows and part of the finishing process.


    If however that is inaccessible, and that inconsistency is completely behind the grids/glazing beads, then I’d reaffirm my initial thoughts. If it’s tape it looks carelessly done. If it’s a bead of dark colored sealant, that dark color seems to be the bad choice. Based on the comments from the manufacturer, if the latter is true, they may also be misunderstanding the situation when they state that the door is not “ready for paint”, as though there is anything that could be done there to ”prep“ that issue .....

  • Craftsman Lover

    Homesealed - it is inaccessible. Below are pictures of an example of the interior side and exterior side of the same section. Someone already came and cut off excess sealant.

    I’m wondering if we do return it, suggest they keep the back of the grids black or dark so it matches their sealant color. And NOT have them prime the grids at al(them priming the front of the grid was an issue the first time because it resulted in overspray on the back - see third picture). We returned the door and they said they will prime BOTH sides of the grid to solve this. Well, they did and now it’s the same issue but opposite...if that makes sense.

    Thanks for your thoughts on the matter!

  • nidnay

    Did you send them pictures of the defect?

  • Craftsman Lover

    @niday yes ! I included it in my email to them and they responded with the door making lesson.

  • nidnay

    Dang. It just doesn’t look right. I could not live with that. I was trying to follow the lengthy teaching and got lost somewhat. Did he say that the simulated divided lites would be the same? Maybe you can check out some other manufacturers and see their doors to make a comparison.

    It’s just not worth it to pay so much money for what you expect to be a beautiful door and then have it marred with the very visible uneven black sealant in between the glass. I just can’t accept that this is the norm.

  • cpartist

    Let them know at this point if they don't fix it you'll be happy to take them to small claims court and let the judge decide if that is acceptable for a $4000 door. Then see what they say.

  • skmom

    Nope. Wouldn’t accept that in a million years. Too bad, it could’ve been a really nice looking door.

  • pink_peony

    Oh hell no. My last home had this style doors and none of them looked like that. I guess mine were not at “industry standard “. That tag line is such a cop out.

  • lizbeth-gardener

    Please do not let them get away with this! You will look at that sloppy job every day and regret not doing something while you could. Have you already paid for the door? If so, I would first try telling them you have talked to other professionals in the door industry and they have confirmed that it is poor quality construction. If you get no where with that, consider small claims or calling the attorney general of your state and let them know you are going that route. If they think you are going to be talked into accepting, they are sure going to try.

  • Craftsman Lover

    Update: They offered to replace it with a fiberglass door that looked nothing like our current door. We actually like the style of this door since it matched our window grids, so we opted not.. explained again the simple issue and how it just wasn’t done right and we preferred this door.

    They are now going to try and redo it again. They said they have a different adhesive (black tape or something?) that will look cleaner than the oozy stuff. Sounds good! Hopefully third time’s the charm.. thanks so much for all the helpful advice ! :)

  • Chessie

    Good luck! Hard to believe that other people buy this door and accept that mess. I don't get it. Post an updated pic when you can.

  • nidnay

    Fingers crossed.

  • PRO
    HomeSealed Exteriors, LLC

    Craftsman, the tape sounds like a good solution. Many door and window manufacturers use that for this reason.

    I found some of their other thoughts interesting, including essentially that your expectations essentially may be too high, and also that there is something inherent about wood doors that prevents this from looking cleaner... I'm paraphrasing, but that was my interpretation of their comments and I'd disagree with both.

    That said, kudos both to you and them for dealing with the situation with level heads. Too many trolls start talking about lawsuits etc and that typically ends in a lose-lose for everyone but the attorneys. Conversely on their end, they could start getting into ASTM standards etc and potentially be correct, however again, nobody really wins there either. They have a ticked off client bad-mouthing them, and you have a crappy looking door... Please come back with an update after the latest fix. I do happen to think that their latest suggestion of using tape should hopefully be a winner as it should lay in a straight line without a ton of deviation.

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