Gack !!!!

I'll add my ugly not Tuscany Superb buds. Mine is newly planted, first effort. I wish I knew what yours are doing, Bob.

Mine has been there since 6 years...

I'm hoping mine is doing strange things from just being planted in the ground. I did put organic fertilizer in the hole when I planted it, which may not have agreed with it.

Yours is so well established I'm sure. I wish I knew.

I doubt yours is affected by what mine is going through...;;:)

I had the same problem with my Chloris (Alba rose). It had tons of buds in the spring, half of which turned yellow and fell off, or bloomed brown and deformed. I wish I knew how to find and link to my old post, which had several photos, just like yours. There were a few theories from forum members, if I remember correctly, about the rose self pruning excess buds, or needing more water when buds are forming. In my case it could be dryness, since there are several Norway maples in the vicinity.

Sorry I can’t be of more help. It’s very frustrating I know, but I've just resigned myself to enjoying what blooms I get, and removing the ugly ones!

I have some roses doing poorly that had trees encroach no doubt affecting their sun, water and nutrition too.

Mine doesn't form tons of buds.... Very few if ever.... And it doesn't matter if we have wet springs or dry springs it's the same..... Maybe it's lack of sun.....

However, anecdotally, I have an Alba semi-plena that is probably 2 feet away from a 40 year old cherry tree and it has no problem flowering...but it gets more sun....go figure...

My Alba only gets 3 hours of sun. So maybe it sets a lot of buds, but needs more sun and moisture to bring them to maturity. I don’t know. If we’re lucky maybe someone

will chime in with an answer to the mystery.

My semi-plena too and if I let it, it might climb the tree. I rarely if ever water it. Prune it once in while and let it be.... It's one of my best roses.....

It's not midge damage, but It is hard to see from your pics if it's insect damage. Did any of them ever flower well? Has the area become progressively shadier? When does it get shadier in this area compared to when the buds set and flower? It could be there's enough sun to set bud, but not enough for them to grow and bloom properly.

Regarding the HMs, I was told by a well-known rosarian that if not pruned properly ie. taking out old wood in its third year, they would eventually bloom less. I can't recall if this is for the multiflora HMs or other HM heritage. Just a thought. I have many HMs in difficult situations, but they do at least get some direct sun and bright light.

Sheila, that is some crazy proliferation!!! I used to get it with potted plants, but now that they are in the ground it seems to have resolved itself.

It's probably getting shadier. But there's a Reine des Violettes and a Prairie Peace even in worse off areas and they flower. Not profusely but they do flower. Prairie Peace is healthy, Reine des Violettes is tired..... but it could be also our successive heatwaves. I've fed them well and I water them regularly.....

And no I haven't seen any of those beautiful deep burgundy of La Belle Sultane. The earlier flower were half the size and measly look, to the point you want to cut them off, rather than seeing them. The plant itself is Grafted, very spindly, messy thin canes......Not a handsome rose by any stretch.....

The hybrid musks have got pruned to the grown by the cold weather and my frustration......

I've only got two left, Felicia, which gets quite a bit of sun and flowered magnificently in it's early years and hasn't flowered for three years or so, and Penelope.... which is hanging on.....

Actually, I'm surprised you can grow HMs at all. My Penelope died over a winter in a poor shady spot, whereas Felicia didn't mind the same area. She's a trooper. Marjorie Fair is hardier still.

Mine are grafted and the bud roots are 6 inches below the earth. Lot of digging :)

We normally have ample snow, so that protects the plants.....

Last year I got rid of Buff Beauty and this year, Cornelia. I was too bored to see if it would at point send up a shoot. I nearly did the same to Penelope, but it decided to send some shoots after all....

In the beginning I loved pushing the zone, but now, I prefer hardy roses. So, I replaced them with Albas.....

Is there a chance that your rose is planted near a centifolia sometimes called "Prolifera de Redoubte"? If I just look at the buds, I think I see some minor proliferation at the center of the buds.

I've seen proliferation in a garden near east TN, but at an elevation of several thousand feet higher and colder and in the first bloom cycle. But not repeated in second and third bloom cycles.

Nobody cares much about proliferation in roses and not much is in the literature.

I wonder if your previously unaffected rose picked up some genes in a root to root graft. That might be a possibility.

The other might be a colder and later spring brought some near-dormant proliferation-like growth forward.

Our knowledge of what makes roses 'tick' is a mile wide and half an inch deep.

I don't have any centifolias. I don't have neither the place nor the sun I assume they need. The rose flowered weakly in the beginning but my guess is that lack of constant direct sun, makes its lanky and spindly.....

I wanted a Gallica and it was "said" that it's shade tolerant....which is not....

The problem started after when I used some composted manure....My HT and the hybrid musks stopped flowering completely..... only the explorers and Albas flower....

Any idea which kind of animal the manure came from? Or how long it was composted?

When flowering/flower production stops, it might be an overwhelming amount of Nitrogen.

A lot of 'flowers' of other genera won't flower if they are in too rich a soil, too much nitrogen could force leaf growth at the expense of bloom growth. I gave some begonias an amount of cottonseed meal that had done well in previous years as a slow release N source. We got a huge amount of rain in lots of lightening srorms. The leaf growth took off gangbusters. The blooms returned two and a half months later.

For your HTs, what rootstock are they on? If from Palatine or Pickering, they'd be on multiflora which might tie into why your HMusks are having a problem.

I only have one gallica, Josephine, also in 2-3 hours of sun (again, because of neighbour‘s Norway maple😕) and it flowers pretty well, although it is a bit lanky.. I’ll see if I can find a photo. But she could be the exception....

It’s funny that your HT’s aren’t flowering at all. Since I have had a rose midge problem for 10 years, that is the first thing that comes to mind. Do a close check for the burnt tips. I really hope you don’t find any, and it turns out to be something else. Other than RRD, rose midge is the worst.

I can’t imagine why composted manure would cause your roses to stop flowering. It seems you have a few different things going on in your garden. Hopefully we can help you figure out what they are.

Before the maple leafs out Josephine gets maybe 4 hours of morning sun....after that, maybe two. But it’s enough for her to flower quite well. And it’s before the midge arrive!

I believe it was packeting sheep manure. I don't know how long.

The remains H Musks are from both Pickering and Palatine grafted on multiflora.....

I haven't given any high nitrogen. The Rose is on a slope, despite having made it a rustic box.

Yes the HT was rose midge. It had that burned tip. So I got rid of it. Thankfully neither the Albas/ Explorer or even Sweet Chariot were effected by it..... but the hybrid musks where....

I've let the hybrid musks for the time being, as I'm not looking forward to digging them up and also thinking/hoping that the midges would be content with them... and leave the other roses alone...

However, La Belle Sultane doesn't have that problem, at least not now anymore. As it had somehow empty, puny buds.....I did spray it with Neem oil soap mixture, when I saw the dratted sawflies....

We had very little sun and a lot of rain this spring. Many of the buds on my roses were deformed.

Yes, the sawflies have arrived here too....I’ve been picking them off daily.

I’m sorry to hear that it was midge on your HT. . Keep an eye out for them on your other roses. Only my once bloomers have escaped them. My spring flush is fine, but then they move in. I’ve tried every organic method possible, including neem oil sprays, soaps, silicates and drenches, removing top layer of soil/mulch, cutting all new growth after the spring flush until October, etc. I’ve managed to source some Neem meal, and use it make a tea to pour over everything, hopefully deterring them a little. I can’t really cover the soil with fabric or cardboard as I have bulbs and underplantings in the way. It’s a never ending battle. Luckily I’m stubborn and not ready to give up yet, even after all these years!!

@ Monarda, in Montreal it’s been very very dry, so it’s not that.

@judith5bmontreal, Josephine looks lovely.....I've caught some sawflies on the buds.... I believe...

I don't have other photos but I checked the buts, which had shrivelled and was hollow....

I've been watering diligently.....

Bob, I found everything I planted in Alaska (US z3) needed full sun for best performance. There is no comparison to hot climate full sun, which can be too much. I had trouble keeping European OGRs alive and blooming in Alaska due to the cold. They grew backwards and petered out.

I managed to snap some hopefully better closeups of two different buds:

THat is very similar to what was happening with my Chloris

FOund my old post with photos.....

Wow! These are exactly like mine. I just planted a Chloris. Hope it'll fair better than yours.....

@Sheila z8a Rogue Valley OR I assume zone 3 is quite different than 4. Especially as we are in a protected zone. La Belle Sultane has no die back with or without snow. But it needs the sun, probably it would be happier if I pruned the tree. But heat we have....This is my only OGR besides the two musks. I have planted several albas this year. We'll see how they fair. It's my favourite class of roses....

@stillanntn6b What is the the relation between multiflora and HM? Are they not compatible?

Once upon a time, a young vicar went to a rose fanciers meeting in England. He gave a brief talk about a species rose he had and mentioned that it might make interesting offspring. The rose fanciers basicly weren't interested and said "thanks for coming, good by"

The Reverend Joseph Pemberton believed in his rose, Rosa multiflora sp., and worked with it. From that rose, Pemberton created the roses called Hybrid Musks. An assistant of his Ann Bentall continued his work. There's a list here. and many of them are still available.

The relationship, IMO, is that the growing conditions for R. multiflora and the Hybrid Musks that should have been called Hybrid multifloras, are similar and conditions that bother one may bother all.

(This won't help Canadian growing conditions, but Rosa moschata is a parent of the Noisette roses. R. moschata can handle most winters as far north as I live, but R. multiflora does well several hundrwed miles further north.)

This won't help much, but I have an unidentified Gallica (a pass-along I got from my Grandmother) that typically blooms maybe half of its buds and aborts the rest. They dry up, like some of the images above. It seemed to me that the plant was just aborting the buds because it didn't feel like it could support so many blooms, but it could also be an unusual sensitivity to aphids -- I have noticed that aphids really really love my Gallicas.

@stillanntn6b Thanks for recalling to my mind the story of the Rev and the multiflora link :) In my experience none of the HMs I have are cane hardy, even pegged to ground and buried under ton of snow. Some years, I might be lucky but often not, they all die to six inches more or less.

Felicia flowered abundantly the first few years so did Cornelia, Buff Beauty and Penelope. Now only two are left, one because it decided to grow this spring (Penelope) and the other (Felicia) because I'm to lazy and sentimental to get rid of it..... and I'm sure the Rose midge is feeding on them.... I tried nematodes, but I wasn't assiduous....(it needs successive applying).

@K S 7a Yakima I'm not so sure if it applies to mine. It had only 3 measly flowers.... :)

I did have a huge infestation of aphids on my rosebuds, now that I think of it.

@judith5bmontreal, I believe the culprit are the budworms...because I started spraying with my neem oil mixture religiously and thus had a few measly flowers....

@monarda_gw Now you that I remember the aphids had flocked to the Belle Sultane.....

I would be relieved to know that it's aphids rather than thrips, though I did fail to get rid of them -- manually and with sprays of water. Still thrips sound a lot worse.