aerbk: A person in Florida reported AD blooming well in only 2 hrs. of sun, which translates to 4 hrs. of sun in cold zone. Linda of Long Ago Roses in North Carolina also sells AD as own-root, here's the info. from her website: "plants are $15 each. Austins are $22 , Delbards are $18. Shipping east of the MS river is $11 per box of one to four plants. West of the MS river it's $15 per box."

I'm east of the MS river so I paid only $11 for shipping of 4 own-root bands. Linda's roots are longer & more solid than High Country Roses.

Straw - many thanks!

Just wanted to mention that hi country roses generally has a gift certificate coupon around thanksgiving that really brings the prices of the roses down even more. You can specify delivery. It has ranged between 15 and 25% discount. Last year was 15% which was shocking still because plants were in such demand. Other years it was 25%. What I like about Linda, besides the quality of her plants and her selection is that they're a great price for plant and shipping all year round. So there's no need to wait!😃

Second flush on Abe. Either it’s a good year for Abe, or I’m learning what he likes. Chicken fertilizer, biosolids, alfalfa, and frequent water.

Noseometer: Great job, best Ab. bush ever !!

Holy Crap!!! That's FABULOUS!!! When I tried to grow Abe many years ago...it was a floppy, long caned mess. LOL Incredible!! I agree with Teresa...best Abraham Darby bush ever!! The blooms are to SWOON for!!

@noseometer...(7A, SZ10, Albuquerque) - your Abe looks amazing!!!

No fair, Nose. I give my ungrateful Abe the equivalent of your spoiled Abe, and I don't have a tenth of the beautiful blooms you get. Plus, what a wimp he is in our hot weather. I still believe I needed a grafted Abe in this garden. Diane

This is own root Abe here, Diane, hang on Twig Darby.

This Spring, not now. Noseometer, your second flush is fabulous.

Wow, Sheila! That’s incredible! Just all kinds of gorgeous!

Thanks all for your kind words. Makes me feel better after struggling with Abe for so long. Diane, I hope yours hits his stride soon.

Sheila - I could cry over how beautiful your Abe is!! My roses all suck. LOL If I could grow THAT...oh my word!! I am soooo impressed!

Same here, Carol. Sheila, how did you do it--get those beautiful results from this rose? What secret fertilizer do you use? We need to know. I think my Abe needs penicillin. Diane

Diane - LOL My roses all need a necromancer. LOL

My Abe is own root from Heirloom, and he just did that. I really think your Abe is gorgeous Diane, even if he is height challenged at the moment. I think I used Coop Poop from Amazon, but next year I'm going Lily Miller and Milorganite because the later repels gophers I heard on NPR.

Have you ever considered growing hardy roses in the ground, Carol? It worked in z3 Alaska. I'm not sure all that fiddling around you are doing with fertilizers is helping you with your pots. I fertilize once or twice a year at most in ground or pots. Keeping it simple here.

Wow - these beautiful, amazing Abe pix are making me yearn for another Abe - had to leave the ones I had at a former house. Has any one compiled a list/chart of Abe’s particular likes/dislikes? My old ones did not look this fabulous — lots of black spot and not as many bloom, though I loved them despite all…

Abe. has glossy & dark green leaves. Glossy means it's a waterhog plus need more potassium. Dark-green means it likes alkaline pH. I constantly have to lime Abe. in a pot prior to a heavy rain. I use high-potassium fertilizer on Abe, potassium helps with disease prevention, be it blackspot, mildew, or rust.

Sheila - yeah, I was just trying to fix a problem I had created with alfalfa pellets. :) :) No, I can't grow roses in the ground...the glacial till makes it like a coffin to rose roots...they drown. I'm very lightly using Osmocote Plus (next year I can fertilize with it normally, since I won't have damaged my roses). Now that most of my roses aren't dying...some are growing, some are very, very slowly getting better (and a lot have died), I have stopped meddling with the pH and am very, very lightly fertilizing (once in awhile) with MG and potassium (leingbite sp?). I figure with the Osmocote and this...my roses should be okay. Thanks for caring, Sheila. :) :)

Straw - my Abe didn’t grow much until I acidified my soil (sand). Although I can’t really say if it was other factors since I have no control group.

Carol - Good for you! you are not giving up and you keep trying! I see the garden as a laboratory, where I try things and learn new things all the time.

Noseometer: This month is rainy here, like flash flood 1st week of July with 3 to 6 inch. of rain per day. Rain here is acidic at pH 4.5. Right now July 11 it's week-long, all-day rain. I always rush out to lime roses right before a rain. It rains so much that I see 1/8 cup of whitish stuff oozing out of bottom of pots (elevated on bricks), rain leaches out nitrogen, calcium, and sulfur. Nitrogen fertilizers (alfalfa meal or chemical) also have an acidizing effect.

Noseometer - only problem is I don't really learn things. LOL When I'm looking at my roses...I'm really not sure what to do. I have to read through my notes.

I learn things in my garden sometimes, often things I don't want to learn. Diane

Straw - you are inspiring me to test the pH of the rain, the next time it rains.

Carol - at least you are taking notes. That’s key!

Diane - There’s that, isn’t there? It’s all part of the process. A metaphor for life? lol!

I think experimenting only works for some people and others do better with structure and concrete established rules for success. People's health is similar. All the crazy diets and woo woo ideas can really drive some people into the ditch. I think this applies to plants and pets too.

Boy, do I totally agree, Sheila.

Yes, Nose, painful discoveries are part of life, though I don't accept them with grace. Diane

No doubt! I hope you didn't think that I was suggesting that experimentation was the only way to garden. It's just how I approach my garden, and in another climate I might have an entirely different attitude. I don't accept the painful discoveries with grace either. I have to remind myself over and over (and over) again to try to see the less pleasant lessons with a more appreciative attitude.

You mean I'm supposed to appreciate this never ending heatwave? Just kidding because it is not something I caused--well maybe my driving caused a bit of it. I usually find a routine for rose feeding and care and stick with it. In spite of the heat, I have some roses that are really budding out. Tamora is unbelievable, but she does have lots of sun, which may destroy all those buds. Diane

Sheila - exactly!!! That's me!!! And I need someone to stand beside me and say...look at this....this means _____. :) :) :)

Rosecanadian.... just laughing about this last night, because I thought to myself "this is too hard, I can't learn it....and the phrase I say to the boys popped into my head "don't say it can't be done chances are you rue it, for some poor fool who doesn't know will come along and do it." Then my next thought was I guess I could be the poor fool, who actually learns and remembers this stuff! So my goal this year is to keep looking at my notes, keep trying to see, keep at this until I get it...and not overwater...going to see which I learn first!!!

Abe for me, did a little the first year...I got him from Garden Valley Ranch as a huge 2 or 3 year own root (I highly recommend them if you want the 5-12 roses they sell mail order.) But he really took off this year.

I am also trying to learn for perennials "First year they sleep, then second year they creep, then third year they leap." I even have a tiny new root rose that I stunted last year with not enough soil or fertilizer and too much water, but it is actually creeping forward too this year.

The perennials I've purchased in the past have all been 4-6 inch potted plants, and I've never had to wait three years for them to grow and bloom. They take off from the start, so I've never understood the three year thing. Same for roses. Whether bare roots or 3-5 gallon plants, they bloom almost immediately, and grow fast (they are grafted, which I prefer). The only rose I've ever grown that hasn't taken off immediately is the three gallon Abe Darby, own root, that I ordered online from a reputable seller. He's been creeping for four years now. I've given up trying to understand that rose. Diane

Ann - my most important lesson this year was not to over______ (fill in the blank with everything you can think of LOL) Excellent that your stunted rose is starting to do something. LOL

Diane - everything you grow is fabulous. :) :) Your little Abe should maybe get the boot for something else. If you can't grow it well...it doesn't need to be grown. :)

Diane: Thank you for the report of AD doesn't like heavy clay as own-root. I notice that Ab. as own-root is a water-hog, best in partial shade.

AD. likes fluffy & moist soil, like potting soil. Mine did great in a pot, until I planted in the ground in dense clay and it got blackspot from the 2 weeks of heavy rain.

AD is the best performer for nearby friend with LOAMY & FLUFFY alkaline soil, so I need to fix the soil to be fluffy & fast-draining to prevent blackspot.

I don't have dense clay; in fact, where Abe is planted has quite good soil, though alkaline. Abe, like all my roses, gets lots of water, too. So something else is going one--he's just a bum clone--ha. Diane

Your Abe is ornery! Well, so is mine, but yours is extra ornery!

In Portland and fabulous soil, plants did not "sleep" either, but generally they do is my understanding.....They sure "sleep" and "creep" here on our sandy scabby soil. My Dad the farmer said that rich soil is very different from poor soil and clay soil of any kind is richer...I don't know....he did quit farming, but grew a great garden.

A lot of my soil is awful (desert hills outside Boise), but not heavy clay. It was pure uncultivated desert and brush when I moved here 17 years, so I've dealt with plenty of bad soil. I grew Austins at my previous home and in this home, and it takes a lot more effort here. My step dad was a big farmer all his life, but he farmed in the valley and on a prehistoric dry lake bed (Dry Lake). His soil was like crumbled cake. We certainly don't have the rain of Portland, and rely totally on constant irrigation. Diane

Abraham Darby 2024. He's not perfect (by far), but I love him anyway, and still perhaps my favorite rose of all.

Wow, your Abe looks pretty darn perfect to me, Noseometer!

Also my favorite rose as well. Haven't grow him in years as recent gardens have been far too shady for roses. May try again in my new garden but he'd have to be in a container. Not sure about that......he gets kinda big.

Beautiful, nose!!!!

One of my first roses and I failed it miserably with no idea what I was doing but I was already head over heels in love with the bloom and scent before it steadily declined and I moved away. When I heard it had been discontinued I managed to grab two from Heirloom and I can only hope this time I can do better and they will one day look like yours Noseometer!

It's one of my favorite Austins.

Goodness these are pretty! And my ears perked up at “likes alkaline soil”. I pH tested the other day and we are 8.

A couple pictures of what my 2-yo own root Abes have managed to put out this week, no idea how they are finding the energy to bloom and also put out new growth. They’ve been stuck in a pot ghetto for two years but this year they are finally going in the ground!

My scrawny babies treking on despite their tiny pots

Edit: There were supposed to be two other pictures but they got eaten by the vagaries of the crazy Houzz forums. I'll try to add them back.

Edit Edit: Second times a charm it seems!

@dave5bWY - Thanks, he's about as perfect as a rose can be, quirky nature and all.

@Gardengal - I've grown him in a 20" pot and he did well, but he didn't grow as big as in the ground.

@oursteelers - thanks!

@Heather RR - Good luck! We don't have blackspot or rust here, but I hear those can affect Abe. With your moisture, he will probably do even better for you than for me!

@erasmus_gw - Your Abe is so gorgeous! Yours seems to be more pink. Funny how Abe does that.

@Melissa Kansas - Try him, and let us know how he does! My "soil" (sand, really) isn't quite that alkaline.

My Abe seems to love chicken byproduct fertilizer, Jobe's Organic and DA rose food in particular. The other brands, not as much (even though they were also chicken byproduct), and not so much with other fertilizers. He turned his nose up at fish emulsion, and he didn't care for alfalfa pellets or MiracleGro fertilizer.

It's just pinker in that picture, Nose. Usually it's pretty apricot.

This spring

Will include a picture of Oshun, a Paul Barden rose , bred from Abe. Mine was more apricot last year, a bit more pink this year.

Last year, its first in my garden

This year

This year

I think my plant might need more sun.

I think Oshun has more vigor own root than Abe, and so far it has better health. It has fantastic fragrance as well. It looks like own root Abe does very well for some people.

Beautiful

Amazing and gorgeous rose! I'm wondering, what happens when it rains? The blooms seem to have so many petals, I'm just wondering if they ball up? I see some of you grow in a dryer area, so maybe that isn't an issue.

prairiemoon, I have two young own root Abes and they never ball for me, even in the rain and its been a rainy year here in my part of the PNW! I do have other roses that ball but Abe has thick petals which helps I think. I also find the higher pointed buds tend to open better than the really globular forms so maybe that helps as well? However, Seattle where I am is rainy but not particularly humid compared to other parts of the country with similar or more rainfall.

Heather, that's really good to know. Some years we get a lot of rain after the roses have started blooming for the season. It's so hard to see a beautiful rose bush turn into a wet tissue paper mess.

I can't remember ever seeing a bloom ball on Abe. It's been a rainy spring and Oshun isn't balling either.

It's frustrating, the various things that can interfere with the spring flush. Rain can beat them down or turn them to mush as you say. Or overly hot weather can fry them. Luckily it was not too hot here this spring. Thrips are starting to kick in here.