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DIY - HVAC questions... Help...?

5 years ago

I'll try to be succinct and just provide needed info... Let me know if you need more! - Thanks in advance!!

- 2000 sq. ft. home in northern MN (built mid-50s) No AC - just heat.

- building an efficiency apartment in 1/2 of the basement

- It will be insulated 4 walls (and ceiling) (and floor) - (for both sound and because the other half of basement is not insulated).

- 2 stage Trane 77,600 btu (LP powered) furnace.

- upstairs there are 3 bedrooms, liv. rm., kitchen, and bath.

- downstairs a laundry room/bath and a furnace/workroom - and the "new" apartment.

- Everything has worked "fine" for many years - I'd guess that furnace and ductwork upgraded maybe 10-15 years ago.

- (We've owned it just a year)

- Furnace is on one end of house - Two main trunks (16 x 8 down center for bedroom side) (12 x 8 down one side for liv. rm/kitchen side) and a return trunk t(also down center of house) hat's half 20x8 and half 10x8

- essentially "all" branch runs are 5" round.

- "Originally," in this 1000 sq. ft. basement, the "apartment side" had two 6x10 supply registers directly out of trunk and no returns. The laundry area (260 sq. ft.) had one 6x8 register out of other trunk and no returns. The furnace has one 6x12 return directly on return plenum.

- The apartment is essentially 250 sq. ft. of liv. rm/kitchen -- 100 sq. ft. of bedroom -- and 60 sq. ft. of bathroom. My "plan" for the apartment is to close up the two registers that are there. Then run three registers to "outside" wall - two in liv. rm/ kitch area and one in bedroom. (the bedroom is furthest from the furnace).

- Then, I was going to add two returns, on the "inside" wall, at floor, one in bedroom and one in liv. rm./kitch. area.

- So essentially, I'm adding one supply and two returns to what was already there. (but moving them further from trunk and to floor.)

- From what I read, I'm relatively confident the furnace is large enough, my main questions are about duct and register size...

- *notes - This basement has been cool in the summer and "mildly uncomfortable" in the winter. There's been no water infiltrating but it has been prone to condensation on the floor. (hence the floor insulation - "dri-core" underlayment).

- Be kind, because I've already started and just got "smarter" as I went along and figured I'd better run some of this by some people who actually know something... ;-)

- I've got three 6" takeoffs installed in the top of the trunk and was planning two 6" returns...

- I'd REALLY rather not rip those off (it'd be ugly) but I could "reduce" them...?

- I have a bunch of 2 1/4 x 10 duct for the walls and was planning 6x10 registers. That could all be returned...

- So.... What "SHOULD" I be doing here?

- I'm curious if bedroom duct (furthest from furnace) needs to be downsized to keep velocity up?

- As the future renter will have minimal control over heat, I was considering three "Flair Smartvents" for registers....

- I'm also inclined to install one more small (3" or 4") round supplies directly out of trunk in bathroom.

- One of the main issues is that I really have no "feel" for what this will all be like after it's built and insulated. I don't know if it will be freezing or too hot. - I'm a little worried about too hot in winter (hence the smartvents) and too cool in the summer but I guess they can always open a window then...

and are smartvents enough? Do I need dampers too? It would be tough to make them "accessible..."

- Lastly - Should I damper the 2nd main trunk (12x8) to liv. rm side of house? - so as to "throttle" a little more air to the side with the apartment?

Okay.... Sorry - but that's me being "succinct." ;-)

I REALLY appreciate any thoughts you might have to share!

Chuck

Comments (7)

  • 5 years ago

    95% - output... There are seven 5" runs for upstairs heat. and one 4" -- Two of them are 12 feet Four of them are 5 feet, One is 3 feet and The 4" One is 8 feet. --- I was thinking of maybe adding a baseboard elec. heater or two for supplemental.... but maybe I'll just wire them and see how it goes...? - Any thoughts on duct/register size?

  • PRO
    5 years ago

    It would be more or less impossible to make that basement apartment "comfortable" to the extent of what most people would consider comfortable.


    Why?


    Because you have comfort needs upstairs in the main house, that are completely different than that of the basement.


    The thermostat is located upstairs in the main house, then to make matters worse you're stealing air to now go into the basement that didn't exist before AND in an extreme winter climate to boot. So because you're stealing air, the air needed for the upstairs will be reduced forcing the system to run longer.


    So 9 times out of 10, the basement will get too warm under this scenario. You have different heat loads for the basement and the main house... because the basement is below grade? *usually*. But it's more complex than that simply for the sake of "no control" for the basement.


    The thermostat upstairs can't tell how hot it is in the basement apartment.


    This isn't a DIY project. Save your money. I know the whole point in this exercise is to make money by renting out a basement apartment.


    But honestly would you pay money to live somewhere and NOT be comfortable?





  • 5 years ago

    The thing is though that the basement has been uninsulated space for twenty years. That side of basement has had two 6x10 registers blowing heat directly out of the main trunk for that long. - with a return on the furnace. I'm proposing adding one more supply register with a system to shut off each register when not needed (thermostatically controlled) - and adding two returns. (plus insulating the area.) I'm also proposing supplemental heat for the shoulder seasons as necessary. Why wouldn't that work?

  • PRO
    5 years ago

    I've already told you.


    Now you either heed my advice or live within the fun you create for yourself.



  • 5 years ago
    last modified: 5 years ago

    - *notes - This basement has been cool in the summer and "mildly uncomfortable" in the winter.

    If the basement has been comfortable in the summer then it needs no additional supplies for cooling. Adding a return will pull cool air from the basement which will be mixed with the air with the rest of the house and will actually help cool it. You want the ability then to close them in the summer. A manual damper is sufficient. The return will also help lower the humidity in the summer.

    For heating two supply registers and one return should be sufficient for 250 sq. feet of space especially if it is below grade and you are adding more insulation.

    I was thinking of maybe adding a baseboard elec. heater or two for supplemental.

    The supplemental heat is what will make the apartment comfortable in the winter. I will tell you from my experience with my own finished basement this makes a big difference. On warm sunny days in the winter upper floors will be warmer than the basement. The electric baseboard heat will fill in what is needed. There is not much heat loss in the basement so I would not be too worried about running up a big electric bill if your tenant is not paying for it. A single 1500 W heater will keep the space at 72 degrees on the coldest day in the winter. You may need two if the bedroom door is kept closed.

    frawg _ thanked mike_home
  • 5 years ago

    Thank you Mike. It's nice to find friendly, helpful people in advice forums.