Cycle Rate too fast?

• My system cycles too fast (or slow). What should I do?
• Cycle rate

Which model thermostat?

If the thermostat tells the compressor to turn off and then immediately tells it to turn back on, is there a delay before the compressor actually restarts or does it restart immediately?

Is this a new installation or did the problem begin after the thermostat had been working correctly for awhile?

Who installed the thermostat? Is it under warranty and have you tried calling customer support?

Do you know if the thermostat has a wire connected to the "C" wire terminal? Has the HVAC company tried swapping out the thermostat or bypassing it to see if the AC compressor works properly?

When the t"stat starts acting up there is a delay when it calls for cooling and then the the clicking starts with the compressor clicking on and off with each click of the sta.t

The t'stat was installed by me and this is not my first installation. The others work fine. It was installed in the fall of last year and worked fine in the heating mode. It was working fine in the cooling mode for a few weeks and then started to act up. I had the HVAC company come check out the system but they could not find anything wrong. Even changed the starting capacitor on the compressor. The C wire is installed.

Just wanted to add that I tried swapping out the one that was installed in the fall with a brand new one and the same thing started to happen after a few days.

If you have a volt meter, measure the voltage between the R and C terminals. You should be getting 24 VAC. If the voltage is too low, the thermostat may be going into a weird state. Measure the voltage with the thermostat calling for cooling, and not cooling for cooling.

"then the the clicking starts with the compressor clicking on and off with each click of the sta.t"

I understand this is called short-cycling and is to be avoided. The thermostat typically prevents restarting of a compressor in less than 5 minutes:

"The compressor needs to wait for the refrigerant to equalize. The compressor compresses the refrigerant gas and pumps it out at high pressure. The condenser condenses it to a high pressure liquid. The high pressure liquid is metered to control the flow. When the high pressure liquid meets the low pressure evaporator it boils off to a low pressure gas and returns to the compressor. So as the compressor runs it develops high pressure on one side and low pressure on its suction. It you restart the compressor right away the compressor can not start pumping against the high pressure. 4–5 minutes is a good general time it could take the system to equalize the pressure so the compressor can start pumping when the pressures are equal on both sides" -- https://www.quora.com/Why-do-air-conditioner-compressors-take-4-5-minutes-to-restart

My Honeywell T6 thermostat has a setting that controls the maximum number of cycles per hour.

My Sensi thermostat sometimes clicks on and off rapidly casing the A/C compressor to cycle each time the thermostat clicks.

Because you bought it yourself, you become the sleuth / AC tech. You need to determine why this is happening. It might be the thermostat, it might be some other issue. Call Emerson thermostat help hot line if they have one... they may walk you thru some procedures.

Because you have this checked by pro HVAC service, leads me to believe it's a ghost (intermittent problem) somehow created by you or the introduction of this thermostat that *might not* be compatible with your HVAC system.

You can't trouble shoot something that doesn't exist at the time of service. Do you still have the old thermostat? Put it back on see if the problems still appear.

This is the proverbial downside of "DIY - HVAC"

Because of the topic header, I thought this was going to be another "nest" type problem... but any wifi type thermostat can exhibit much of the same kind of nonsense that you've posted here.

Usally the end result is to replace the thermostat with something else. If you want something of this nature, you might have to look into a complete package... thermostat, HVAC system etc.

I service the Katy, Texas area.

It is one of the "nest" type WIFI stats and I am beginning to believe it is the problem as Austin Air suggested. One of the reasons I put it in was to get a rebate on the unit since the old mechanical one was shot and to get a reduced usage rate from the power company because they could adjust the setting during times of high power demands. I guess it goes back to the old saying "you get nothing for nothing".

Thanks to all on your replies.

Just wanted to add that I tried swapping out the one that was installed in the fall with a brand new one and the same thing started to happen after a few days.

You swapped the thermostat with another one and the same thing happened. That would rule out a bad thermostat.

Even changed the starting capacitor on the compressor.

Did the change the run capacitor or the starting capacitor, or both?

I still think the cause is a low voltage problem. I would also measure the voltage from Y to C with and without the AC running. The control board may be sinking more current than the thermostat can source at 24 V. The voltage drops and the relay on the control board opens. The relay opening causes the voltage to rise and the relay closes again and starts the rapid opening and closing cycle. It could be the control board relay is beginning to fail Your old thermostat may have been able to tolerate the extra current, but the Sensi is having difficulty. I would also measure the voltage at the control board. The voltage drop across the wiring and connections could aggravate the problem.

both the start and run caps were replaced. checking into the voltage.

One of the reasons I put it in was to get a rebate on the unit since the old mechanical one was shot and to get a reduced usage rate from the power company because they could adjust the setting during times of high power demands. I guess it goes back to the old saying "you get nothing for nothing".

Ah, Ok. The old power company wanting to "control" your home regardless how hot or cold you are.

Back years ago before deregulation happened here, they actually installed electronic boxes on the side or near the outdoor condenser. Usually the same approach they could cut your energy bill. Essentially all this does is shut your home down -- back then it was just about AC.

So it was fairly common to run a few calls a year with the complaint the AC is not working only to find out the power company had shut it off due to the box on the side unit.

Now that this form of control can be done from a wifi stat... the power company dangles a carrot and has you become the technician to install your own stat. I've heard it all now.

As you can clearly see, this isn't what it's cracked up to be 9 times out of 10.

I don't know why anyone would want the power company to be shutting off their AC during an extreme heat wave... usually that's when they do it when there is extreme demand on the energy grid. (adjust the setting: means shut it off)

let me clarify. The power company does not shut off the AC it only bumps up the set point of the stat a few degrees but you can still override the higher set point and adjust it back down if you want.

First thing to do is to have the power company disconnect their "power saver". Then see if the problem persists. If it does, it's either the thermostat (unlikely, as it happens with a second thermostat) or the system. As stated above, you have to do the diagnosis yourself.

let me clarify. The power company does not shut off the AC it only bumps up the set point of the stat a few degrees.....

yeah 'tis true, but the effect is the AC shuts off. If you're away you come home to a hot house depending on your previous setting.

That said: you're trading one problem for another. If comfort doesn't mean as much to you then sure no problem.

What's the problem in case you missed it? "inconvenience"

Oh well I can turn it back on remotely? sure. But why should you have to do that?

Don't you have enough to do?

If you still choose it after all that you're going into the decision with eyes wide open, provided of course you can get it to play nice with your HVAC system.

I service the Katy, Texas area. (There are better options available than wifi)

the next time the stat acts up I plan on disconnecting the stat from the internet and see if the problem goes away and this should tell me if it is an internet problem or a something else. This is similar to what sktn77a suggested.

The electric rates on Long Island are the highest in the country and if I can save some money by allowing the power company the "option" to raise my temperature setting I can live with that. I can easily change it back to were i want and it is no big deal. Its my preference and that is what I elect to do.

I should point out that when you enter this program with the power company you are on a special lower rate throughout the year and not just when they adjust the temperature, it adds up to a lot of money per year.

There's no add-on device from the OP's electric provider involved in this scenario. Emerson/Sensi partnered with some electric providers to have them control the thermostat for load management via networking, IF the user wants to (optionally) join that program. There's also a separate optional geofencing function if the user installs the Sensi app for it to raise (or lower for heating) the setpoint by 3°F when the user leaves his home area, and set it back to normal when he approaches back home. There were four Sensi 'stats at my work (which business is now shut down and the property sold). I didn't activate those functions as neither was conducive to the type of business. The thermostats otherwise worked perfectly fine ... 7-day programming with up to 8 temp changes per day.

Thanks for the input but I have not activated the geofencing option

I didn't say that you did activate geofencing. I was offering (against my better judgement per how these discussions always progress regards to people not from Renee Zellwegger's home town) some info about how Sensi can function for those who may be unfamiliar.

"The electric rates on Long Island are the highest in the country..."

In Northern California, PG+E's rates start at about 25 cents for the first kwh, go to about 30 cents when a "baseline" is exceeded for a range, then go to 40 cents. The baseline is an inadequate quanity for anything more than a modest home or apartment so exceeding it is normal. It's why solar panels are so popular.

How do these compare with rates in the Long Island area? Would installing solar panels be feasible for you?

I agree with and support what dadoes said about power company programs. I also share dadoes view of those who license themselves to spit and hiss simply by putting the word Pro beside their name.

1. For benefit of those that have been lead to believe power company shut's them off,here's a simplification similar to the 3rd grade riddle about crossing the river with a rooster,bag of grain and a fox. Picture crossing the country in a horse drawn wagon capiable of hauling 4 passengers but 6 people want to go. It's too physically demanding for walking the intire distance so you are left with options of (1) leave 2 people behind (2) 4 riding and 2 walking with everyone taking turns walking in one hour shifts. (3) the houzzer way where everyone is too good to walk and noone will agree to stay behind so all 6 get on board to fight,insult,demean and argue until horses fall dead and strand the whole bunch. Every power grid can only carry xxxx units,some more than others. Your grid with 500 patrons is capiable of 1,000 units max which is ample except for 60 days each year when temperatures exceed 100f for 10 hours out of 24 each day and cooling all homes to maintain 75f demand's 1,200 units. If all patrons take turns living with 78f a few minutes each day,problem solved. Otherwise obstinate bull heads make it hard on everyone by overloading and cause reoccuring black outs. Spit and hiss if you please but a bunch of Texans suffered when tempertures dropped blow normal earlier this year only to find buracrats had done nothing in preperation.

The electric rates on Long Island are the highest in the country and if I can save some money by allowing the power company the "option" to raise my temperature setting I can live with that. I can easily change it back to were i want and it is no big deal. Its my preference and that is what I elect to do.

I can understand that philosophy. It's nothing I haven't seen before, where people put their prescribed feelings of comfort on the back burner in favor of saving money.

Why I put the things I put is to describe there are ways in which you can have your cake and eat it too. I offer solutions to what you want to do... if what you want to do is install your own thermostat to get a reduction and allow the power company control --- turning up the temp is going to shut the unit off. You can wriggle and writhe and debate this -- it's fine. I know people's view of comfort isn't the same for everyone.

Getting this reduction for no cost to you: other than having to deal with trouble shooting going thru service visits to no avail, due to intermittent problems?

The cost is time.

I change energy providers alot I like deals just as much as the next guy, but I am a control freak - not going to let an energy provider jack around with my settings. I put in an Bosch Inverter AC back in Oct 2019, that effectively cut my electric bill in half.

Of course the investment was more than a freebie thermostat controlled by the power company. Choices - Choices.

I'm here to provide options (solutions), to how others may want to save money, while also being comfortable. Someone mentioned solar power too...

So if I seem persnickety one way or the other: there are people out there with my "comfort" views. I've got a 27 year track record in HVAC. You may view that as an ego type statement, but experience is worth? You decide ___________________. You have choices. I'm merely informing you of pitfalls with those choices. (free isn't really free when you really boil things down, if you can live with it -- no harm no foul --

I service the Katy, Texas area.

The electric cooperative that serves me has an optional load-management program. Devices installed on the HVAC system (by local HVAC servicers, NOT the electric company people) and water heater to remotely turn them off on a rotating group basis for 7.5 minutes twice per hour during periods of peak power demand on the grid ... generally between 3p and 8p during summer months. The control signal is sent via the power lines, not WiFi, and doesn't require a special thermostat.

I don't think they do it on 2-speed or variable speed HVAC or heat pump water heaters. A given customer's HVAC or water heater may not even be on at the moment a shed signal is sent but it will turn off if it is on. The control system can also stagger participating customers against all turning back on simultaneously after a power outage to avoid overloading the substation circuits.

Participating accounts receive a $25/month bill credit for each the HVAC and water heater ($50 total) for Jun, Jul, Aug, & Sept. Proper load management control saves them $$$$ on their wholesale power cost vs. the grid peak during each monthly period. Electric cooperatives are member-owned and operate as non-profit entities, returning excess operating margins to the members as a bill credit. There are also adjustment factors on every bill for power costs, which sometimes may be a credit if they keep the costs low enough.

My neighbor worked there for 40+ years and single-handedly took care of load management until he retired in June. The aim is to do load management on only the one day of the month that is the peak which is difficult to anticipate ... so next best is do it as few days as possible. A lot of it is monitoring grid conditions and weather conditions across the state, anticipating through experience when a peak will occur. He sometimes did not engage load management when ERCOT called for it because he didn't anticipate it to be a peak day ... or did load management on a day when ERCOT didn't call for it.

Dadoes,

Yeah there are opposing methods I'm sure. ERCOT has mismanaged things even before the big freeze this past winter. But these things are 1 in 10 year or 1 in 20 year events.

Obviously they (ERCOT) are known to threaten rolling black outs on occasion of high usage so you're ability to control things can be limited in Texas for those unaware.

Unless of course you have a back up generator, but there are cons with that sort of thinking as well. (noise among others)

"ERCOT has mismanaged things even before the big freeze this past winter. But these things are 1 in 10 year or 1 in 20 year events."

It doesn't happen at all elsewhere. Texas has historically chosen to have its grid, ERCOT, exist as an electricity island without significant inter-connections. The only state to do so. Many of the interconnects around the US are inadequate and need updating but they still exist and function, often daily.

The consequences to the people of Texas of its grid choice are what they are. Bad decisions often have undesirable consequences. Like other things that happen there.

The consequences to the people of Texas of its grid choice are what they are. Bad decisions often have undesirable consequences. Like other things that happen there.

Like Californians moving here by the truck load? Now that Gov. Newsom is back in charge... the flow is only likely to increase. (Cali is not the only place people are coming from though)

So there's much more to this than mismanagement of ERCOT.

You can't overwhelm an electric grid without power hungry people. Cali is without power problems? I don't think so...

Certainly if ERCOT was actually doing their job -- the problem shouldn't have been as severe as it was.

Load shedding/demand management is not a new idea. It's certainly an appropriate strategy when user demand for electricity exceeds transmission capability--irrespective of the cost of electricity or what state you happen to live in.

Whether it's appropriate for a particular user to volunteer to participate in a load shedding program requires them to weigh a number of factors including their lifestyle and health needs and the performance of their particular home. Bumping a temperature setpoint up or down in a well-insulated home, for example, will have different implications than a poorly insulated one. Shedding the hot water heating load will have different implications for a large family or a single person and for a system which has a large versus a small tank.

As for me, I'd rather have the set-point of my air conditioner raised a couple of degrees than the alternatives if the alternatives are a loss of a power grid or rolling blackouts. But, that's a personal choice.

It's a tragedy either way ... seems the only workable recourses are 1) each home goes off-the-grid (solar? wind-generator? mini-nuclear?) or 2) makes-do without electricity.

Were you able to take any voltage readings at the thermostat and control board?

"Like Californians moving here by the truck load?"

Does this needless (and untruthful) slam have something to do with power grids?

Some friends of mine just moved to California from Texas, where they'd had to live for 5 years for family reasons. They couldn't wait to leave. This also has nothing to do with power grids but it's an example to show that the roads run in both directions.

If you don't include Uncle Joe's monopoly money welfare in Texas stinks so who could blame people for returning to California.

klem, Congress and state legislatures enact laws, not the President or governors. Sorry if that squelches your rhetoric.

My friend has enough money to perhaps buy you and certainly me and a few others put together. From Texas to California is a move from a rather lower cost of living region to a much higher one. As far as I'm concerned, you get what you pay for in this case. I've known a handful of people who've had to move to Texas for job reasons, none stayed longer than they had to.

I only know what CNN tells us and they give Uncle Joe credit for all that's wholesome and good . If you tell me CNN is untrustworthy,I'll believe you. I'm already suspicious of them.

No, I'll suggest that to be an informed person, we all need to consider a variety of sources (and a variety of political views) and then process what we've heard to be sure we understand.

The President heads an administration which like all others that does just that - they administer laws passed by Congress. A recent ADMININSTRATIVE change in the federal food stamp program (passed by Congress) will increase benefits by about $30 per person per month. That's a bit less than a massive giveaway. These are people who, for good reasons and sometimes for bad reasons, are at the very bottom of our society. I don't think they should starve. Do you?