HMF says that it is in the collection of Vintage Roses. I would contact them and ask if they will have it available in any of their future rose sales.

Jackie

Well do Jeri, thank you. I did try to message people who had it in their gardens, but they all had messages turned off.

I got "Elisabeth's China" and I love it so much!

I grew "Ferndale Red China" and "Korbel Canyon Red China" directly across a path from each other for about 8 years and, in my opinion, there was no difference between them. The leaves, bloom structure and color, slight cherry scent, plant structure, etc. were the same, Both will form tall (10'+) pillars if trained that way (I had one trained as such on one side of the path and the other trained as such on the other). Vintage's last catalog equated "Korbel Canyon Red China" with 'White Pearl in Red Dragon's Mouth' which, based on the clones of these I have, would not be correct, as my WPRDM has smaller, truer red flowers than the ones that seem a pinker red on FRC/KCRC (my FRC and KCRC came from Vintage and my WPRDM from Angel Gardens). WPRDM has also thus far stayed a compact, even small (for a China here) plant, very unlike KCRC.

A possibility might be that Vintage sent me a wrong plant for KCRC, but I still have the label, which definitely says "Korbel Canyon Red China". I unfortunately no longer have the plant since, because it was so identical to the Ferndale China, I removed it this year to make room for another rose.

There was a post and in it, there was definitely a difference. Korbel was darker. Maybe something else caused the bloom difference for them at that time idk.. even on HMF there is someone on there said they were the same. So idk they might be.

One thing to keep in mind is that the colors of China Roses are very very changeable. All of them I've seen darken in sunlight, and I've had "Elisabeth's China open inside as pretty much PINK all the way. So, I'd think that where you grew 'em, and what your conditions are will greatly affect their color.

"Elisabeth's China" opened outdoors

"Elisabeth's China" opened outdoors

"Elisabeth's China" opened indoors

I had the same thought, Jeri. Red China blooms, in particular, do vary widely in color, depending on the weather and the time of year

https://www.houzz.com/discussions/2986684/ferndale-korbel-cramoisi

That is the post, of who grew them and the difference. Let me know what you think.

I remember that thread! But, I would revise my comment on scents, as afterwards I would catch hints of cherry scent in the Ferndale rose sometimes, too -- for me, it's always been faint and very much depends on the weather and how recently the bloom has opened. As the plants both matured, too, any differences between the leaves and shrub habits disappeared, too. So, my opinion that the Ferndale and Korbel Canyon varieties are extremely similar, even identical, remains -- I certainly didn't find the Korbel Canyon flower color darker on the plant I had here.

They're pretty darn similar, though I feel like Korbel is a slightly richer/darker shade of pink. Its flowers are (I think) also slightly larger, though they don't look it in the samples above. The foliage is very slightly darker on Korbel, and the midribs may be slightly pricklier. I also think its flowers tend to be slightly looser and more open, but maybe that's my imagination. I like Korbel better--it's very free-blooming, and the color is (minutely) prettier.

That is what was said and if you flip them they are even different. With Korbel having streaking down the back. Same climate, same person growing it. The pictures are very through, and very good. The author of that post said they even preferred Korbel.