I guess I usually transplant that way. Just planted out a bunch of peppers doing exactly that. I make a hole that is deeper than the soil ball that comes out of the cup, set it in, and push dirt around it. As a result, the plant ends up in a natural depression. Well, maybe 1-2 inches deep. That's very handy for watering the seedlings, where you want the water to go just around the plant, and not dribble all over the bed. By the time the plants are getting large, and are no longer soft baby plants, you just fill whatever depression is still present with mulch. I really don't understand how this would be problematical. To the extent the depression starts to fill in naturally, who cares?

@daninthedirt (USDA 9a, HZ9, CentTX, Sunset z30, Cfa) I dont know how to word this. I did not really think planting deep is a problem specially since his garden is so successful. I was just very surprised. For years I have heard not to pile dirt and moisture around and up against the base of a plant for fear of rot. Some people will still tell you the same. But that may not be entirely true when done judiciously. I see why planting deep may be particularly important for the watering bit. I have soaker hoses/ drip irrigation throughout the area I plant so I water manually when planting and after that only if I want to or need to.

@floral_uk z.8/9 SW UKI knew about tomatoes but not about peas. Thanks!

Well, you did say "And thats not a problem?????" which suggested to me that you did think it was a problem. A plant is planted in soil so, at some level, there is always dirt piled around the base of it. That's true that *moist dirt" around the base of the plant isn't smart, but again, after you water, there is always going to be moist dirt there. I think the caution is to avoid having moist dirt permanently around the base of the plant. Good to let the soil surface dry out between waterings. Fungal diseases are well suppressed by that strategy. People tend to forget that the roots are well below the soil surface, and that's where it should stay moist. Once the soil surface dries out, it'll be at least several days before the root zone dries out.

Phytophthora, which is a common root and stem rot fungus, thrives in anaerobic conditions, which is what you get when lots of water is blocking root and stem ventilation.

This is a good conversation to have. Thanks for bringing it up.

I do like Charles too... a bit deeper for good root development and also a bit of a natural well around the plant for watering. By the time the seedlings get bigger, the depression is mostly gone, I assume it's because it's filled in well with the plant.

Part of it is the condition of your soil too. Charles has some nice light fluffy tilth going on- and that means there is a lot of air and room for the plants roots to grow and allow air around the stems. So there's less risk for the rotting/fungal issues. If his soil was more compact or less fluff, he might have issues planting in like that.

That's a good point. Fluffy soil drains effectively, so one never ends up with puddles around the plants. If your soil is less permeable, planting in a depression might not be smart. I dig in a load of compost before planting, so while my soil isn't naturally that fluffy, it drains well for young plants.

I think piling soil around the base of many woody plants is the issue, not plants that will grow roots from their lower stems. I think it can sometimes be helpful too, if the seedling stems are elongated.

I definitely do it with tomatoes and brassicas, and I remove the leaves that will be below soil level first.

Exactly. We’re talking about vegetables, most of which are annuals or biennials. You wouldn't do this with perennials, shrubs or trees. Although I plant deeper, I do not plant in a well. I firm plants in with soil right up to the stem. Dowding grows about 60 miles from me and irrigation isn't a big job in our area. Most water will arrive from the sky. Planting deep here is not for watering purposes. It’s for root development and sturdiness.

That's generally true about mature plants, but for young plants, and seedlings in particular, damping off and stem rot is caused by cool, wet stems. Also true that for plants with adventitious roots, like tomatoes in particular, moist soil against the stems can be useful. But most vegetables are not like that.

Many vegetables are like that ... all brassicas, sweet corn, peas, broad beans, squash even lettuce To a certain extent. All grow roots from the stems and I plant them all deep. Damping off is pretty much non existent outdoors and by the time they're big enough to plant out the danger of damping off is past anyway.

In more mature plants, we're not talking about damping off. We're talking about stem rot. Stem rot is fungal, promoted by overly wet stems, and can happen at all stages of plant growth.

https://cropwatch.unl.edu/soybean-management/plant-disease-phytophthora-root-and-stem-rot

https://extension.umn.edu/pest-management/phytophthora-root-and-stem-rot-soybean

Damping off can certainly happen outdoors. I've seen it happen when I direct seed. Fungal infection doesn't restrict itself to indoors. It is true that overwatering is more prevalent indoors, though.

Solanacea are largely the only plants that form roots from anywhere on the stem. Tomatoes do it better than peppers or eggplant. Other plants may form roots at stem nodes where leaves come out, which you may or may not have buried. Of course, maximizing stem support doesn't require growing roots from stems. You just bury the stem deeper, and with more stem underground, the plant will be more firmly anchored and stable.

“Solanacea are largely the only plants that form roots from anywhere on the stem.” Sorry, Dan, but that just isn’t correct. Many vegetables form adventitious roots. If you leave a cabbage in the fridge long enough you’ll see it sprout roots. Brassicas, Maize, many Cucurbits, eg cucumbers, and many Fabaceae, eg favas and peas, have this capability.

I think you mean that cabbage sprouts roots at the base, from root tissue where the roots were originally growing. Roots certainly don't come out of the leaves or stems topside. Adventitious roots are roots that form from non-root tissue.

I was referring to roots that can form from anywhere on the stem, which solonacea can do well. That being said, it's easier to get adventitious roots out of tomatoes than it is from peppers or eggplants. As I said before, other plants can form roots on the stem, but only at leaf nodes. That's not anywhere on the stem. This is explained very clearly for cucurbits here.

https://sites.udel.edu/weeklycropupdate/?p=14836

So if you want to root a cuke by planting it deeply, better bury a leaf node. I believe that's also true with legumes. Now, I think I've heard that adventitious rooting can also be induced where the stem is wounded. I try to avoid that! Also, I think adventitious roots can form on the stem above the root and below the cotyledons in seedlings (hypocotyl roots). That's kinda slick, and would suggest that piling soil up against stems below the cotyledons is smart.

The only plant I do that with is tomatoes -- they will form roots along the buried stem and are less likely to topple over when mature. IDK about the other vegetables mentioned above, never tried it.

I would not transplant annuals like that, especially those that are prone to stem rot like Vinca. I also wouldn't take the chance on shrubs or trees -- #1 rule when planting a tree is never bury the flare. NEVER.

No, Dan, that is not what I mean. Roots do come out of cabbage stems. At least they do here. I do know what adventitious roots are.

I know cabbage bases can grow out roots, not sure if that counts as stem or not. Sometimes I get cabbages from the farmers markets and I can cut off the top leaves and regrow a set of baby cabbage out of the base. I've never tried it with regular supermarket cabbage, it's usually super cleaned down. But the farmers market ones still often have their outer leaves and stem base on them and those can regrow. I pop them into a bowl of water to encourage the root start and new leaf pop to get my second round. I do this with other kitchen scraps like bok choi, radish tops,, celery, onions, and the occasional sweet potato gone green to get second rounds of eating out of my "garbage bins". Especially in the winter :) Right now I've got some parsnip and carrot tops in the bins too- more for green manure tea in a few weeks than for us to eat.

I've done deep seeding with brassicas with success before. It's where you punch a hole real deep into your little pot, then let the seed sprout up and get long before it clears the hole- then you pinch the hole shut. Been a couples years since I've grown from seed, been having other gardening going on.

I like to plant seedlings deep here because the soil is a heavy clay. Once planted deep I spread some of the clay soil over the top of the transplant area. The seedling mix is usually a peat mix during late spring plant out. If I don't cover the top of the peat it seems the roots never extend much out. I've been moving to starting some seedlings in containers with garden soil which seems to work better than the peat mix.

Thank you so much everyone for all this input. I was surprised by the deep planting of seedlings but with fluffy very well draining soil the rot issue I immediately worried about does not become an issue. Anyway, his method works. I like that almost every plant he grows from seed he transplants after starting the seeds indoors. I do the same. So its good to be versed on the most practical and effective methods for transplanting.

We veered into planting stems deep into the soil in general vs planting seedlings deeply, which actually can be quite different.

Probably you dont want to bury stems of most woody plants...but I routinely have buried one to two inches of the main stem of own-root rose bushes or several inches of stem above the bud union of a grafted rose when planting. The rose roots all along the buried stem by the end of the season and becomes healthier and more long lived. I dont remember seeing any leaf nodes in this region of the stem but there may be dormant nodes. I felt uncomfortable the first time I did this ..of course. And also you can bury the stems of raspberry and blackberry bushes from anywhere on the plant and they will root thickly without rotting. But this different from what a little seedling experiences.

@beesneeds: that is such a relevant example here. I have heard/seen it a thousand times that you can bury the bottoms of cabbage, cabbage like Chinese greens and green onions. They will root and give you green growth again. I think spinach and celery will work too. Just like @floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK said. You are right, it is important to have a critical amount of the right kind of tissue left at the bottom.

Yes, I regularly regrow my green onions and celery bottoms too. I haven't tried it with spinach, but I've regrown a head lettuce a couple times in the past when I've gotten a head in a produce box back when I still did Misfits. Root crops like radishes, carrots, parsnips, beets I don't regrow for roots, it's for the greens too.

Thanks, katyajini for the videos and post! That method will solve my problem with the nosy crows and squirrels plucking my pea seedlings. Both the row cover and the deep planting. This is my first year starting a portion of my pea seedlings inside. Dowding’s garden row setup is exactly like mine.