Doing a size experiment with "Sombreuil'

3 years ago

There was a recent thread on here about using English "Climber-Shrubs" as climbers in warm climates. I am trying to do the opposite - turning a very very tall (some have guessed that it is "indeterminant") rose into a medium tall shrub rose.

Our Fire Dept (with a recent law as backup) has insisted that we take all 9 of our HUGE climbing roses off our 118 year old, wood shingled Victorian house. So, we did take them all out, except for Sombreuil, because it is actually rooted 9 feet away from the house, with part of a brick patio between it and the house.

Below and After pictures are below - Sombreuil used to grow up 9 feet to the top of an arch, then sideways another 8-9 feet to the house, then up PAST the roof of the 3 story house (then it sent canes draping down, or going sideways, looking for more support!).

Since last Summer, we had our gardeners take 90% of it down (more than one trip to the dump!), and then prune it down further several times, until it is now about 8 feet tall from the floor of the patio, and 7 feet from the level of the soil. Of course, it is leafing out, and planning another asault on the house. My plan is to see how it blooms in the Spring, and then have it pruned periodically, to try and keep it as a 7 ft by maybe 3-4 ft wide shrub. Any thoughts or recommendations would be very helpful.

BEFORE - all of the white blooms are from the one rose.

AFTER -

Closer look at AFTER

BLOOMS, which are the reason I want to keep this rose.

Jackie

Featured Answer

jacqueline9CA
Original Author

3 years ago

Thanks so much, Jeri! I feel so lucky that you have experience with S. I was sort of expecting it to put out 12 ft long new canes, because that is what it does. We really don't have space for a huge S growing all over an arbor there, as that bed is sort of small island between the driveway and the smallish patio, and the patio is used every day for our tenants to come & go from their back door to the garage, and everyone's access to the garbage cans, my DH's access to the lawnmower storage area, and also as a patio. Also it is very near our next door neighbor's garage.

I think I will play it by ear, and see what it does in the Spring. Do you (or anyone) know what it might be likely to do if I just chop off the new long canes to much shorter when they show up? I keep having visions of the Fortune's Double Yellow I saw at a local park, which is kept about 7 ft by 6 ft, and blooms fabulously. Also I have seen banksia luteas kept actually tiny (2ft high by 3 ft wide) and blooming. Of course, I know this is some sort of hybrid wichurana and the lord only knows who, but I thought I would give it a try and see what happens. So many roses in my garden do things people say they cannot do. For once, I am not going to let it do what it wants to do - it will be a fun experiment, anyway.

Jackie

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Comments (7)

jerijen
3 years ago
last modified: 3 years ago
I'm probably the only person here who has actually done that, so I'll weigh in.

We had an extra one. We put it into the ground unsupported to grow as a Shrub. You know those 12-plus-foot-long canes? Well, they were STILL 12-feet long. The thing arched out 10-12 ft. in every direction, making it a madly thorny Shrub, some 20+ feet in diameter. And if you think its armament is impressive when affixed to a support . . . Imagine what it was able to do in a brisk sea breeze.

It might have worked had we trained it on a tripod of poles . . . But that would have meant thar we had to tie it to the poles. And having done that long ago with Mme. Isaac Pereire . . . let's just say it was not a fun experience.

I think what I might suggest is that you place an arbor next to the rose, and tie it to grow over THAT. You could put a small bench, or a statue or something under the arbor, to substitued for walking through it.
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Ingrid_vc zone 9b, San Diego Co. inland
3 years ago
I'm not an expert by any means, but wouldn't a living, healthy rose be more fire-resistant than the wooden house it's climbing on? Jackie, I hope your rose bounces back and will continue to give you those gorgeous frilly blooms, although of course on a smaller scale.
jacqueline9CA
Original Author
3 years ago
Thanks, Ingrid. MY DH agrees with you - he is still insisting that a well watered rose is less likely to catch fire than old wooden shingles (and also makes the house cooler). However, we don't get a vote - our county and also our town passed similar laws re reducing what they call "cultivated bio mass" near structures. As our vacation cabin in far Northern CA burned down to ash and melted metal in a forest fire storm a couple of years ago, we do get it.

I was very sad, but my DH built me a lovely gated and fenced against deer garden for roses across the driveway from the house, and we have and are moving some of the roses from the house into it. I will post pics in a couple of months.

Meanwhile - any comments on whether my plans for Sombreuil will work?

Jackie
Patrick-7a-MD
3 years ago
I tried to grow SOMBREUIL (aka Colonial White) as a tall shrub. And I did by constantly hard pruning it, which resulted in very few flowers. Actually a few flowers would have been nice. I got nothing. I said forget it, experiment failed, after getting mauled by the vicious thorns for the umpteenth time. That spot is occupied now by EARTH ANGEL and I am very happy with it. I have heard MME. ANISETTE is another disease resistant ivory rose worth considering.

Those Wichurana climbers should come with a warning label. Actually they do if you bother to look at the canes. DANGER!
stillanntn6b
3 years ago
Years ago, in the east where winter doesn't take kindly to most big climbing roses (with a few exceptions) someone said that the small bush Somb isn't that strong a grower. Buy the climbing verstion, get it established and then cut it back. Odds are it (for us) won't grow back big but as a more mannerly shrub.

The one Climber I had first time out had long, good canes. Someone cut it back while I wasn't watching, and it never regained its biomass. Its roots were in a fairly tight acidic red clay which may have contributed to its hesitancy to put on size wantonly.

(Your first picture makes me want to breath deeply with my eyes wide open.)
jacqueline9CA
Original Author
3 years ago
Thank you Patrick! Your response answered my question, at any rate. My S (aka CW) has only been pruned down to its current size for a few months, so I will see what it does in the Spring before I make any decisions. It does have several new shoots coming out of the old large canes near the bottom of it, so I have hopes... but who knows. I will let everyone know what happens.

Jackie