This question needs to be directed to your contractor. Then once the Change Order $$ is determined I would hand the bill to the architect.

They said there is nothing we can do… which is why I’m asking if that’s the case, or if others have figured out a work around

With zero design shown, and no pertinent information about the subfloor or other construction choices, your builder is in a better position to answer that than anyone here. Curbless are often retrofit, and the only way that it is usually "impossible" is with a post tension cable reinforced slab that prevents the concrete from being removed to create the correct slope for the room. Even then, it is possible, it is just crazy expensive to have the slab X rayed and marked for the cables, and in the different phases.

You have not listed the exact issues they list as being the hurdles they cannot overcome.

Contractors manage to install curbless showers in existing homes all the time. View this video for general info on how to do this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-db4d34MTiA

Here is the link to the thin Schluter Shower Pan

https://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/en_US/ShowerTrays

I would contact a contractor who specializes in curbless showers and fitting residences for handicapped access. They'll know the different options for your space. They can come in now and do the work for the least amount of money at this framing stage. Don't feel you need to rely on your contractor. He has removed himself from consideration. He said it's impossible. Forget him. Get what you need asap.

No framing changes are necessary.

And there's ALWAYS something that can be done. It's a matter of how much it will cost.

Joseph, that shower pan is a handy dandy dealio!

It’s just so frustrating. The shower is 7’x7’ and I don’t feel I should foot the bill. Shouldn’t the framers have caught it? Or the contractor?! Who’s considered at fault for this mistake?

If an ADA shower can be added to an already existing home, surely it can be added into your not yet built bathroom.

Who's fault is it? Might depend on the contracts. Were you in charge of signing off on the architects finalized plans before it went to the contractor? Or was the architect in charge of signing off on the finalized plans to hand over to the contractor? Or something else? If it wasn't in the plans and the contractor or framers didn't know, they wouldn't really be at fault for working with the approved plans.

Op post photos of what was built as well as a photo of the relevant plan detail and we can maybe provide suggestions. Otherwise we are all guessing.

If it's not on the plan, you can't blame the contractor or the builder. The architect is responsible for the plans, everyone else just implements it.

We had noticed a few times that specs were stapled up in our build that didn't state curbless. Every time a paper went up, we took a Sharpie and wrote CURBLESS to avoid this as well. How far along is framing? Hopefully, you caught it early enough to do the options that Joseph suggested.

The answer to who's at fault is in the title of your post.

IMO architects are not kitchen or bathroom designers and I never let one touch either of those spaces . Now listen to Joseph and IMO pick your fight carefully and this is IMO pretty small issue in the grand scheme of building a house.

Agree not a small issue at all. Also ridiculous not to expect an architect to be able to design a bathroom to include a feature you specifically requested, or in general.

Your solution should be worked out between you, your architect, and your builder; not online.

If you want actual help, you need to post actual diagrams and specifications. Plus pictures of in progress and what was built.

"Don't feel you need to rely on your contractor." This may qualify as some of the worst advice ever given on houzz.com. While the terms and conditions of residential construction contracts may vary, confusing the roles of architect, owner, and builder is a recipe for problems. Do what Mark Bischak advised and collaborate with your architect and builder to come up with a workable solution.

"The shower is 7’x7’ and I don’t feel I should foot the bill. Shouldn’t the framers have caught it? Or the contractor?! Who’s considered at fault for this mistake?"

Who designs a 7' x 7' shower? Is the family going to shower simultaneously?

Not a family, but a person that is wheelchair bound needs space for their equipment in the shower and potentally the room for a medical assistant to be there. 7x7 is bigger than the minimum, but probably not too large for future wheelchair use. I would imagine there are also grab bars (or at least the mounting studs planned in the framing) in there and probably the rest of the bathroom will be bigger and have grab bars too. Or if there aren't plans for grab bars, the OP might want to bring that up while speaking with the architect and contractor.

It might be part of a communication error to be asking for a curbless shower when the OP is wanting potentially an ADA shower. Not a huge difference, but one is a design want and has less rules that must be followed and the other is medical need and has more rules to follow in the build. Once a curbless goes ADA there are codes and often more expenses involved.

I might be mistaken, but I do believe that 7x7 would be too big to be code for a transfer shower. I think it's 3 feet or arms reach from the center to any wall so that would be a 6x6 max. But again if it's being built as a curbless and not ADA, the ADA codes wouldn't necessarily apply.

ADA regulations apply to public spaces not private residences.

I was also going to chime in about the size and getting a bath designer involved that specializes in ADA

Shes said she’ll likely need a wheelchair, which requires 5x5. Add in a helper and she’s def not out of the ballpark with 7x7. If you have the space and the resources, why not make life easier?

i agree to work it out with the builder and architect, perhaps send the product joseph posted to your builder. If he doesn’t do renovations, he may not be aware that there are options to make it work.

Someone building a home to help ease their lives when someone has a progressively debiliating disease has needs. they are specific. To downplay the importance of being able to shower (potentially with an aid, or a shower chair, or even a sling lift) is not very empathetic.

Maintaining hygiene and dignity for anyone with a disability or disease is very important.

You may want to find an aging in place or designing for disability specialist and have him / her review your plans and take a short pause in the build.

And your architect should have provided plans sufficient to build a curbless shower.

Hang in there - and consider getting some help to supervise this build and ensure your needs are met. You have a lot on your plate and this can quickly get overwhelming.

It shouldn't be a difficult mistake to correct and you definitely need the curbless feature so get the cost and timing of that work settled first. Who pays for it is a different matter; don't let it delay or prevent the correction or other work.

When I said pick your battles I did not mean this was minimal but who you fight with can create all kinds of issues.

"is there any way to retrofit our current shower to allow for a curbless entry?"

Yes. Work it out between you, your architect, and your builder.

"What can we do?"

Work it out between you, your architect, and your builder.

FYI you do not need a 7x7 shower to be fully accessible. You can create a full accessible bathroom in a pretty small space. Adding a helper can work with either of these, with just a little bit more room, as long as the whole is constructed as a wet room. Smaller baths are often easier to maintain comfortable temperatures while bathing. Large areas need larger amounts of supplemental heating in order for the user to not become chilled by the additional air volume. Going large because you can often results in something user unfriendly. This is why it is vital to have a designer involved who has experience with accessible living, aka aging in place.

I had a client that wanted their living space to be 100% barrier free. All bathrooms, the kitchen, bedrooms, all the spaces to be accessible to anyone in a wheel chair. They did until I pointed out their living space was on the second floor above a garage and an elevator was not in the budget.

This is not a little mistake, this is huge and I am sorry that your architect was not more careful.

If I were in your situation I would probably go to an attorney for a consult to help decipher contractual limitations and strength of your case (do you have written evidence that you communicated the need / weight of sign off on plans etc). The architect is responsible for meeting reasonable and ordinary standards of care in the performance of his duties. I think most architects would have ensured that the shower being built for someone who has MS and is likely to someday be wheelchair bound would be a curbless shower, especially if they built a shower this large, which indicates that they had knowledge of the circumstance, which would be interpreted as a failure to meet ordinary and reasonable standards of care.

Most likely your architect carries E&O (Error and Omission) insurance, so any finding in your favor should be covered by his policy.

Is running off to an attorney or engineer the default answer to every problem posted here?

Contract, schmontract. I don't care what it says because life isn't fair. It's all about the position of strength. You either have it or you don't.

Nearly a year ago, I got a fancy demand letter from a large reputable and powerful law firm; a shake-down for money from an ex-business associate. I was initially so intimidated that I offered a settlement (hey, this guy was good, I'll give him that), but they were too stupid to take my first, best, and final offer.

My attorney went back and forth with them and after some documentation, the dog never left the porch and even quit barking. I know what happened. My ex-associate's case was so weak, his big dawg lawyer wouldn't take it on contingency. If you don't have heaps of money to feed 'em, they're dropping you like a bad habit. He maybe had a case, but he had no money. At least not enough to make the cost/benefit analysis work.

Car wreck where you're the victim and big-pocket insurance company on the hook? You'll have lawyers fighting over your case on contingency. Dispute over residential drawings and wading through AIA boilerplate? Not a chance.

What is the framing below the shower? Is it a truss system or joists? Is it on a slab?

I agree that suing someone is usually not the answer (and most likely not here), but I have learned that having a good attorney review your build contract/agreement from the get-go can save a lot of issues down the road. They can help negotiate a better warranty and they can suggest changes that may not be in the homeowner's best interest but tend to be part of the standard builder's contract.

The OP should have some agreement with the GC that at least outlines change orders and who is responsible for signing off on plans. My uneducated guess is that unless there is something in writing somewhere about universal design or the curbless shower in particular, the charge for the change order will fall on the OP. However, the most important thing is for the OP to negotiate a change to the plan with her builder ASAP - it will never get any cheaper to make the change than right now.

Wow, the response on this post has been incredible! We are reached out to the tile installer, who is getting a rep to look at it and give us the easiest options we have. we also reached out to the engineer, who already sent us a plan to cut the joists, and box it out basically. The engineer said it should cost very much to redo it… just a matter of if we need to move any hvac or anything.

I just want a solution that is acceptable and I started getting frustrated when people started saying nothing could be done, which is why I decided to ask on this forum.

Thank you for all the wonderful advice! I’m not making it “ADA”, just curbless. We do plan of have extra backing out in the wall so I can add grab bars if needed in the future.

We will probably end up just dealing with the change bill, just a matter of how much each option is and the pros and cons.

*shouldn’t cost very much

I’ll update when we get pricing and finalize a solution

Shes said she’ll likely need a wheelchair, which requires 5x5. Add in a helper and she’s def not out of the ballpark with 7x7. If you have the space and the resources, why not make life easier?

5x5 = 25 square feet, and that's enough space to turn around IN the shower. Realistically, you'd go straight in /back straight out. And realistically, the question would be, Will the OP be able to walk a short distance into the shower, or will s/he need a hospital shower chair.

In contrast, 7x7 = 49 square feet, almost double the size of a 5x5 shower. This isn't making life easier; rather, it's eliminating the possibility of a shower pan, which is the easiest /most stable option, and it's adding a huge amount of wall to clean -- wall that won't be reachable with a single hand-held showerhead.

Someone building a home to help ease their lives when someone has a progressively debiliating disease has needs ... Maintaining hygiene and dignity for anyone with a disability or disease is very important.

Agree. If we were talking about simple aging (instead of a medical condition), I'd add that lack of adequate bathroom facilities is the #1 thing that sends people to nursing homes instead of being able to stay in their own home.

We had a similiar issue where the builder framed for a curbless in the main bath but did not for the second bathroom. We pointed out the error, he promptly fixed it said it was no big deal to re-frame that shower area.

@ Joseph Corlett, LLC - " Is running off to an attorney or engineer the default answer to every problem posted here? "

No, but there are times when an attorney can provide better advice than a boatload of people who don't know the law.

They can let you know where you stand and how to proceed.

It does sound like the original answer of "Nothing can be done about it now. Too late, too bad, so sad, sucks to be you" changed when the OP didn't accept this answer.

I am glad she didn't have to go that route, but it sounded to me that she was dealing with a bully and they were in the wrong. That is a time to go get an attorney and find out where you stand and if they are simply bullying you or if they have the upper hand.

In this case, the OP had a pretty strong argument.

I think the most important factor in sending elderly people to a nursing home is financial. In my experience, it is much more expensive to have in-home care and have to maintain your home than to sell it and then use the funds to pay for care in a facility. That's what we had to do with my Mom last year. The proceeds from the sale of her home were used for her care. And the worries and expenses of maintaining the house were eliminated.

She had a one room studio with a bath and kitchenette. The shower was probably about 3 feet by 5 feet at most, and was fine for her and an aide. It was a curbless shower with a shower curtain, linear drain and a pull-down seat. She was very happy with the situation.

Stop work. Gather with architect and builder. Don't be a drama queen.

The Amish ask why we send our elderly to institutions and call them homes?