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ostrich0001

Small narrow tree for my zone 4a backyard

last year

Hi everyone,


I am wondering if you can give me some advice or opinions on this please. I have a spot in the backyard that I would like to plant a tree that is narrow (perhaps up to 6 feet wide) and not too tall (probably around 12-15 feet) in a sunny spot. Ideally, it would have a multi-stem look as that is what I am going for. What are your suggestions please? I am trying to avoid columnar trees like the aspens, crabapple (I have several already), and anything that cannot tolerate clay soil!


I am currently considering a serviceberry Standing Ovation. What else do you suggest please, even if it means that I have to prune it to create that multi-stem look that I like please? Thanks in advance!

Comments (34)

  • last year

    Star Magnolia and Crepe Myrtle are two more to look at.

    ostrich thanked dan1888
  • last year

    I don't believe Star Magnolia of Crepe Myrtle will grow that far north.


    While it eventually becomes a large tree, what about a multi trunk paper bark birch. I believe a lilac can be trained to a multi stemmed tree like bush.

    ostrich thanked KR Nuttle
  • last year

    Check out some forms of European hornbeam, like Carpinus betulus Monument.

    ostrich thanked David Gray
  • last year

    What you are describing is a shrub - something very like common lilac.

    ostrich thanked mad_gallica (z5 Eastern NY)
  • last year

    Acer pseudosieboldianum (Korean Maple).

    ostrich thanked BillMN-z4a
  • last year

    Star Magnolia are tree hardy to -30F. The spring blooms can be affected by a late frost. Plant to get some morning sun and in a spot protected from West winds.

    Crepe Murtle would be more challenging.

    • Outdoor Planting If you choose to plant outdoors (at your own risk), select a variety known for its cold hardiness (some are bred to tolerate zone 6 and even warmer sites in zone 5). Plant in a full sun location and insulate the roots with a thick layer of mulch in late fall. Be aware that even with protection, the plant may die back to the ground and regrow from the roots in the spring.
    • Chickasaw Crape Myrtle
    • Hopi Crape Myrtle
    • Natchez Crape Myrtle
    • Sioux Crape Myrtle
    • Tonto Crape Myrtle
    ostrich thanked dan1888
  • last year

    The limiting factor is the width of 6', especially since you don't want columnar or fastigitate. I think I understand the look you're after, but something like Amelanchier 'Standing Ovation' is going to have the upright/fastigiate habit, which you don't want.

    Crape Myrtle is a non-starter in z4. Would you consider a conifer?

    ostrich thanked maackia
  • last year
    last modified: last year

    Would an Elder work? Maybe a golden or dark leaved cultivar. Some of the dark ones have pink flowers. I believe it would be hardy in Z4 and it will grow as a tall multi stemmed shrub. Easy enough to prune if the width starts to get too much.



    ostrich thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
  • last year

    ^^ Lace leaf elder

    ostrich thanked L Clark (zone 4 WY)
  • last year

    Thank you everyone! You have provided me with some really great suggestions!!!


    It's funny that dan1888 mentioned Star Magnolia - I was just looking at one at Home Depot yesterday! I really like the unique shape of the leaves and how uncommon it is around here! That said, it may be uncommon here for a good reason! LOL! Just like dan1888 suggested, I am worrying about the late frost that we tend to get here....sigh! If I wait for a whole year and then the buds will be damaged by a late frost, I would be so MAD! LOL! But it is a very unique choice for here though, so I am still wondering.... :-) Thanks!


    I am not sure that crepe myrtle would grow here - I have never seen on here in Canada. If it does survive here, it would be a lovely, lovely tree to have!!!


    KR Nuttle and mad_gallica, I was wondering about a lilac trained as a narrow tree too! In fact, I was just a the local university here today and saw some that were pruned beautifully into small tree forms. I love that! The very airy and architectural form is exactly what I am going for here! Maackia hit it on the head of the nail by saying that I was not looking for something columnar! If I go with a lilac, what would be a good one to have that would not get out of hand please? Some lilacs here get so wild and out of hand that it is a bit scary,,, LOL!


    Speaking of training a shrub to a multi-stem, leggy and airy form, what do you think about something like viburnum triloba (e.g. Redwing)? Has anyone done that successfully please?


    BillMN, Korean Maple would be absolutely lovely! But they are so hard to find a round here, and they are still a bit borderline too...but that wouild be a spectacular choice!


    maackia, I have seen some photos of the Standing Ovation Serviceberry being trained to look more like a multi-stem tree! I wonder how that may work? It is obviously hardy and does well here (esp since serviceberry is native!) I really wonder how that might work here? I am not sure about a conifer as I am looking for someothing airy here.... any suggestion here please regarding conifers please?


    floral and L clark, you read my mind! Actually, in that area, I have already some Golden Tower elderberries! So I was wondering if I should do a Black Lack elderberry in that area too? I hesitated because they thing died on me twice already in my yard! It was so susceptible to some type of wilt that it was never that reliable for me. I don't know why??? Otherwise, yes, it would have been a really amazing choice! I may still try though.... thanks!


    Thank you everyone! Please keep the great suggestions comoing!





  • last year

    My Black Lace elder is doing well. It’s pretty dang cold here

    ostrich thanked L Clark (zone 4 WY)
  • last year
    last modified: last year

    When recommending things to plant, I did not mentions Rose of Sharon. We had one in Indianapolis, so it should with stand the temperatures in Zone 4. It grows well. The ones we have are now about 10 feet tall, and I have to keep them back. The branches with leaves are about 5 feet off of the ground, and provides some shade. I can walk under it only slightly bowing my head. It can easily be mowed under while I am on my lawn tractor. Right now they are in full bloom.


    I am currently about 20 miles east of Raleigh North Carolina

    ostrich thanked KR Nuttle
  • last year
    last modified: last year

    That's early... mine doesn't bloom until August. I'm not convinced it would survive in Z4. I've read z5.

    ostrich thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
  • last year
    last modified: last year

    When it comes to conifers, short, narrow, and airy is a challenge. How about something beautiful and airyish? ;)


    ostrich thanked maackia
  • last year
    last modified: last year

    Maackia, thank you! That is a very lovely conifer! I would love it have it somewhere in my yard, just not in that spot.... but thank you though!

    KR Nuttle, thank you for your suggestion. I am not sure that Rose of Sharon is my favourite thing and I don't think that it does well here... but thanks for your thought though! I appreciate it :-)

    L Clark, regarding Black Lace, I think that it is the soil that I have here that was causing verticillium wilt (did I spell that right!? LOL) so it's not the temperature... after having 2 collapsing on me, I thought that I might try something else....

    I went to some local garden centres today (FINALLY I had time to do so!). It was super helpful. Now I am considering these options:

    1. Mount Royal Plum - not quite the multi-stem look but I somehow would love to have some sweet plums to eat!!! What do you think???

    2. Sensation French Lilac - they can be pruned into a multi-stem shrub/little tree - I wonder if that would be nice??? Or other lilacs like Beauty of Moscow? Or Charles Joly (spelling?)?

    3. Amur Maple - they had some multie trunk specimens but then I worry that it will get too big for that space...

    4. Redwing Cranberry bush - the lady there said that I could train it so that it will have that multi-stem leggy look with the crown at the top... what do you think?

    5. Dwarf Korean lilac top graft standard tree - I do have that elsewhere in the yard and it is very pretty.... perhaps I can repeat it there too? OK, it is not a muilti-stem thing but it is pretty and the size is good..

    Decision, decision, decision!!! I would value your opinions on these narrowed down options please! Thank you..

  • last year

    Here's a photo of the area in question, OutdoorTV Life Cabinet by IntelliCube:



    You see right in the back where I have this almost dead Elderberry Black Lace? This is where I need a little tree or something there.... thanks!

  • last year
    last modified: last year

    Why the spam in what appeared to be a genuine question originally?

    ostrich thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
  • last year

    Floral, I totally fell for it!!! Oops!!!

  • last year
    last modified: last year

    That outdoor TV spam is a regular nuisance on these forums.


    That Elder certainly looks very unhappy. Strange total collapse of an apparently healthy shrub. But it's much too large a shrub for that space anyway imo. Do you really want to stop traffic between the lawn and the gravelled area? Looks like a useful path to me. How about climbers on the fence instead of a shrub/tree?

  • last year

    Hi Floral, thanks! I had no idea that that was a company that spams these forums! YIKES! Thanks!


    Floral, it is actually good that I am showing you all this photo! This is actually an area that I need to have something to create some privacy. I do not typically use this pathway to get in and out of the yard - we use the other side. So this side needs to have something to "close off" the yard from the fence gate but still allow me access to the gate when I need to. That's why I wanted to have something skinnier and taller there.


    In terms of climbers, I just don't know what does well for that area that provides some structure even during winter? Some climbers here are very small but some are massive and they are not very "structural" or "architectural" as I would call it! LOL! I am really desiring something that is more architectural hence the thought of a multi-stem little tree or a leggy shrub....


    Thoughts please? Thank you!

  • last year

    You have a metal trellis/screen on the right. Can you get another for the left and grow Clematis or a rose up it? The screen itself would provide winter structure. And in Z4 how often are you out there looking at it?😉

    ostrich thanked floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
  • last year

    Hi Floral, you have sharp eyes!! Yes, there is a trellis there, and I absolutely can get another one on the other side!!!


    In terms of climbers, I can get a clematis for sure.... being in zone 4a, the choices are not great! LOL! I do have a John Davis rose elsewhere that is climbing up the trellis nicely.... but some other Canadian hardy roses could be huge for that area though.... let me think.


    But my family wanted something to provide some separation from the house next door, that's why we were thinking of a small tree.... I am wondering more about the Mount Royal plum now. But if the tree is only like 6 feet away from the house foundation, I wonder if that is a problem?


    Thanks again!

  • last year

    I actually think the serviceberry Is a good idea. When we put in a brick patio, our landscape designer put one in. It is against a house wall, so it does arch toward the south. But I liked it so much that I put in a second one in a back shrub/tree border. The early May white blooms don’t last long, but the leaves are a nice green and the burnt orange fall color is spectacular. I initially worried about berries on the patio, but not an issue at all - the birds do all the cleanup. I have had to spray some years - aphids? I think? And this year with the crazy rain and 90 degree heat some of the leaves are turning yellow (end of June in upstate NY) - that has never happened before. But a lot of my plants are showing the stress from these unusual weather conditions. Important: I had a different landscaper put in the second one in the back border. He arrived with one that was very bushy and I insisted that he find another one with a more multiple trunk shape..

    is spectacular.

    ostrich thanked chloe00s
  • last year

    Sorry - I was trying to edit, but somehow posted. I am not familiar with the particular variety you mentioned, but if you do a serviceberry, do insisted on a young one with just a few multiple branches. One of mine is nearly 40 yrs old, the other s 20 yrs, and both have a nice shape.

  • last year

    Just looked up the Standing Ovation variety. That is different - oval, columnar shrub looking vs. a multiple
    trunked small tree. I would say that my old variety of serviceberry might be as much as 8 to 10 ft total width, but definitely has a small multi-trunk tree shape, with branches starting about 5 ft up. Airy branching, though, NOT like a crabapple.
    .

    ostrich thanked chloe00s
  • last year

    chloe00s, thank you! I would love to get hold of a multi-stem serviceberry, but it is almost impossible to find one around here! YIKES! I went to 3 major nurseries/greenhouses and none of them has one this year!!! So annoying....


    Would you by any chance have a photo of these beauties please? I would love to see what they grow up to be... thank you!

  • last year

    " Oh, I haven't done anything. I just wanted to give some advice. This is clearly a forum that has nothing to do with my business."

    And yet you persist on posting in the landscaping forms on topics you clearly know nothing about. Why is that? Please let us know how a Chinese company specializing in so-called "intelligent" furniture can offer meaningful or even slightly viable advice on plant specific landscaping questions.


    "Floral, it seems you have some misunderstandings about me."

    Actually, she has pretty much nailed the situation!

  • last year

    Maybe a columnar Swedish Aspen. My neighbor has one that is staying very skinny

  • last year

    Here is the one in back in bloom

    ostrich thanked chloe00s
  • last year

    L Clark, thank you! I know that Swedish Aspen can do well here, but they are now suffering from some disease that is wiping them out around here.... also, I am looking for something that is a little bit different as there are lots of Swedish Aspens around here already... but thank you though! :-)


    chloe00s, that is so pretty! Thank you for the photo! I love your wooded look there. It's a gorgeous environment! We don't have those tall trees here far up north here, so I am really envious.... your serviceberry is GORGEOUS! But I am wondering if that would be now too big for my area??? I need to see one in real life around here as things are usually proportionately smaller around here due to our very cold climate! LOL! Anyway, thanks so much! I really appreciate it!

  • last year
    last modified: last year

    I believe some Crataegus would be hardy for you and they are available as multi stems. https://www.deepdale-trees.co.uk/trees/2020/03-crataegus-coccinea.html

  • last year

    That Serviceberry tree is fully mature - 20+ yrs old, so as big as it’s ever going to be. Width seems to be at the top. It has never been pruned. It could be pruned back a bit, if needed.

    ostrich thanked chloe00s
  • last year

    floral, thank you! Yes, crataegus (hawthorn, I think, right?) would do fine here. I actually had one of them when I lived in Calgary before. It's lovely BUT it was a magnet for aphids!!! I hated that so much! LOL! So I swore I would not do it again.... sigh! But thanks for the thought though!


    chloe00s, thanks! It is really lovely. I actually was with a friend looking around my yard this evening... and she thought that a move oval skinny shape would look the best there.... now that she said it, I actually agreed .... maybe I should go with the Serviceberry Standing Ovation?


    Well, now that I agree accepted that kind of shape, perhaps it will open up more options for me!? Oops!