I agree. Nothing with Nitrogen for the rest of the season.

Fertilizers with slow acting N can be the most dangerous, keeping growth active on into the Fall.

Funny you post this today, PM2 - we always seem to be on the same page lol! Just this morning I was thinking about fertilizing and whether I should. Honestly, I have never been big on fertilizing anything, but last year, with the introduction of more shrubs into my garden, I started using Hollytone and Plantone. I'll have to double-check the label but I did think they recommended a second application after the spring one. Could it already be too late for that?? I'll have to check the bag.

I was, however, definitely going to give some seaweed fertilizer to my potted annuals and veggies. I think the recent heat wave and dry conditions have taken a toll. The weather the last few days has been quite nice and we had a nice rain a few nights ago, and things have perked up, so I think I will give them a bit of the seaweed fertilizer.

:)

Dee

You can fertilize annuals to your heart's content right up until they die off from frost/cold weather. I also wouldn't be concerned about fertilizing perennials you normally cut back in fall. But it is against recommended practice to fertilize any woodies after midsummer/beginning of August. The new growth that would encourage does not have enough time to ripen sufficiently to withstand winter cold, resulting in dieback and sometimes death.

Other than containerized plants, I rarely ever fertilize with anything stronger than compost.

Dee - you are early rather than late for the 2nd application of Holly-tone. Spring and late fall. My acid loving shrubs really benefit from the late fall application (especially if I get a late start to spring fertilizing!).

Okay, well…the advice I’d read in The Well Tended Perennial Garden, advised July as the last time to fertilize. So I was thinking if it was only Aug 4th that might be close enough to July. But… I’ve read all your comments and I can forgo the fertilizer. One more season without doing it, isn’t going to be a big deal.

I don’t normally fertilize at all when it comes to shrubs or trees. Just annuals, perennials and roses. And I always just use Seaweed/fish emulsion and compost. I have bags of Plantone and Hollytone but I rarely use it. I have put Hollytone on my hollies if the leaves start yellowing, that’s usually all I ever find the time to do and I just don’t remember it at the right time to do it. And hasn’t fertilizers and everything garden related, gotten so expensive?

I have felt torn. I thought shrubs should be able to do fine with the natural soil they were in. I certainly have a Kolkwitzia that is over 40 years old and never gets fertilizer and performs great. And is more drought tolerant than anything else on the property.

But…this spring I added Planttone to a Ninebark, because last spring I did that for the first time and I could see that it responded very well. I think our climate has changed and it is challenging for the plants. So maybe they could use the help. And it’s organic and it’s just sitting there being wasted.

Bill, that’s a good point, that the slow acting might be more of a problem.

Dee, my garden has taken a hit from the heat and dryness too and I am planning to do the same with annuals and veggies. I’m surprised that my tomatoes and peppers did not do as well this year and I wouldn’t think the hot weather would be a problem for them. Oh well, next year. [g]

GGal, I leave my perennials up all winter and clean up in the spring.

Design Fan - Late fall for acid loving shrubs - would be the Hollies and the Hydrangeas? I could try that. Late Fall would be late November?

prairiemoon - I use Holly-tone in late fall (late November - early December) on my rhododendrons, andromedas, blueberries, hydrangeas, and evergreens and dogwoods planted in the last 5 years. They respond well to the boost.

Thanks DFan - I have a few of those acid lovers, I just couldn't remember all of those that are acid lovers. And I'm really glad to be able to apply it in late November because spring is so busy with so much to do, fitting in a round of fertilizer to so many woodies is not easy. Do you apply it again in March if you did it in November?

I do a fall application but I don’t always get around to a spring application for everything in March as it just so busy. I do apply it to the blueberries in spring as my berry bushes/plants do better with multiple feedings.

Yes, I just checked the hollytone bag and it said apply "in spring and fall".... so I'm a little confused here lol. Do we or don't we? (apply in fall?)

No big deal if Ishouldn't. Like I said last year was the first time I ever really fertilized, and as PM2 said I either don't remember lol or don't find the time. I was rather proud of myself that this spring I fertilized every shrub in my garden and in my daughter's garden.... a week or two late haha, but still...

PM2 I was thinking the same thing - I thought for sure this heat would be great for my tomatoes, but they aren't lookin so great. Although, honestly, I think once again it is neglect on my part. I helped my son-in-law put in a garden this spring, with the same winter-sown seedlings I planted, and his is doing great. But, somehow, despite working and taking care of twin toddlers, he finds time to get out there and do stuff. (This man makes the energizer bunny look like a lazy bum lol). He has tied up and staked all his tomatoes, has his squashes and cukes on trellises, constantly monitors and waters when needed, and watches for pests too. For a first garden, he is doing great and so are his tomatoes lol. I'm so happy he's so into it, as my daughter has absolutely no interest in gardening, which always saddened me. Now I have him to chat garden stuff with!

:)

Dee

Dee - you really lucked out with your son in law!! That's a real blessing after a daughter with no interest. lol

As for the fertilizing- congrats on getting all your shrubs done in the spring. I've done one. lol I think the differece in the schedule is it's not really Fall that you apply it's late Fall. Late November/early December. I'd assume the shrubs are dormant at that point and if you apply now, in beginning of August, they are going to have a growth spurt which will make them vulnerable going into the winter. I think I have that right.

In my colder zone, I could fertilize in the Fall.

Fall here meaning late October, first half of November.

But I've had just as good or better results to fertilize late winter to early spring, as soon as the frost is out and before the plants wake from dormancy.

The reason being, Nitrogen is very gaseous and volatile and depending on soil type and temperatures, much of it can be lost if it sits too long in the ground, especially if it rains a lot and you have porous soil.

It helps if the ground gets very cold or freezes soon after application.

Depending on these variables, there's no way of telling how much you lost and most likely, your plants will still do better than if no fertilizer was applied at all.

TBH, I don't use a lot of fertilizer here but if I don't use any, parts of my sandy, nutrient poor soil won't grow grass, even if it rains (it does survive, just doesn't grow).

My problem always has and always will be, having too much to do in the spring. As much as my intentions are good....the almost full bags of fertilizer in the garage, tell a tale. [g]

We had an unusual season last year. We had really good rain and frequently and I was amazed at how much better all my plants and trees looked. It was good timing because the previous season we had a late cold snap and had damage to our Japanese Maple and it recovered pretty well last year. And it really showed me that most seasons, my garden doesn't get enough rain and can perform a lot better.

We also have a LOT of trees around our property. Mature Silver Maples, Maples, Spruce, Sycamore, White Pine. All in a very small space and their root systems must cover most of my property. I would assume that those tree roots are robbing us of water and nutrients.

I would like to see just what result I would get if I paid more attention to fertilizing. Late November should be easier for me to find the time to do that. And actually, the 'Tones' are slow acting natural organic, so using them early in the spring, seems like the effect would be delayed. If you put it down in November, maybe it's just becoming available in the spring? The analysis of Plantone - is 5-3-3 and the Nitrogen is from Feather Meal/Poultry Manure/Bone Meal/Alfalfa Meal.

Like anything else, we all have to do what works for each one of us. ;-)

In late winter/early spring, I'm generally walking around, checking things over and waiting for the last frost date that could be 2 months away! So, a lot of time to do all the early stuff like fertilizing and such.

I use a fair amount of compost on most everything I grow, so if I'm off a little on my fertilizer applications, it's not immediately noticeable and surly no need to panic. ;-)

One thing I've learned through soil tests and experience, a little N is necessary, in combination with any balanced nutrient program. IOW: The plants can have everything they need but with zero N, they just won't be able to use all the other nutrients to perform effectively (and the source or type of the N isn't always critical), generally speaking.

And the plants don't need much so if you see improvement using a little N, that doesn't mean more is better (could be worse).

I also have a couple trace minerals missing at my place too, that show an increased response when I supply them.

But everyone has to get to know their own conditions and situation because there are so many variables to take into account with gardening, so one person in another area, can give their own personal experience, but that situation may differ widely from the one getting the advice.

bill

Sound observations Bill. I agree with all that. And I've had my soil tested and have had more than enough of everything, I have clay soil], and I mulch with leaves every year. The one thing I am short on has always been Nitrogen. What do you use as a source of Nitrogen? I should be more consistent in providing it. I'd want a natural source.

Most garden soils will test out as being nitrogen deficient. In fact, many soil testing labs do not test for N at all. That's because it is the most mobile of any of the essential plant nutrients and can fluctuate widely depending on time of year and even the time of day and the weather.

Generally, mulching generously with compost or composted leaves (non-composted leaves are users - not providers - of N) will provide sufficient N but you can supplement with alfalfa meal or alfalfa tea, which also offers other garden soil benefits as well.

pm2,

Microorganisms contribute a large portion of nitrogen in the soil by digesting OM.

Earthworms contribute a fair amount depending on their numbers.

Certain decomposing materials too.

Even lightning creates nitrates that are water soluble and are absorbed into the soil via rainwater.

So generally, if your soil is in a healthy, balanced state, lack of nitrogen may be a moot point.

;-)

Bill, that's good to know. It also explains why your plants seem to be benefited so much from a rain or lightning storm as well. Sometimes they look better than simply water explains.

So, yes, if your soil is healthy - if your plants are healthy - then you have no reason for questioning the nitrogen, but if you're looking at underperforming plants and a soil check shows everything else ok, then maybe Ntirogen? Or pH?