Please help tapla

14 years ago

I feel like we left off on a bad note. I was seeking your help with trying a mix between your media and mine. Let me start by repeating what I usually use:

2 parts perlite (for aeration)

1 part vermiculite (for moisture and nutrient retention)

1 part pea gravel (for more aeration and drainage)

1/2 part live "humus" (made in a bin for the colloidal structure and microbes)

I was thinking of trying turface MVP for the CEC, but I am unsure if this will cause a water retention issue with the vermiculite. I would like to get your opinion on a mix that still includes my composted humus (I know you disagree but I have found it invaluable through my trial and error).

I was thinking:

1 part turface

1 part perlite

1 part gravel

1/2 part humus

I have access to perlite, vermiculite, pea gravel, crushed granite, turface, bark and peat moss (I really detest peat moss because it makes soup, not soil).

As far as conditions I live in 9b in Fl, high humidity during summer, low in winter, I water as needed (usually that is daily) with diluted 12-4-8 fert (micros with foliar spray). I will be using the mix for vegetables, namely tomatoes, beans, and lettuce (if it works well I'll use it to repot my herbs and roses).

Any coments would be appreciated and I am open to suggestions.

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Comments (9)

dickiefickle
14 years ago
why not try sending a message to him ?
tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
14 years ago
I don't know how I can help, Bob, other than to make some general comments. I had several paragraphs written and I deleted them because they sounded preachy to me, and I don't want to come off that way.

I would suggest you're careful that the peastone isn't too large. Mixed with the Turface & perlite, it may have a tendency to separate if it's indeed 'pea' size or larger.

FWIW - if you're using vermiculite in the hope of increasing CEC, it's good to remember that CEC is measured on a per weight basis, but in container culture, we work on a per volume basis. Example: While on a per weight basis the CEC of exfoliated vermiculite is about 3X greater than that of, say Turface, Turface has a bulk density at least 7X greater than that of vermiculite, making it a much better choice re that particular property on a per volume basis.

Best luck!

Al
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Bob1016
Original Author
14 years ago
Thanks Al, I might for go the vermiculite to use turface instead. I remember reading (it might have been one of your posts or another source, not sure) that the shape of crushed granites and marbles induces branching in the roots, if this is true then I might use one of these products instead of the gravel.
Usually the gravel is about the same size as the perlite (if not slightly larger), what size granite would you recommend?
tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
14 years ago
Ideal would be 3/32 to 3/16". PWTs disappear as uniform particle size approaches about .110".

Al
Bob1016
Original Author
14 years ago
So now my revised mix is:
1 part perlite (sifted to remove dust)
1 part turface (1/16"-1/8")
1 part crushed granite (~1/16"-3/16")
Handful / container humus (just a top dressing really)
I think this will be a good place to start. Thanks for the help Al, I really do appreciate it.
tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
14 years ago
No problem - You have a referral if you'll follow the embedded link.

Al
gymgirl2
14 years ago
Uh, Bob,
This past spring of 2011, I grew the best tomato crop I ever had, in free-draining, 6.5 gallon buckets, using a modified version of Al's 5-1-1 container mix. He and I discussed at GREAT, GREAT, GREAT lengths, and I worked with a 3-1-1 mix of:
3 parts pine bark fines
1 part perlite
1 part MG potting mix as the peat component (re-purposed from the previous season...)

I watered with a water soluble fertilizer in his recommended ratio of a 3-1-2, using MG Water Soluble Plant food for Veggies (24-8-16).

I am a very happy person...sure wish I knew how to post pics on this website....

Linda
Bob1016
Original Author
14 years ago
For pics, you have to upload them from your desktop to photobucket (or something similar) then ad the HTML to the posting.
I'm thinking 7 gal containers for mine (white because of the heat in Orlando), filled with the new mix I listed above, I'm debating on adding bark or not. I am not a fan of peat based mixes at all, the only organic component I like is my humus because it does not decompose any more (humus is what you get when organic matter is broke down as far as it can ,
It litteraly cant breakdown more) but it does eventually dissipate and fill in some of the air holes. Although it is peat based, it is no longer peat, it is truly colloidal humus.
Your mix does have the components of a good mix: aeration, water retention, high adsobancy, and slow decomp. It would be great for our winters here, but no peat will withstand Florida humidity and heat in summer.
For fert I use a low, continual dose of MG 12-4-8 with a few othe components so I can attend to the plants individual needs, but for some seasons I just do straight MG; results are good but not as good, but still better than people who use straight potting soil.
Thanks for thi input, Bob
ssmdgardener
14 years ago
Bob, I'm very interested in hearing about how your experiment turns out. I'm not a fan of peat myself, but the 5:1:1 is working great for me so far. I'm looking forward to seeing your updates!