Hi, Paul. The hay field should present no special challenge because of the hay. First recommended step is to get a thorough soil evaluation through your extension service. Misterbaby.

Paul- Where are you? I'm in Eastern Washington and here hay fields are usually in need of some fertilizer before they're replanted. Are there other types of fields nearby? I only ask, since crop dusting, other fertilizers, water runoff etc. might be a concern, if you're planning to grow vegetables.

Another thing to be aware of is that every nearby weed and field crop (if any) will probably appear in your field, once the soil is turned over. I'm sure you're used to that in town, but it's amazing how many different weeds you find in the country.

Congratulations on your future garden. Please let us know how you progress and maybe include some photos :)

rovenorth,

Congratulations. Your situation is identical to mine. Without question, you need a soil test. Haying can be hard on nutrients as the entire crop is removed from the soil unlike field crops where most of the plant is incorporated back into the soil. Weeds will be a major problem forever. Either submit to using chemicals or get ready to till constantly, in which case you're burning a lot of fuel. Of course, you could buy mulch if you can acquire that much or afford it. There is usually a plethora of critters (mice,voles,etc.) that have called that hay field home as well.

Good luck,

Brook

I'm from southern Ohio and we must be talking about different crops. Lots of people raised hay to feed to livestock - clover, alfalfa, Timothy, - and it was rotated with crops such as corn and tobacco because it returned so many nutrients to the soil. The fields were plowed under in the spring and usually disked several times before planting. Weeds were never a concern, probably because the crops were mowed in the fall.

Different type of hay?

Mike

wordwiz-
It might not be more of a difference in land management practices and climate than a different type of hay. Most hayfields around me have been hayfields or pasture for decades. They also seem to be in areas that maintain more ground moisture during the summer when little to no rain is normal for months (unless you don't want rain because it will spoil your hay, then it rains). The number of viable commercial crops that can be grown is limited due to the cost or availability of irrigation.

OK, that helps explain it a bit. No one irrigates around here, everyone relies on the skies for water!

When farmers here "turn the clover over" I'm talking about plowing ground at least six inches deep, usually closer to eight. The idea has always been to break what dad called "the hard plane" or the depth of the soil that the ground froze to during the winter.

For the last couple of years, I've sown winter wheat or ryegrass in my garden. I mow it in early May (let it grow as long as possible) then till the ground so the roots get chopped up and mixed in the dirt. I cannot get deeper than about five inches but that stuff is worth a ton of fertilizer.

One thing to consider: if you have a soil analysis done, which is a great idea, if you add the roots or foliage to the dirt, it is going to change the pH, probably quite a bit (more than likely raising it, at least over time).

HTH,

Mike

Here, hay fields are not always rotated and it's usually grass hay or alfalfa hay. The grass hay is often just grass (maybe a little clover) without a lot of amendments to the soil. Some people let their animals out on the field, after the haying is over, to get a little fertilizer back in the ground.

It sounds like you have a nice spot for crops. I'd be hesitant to spray poison on your field. Are you growing it for yourself, or hoping to sell certified organic crops, or maybe some other possibility? Also, none of my business I know, but are you moving onto this land, or just converting it into crops? That makes a difference too, I think, once you know you might live on the land, what you want to put on it. You might want to talk to some farmers in your area. Most farmers are pretty helpful, once they realize your serious about growing crops and really want some advice. You might even get some offers for cheap or free aged manure and mulch, depending on who lives nearby. When we first moved out here, one of the large-scale farmers drove by and swathed (cut) our hayfield for us. Did it for free, since he had equipment in the area and thought our horses were nice little guys, as he called them. These farmers can surprise you :)

First it depends on what type of hay was grown and how much other plants are growing. High levels of alfalfa consume lots of phosphate, sulphur, and boron, but their large and deep roots can bring nutrients from deep down and they are able to produce their own nitrogen, plus they help break up and improve the soil. When the roots decay, this nitrogen will be released.

Grass hay consumes lots of nitrogen but doesn't deplete the others as much. Grass forms a heavy mat of roots near the surface, which will still release a lot of nitrogen and other nutrients when they decay, plus all those roots help build soil structure.

So--get your soil test, work whatever is growing there under, and plant when the roots have been broken up enough not to interfere with your planting. Hay fields tend not to have as many weeds because they get mown off, though perennial weeds may be a problem.

It is often a good idea to use glyphosate when it gets a couple inches of growth to start the process of killing all those roots, then till after a couple weeks and get ready to plant. Grass fields often take a lot of repeated tillage to eliminate the grass if you don't spray it first.

I wouldn't add any organic matter to the soil for the first year or two until what is there has had time to decompose. You could mulch on the surface, but don't work things in too quickly. The first couple years out of alfalfa or grass are usually very productive for whatever you are growing because of all the nutrients being released by the decay of the roots.

If the previous hay farmers have been ploughing the soil with a mouldboard plow, you are going to run into a potentially very hard and defined plow hardpan about 10" down. This is easily tested with a shovel - trust me, you will feel that hardpan when you reach it, and then break through it.

Getting rid of a hardpan is alot more difficult. If it is extensive and particularly hard, you may need to hire someone to bring in a deep chisel plough and break it up for you. Otherwise, growing any deep rooting veggie (i.e. anything other than peas and beans and lettuce) is going to be a major problem.

Good luck,
Michael

Around here, we use a tool called a v-ripper that gets down deep but doesn't disturb the surface that much. It's similar to the field cultivator. You might notice improved drainage by doing this as well. I had mine done last fall, and you should have seen all the wild sweet potatoes it dug up as well!!

Brook

Again, many thanks to all for the terrifically helpful replies. I'll ask around when we're moved in; perhaps I can find out more about who's been growing what out there, etc. I'll post the results just to follow up.

>Are you growing it for yourself, or hoping to sell certified organic crops, or maybe some other possibility?

Semi-retired and pushing sixty, my wife and I figured we could do like lots of other folks and start looking for that easy to maintain/golden years home. Or we could move to the country and work hard. We chose the latter. Oops!

We're mostly interested in having a big vegetable garden for ourselves. It's possible over time - as we learn more about what's possible on the land - that we might market some things. Not sure.

>Also, none of my business I know, but are you moving onto this land, or just converting it into crops?

We'll be living there. We've been together a whole lot of years, and have been wanting to leave the city and try something entirely new.

>Most farmers are pretty helpful

That's certainly been my life experience!

My 2 c's, for what it's worth. Well maybe 3. ;-)

A field that has been in hay for an extended period will have a lot of organic material - which is a good thing. Mowing as short as possible prior to tilling will help. However, it might take awhile for all of that material to break down. In the meanwhile, the decomposing material will use up soil nitrogen, so you might need to add some the first year. I'll second the recommendation for a soil test, since you don't want to over-fertilize, and you might need to add lime as well.

If you will be planting as soon as you have broken ground, you might want to mow & remove the majority of the material; this will lessen the time required for the organic material to break down. The roots & stubble will still contain a lot of organic material. Green material will break down more rapidly than dead, brown material.

There is also the question of perennial weeds, and how you intend to turn the soil. I've broken several lawns/fields into gardens; and when I rushed into planting, I had some real battles with thistle, quack grass, & other perennials that can propagate from root pieces. A single tilling just makes things worse, since every broken piece will sprout. It takes several cultivations (such as cultivation in Fall, followed by several cultivations in Spring) to kill the majority. If you have such weeds, the wait & additional cultivations can pay off in a major reduction in weeding.

If the garden will be small, you could just solarize the area with a black plastic tarp, which would pretty much kill everything. You would need a lot of clear, sunny days for that to work, and you would want to leave the tarp on until inspection beneath it reveals no new weed sprouts.

It's possible, depending upon how you maintain your garden, that the soil could become depleted fairly quickly. I lived in the Sound (Whidbey Island) for several years, and I know how much rain you will have. Extended periods of rainfall can leech nutrients from the soil, especially if it is sandy. Large amounts of organic material will help, as would the use of cover crops/trap crops that grow over winter, and are turned under in Spring. Your local Extension office might be able to advise you on the best cover crops for your area.

Provided that the property is large enough, you might want to lay out several plots. Rotate the location of the garden every few years; as you are gardening in one, you can begin cultivating the next plot, and raising a cover crop which will help to beat back some of the weeds. By the next year, after several cultivations, the next plot will be ready... and you can let the first plot go fallow (or cover crop, such as clover or alfalfa). I've seen the results of such a rotation, and it is a method I highly recommend for those that have the room.

Oh, and one last warning: be prepared for rocks & debris!!! I would highly recommend that if you intend to use a rotary tiller, you first have someone disc the area you will be planting. This will uncover any large objects which might otherwise destroy your tiller. You'd be amazed what you can find in a field... I've found large pieces of buried pipe (with my tiller). :-(

Thanks, Zeedman, for yet another terrifically thorough reply. Thoughts below ...

>I'll second the recommendation for a soil test

Yes, it's clear this is a good idea. I definitely will do it.

>If you will be planting as soon as you have broken ground

I think it will be difficult to resist the urge to plant right away, but I also think it might be the wisest course not to do so. There are plenty of other things that need doing on the property, so it won't be the end of the world to wait awhile. I much prefer getting the land off to a good start rather than retroactively exerting a whole lot of effort that I could have avoided if I'd waited.

>If the garden will be small, you could just solarize the area with a black plastic tarp

Tentatively, I plan to have one of five acres available for gardening. This is not to say that all of the one acre would be planted at any one time, but rather that it be tilled, prepped and available.

>I would highly recommend that if you intend to use a rotary tiller, you first have someone disc the area you will be planting.

Yes, excellent advice; other contributors to this thread mentioned it too. There are "tractor for hire" signs around town, so I'll pursue that.

Many thanks,

Paul

I love this post. This is what I hope to be able to do in the next 5 - 10 years. I've started looking at real estate listings. I'm on the east coast, though. I'm thinking about the mid Atlantic area or New England. I'm looking for low, low taxes, land without restrictions, and a close enough drive to civilization so I won't find myself stranded in the winter. A large garden is definitely part of my plan. This post is a great help. What kind of land should I be looking for to start with?

handh,

It all depends on what all you want to do with the property. Do you want it for business or recreation? I'm assuming both. Originally, we bought our land because the wife and I like to deer hunt. We have 18 acres of woods and five acres of hay field, which is perfect for us. Be aware that buying property is like buying a house: it often takes as much money to accessorize it as to purchase it. Of course, that's what makes it fun and rewarding. You will find an almost endless list of needful things to keep it mowed and to work it. Ultimately, much depends on how much time and money you want to spend on it.

Good luck in your search,

Brook

Hi everyone, I’m in Ontario canada in similar situation. And, this info is very helpful. Thanks

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