It's not a bad lineup of varieties, but it depends on what you're looking for. Duchess of oldenburg is ok, but would not be my first choice. I'd go with "transparente de croncels" or "De Lestre" for a tasty Summer apple. Grimes Golden is an excellent choice, but I'd replace nonethesuch with "Calville Rouge D'automne" which ripens at about the same time and is in the same sweet/tartness category. Yes, I have a bent for the French varieties, they are sooooo good.

Since you're in NY, I'd try growing more Mac types. There are many to choose from, spartan is ok, but Mccoun is better.

Anyway, apple preferences are quite subjective, I'd recommend you pick apples you like as opposed to what other people tell you. Definitely sample the varieties first before growing them unless you don't mind top working trees.

I lived in Dutchess County for a while (a very similar climate, soil etc.) And like everyone else I have opinions. I would add to the consideration list Ida Reds, they do very well in that area, and are absolutely delicious. Secondly, If one of my goals was to spread out the havvest, I would try some fruits along with apples. It's no more work, the spraying schedules and other aspects of growing are very similar for the different kinds of fruit. Winter hardy peaches do great there. For my family I have three peach trees, two apples, an apricot, two asian plums and a cherry tree with four varieties grafted on it. I have fresh fruit from the end of June until the snow flies. But again--that's just me.

Thank you for these suggestions!

I would appreciate feedback for two specific end-uses.

Along the line of French varieties, can you suggest apples for two specific baking purposes:

Tarte Tatin (we have found that a very sweet apple that yields little juice when baking and holds it shape well produces the best tarte), and

Baked Apples (also sweet, not too much juice when baking, skin doesn't become leathery /still "cuttable" without destroying the baked flesh.

Thanks again, Mark

I would consider Alex's suggestions of dubious value as his climate will produce much different apples. Santa Cruz has a very unique climate. Monticello is more challenging than Dutchess county, which has lots of commercial production.

I've never seen a commercial orchard around Monticello, which must mean something so I'd want to know what's up with that before I started my selection process. I think it may be wrong-headed to focus so largely on old varieties. Make sure the varieties you select have proven themselves in your area at least. Why ignore the incredible breading work of the last century? They will taste unique off your own trees anyway?

I'm not that fondof Ida Red but it does have its following and like many newer varieties, it likes to fruit every year and is easy to manage. Only the last 3 you listed am I familiar with and they are all good and should do well. I think you should consider N. Spy and focusing more on antiques traditionally grown in upstate NY. Alex's climate is much closer to that of France.

You should get some help from Cummins Nursery- they know your climate and the heirlooms that will do well there. And don't neglect your cooperative extension.

Yes, advice is best taken from someone who has grown apples in NY. Our climate here is equivalent to the climate along the Cote D'azur in France, we are mediterranean, and that might explain why the French apples are so yummy here. But so are German apples, and they hail from a climate much closer to that of NY.

I would still recommend getting in touch with local growers and selecting varieties based on what you find tasty. For example, NY grown McIntoshs are great, but California grown McIntoshs, even though they are the first of the season, are really mediocre.

I don't recommend spigold as a choice desert apple, there are better ones out there, but it might fit the bill for the "Tarte Tatin" since it has a bit of Golden delicious and will be very sweet. I'd favor it's parent, Northern Spy as a good cooking apple. But the most fullproof apple for European apple pies and the such is the "Belle de boscoop", both the French and the Germans use it for pies and other baked goods.

Harvestman, my name is Axel, not Alex. :)

Sorry Axel, I usually do my posting after a long day- during winter, a long day of pruning fruit trees. I know your name is Axel (on a clear day). Mine is Alan Haigh- pleased to meet you.

I don't get the raves about Spygold, but I only grow it on one site that doesn't get full sun. Still it should taste better than it does given what I've read. However on this site all who've experienced it have voiced dissappointment.

I agree that Macoun is a good apple but its shelf life is far too short and it's quite difficult for an amateur to handle its weird growth habit. You almost have to prune it like a peach, but on a 2-year cycle. It gets all its good fruit on the 2-year wood so you need to keep cycling its least vigorous shoots. N. Spy is no picnic either.

Thank you both, Axel & Alan. I really appreciate the feedback. Here are tentatively narrowed choices so far:

Very Early Season (harvest Mid-July--End-August):
Pristine (rec by Cummins)
Z Star (rec by Cummins)

Mid Season (harvest Mid-September--October):
Ribston Pippin (alt Cox Orange Pippin or Newtown Pippin)
Sweet Sixteen
Smokehouse
Honeycrisp
Spigold

Late Season (October--November)
Belle de Boskoop
GoldRush
Northern Spy

Very Late Season ?

Plus SweeTango if it is available anywhere.

I cannot get local information on Transparente de Croncels, De Lestre, Calville Rouge D'Automne -- shd I continue to pursue these or others?

Not sure if Russets or other classifications are properly represented on this list, or if there is unnecessary overlap. Are there other refinements you suggest?

I should have worked this backwards: goal for small to medium apples, disease resistant and hardy as semi dwarfs in NY State z5 stony somewhat heavy soil SE facing, outstanding flavor and texture for eating, making tarte tatin & baked apples (skins don't become tough & leathery), good storers, mix of apple types that also mature over an extended season; prefer varieties not commercialized unless they are too excellent to pass up.

Thanks for looking this over again! --Mark

I dont have much experience growing it, planted one last year, but at least here in central pa id go with a zestar. I had a bag of them from a local orchard last year and was very pleased. I do not think you are going to get much more late season than a goldrush, may not even get that every season, but im sure hman can tell you that if its true.

Goldrush will not always ripen for you- mine didn't last year, neither did Braebern, but I'm still using them for baking and they're better than any G. Smith I can purchase. The GR, that is- the Braes are worthless.

Of course last season had the coolest summer in memory- really just a long wet spring with about a month of summer. Strangely the Granny Smiths were the best ever here. They got ripe late in our very mild Nov.

For that very sweet apple I recommend Sansa over Zestar. Not especially dry, as you want it but not highly juicey either. It is the sweetest apple I've ever eaten when fully ripe and ripens with Zestar just ahead of Gala. Gala is your most reliable cropper of tart sweet apples, by the way. It has become the main money maker in the Hud Valley with Honeycrisp. Personally it doesn't excite me though.

I think you should grow the Rox Russet, by the way. It is very reliable and great in the kitchen as well as eaten off the tree. It's the easiest to grow really interesting apple I manage.

A little more difficult to grow (Coddling moth and other pests love it) but completely filling the bill of a dry but very sweet apple is Golden Russet. If you let it get fully ripe it is actually like syrup out of the press and I'm sure the flesh must cook reasonably well.

Pound Pippon may also work for your cullinary purposes- dry and sweet, and I know from experience that it holds its texture when cooked.

Smokehouse is nothing special at all in my book- what are you told about it? It is dry, but inedible off the tree.

Cox is very difficult- I'm running with Kidd's Orange Red which has Cox's wonderful tartness, unlike many Cox subs. I'd find one real person who grows it that likes Spigold before I'd plant it, by the way.

I also love Baldwins and Tomkins King as grown here, BTW

Because you are so interested in high quality, interesting apples, I have a feeling you'll wind up doing lots of grafting so don't worry too much about your original selection.

Cornell may have Beache's "Apples of New York" in its e-library. Go there.

I'm in Putnam County, just south of Dutchess, by the way, and have been growing apples here for 20 years. I am in the trees all day every working day.

E-mail me if you want to visit my nursery-orchard.