I only have one mottled leaf paph that I grow for the foliage only, so I'll let the others handle that part of it :)

As for the tolumnia, these will probably bloom for you in those small thumbnail pots...with proper care. Google tolumnia culture if you are interested. These really are beautiful, small plants if grown correctly. I have two that do pretty well for me in an Eastern exposure with supplemental winter lighting. These plants do best when allowed to dry slightly between waterings. The thick, triangular shaped leaves are there to conserve moisture between drought. Overwatering these plants can be pretty easy in cool temps. You can tell when they need water--the leaves don't look as fat and plump. The reddish flowered-ones blush purple when they have enough light to be happy. Which one did you get?

If you are a newbie, get mature plants. Seedlings can be tough and require a little more experience...Work on keeping happy plants happy first.

Clint

My experience in on-line ordering allows me to suggest that it's not very risky as long as you do some research up front. You statement "I've read all the posts ..." means you're likely to weigh positive reports about a seller against negative reports, & will purchase in the end based on a risk-managed approach. That's exactly what I do & after 30 or 40 on-line plant orders I have only a few to gripe about. The sellers I gripe about never see my orders again. Simple.

I can't over-state the value of asking questions like this on forums like this. I have all the right reference books, but I've learned as much or more on forums. Good luck!

I agree with Clint. I would stay away from seedlings. They can be a hassle and could take years to get flowers. Buy big. The bigger plants have more resources to handle a beginner.

My biggest mistake as a 'newbie' was buying seedlings! I lost the great majority of them, the survivors took years to bloom. If you join an orchid society, you'll probably have the opportunity to get mature plants just by buying a raffle ticket. Also all the helpful members are right there to give suggestions on how to grow your new plant. My OS meets this coming Tuesday, can't wait, it's so much fun.

The biggest jump start that a novice can get is to join an orchid society. You will be able to learn from more experienced growers, and we all love to be asked for advice. It is much easier to give sound advice with the plant in question present.

I understand the urge to keep the cost down, but I have to agree that in the long run, more mature plants will be more satisfactory.

Thanks for the feedback! Why are seedling such a pain? I emailed them and they said that it takes about a year for the plants to bloom. Has anyone else bought seedlings from them?

I guess I'm the only one who would recommend seedlings, but I think you should have a mix of both mature plants, NFS and the seedlings just so you aren't years away from seeing flowers on everything you own.

Seedling can also mean many different things. Some are very tiny. Others not that small. It kind of depends on where you buy them. I've never ordered from Hausermann's, so I don't know what their plants are like, but some of the "seedlings" I've purchased from other places have flowered within a year or less. There are just so many variables it's hard to make a blanket statement.

If you enjoy the growing process like I do, I think seedlings can be a heck of a lot of fun and a very good value. Anyone with the $ can buy a blooming plant, but it takes a bit more to make it bloom yourself. The thrill of a first flower from something you've raised yourself is hard to describe and worth it to me. I know, I know not everyone feels this way and I'm not trying to put anyone down. I'm just trying to give another perspective.

Like I originally stated, have a mix of different sized plants, but don't shy away from the little ones. They're fun.

Kevin

Hi, wish. I haven't grown paphs, so can't advise you on them. But some reasons why people are cautioning that seedlings are hard on newbies...

Big plants have more reserves to wthstand stress than seedlings do. As a consequence, they have a wider range of tolerance of sub-optimal conditions. One mistake usually won't kill them so quick that you can't make corrections. Seedlings are basically babies or toddlers, and they are needier. They have to be kept at just the right moisture, light, etc. No tolerance for short shrift on anything. So it's easier to fail with them, and we all have.

The advice to buy bigger plants when you can is based on saving you from a sense of failure if the seedlings succumb. A more mature plant will survive more easily and more likely to build rather than destroy your confidence.

That said, I agree with Kevin. Seedlings can be a very good value and a lot of fun. I've bought seedlings as well as big plants from Hausermann's and I think you get good value from them. In fact their statement of purpose for their business states that they want to provide superior plants at good value.

Some are bulging out of their pots, and others are a little less robust than that.

They are honest business people, and I'm sure what they told you about blooming time is essentially correct.

Here's an example of a bulger: I bought a seedling, 2" phal venosa hybrid from Hausermann about August of 06. It already had a keiki, and just started right away to grow and grow and thrive and thrive, putting out new leaves almost constantly. Right now it has a spike on it with 5 flowers, and a tiny little undeveloped spike nub for later. Supreme vigor, and a real bargain for $10.

A Dialalia Snowflake I got from them in seedling size in spring of '06 behaved in the same way, but hasn't bloomed yet. But it grew at least 5X as big over the summer, putting out 6 or more shiny new pbs. I'm pretty sure it will bloom this fall.

OTOH, you can get a tiny, tiny thing that looks as if you can't breathe on it, as I did last week, buying a 2" Vaughanara that has lots of growths, but none of them bigger than a couple of inches. I think Vaughanara is dwarfish, and this little seedling sure shows it.

So you can really luck into some very vigorous varieties that thrive from day one, or ones that will need a little more fuss.

I've bought tolumnia from them, and you get good value on them, too. Keep them in their tiny pot.

Enjoy your new little guys. I hope we didn't rain on your parade, and that some or all of your babies are grow monster confidence builders like the venosa and the Snowflake.

You guys are a treasure. Thanks--you know it's wonderful to find people who care enough to respond with such detail and experience.

I understand the reason why babies fail but I guess I'll try my hand....I've bought from the Botanical Gardens (tolumnia & oncidium/odontoglossum) and at Home Depot (phals & doritis) and every time it was a mature plant. Now, I guess I was waiting for some encouragement! I've raised African Violets from leaves before and I guess baby orchids are my next frontier.

It's great to hear some good stories. I just got off the phone with a very helpful lady at Hausermann's. She assured me that the vini-colored paphs are very hardy and some are known to bloom in 3" pots. They seem very approachable and didn't try to sell me a bigger plant for the sake of it. I appreciate that. The tolumnia on order(I have one already) is of blooming size. I was actually thinking of mounting them on a moss pole....

In any case, my thanks again. Ironically, what brought me to Hausermann's in the first place was a delenatii I saw at the Orchid Shop but couldn't afford the $72 price tag....So my quest began...

I have 3 seedlings from EOoM (freebies) from 2003 which, still have never bloomed. They are alive, have grown slowly and are one season from the trash can. The only reason they are still taking up room is because I refuse to give-up! I know what they are supposed to look like, once they flower I'll put them on the auction table at the OS. It's a battle of wills!

I want flowers, I don't want to watch 'grass grow.'

Jane

A note on paphs, pot size as a proxy for blooming size is not as reliable for paphs as for other species. Generally, single-growth paphs that haven't bloomed or budded yet are quoted in terms of leaf span (or LS), the measurement across the long axis of a pair of opposite leaves. The leaf span necessary to set a bud varies from one species/hybrid to another.

For the mottled-leaved, Maudiae-type paphs you're referring to, I've also found the number of leaves in a single growth to be a useful estimate of blooming size, with somewhere around 6-8 leaves needed before blooming. Subsequent growths can and will bloom off fewer leaves, as the bigger plant has more sugar-making leaf surface area.

Good luck, it's great fun. P. delenatii should be nowhere near $72, though. I'd think you can get a good BS one for around $20. Or, go with one of my favorites, P. Magic Lantern (delenatii x micranthum) for a beautiful flower and hybrid vigor!

Hmmmmmm, Jane, glad you mentioned EOoM. I've been wondering about the dates for their Spring 'free shipping' sale. I have two friends who are new to 'kids and I've told them about their great plants. Gotta go check out their website.

I think the best advice is to get plants at various stages of development. You sound like you have a green thumb and will figure it out as you go along. I have catts I bought as seedlings from Hauserman that are doing well and flowering except one, Blc. Greenwich 'Elmhurts' that's been mature size for 2 years now and no flowers, even though I pretty much fry it. Like Jane, I don't like to give up, but most people don't grow orchids for their foliage and I'm one of them. I don't know about paphs, but growing seedlings is really rewarding. It teaches patience and you'll find its not really that difficult, they're just a bit more tender than mature plants and generally need less light and slightly greater warmth. I even have a "baby" albumn of orchids when they were seedlings. I know, I'm a little ill... :-)

I love it--A baby album! Now I don't feel so bad when I email pictures of my "babies" to my friends...I know they think I'm loopy but I am sooo happy when they do so well..

Now all I need is to figure out how to upload my pics onto the gallery...hmmm

onemango - you're in Miami! Everything grows and blooms in Miami!!
As I get older, I have less patience and less room...I have always enjoyed starting from seed and cuttings, but 'normal' plants grow rapidly and bloom quickly. Many baby orchids, on the other hand, like to take forever to grow up. It becomes annoying. Ahhh, to be young again.

Wish-- if I could figure it out, anyone could. It took me years and I finally got it. I'm not sure I'm doing it right, but it works and was really easy. If you want, email me.
Here goes again,

{{gwi:154305}}

This is a baby, took 2 years to flower...
Jane

Oh my God, what a beauty! You have soooo much more patience than me... It's a virtue my husband constantly tells me I need to develop. So when my baby orchid shipment arrives (which he knows nothing about) I can say that it's for 'developing my patience!'

I am still tempted to order a mature plant...the equitant oncidium on order is of blooming size so I'll have to be satisfied with that....Alas, it's the baby paphs I'll have to practice this timeless virtue with!

It's nice to have a mix of mature and baby plants when you master their culture. It's the plants I grew from seedlings that I have problems parting with...

Enjoy your new plants and post a few snapshots when you get your order.

I'll let everyone know when EOoM has their free shipping sale and you'll have to pick up a few more...You'll be surprised how much your collection will grow in the next couple of years..

Can any one give me the web site to order orchids.
Thanks

Google Hausermann's. Couldn't be easier. That's why God invented it.

K

Jane - not everything grows in Miami. For example, Neofinetia species grow wonderful foliage here but put out few flowers. But I catch your drift... it's paradise most the time.

I've been growing for about 8 years, but not seriously until 3 years ago. Back then I watched my budget and seedlings are cheaper. Now I find myself laying down $100 or more for a single mature plant, that's how advanced this illness, uh, passion has become. :-)

I grow bonsai, too. Now that'll teach you patience. Next stop for me is to try my hand at hybridizing. Apparently there's some new technique out there where regular hobbyists can grow seedlings with materials found in your average kitchen and without a hood, etc. Onward!
Cheers

I'm glad that not everyone thinks buying a seedling is a bad idea for a beginner, as I just bought one.

I drove for an hour through Chicago traffic to get to Hausermann's just the other day (my first trip). I nearly got lost in the individual houses and am heading back on Saturday (I convinced a friend that orchids are not hard to grow and uh. I want another plant). While I was there I picked up a pleasant large white phalaenopsis in bloom. While I was at it, I couldn't pass up a paph delenatii seedling. The leaves are just so cute.

It was a great experience, now let's just hope I can keep this paph going.

You're lucky that you can actually VISIT a greenhouse! I must say it would be a dangerous thing if I did indeed have access... Good luck with the delenatii--how big is it? It's also the one I ordered. Lucky you had the immediate gratification. I'm still waiting for mine...and considering adding a violacea to the order...Has anyone had experience growing this one from a seedling?

I bought my P. violacea x violacea x var. Borneo from Hauserman several months ago and the first bloom on it just started opening today. It is GORGEOUS. It set for 3-4 months and did nothing - no root growth, no leaf growth but looked extremely happy. A spike finally appeared and then the roots went wild. I have it potted in a slash clay pot and I have roots from every slash, growing over and down the sides - just a happy, happy phal.

Brooke

The Delenatii is pretty tiny, in a 2" pot. IT has 4 leaves and then a 5th leaf which is coming in (or something like that). The specimen plant wasn't really all that much larger than this little guy, which should be mature enough to send out a spike next year. The added bonus is the beautiful foliage the plant has.

OK, so I bit the bullet and added the Violacea to my order...I couldn't resist. Brooke, what potting medium did you use for your's? And how is the fragrance?

And thanks, Tropbavard, for the description of the Delenatii. I still haven't received my shipment...boohoo.

Wish I potted mine in a small bark/turface mix. And YES, the fragrance is outstanding!

Brooke