Catlover Gardener asked:

"Can I add that bucket of old compost to this new one, even though it is wet?"

Of course you can add it to your new batch with no problem IMO. Control of moisture is very tricky, as you have discovered. However it can be done as time and experience are gained. I for one tend to add extra moisture to my compost drums during curing to gain colloidal humus compost as a finished product for the garden. It may be an advantage to add extra browns (carbon) to your batches, for using drums/cans can hold more moisture than expected. I trust this helps in some way

Blutranes

Thanks for your answer, and quickly too. I appreciate that.
...and what is "colloidal humus compost?"

Humus is the undigested organic matter in your soil, what is left of your compost after the soil bacteria digest everything else they need to to feed your plants. A colloid is a substance that is evenly distrubuted in another substance, so I would guess (no one tells you what this is) that "colloidal humus compost" is simply the residue from your compost that is evenly distributed in your soil.
Some people think that you need to mix some "old" compost into the new pile to get things started, but I've never seen any need to do that, but you can. Once compost is finished it is ready to use, there is no need to "cure" compost.

blutrane,
After reading your comment:
"I for one tend to add extra moisture to my compost drums during curing to gain colloidal humus compost as a finished product for the garden" I search for colloidal humus compost on this forum and there has been a discussion about it. So, did you follow the steps suggested in that e-book? Did you notice the benificial difference in composts? The guys experimenting that process haven't reported back again.
Thanks,
Otis

Can I add that bucket of old compost to this new one, even though it is wet?

Even though this has already been answered I thought I'd let you know that this almost exact thing happened to me. I made a batch of compost that had way to much kitchen scraps in it and not enough of carbon/brown/whatever in it. Boy did it stink and get nasty. When I did finally get some leaves, I dumped it all together, mixed it up and it started cooking and turned out just fine.

Val

the "buck of old" compost, isnt compost, its just compost ingredients that havent been composted yet, so yeah go ahead and use it.

Catlover Gardener asked:

"...and what is "colloidal humus compost?"

Then Otis11 asked:

"So, did you follow the steps suggested in that e-book? Did you notice the beneficial difference in composts?"

Colloidal humus compost is compost that has been allowed to ferment and cure in the presence of water over a period time (my definition). That is basically the way I make it, some have written books about it as has been stated. A site that gives a better explanation of the process can be found below.

Otis11,

No, I didnt buy the book, no need to if one pays attention around here and listens to the right people. And too, a little research on ones own pays in dividends as well. I learned the technique from my good friend "Tiffy" in a thread she started a few years ago. You see Otis11, Tiffy stated that members could make compost during the winter. At the time this was unheard of and not something to say to the community. Well, Tiffy lives up north, if she said she could do it I knew I could do it. I followed her instructions and made two very large bins of compost. The thing was, once I opened up the piles there was sticky sweet smelling compost in the bins; it is this form of compost they now call colloidal humus compost. It didnt occur to me what it was until the day Lloyd was busy building his blue beauty "compost sifter" that I asked the question about how it would handle sticky clumped up compost. A dear deceased member stated to run a tiller through the pile and that wont be a problem (Gonefishin was that kind of guy). The thread you speak of was going but I didnt make the connection because my "clumps" were not the color spoken about, so I didnt make the connection until later. Belgian Pup (Sue) was closest to the correct answer as to how to make it, but the thread died before it was brought out.

Did I notice a difference in the compost? Oh yes, but not for the reasons the author stated. IMO, compost is a matter of degrees and time. The more time you give compost to cure, the greater the degree of performance of a given plant is my experience. The ebook is wrong in its conclusion that compost made without his technique is mearly mulch; IMO pure nonsense to be kind. What makes colloidal humus compost, or any compost such a wonderful amendment besides its basic stated facts is humic and fulvic acids that are created during the composting process. The longer compost does its thing, the larger the amount of humic and fulvic acids found in the pile. Theses acids are the workhorses of the process and are the secret weapon found within our garden beds. How much of this acid found within a pile depends on the amount of time a pile is given to mature before it is spread on the soil. Other factors are also involved, how few times the pile is turned, how little leaching is allowed, how much air is circulated within the pile, and how well the pile holds heat are a few. Basically it boils down to building the pile at one time, making sure there is plenty of air circulation into the middle of the pile, keeping the top of the pile moist and covered; simple really. It can be done in a drum as well, but that is a different process, but basically the same. Colloidal humus compost is not the "best" compost that can be made at ones home, but it is very good IMO

Blutranes

Sorry, I took so long to post a comment, but I went to the store.

All the comments are helpful and wonderful.
But I think I opened Pandora's box. That colloidal thing sounds complicated to understand and to do. I can barely make compost. I want that dark brown fluffy, crumbly earth I hear everyone boasting about.

I read and reread the posts and as soon as I hit colloidal etc., by brain froze. I read that link Blutranses offered and for this newbie to composting, it is daunting. I am going to press on with my composting for I think I need more leaves (browns).

BTW, I have been adding browns (leaves) to the old wet bucket, but it is still wet. I am afraid to leave open bz of rain. So since I can add it to the new one, I will. Thanks a lot again.

That "dark brown fluffy, crunmbly" stuff is finshed compost, not earth or soil but one of the components of a good soil. That is what you do want and can get without all the digression about "colloidal humus compost". One very good web site to learn about composting can be found linked below.

Blutranes - since the original poster has signed off the thread, can I ask you a few questions? First, I looked at the link you provided about Colloidal Humus Compost and it doesn't really say much except it's good stuff. Inside that article he has two links that go to the same place where a guy is trying to sell you an e-book and shows you a picture of what he is calling Colloidal Humus Compost. It looks like a lump of pottery clay.

Question 1: Is this what your Colloidal Humus Compost looks like? And if so, how do you spread it on the garden? Does it retain that clay shape or does it break apart easily and that just isn't shown?

Question 2: How do you go about this process of making Colloidal Humus Compost? If you have a post you can point me to where you've already explained this, I would be happy to read it.

Question 3: Can you tell me why you think this type of compost is better (in a for dummies style).

I did do a search on the forum but I don't think I found these answers, at least none that I can understand. And all kidding aside, I would like to hear your thinking. To me, this is like soilguy's technique of making compost. It's different than other peoples and I like learning about the differences. I'm not a scientific type though, just a curious type.

Val

HMMM!

Dried leaves = Good; Mixing = Good; Curing = Good

Always at work = Bad

Lloyd

P.S. Some refer to curing as "maturing", doesn't matter, it's good.

Kimmsr,

When this topic (colloidal humus compost) first came up you said on Fri, Sept 7, 2007 at 7:17 am EST:

"Much of the information on the website is good adn should not be totally disregarded simply because the guy wants to seel you a very expensive book that tells you the same thing that is available free on the web." (Click link below)

Do me a favor and hold up on all that data you are spewing and go somewhere and make up your mind. Just because you didnt do the work to find out if all this is true or not disqualifies you from this discussion, IMO.

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Hi Val S,

Sorry for the above everyone, that dude can be a work of art from time to time (so can I). Anyway Val, that website and those associated with the guy who is trying to sell that book are no more than his attempt to make money on what we discuss around here day after day. We all are making colloidal humus compost; some of us just dont give our compost time to reach that state in the bin. That said, I will do my best to answer your questions (and keep it simple too!).

1. It can look like that, but that is a waste of time. As soon as air starts to dry the compost it will revert back to a clay type form sooner or later. Our compost reverts to that form in the soil when it is watered well if the soil is amended well, we just cant see it because we dont dig in the soil when it is wet. All healthy soil clumps together, we call it good tithe.

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2. Ok, I just did, but will do it again. Build the pile all at once. Make sure there is good airflow into the middle of the pile (the bins below show pvc pipes in the piles). Keep the top of the pile moist and covered. Do not turn the pile for any reason; leave it alone until it is finished. When finished the top of the pile will look like regular compost, the rest will be sticky and clumped together. I still screen my compost due to the fact that I use materials from everywhere, thus there is a lot of trash in the pile. While screening I add bio-char to the compost, thus the black color of the compost. I then put the compost in 55-gallon drums to cure (keep composting) until I am ready to use it; the compost clumps back together again in the drums. I continue to keep the compost moist until I add it to the garden beds.

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3. Better? That word doesnt do the process justice. There are many reasons; no turning of the pile, less compost needed for greater return (harvest), fantastic flowerbeds, low work maintained beds with few pests or weeds, food full of nutrition (vitamins, minerals etc.), big-time bragging rights (just kidding) to name a few.

All the compost we make turns into colloidal humus compost sooner or later, even when do nothing but make compost and spread it. Lasagna beds are a real easy way to make it; we just dont go digging into the bed once it is built to see what has happened. The technique Soilguy uses was created (?) by Maye E. Bruce from England in 1946. Her book on that technique is a classic and a very good read (you can get it free online). She too never turned her piles and got the same results (good thing, she was 78 years old at the time). As well, she used the biodynamic preparations in her piles, but they cost pennies and can be made at home if one is so inclined.

The best suggestion I can give is to just make some compost and give it time to do its thing. Everyone develops their own technique based on their own limits and abilities, and this is a good thing IMO. Dont be afraid to experiment or try the new, it has paid off for me in many ways. And finally, please dont be like some people with all this access to artificial intelligence (computers), yet remain stuck on stupid

Blutranes

Blutranes,
that is wonderful and I am impressed with your set up.
Thank you for showing and telling.
Otis

Blutranes - first off, thanks for the pics. I love looking at everyone's pics. If some of my family/friends knew how I drool over someones compost pics, they'd probably have me committed. How I wish for more room like you, Lloyd and soilguy have. (input HUGH sigh here)

1.) Okay, I think I see now. It's not that the compost actually does that itself (form a lump of clay), it's just that you CAN make it form a lump if you so desire. Right? The actual colloidal humus compost looks pretty much like...well...compost.

2.) Okay, so the difference is basically...turning? I mean, there are other small differences but turning seems to be the big one. When I build my pile in the spring, I build it all at the same time, wet it down and turn periodically. When the compost is done, I screen it and then store it in 32 gal. trash cans until I'm ready to apply it in the fall. I don't get anything clay-like so I'm thinking the differences that stand out to me are: you don't turn/I do, you cover yours/I don't, you add bio-char/I don't, you add water to the curing compost/I don't. So...some where in those differences there is something that makes your compost a different texture than mine.

3.) big-time bragging rights Go ahead - I would. If it's working for you and you see that much of a difference than brag away :-)

I'm just going to clarify this point really quick. I never meant that your way of composting sounded like soilguy's method. What I meant was that like soilguy, it sounded like you too were doing things against the "norm" (whatever that means). When soilguy said he "compacted" his compost, I could just feel the collective norm dropping their drinks right into the keyboard. Once he explained it with pics and a "for dummies" (for people like me) post, I found it interesting to learn about a new way of making compost. The same holds true for you. I like learning new ways and the pics are a bonus.

Now, of course I have a few more questions.

1. About bio-char - Is it basically just the burnt stuff on wood? Like could I burn some branches and logs, put them out before they totally turn to ash, then scrape off the burnt part? It's hard to explain. I don't have an area big enough to get into bio-charing, I don't have a wood burning stove. I have an outside homemade fire pit that we burn a couple of times a year in so the kids can roast marshmallows but usually everything burns down to nothing but ash.

2. Can you use ash in place of bio-char? Until recently, I'd always thought that you couldn't use ashes of any kind in the garden or the compost, but I see people talking about using it nowadays.

3. I'm wondering if using a compost tumbler could result in colloidal humus compost? If you put everything in the tumbler but don't tumble, it would keep it covered and moist, two of the prerequisites. What do you think?

Sorry for picking your brain so hard but all these ideas keep cropping up and I just find it so interesting. And lastly, while sometimes I feel stupid especially when I have to have things explained really sssslllloooowwww to me, I hope I have enough brain cells left that I never become arrogant in my opinion of how things have to or should be done to be right.

Val

How I wish we could edit our own posts! Above - HUGH is supposed to HUGE...argh!

Val

Val S said:

"It's not that the compost actually does that itself (form a lump of clay), it's just that you CAN make it form a lump if you so desire. Right?"

No, the compost forms the lumps by itself. The clumps break up if they get too dry or they are broken by force, say when they are mashed through a screen. They will reform if the water is replaced, or they can turn into almost a powder if left dry long enough. And yes, colloidal humus compost is compost that has been allowed to form into a colloidal from the process.

"Okay, so the difference is basically...turning?"

Not just turning, also air, pressure, water, and amount of time. They all must come together or the compost will not colloidal.

There are many different ways to compost, so I understand your point about comparison of techniques. Everyone cant compost the same way all the time. I rarely compost during the summer (too hot), nor do I make as much compost as I used too (I have 12 bins), I dont need that much anymore. I still have twenty-five 55-gallon drums left from 2007. For me, the more I learn around here, the less I have to do (and it does feel good).

1. Bio-char is charcoal really. There are posts about how to do it on the forum, which is how I learned about it. If you "Google" "Terra Preta" you will get all the information you could want to know; information that they have found out so far that is. Bio-char is awesome when combined with compost. You could make some in that pit you have, you just have to figure out how to do it. It will make a lot of smoke if you do though. You dont want the ash, you want the coals. You can bio-char just about anything, wood, vegetables, pecans, eggshells, melon rind, fruit skin, anything that can be brunt to a crisp fits the bill. You just want it to char, not burn up.

2. See #1

3. Tumblers wont work; they have to be turned to keep sufficient air in the mix. And too, if you think about it, as you water your pile that water seeps down to the bottom. If you turn a pile, very rarely will you have to add water to the bottom unless it is on the edges. This water is what ferments and causes the colloidal process. That is why one wants the top of the pile to remain moist; we want that moisture to seep through the pile (slowly). A tumbler is too shallow for that to occur, the mixture will go anaerobic. Better to compost the mixture completely, then remove and store the finished compost in a vessel to cure there.

Asking questions is how we all learn. Answering a question allows one to keep ones thinking clear. We all are here to share (for the most part), that is how I have learned what I know now. It is the sharing of information that keeps the community dynamic, exciting, and in constant evolution. Thank you for your kinds words

Blutranes

BTW, don't sweat the typo, I thought you spelled it right the first time (HA!)

Very interesting thread here. Never heard of the Colloidal Compost but probably to my surprise was probably what I was making by mistake.

In The Official Earth Machine users thread I thought I was making the compost wrong since it didn't resemble the soft crumbly (like devils-food cake) compost I was trying to make. As you can read in my first post on that thread I was complaining that the finished compost was sticky and clumpy resembling clay. My problem with the material was it wouldn't sift that great.

Since then thought I bought 2 Soil Saver bins and started new piles and let the 3 Earth Machines basically cure and dry out. They do now more resemble the crumbly black gold I was originally seeking, but since I am wanting to incorporate the finished product to ammend the sugar sand here in Florida, perhaps the Colloidal Compost would suit me better to retain more water in the lawn, but I'm still not sure how best to sift through that when it is sticky and clumpy like that. Any thought how best to incorporate the Colloidal stuff to the lawn/soil?

Pkapeckopickldpepprz asked:

"Any thought how best to incorporate the Colloidal stuff to the lawn/soil?"

Oh yes, finding your compost in that state the first time can have one scratching their head. For those pieces that are just too jelly like I usually put them in a wheelbarrow then mix in a lot of dry compost from one of the cabinets I store compost in and mix that baby up until a lot of the moisture has been absorbed. I then run the mixture through the screen to get all the sticks and other stuff out so I can use the screened compost. I really don't like to try spreading my compost in that state, it's too messy and seems like a waste to put so much in one area.

And too, I did use small balls in the bottom of planting holes with ok results, but again the waste factor kicked in. Letting it dry out then spreading it on the lawn works, but I vow to never do that again. I have better things to do than cut the grass twice a week (or more). Also, colloidal humus compost makes great compost tea for the soil, lawn, and plants; I get fast results when used that way. But again, the grass-cutting factor rears up, so the rule is no spraying allowed on the lawn, ever! If you were looking to grow some pretty, thick, lush lawn that is the way I would go.

Let me ask you this Pepprz, how did you make colloidal humus compost in your tumbler? As you may have read, Val asked that question but I don't know of a way to do it, but you do. Share with the community so we can learn from you if you have the time. I trust this helps in some way, for my method is to mix and move on to the next load...

Blutranes

Blutrane, (by the way love the name you have. Is it in honor of the late great John Coltrane?)

You are asking me how I made Colloidal compost. I'm still not 100% sure that is what I have done, but I will retrace my steps. Probably 2 years ago when I bought my first Earth Machine it filled up rather quickly since I was just starting to bring home rose cuttings from a job that I do tending to over 100 rose bushes. This then prompted me to buy 2 more Earth Machines. On some late days coming home from work I wouldn't have the time to cut the longer rose canes into small 1 or 2" pieces, so I would get lazy and dump most of them in, as I needed the trash can to bring back over to the job with the roses. Besides rose cuttings a lot of food trimmings and other misc weeds were added. I did use lots of urine and other liquid like spoiled milk and even the occasional bad meat from the refridgerator. At this time the compost was probably not as hot as I was hoping for, but still close to 100-110 on most days, usually closer to 120 when adding new nitrogen rich items. Well even after months of adding new material even at the bottom door the stuff was only partially composted as I could readily identify peanut shells and rose canes albeit they were generally black in color and the sticky, claylike texture of the compost which I kind of was discouraged by to be quite honest. Not sure if this qualifies as pure Colloidal compost but I will say once I started getting used coffee grounds regularly and the compost was heating up past 130 consistently, it wasn't long before the excess moisture was being released as water vapor. I was also getting discouraged as I was never actually using any of the compost even with the 3 Earth Machine bins being 100% full. Once I bought another compost bin (Soil Saver) I started transferring the still hot compost from 2 of the Earth Machines to start a base for the new pile and then I left the Earth Machines idle without adding moisture or anything else (letting it cure). Noticed all the pillbugs and palmetto bugs along with those strange looking green winged bugs that look like smaller grasshoppers (what are these things?)

Blutrane, I forgot to add the Earth Machines are not tumblers they are stationary cone shaped compost bins.

Funny you mentioned about the grass growing out of control when you applied compost, well ironically enough that is exactly what I am hoping for. I want to have the new plugs I just planted today to spread out and fill in the bare spots. I just spread compost around each plug and also spread alfalfa meal and soybean meal over the entire lawn. Supposed to rain tomorrow so I'm pretty happy.

Some more info that may prove useful in some way is as I mentioned I bought the Earth Machines 2 years ago, but after thinking about it, it was probably last year. Even still up until last week I never emptied any of the Earth Machines. It almost sounds like the material would just disappear somehow as it was usually always 3/4 full and I was kind of in a panic as I was always running out of room to compost my rose trimmings and I was not going to start putting out lawn trash. Perhaps the material just got compressed and compressed. Maybe this is Colloidal compost, maybe I was onto making my own mystery innovation, who knows lol.

Pepprz said:

"You are asking me how I made Colloidal compost."

Ok, so I asked the wrong person, fair enough. Sounds to me like you and Catlover Gardener are both in the same pickle, both of you are in dire need of a good carbon source. Can you get your hands on some leaves, or shredded paper, or newspaper, or maybe even a big bunch of junk mail to add to your compost bins? Maybe some sawdust or wood chips? Not having enough carbon (browns) in your bin is like having a tank full of gas in your car, but all of your tires are flat. Yes, you can drive to work, but the ride is going to be rather slow and bumpy. Adding a good measure of leaves will have those rascals putting out heat like they are meant to do. Let me say this; as you can tell I have never seen or owned anything but compost bins that I made by hand, so please take what I say for what its worth. That being said, carbon is the food microbes consume, nitrogen is the fuel they use to do what they do. You can see what your problem may be I trust. Get some carbon in those puppies over there and get Pepprz some compost!

Blutranes

I still have twenty-five 55-gallon drums left from 2007.

Oh that's just cruel! LOL Thanks for explaining Blutranes, your posts were very clear. This might be something I can try next fall. Leaving the bins sit and not turning them would be the hardest part for me (I like seeing what it's doing). Building it in the fall and leaving it sit all winter would be easier as I'm not inclined to play in the compost when it's cold :-)

Thanks again for being so patient and explaining everything.

Val

Bluetranes, I do know how to make compost as I have been cooking along steadily at 150-160 degrees for the past few weeks. I think over compacting the only 3 bins I had and not actually using the compost was compounding my problem. Now life is good and I use tons of shredded paper, newspaper, cardboard boxes and anything paper oriented. I have plenty of carbon and I am going to make a few Starbux runs today for more UCGs.

Reading this discussion with interest and although I know only a fraction about this colloidal humus technique, or what the product looks like from reading your posts, I wanted to add one technical point from a chemist's background:

A colloid is defined as a finely divided solid, where the particles are so small that they can be suspended in liquid and not settle. We're talking less than 5 microns or so. Humic and fulvic acids are quite large molecules themselves, with molecular masses on the order of 500+. One carbon atom is 12 so we're talking about a molecule with scores of atoms, mostly C but they are complex structures that also include acid functional groups (COOH), alcohol (OH), etc. They have a lot of ion exchange sites which is why they can absorb and release nutrients so well. They are almost like polymers. A concentrated suspension of them in water would be somewhat akin to jello - physically, not chemically, because jello is protein and these are more like carbs.

It is ironic that in the molecular world humic and fulvic acids are considered large molecules, but on a human scale colloidal suspensions of them consist of very tiny particles that cannot be seen by the naked eye.

It is my impression from what I know about soil chemistry that humic/fulvic acids become part of the soil structure and coat soil particles as organic matter breaks down to its final indigestible form. It is this material that makes soil dark and rich looking. And it will form in a bin, in a pile, in the ground, even in a mulch. It all ends up as compost. I haven't made this "colloidal compost" and don't know of it, but I trust I have colloidal humic/fulvic acids in my soil anyway.

I hope I have added something to the discussion. Just wanted clear up what a colloid was.

Tox

Hi everyone!
I decided to come back to this post this a.m. to see what else was posted. After I read I went outside immediately and added shredded papers and UCG. More paper than UCGs though. Still haven't added old bucket bz I am afraid to upset the new bin with old stuff.

Just one question. How does one add more browns to make it less wet (crumbly)and still add more greens (e.g. UCGs) to make it hot (cook? I have never experienced the hot situation, although one bucket became a lot less wet, but was still not loose and crumbly. It was drier enough to be used in my veggie pots, but not like that wheelbarrow of compost in Blutranses' photo.

Cd I buy some Black Kow compost I see at HD and add a little to start my bin, as that seems to be more authentic than the wet stuff I have.

Another thing. Do you think the stuff I have could be "chc" and do you think that it could be added to my pots in that form. If it is not "chc", and I addeed it to the veggie pots, would it leech away the nutrients from the roots of the plants (as I read in another article)? Reading all the information from all the posts makes you understand more, but I wonder if there is a simpler procedure for folks who have a simple setup (like my backyard veggie plot)who just want to put simple compost on their veggie plots.

Wish my plants cd look like the ones in the photos.
Thanks!

Do you have any holes in your containers to let them drain and to let air in? That will help with the water and smell.

You may not get much heat if you don't have a large enough container. There are a lot of people who say you need at least 3 X 3 X 3 ft to get hot compost. I've done it in a much smaller bin, but my bin is still about 1.5x1.5x4, which sounds like it's bigger than what you're using.

My container is a 32 gal BRUTE from HD.
What I mean is can you add more carbons to get crumbly compost AND add greens at the same time to get hot and still not get wet from the greens?

You can add the carbons, but if you have too much moisture and no holes, it'll end up smelling bad. With a 32 gallon container, you may not get hot compost regardless of what you add. It'll still decompose, but it might take longer and it might not heat up.

Toxcrusadr,

While never having spoken (conversed) with you before I have read some of your posts and am happy to be able to share a few thoughts with you. As has been stated earlier in this thread, I did my best to keep things simple but do not feel that limit necessary with you, the pleasure is mine.

The reason your limit of familiarity with "colloidal humus compost" is due to the fact that the author of the book spoken of coined the phrase is my understanding. Each term stands on its own; however in the original discussion that was the name given to the substance at the time and it has stuck. Humus can develop colloidal properties, yet compost cant; compost can lead to humus, yet humus cannot lead to compost.

"Humic substances are key components of a friable (loose) soil structure. Various carbon containing humic substances are key components of soil crumbs (aggregates). Complex carbohydrates synthesized by bacteria and humic substances function together with clay and silt to form soil aggregate. As the humic substances become intimately associated with the mineral fraction of the soil, colloidal complexes of humus-clay and humus-silt aggregates are formed. These aggregates are formed by electrical processes, which increase the cohesive forces that cause very fine soil particles and clay components to attract each other. Once formed these aggregates help create a desirable crumb structure in the top soil, making it more friable." (See link below)

While I do enjoy making compost, my larger focus is allowing said compost to develop the largest amount of humic and fulvic acid as possible. And too, auxins, cytokinins, and other grown hormones and enzymes can be present and ready to go to work once the compost is applied to the soil. It is for this reason I constantly stress allowing ones compost be allowed to cure/mature. Those of us who have developed soil with such an organic foundation find we grow plants that refuse to die. As an example, those "Georgia collard greens" in the photo above will live well past a year, growing a stalk over three (3) feet tall, and will harvest collards with a taste to die for.

I do have a different understanding of the nature of humic and fulvic acid, with fulvic being much smaller than humic, thus is the main carrier of nutrition in foliar sprays. Fulvic acid and the many wonderful functions it provides for all life on earth is one of my favorite topics so all I will say for now is that once our planet has replaced both fulvic and humic acid in our soils our health will be akin to those collards I just spoke of, in human time. I too will avoid the topic of bio-char as well; I trust you will understand.

I do appreciate your insight and sharing of knowledge, it is very much well taken

Blutranes
@gmail.com

Thanks blutranes, good stuff. I hope I can find a few minutes to further research this.

I once worked in a lab where one of my duties was to actually extract humic/fuvic acids from soils, separate the two, and measure things in them. There was a third, unextractable fraction we called "humin" which I assume is heavier (larger molecules) than the humics and thus insoluble even in base.

haven't used colloidal compost yet but plan to try it out, to help save water....already use biochar which helps hold water....also mix in a few pcs of old wood....and use mulch....it all adds up in summertime...water is most precious thing we use everyday and everyone needs to learn how to use less...the colloidal product i plan to try is called fishnure...jim@fishnure.com....if i like it i will try and make my own...in a black bag at first and adding liquid fish to fresh grass and leaves, must keep damp....and takes time, 6 to 12 months, but do not turn , just leave alone....the indian

Just to give a simple answer, adding old compost to new compost (you are making) will slow down the process, but won't really hurt anything. I would just use old compost at once as it ages it loses it's benefits slowly. I would not add old to new unless I had a good idea, like no place to put the old compost or a had a lack of raw materials and I wanted filled for my bins. You can also go buy some bagged compost and add that if you want or peat moss or something like that, if you really want more bulk.

This is an old thread from 2009 resurrected by butchfomby. Not sure the original poster is around to see your comment.

Funny how a simple question from a novice composter turned into a highly technical discussion on advanced forms of composting. I feel sorry for catlover, who only wanted to know whether s/he could dump a bucket of wet smelly compost into a bin with a new batch. Might have scared them away from composting completely!