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What herbs will take over?

19 years ago

I'm in the process of planning to put my herb into the raise bed planter, which is this one:

I have the following herbs:

1.) Rosemerry

2.) Tarragon

3.) Chive

4.) Basil

5.) Lemon Thyme

6.) Lemon Grass

7.) Pinapple Sage

8.) Oregano

9.) Garden Sage

10.) Spearmint

11.) Peppermint

12.) Scalion

13.) Dill

14.) Paseley (curl and flat)

My question is, which one is safe to put into the raise bed and not to worry about taking over and over crowded. I know for sure mint has to go into pot. I had thyme in the pot before and the pot filled with thyme in one season, would it do the same in the bed? Terragon seems to grow very bushy as well and came back after the hard cold winter. The raise bed receive full sun, will Sage survive in there? Any suggestion on spacing? The bed is 4'x8' on the low side, 4'x8' on the high site. I need to plant tomato, bell pepper, and may be egg plant in the bed too.

I'm first time gardener and only did herb in pots before, am I over done myself?

Comments (13)

  • 19 years ago

    Ummmm... those are a lot of plants for an area 4' x 16'. Lets see:
    Depending on the kind of Rosemary it will either spread wide or go up tall... either way get large;
    The Pineapple Sage will want to be 4' x 4' but could hang over the edge if you planted it close to the edge;
    Oregano will make an increasing circle being 2' in a couple of years;
    Salvia officinalis, Culinary Sage, will spread quickly to 4' x 2't;
    The Spearmint and Peppermint will take over the whole bed and then into the grass and beyond;
    Chives, Basil,Thyme, Lemon Grass, Scallions,DIll and Parsley will all stay put;
    The Tomatoes, Peppers and Eggplant will each take at least 2' x 2' each.

  • 19 years ago

    Oh wow... I didn't know they need that much space. Yeah I probably over did it. I will put those large item in pots and probably treat them as annual, can't go through 4'x4' size of Sage you know.. he he.

  • 19 years ago

    Lemon grass won't survive the winter outside in your climate; pineapple sage won't either. You might consider them candidates for pots that you bring in for the winter or as annuals. Pretty much the same story with rosemay unless you've got an exceptionally hardy variety and good luck, as well.

    You can keep sage to a manageable size by harvesting it, and it will probably die back quite a bit in the winter. That should keep its spread closer to 2-3 feet.

  • 19 years ago

    Gosh! that's a teensy space for all those plants! The lemongrass on its own will fill it and spread over the edges by quite some distance! The rosemary and basil together will more than fill it, too.

    Here's a rundown on how big each can get!

    1.) Rosemary: 1.5 metres tall and about 1 metre wide
    2.) Tarragon: 60cm high and 45cm wide if it's the real French. The Russian is taller. The Winter Tarragon (Tagetes lucida is about the same.
    3.) Chives: (always referred to in the plural) 50cm high and 50cm wide. Garlic chives can get much bigger.
    4.) Basil: 1 metre with a spread of about 30-40cm, according to the books. Mine get much bigger than that.
    5.) Lemon Thyme: roughly 20cm tall with a spread usually around 60cm, but if it self-layers it can spread as far as you like!
    6.) Lemon Grass: up to 2 metres high and at least the same wide (the clump just keeps on growing!)
    7.) Pineapple Sage: May grow to 1.5 metres or more in warm climates, smaller in cool or cold climates. I had to get rid of mine because it threatened to take over - it is a noxious weed in my part of the world. It self-seeds.
    8.) Oregano: 60cm tall and as wide as it spreads - which can be quite some distance!
    9.) Garden Sage: about 1 metre tall with about the same spread.
    10.) Spearmint: POT IT! Or it will take over! Can get to 1 metre tall when in bloom!
    11.) Peppermint: Ditto. 30-60cm high but can reach 1 metre when in bloom.
    12.) Scallion: about 50cm tall. They don't spread much.
    13.) Dill: 1.5 metres tall and about 30cm wide. Self-seeds readily.
    14.) Parsely (curly and flat): Curly will get to 40cm tall and 15cm wide. Italian flat-leafed will get much bigger.

    You'll need at least 2 beds for all those - one for the 'drys' and one for the 'moists'. Of course, large pots for the mints.

    The 'drys' are rosemary, sage, thyme, oregano. This doesn't mean they grow in desert conditions - it means that they like long dry summers and wet winters, and excellent drainage.

    The rest are 'wets' which doesn't mean soggy, it means constantly moist soil - and excellent drainage.

    Your raised bed is a good start for the drainage.

    Looks like you have the space to expand - you'll need to!

  • 19 years ago

    What a shame I can't figure out the centimeter thing without googling a conversion calculator!!

  • 19 years ago

    Here's a good conversion program...

    Here is a link that might be useful: online conversion

  • 19 years ago

    It would take most of the yard on the side of my house to grow all those. :o)

  • 19 years ago

    Think of 1cm as being 1/2 inch, or roughly the width of a man's thumbnail. Think of 1 metre as 1 yard, or a long as a man's arm - so 50-60cm is roughly half a yard (up to your knees). It's not mathematically precise, but it helps with visualisation.

  • 19 years ago

    Does the size that the plants grow depend on the zone you are in? I notice that most of those indicating that they have huge plants live in higher zones than your zone 5. I know that in my zone my herbs don't get huge although we do have hot summers - they are short. Just a thought for your plans

    Fern

  • 19 years ago

    Plants originating in warm/hot climates will almost always be stunted to some degree in a cool climate. By how much will depend on how cool or cold the climate is.

    Interestingly, plants originating in cool climates won't get to optimum size in a hot climate, either.

  • 19 years ago

    Thanks for the breakdown list of space needs daisyduckworth. Now I wish I have a ranch!!!! But like you said, I do have room for expansion. The left side of the plater are for berries (black, blue and rasp) that goes in ground. I have another 40 ft or so of space on the right that I can add more planter space in the future. I can't add more space in front of the planter because that area collect water.

    I had lemon grass in pots for two years and they do get bushy, so I will keep them in the pot because they will die in Winter. I also have a two years old rosemery that die, but it only get 1.5 feet before I neglect it over winter.

    It's going to be an adventurous season to see what herb do well in my zone and how they react to the crazy weather in my area.

  • 19 years ago

    Put your spearmint aside from the rest,it will soon take over from the underneath, more than the top. It takes over a garden. You can grow it in pots, but if not enough room, it will grow in circles around the pots. Parsley and chives you may be able to keep together. Chives are easy, you just give it a hair cut when you need to use, then let it grow out. Eventually they clump and need to be taken out and seperated, much like bulb plants. Rosemary, tarragon and oregano should be by themselves unless you have a 12 foot space to work with. They also take over.

    When the rosemary gets too big, you can cut sprigs and bring in the house to refresh the room or house. Does wonders!!!!

    Oregano when it gets to big, consider cutting stalks and donating to a rabbit rescue. It is good for ill rabbits, so I hear. I give my excess away on Craigslist and rabbit rescuers have told me it is good for the bunnies.

    Have fun!

  • 19 years ago

    Whew, what a challenge. Here's how I'd call it, from a zone-7 background, so your mileage may vary:

    Rosemary - safe, most likely an annual in your zone. If you want to keep it more than a year, I'd put it in a pot that you can bring in in the winter. I've had better luck with prostrate rosemary than the bush rosemary. My 4-year old clump is a good 5-6' around and about 12-18" tall, from a 4" nursery pot. I'm planning on replacing my existing fitzer/juniper bushes with prostrate "Irene" rosemary. I love this plant!

    Tarragon - maybe safe. Mine is only a couple years old and so far it's well behaved, about 18" wide and 24-28" tall now. I use it a lot.

    Chives - safe, I've had the same chives in the same place for nearly 7 years, they're 12-15" wide and about as tall in semi-shade. Probably get a bit bigger in full sun, but so far they've been one of my best behaved perennial herbs.

    Basil - safe, grown as an annual in all zones. I usually grow cinnimon basil and it only gets about 18-24" tall for me and maybe 10-12" around.

    Lemon Thyme - maybe. This one spreads a bit more than my other tnymes, but in three years it's still only about 12-18" around and 6-10" high - from a small 2" nursery pot.

    Lemon Grass - safe, an annual in your zone, it's an annual in my zone as well.

    Pineapple Sage - safe, an annual in your zone. It's supposed to be an annual in my zone, but mine comes back every year after dying to the ground each winter. Mine is slightly larger than "regular" sage at 4' tall and about as big around. BTW, it flowers very late in the season, usually October for me. And it turns black at the first hard frost, which is around Thanksgiving in my neighborhood.

    Oregano - not safe, mine is far more aggressive than any of my mints (spear, pepper, chocolate, orange, pineapple). In my garden and my mother's garden, oregano has taken over the bed it was initially planted in. It's now moving on to conquer the lawn, which is fine by me...

    Spearmint - not safe, aggressive spreader - although mine is kept in check by heavy harvest throughout the summer for mint tea. At least a pound per week.

    Peppermint - not safe, aggressive spreader. Again I keep it in check with heavy harvesting.

    Garden Sage - safe, but big. full grown about 3-4ft around and about that tall, even in your zone.

    Dill - not safe, it will be ok this year, but you'll have seedlings all over the place next year, unless you're extraordinarily vigilant about chopping of it's flowers. And it get's kind of big, 3' tall. Though I think mine stayed around 2'

    No experience with scallions nor parsely.

    You may try a "thug garden" with your mints, oregano, and dill to see who wins, hehe. My bet would be mint would make a good showing, but the oregano will win. The mint will move to easier conquests, like the lawn. And the dill will probably just re-seed to wherever you least want it growning, hehe.