Dave, I am not familiar with either one of those books to know if they are USDA safe.
I keep asking about the new USDA guidelines. So far, even as of last week, no news !!! This has been a year or more since we were told they should be out any time.
I just know that I was told that most of the new information will be updated and more clarified instruction on tomato products. Other than that, I don't know.
The newest recipes for things like jicama relish are online at the University of Georgia's site. If you haven't checked to see what they have perhaps you would like to.

Here is a link that might be useful: University of Georgia.

The UofG recipe for Tomatillo Green Salsa calls for 1 cup of lemon juice for a 5 pint batch. That amounts to 10% lemon juice. That is SOUR!!!! My mouth puckers just thinking about it. I can't use that salsa in my recipes for enchiladas, chilaquiles and the like. I tried it and it's not good. I also canned chow chow, using a "safe" recipe, with similar results.

For safety these recipes get an A (so does battery acid, so far as botulism is concerned). For taste I give them an F. Is there somewhere else I can go to for safe canning recipes?

Jim

Jim,
If they are safe they will have that much added acid. Otherwise they will not have a ph level that is acidic enough to prevent botulism.
So, not other than Ball Blue book or Small Batch Preseving by Ellie Topp, or something like that.
There are many books and much info online that do not meet the safety standards and put you at risk if you use them.
I love the green tomato salsa. It is good to us. I use plain green tomatoes. We simmer it with diced cooked beef, or pork, or chicken and use for burritos.
Bottled lemon juice doesn't taste as acidic as vinegar does.
For enchiladas I would make a red sauce, not the green tomato salsa.
Annie's salsa recipe that you pressure can is really good. You don't need as much added acid if you pressure can it.

This is also a good recipe, You just have to use DRY spices to keep it safe, not fresh herbs. :
Enchilada sauce
Ingredients
12 cups halved cored peeled tomato (about 24 medium or 8 lb)
water
spices
bottled lemon juice
salt (optional)
You will need
6 teaspoons chili powder
2 teaspoons ground cumin
2 teaspoons oregano
2 teaspoons garlic powder
2 teaspoons ground coriander
1 1/2 teaspoons seasoning salt (optional)
Directions
1 add 2-1/2 tsp of spice blend to each pint jar. if omitting seasoning salt, use only 2 tsp.
2PREPARE boiling water canner. Heat jars and lids in simmering water until ready for use. Do not boil. Set bands aside.
3COMBINE tomatoes with just enough water to cover in a large saucepan. Bring to a boil and boil gently for 5 minutes.
4ADD specified quantity of spice blend, 1 Tbsp lemon juice and 1/4 tsp salt, if using, to each hot jar.
5PACK tomatoes into hot jars leaving 1/2 inch headspace. Ladle hot cooking liquid over tomatoes leaving 1/2 inch headspace. Remove air bubbles. Wipe rim. Center hot lid on jar. Apply band and adjust until fit is fingertip tight.
6PROCESS filled jars in a boiling water canner 40 minutes for pints and quarts, adjusting for altitude. Remove jars and cool. Check lids for seal after 24 hours. Lid should not flex up and down when center is pressed.

I do wish they would give us a citric acid equivalent for those recipes tho. Some of the recipes call for 2 cups of lemon juice. It's just too muck liquid.

Dave

PS: Linda Lou - thanks for the info on the updates. If most of the changes are tomato related the books should still be ok as we are mostly looking for new pickling and jam recipes. Wife says if we have to start pressure cooking jam and pickles - she quits!! ;)

I use jam and other full-sugar preserves recipes from the UK, Europe, Australia and New Zealand and also old books going back to the 1940's. Unless you're talking about an exotic preserve like Habanero Gold that has peppers or onions or something like a fig jam or banana which call for low-acid fruits, those recipes were fine, are fine and will continue to be fine.

I doubt very much that we're going to see big changes in the jams department. I do wonder if testing will help with guidelines for peppers added to fruits in jams (like Peach Preserves for a Winter Morning) but other than that I'm not worried. High acid+ full sugar = safety and I doubt the USDA is going to expend its funds on a non-issue.

A lot of the old relish/condiment recipes are fine too, especially the ones that are 100% vinegar. An example is "Blender Ketchup," which appeared in Farm Journal in the early 1970's. That recipe is still around. It's been tweaked a bit but it hasn't done it any harm.

In many cases the only change you see is a trend to move recipes from "1 large bell pepper," to "1 1/2 cup chopped bell pepper." In other words, canning recipes are being re-written for precision, which is as critical to safety as anything, but which doesn't change the food's essential character.

I'm just guessing, but again, except for some tweaking and hopefully some clarification of the listeria issue with pickles, I doubt there'll be much change there either. Barring unforseen entirely new research, I expect a book like "Joy of Pickling" will continue to be just as useful to me as it is now.

I use the Ball Blue Book seldom. We all have different preferences, but for my taste too many recipes I've tried just aren't very good or have poor instructions. I do like the Ball Complete Book of Home Preserving. It includes Ball, Bernardin and even old Kerr recipes updated for current standards. I'm an old fan of Kerr and I was glad to see those recipes return.

The NCHFP is an invaluable resource, especially Dr. Andress. I continue to be amazed at her willingness to respond to emails quickly and completely. I don't always get the answer I hope for, but it's nice to know there's someone I can ask who will give me the straight scoop.

I find their recipes hit-and-miss. Some work. Some, like their new "safe" lemon curd is a sin. In some cases the compromises necessary to meet current standards are just too great. You'd be better off not attempting it, and to my mind lemon curd is a prime example. Besides, curd freezes beautifully. Not all things should be canned - or need to be.

Too bad they don't have a taste-tester who could paste those "Mr. Yuck" pictures on some of the really bad stuff.

For imaginative, even moderately "gourmet" ways of resolving acidity issues, I rate Small-Batch Preserving #1. In some recipes Topp & Howard use wine in conjunction with wine vinegars to raise acidity in pasta sauces, etc. Generally the recipes in this book "work." I've canned a lot of things from it and have never had a miss. Some I might not make again, but that's because it's only two of us now and you can only use so many of the boutique foods.

Secondary sources I will continue to use are The Jamlady Cookbook. Anyone into jams or preserves should have that. Alfeld is very cognizant of the issues with pepper jellies, etc. She really hews the line in terms of pH but still manages to cover a vast spectrum of full-sugar and low-sugar preserves and spreads. It's kind of the jam encyclopedia.

I also like Carol Costenbader's Preserving the Harvest and Amendt's Blue Ribbon Preserves. I'll continue to use both books. But each is a little minefield compared to the books above. Preserving the Harvest is wonderful for freezing and has a number of good freezer recipes. Her canning recipes are a mixed bag. You have to pick and choose. For example, she has an egg, flour and vegetable oil-thickened green tomato sandwich spread I wouldn't touch for the world. And Linda Amendt provides instructions for pressure canning curds. When emailed she acknowledged her recipes aren't tested and that she no longer pressure cans her own curds.

But 90% of each book is very good. I'll keep them and use them selectively.

More important, I think, is understanding the issues so that you can assess recipes outside the USDA-Ball-NCHFP canon and decide whether they fall within the acceptable range or not.

P.S. There's a salsa verde in Joy of Pickling. Beyond that Tomatillos can be substituted in any salsa that calls for tomatoes. Look for a tomato salsa recipe that suits you and just use the green (or purple) guys.

Carol

Carol - You have talked about the Topp book so often and recommended it so highly that I did spend part of my birthday gift on it. ;)

Also ordered the Putting Up: A Seasonal Guide to Canning in the Southern Tradition by Steve Dowdney I mentioned above - the exerpts from it I have read just sound too good to pass up. But passed on the Nelson book. Already have the Ball Complete Book of Home Preserving so we are in good shape I think.

Rest of the gift is going for the outdoor burner I think.

Thanks for all the great info. ;)

Dave

****If they are safe they will have that much added acid. Otherwise they will not have a ph level that is acidic enough to prevent botulism. ****

Added acid isn't required to prevent acid in all tomato products. If that were true then there would be added acid in the approved NCHFP pressure canning recipe for tomatoes and zucchini.

Here is a link that might be useful: NCHFP canning recipe Tomatoes and Zucchini

Good point but for safety sake, I am going to assume there is an error of omission in that recipe since all the others require not only the addition of the acid but an increase in the amount of lemon juice required.

Dave

I don't think it is an error of omission. If you read the NCHFP site tomatoes are processed as acid vegetables only if acid is added. If acid is not added then they are considered low acid vegetables and must be processed as low acid vegetables.

Low acid vegetables require more heat and longer processing times. That is why low acid vegetables are processed in pressure canners.

From the NCHFP site

****Whether food should be processed in a pressure canner or boiling-water canner to control botulinum bacteria depends on the acidity of the food. Acidity may be natural, as in most fruits, or added, as in pickled food. Low-acid canned foods are not acidic enough to prevent the growth of these bacteria. Acid foods contain enough acid to block their growth, or destroy them more rapidly when heated. The term "pH" is a measure of acidity; the lower its value, the more acid the food. The acidity level in foods can be increased by adding lemon juice, citric acid, or vinegar.***

Tomatoes from NCHFP

***Although tomatoes usually are considered an acid food, some are now known to have pH values slightly above 4.6. Figs also have pH values slightly above 4.6. Therefore, if they are to be canned as acid foods, these products must be acidified to a pH of 4.6 or lower with lemon juice or citric acid. Properly acidified tomatoes and figs are acid foods and can be safely processed in a boiling-water canner.****

As stated by NCHFP ****if they are to be canned as acid foods, these products must be acidified to a pH of 4.6 or lower with lemon juice or citric acid.****

They do not have to be canned as acid foods. If they are not canned as acid foods guidelines for low acid foods must be followed which requires pressure canning.

The NCHFP tomato zucchin with optional onion is pressure canned and treated as low acid.

Zeuspaul

Here is a link that might be useful: Ensuring Safe Canned Foods

Carol,

Thanks for the tip on using tomato recipes for tomatillos. There may be a tomato recipe which will work for my purposes. Other than that, perhaps canning the tomatillos by themselves and making the salsa a batch at a time might be the answer.

Jim

I agree. It's two different categories of canned goods, but it's a good example of how confusing things can become.

Dave, I hope you like the Topp/Howard book. Everyone's tastes are different, but so far no one who got it has been dissatisfied. That book is one of the "standards" in Canada. I had to argue mightily to get it accepted on this Forum as a safe source. Actually, I never did succeed, despite documentation. It wasn't until a Canadian member came on and said, essentially, "Oh, that book's famous here," that it was accepted.

I looked the Dowdney book up online and put it on my wishlist. Actually, I think I'm going to order it. I notice he ran a commercial canning business, so I'm confident he's up to date on the food safety issues. I also see Jamlady has a new pickles and relishes book. She also has a commercial background, so I'd like to get hers. And Linda Amendt has a new book of jams and jellies. Her recipes are always excellent and jams and jellies don't concern me safety-wise.

Lots of ways to spend money! Unfortunately, now that we're older and it's just two of us, I don't need to can as much as I used to. I was inventorying the shelves yesterday and thinking what I mainly need to do this year is use up what's on the shelves and in the freezer. But it's still fun to read new books and get ideas for future "canning adventures."

Carol

****If they are safe they will have that much added acid. Otherwise they will not have a ph level that is acidic enough to prevent botulism. ****
That was in response to the salsa recipes, as he was talking about the green tomatillo salsa. Perhaps I should have said specifically salsa.
Those are BWB canning recipes, not pressure canned ones like the tomato and zucchini.
The Ball Complete Book of Home Preserving is a Candian publication and not all of the things in there are USDA guidelines. There is one for apples that says you need to acidify them. Not so. I have not seen it with my own eyes, but someone said there was even reference to an "open kettle" method for something where the jars are just turned upside down. Of course, that would not be safe.
I need to find time to hunt that down and see if it is indeed in that book. I have a copy.
I asked Elizabeth Andress about the apple one and her reply to me was that it is a Canadian publication and not everything is the way we would recommend here.
Carol brought out some good points with other books, as well, and the safety of some recipes and methods in them.

OK, I do have to speak up in defense of the canning standards of our neighbors to the north.

The Ball Complete Book of Home Preserving was indeed published in Canada. The Canadian government was generous enough to subsidize publication.

However, the book itself is a collaborative effort. Kingry is a Consumer Services Manager at Bernardin (Canada) and Devine is a Research/Test Kitchen Scientist with Jarden (U.S.).

As far as I can tell, the book is, if anything, more stringent than the current USDA standards. The only apple recipe that requires lemon juice is applesauce. Plain apples are canned as per usual. Apple pie filling calls for additional lemon juice, but that seems to be for flavor.

We had a lengthy discussion last season about the difference between the Ball Blue Book and the Ball Complete Book of Home Preserving as the first does not call for lemon juice in applesauce and the latter does.

You can check the link for the complete thread. It appears that the Ball Complete Book is requiring lemon juice for applesauce because many thrifty types use windfalls for applesauce and windfalls are lower pH. Here's what I said on that thread:

"The only way I think it could potentially be an issue if someone is canning bruised apples, either tree-picked or windfalls. In 'The Microbiology of Fruits and Vegetables' the authors discuss changes in pH for whole undamaged tree-picked apples and bruised dropped apples. So a fresh-picked Red Delicious is somewhere around 3.98 pH but, and this is interesting, the bruised tree-picked were 4.57 mean pH and bruised windfalls were all the way up to 4.9 mean pH. Which means if the variety is one which tends to less acidity and the condition of the fruit is less than optimal, it is possible for the applesauce to be low-acid.

Condition is all."

On the thread you'll also see an email from Ball regarding the issue.

I went through the entire boiling water bath section, all 378 pages, and found not a single open kettle canning recipe. The only inversion I found was to distribute solids in canned Habanero Gold Jelly or other recipes of that sort. The only "uncanned" recipes I found in the entire book were brined limes and lemons which are held at room temp for two weeks then refrigerated.

Carol

Here is a link that might be useful: Confused About Lemon Juice for Applesauce

A Google search on "ph tomatillos" turned up the interesting site linked below.

Jim

Here is a link that might be useful: Safety of tomatillos and products containing tomatillos canned by the water-bath canning method

Thanks, Jim. Interesting to read. I've saved that one.

Carol

I have the Putting Up book. He uses a lot of oil in recipes, but includes instructions for pH testing which is part of many of his recipes. His canning instructions call for inversion. As someone who doesn't feel at all expert in canning of low-acid ingredients, it's a bit scary. :D

Hi Valeree - yeah I wrote a review of it (linked below) after I got it. Can't recommend it as a safe book.

Dave

Here is a link that might be useful: Review of