Never tried beneficial nematodes (not to be confused with leaf nematodes) but I do use ammonia at the ratio of 1 part ammonia to 10 parts water and have not seen an issue with it. The nitrogen in ammonia (all nitrogen, really) is quite volatile and will not build up in the soil, especially since I only use it every month or so. Unless you are out there weekly, dowsing the plants, there should be no issue. Some here use vinegar at a similar ratio, but since vinegar undiluted is toxic to plants, I prefer the feeding ammonia offers.

tj

I don't have experience with either, but have been doing some reading on nematodes. A place to get info and buy, if you go that route is PlanetNatural. Haven't price shopped yet so there may be less expensive products.

Here is a link that might be useful: Planet Natural

I saw a YouTube video that recommend on dose just before leafing at 4 parts water, 1 part ammonia. After leafing they recommend 8 to 1. It seemed to me this was recommended for a one time per year treatment.

I was considering its use for next spring also.

The observation of vinegar vs Ammonia is exactly the reason why I rejected that route. For general information vinegar is considered by many as one of the BEST defoliants known! [won;t go into my side story about this]

Thank you for confirming that there are indeed (at least) two different types of Nematodes. So what I am reading sounds more real.

I have also been playing with (half worried look) with a 1:10 ratio of ammonia and water. It sounds like I am doing this correctly on the monthly basis. (a bit happier look) I was unsure what strength of ratio I ought to use in the spring (pee-emergent) and early fall (post-growth) after my cut back routine for the winter. A 1:4 ratio sounds a bit strong ... but ... could conceivably be 'right'.

Has anyone seen any research as to the effects of ammonia vs "beneficial nematodes"? Might a hybrid practice of these two approaches promote good management of slugs? ... OR would the ammonia cancel out the nematodes?

Peter Kelley
St.t Paul, MN USA

Is this the Pete Kelley I met in Minnehaha back at the 1990's AHS national meetings?

In my chemical experience, ammonia is your least hazardous chemical spray, compared to vinegar, bleach, peroxide or regular chemical sprays ( bleach is main one that I use, Orthene and Malathion to name a few, Bayer etc.).

PLEASE remember all these chemicals will burn your eyes and skin, let alone other potential side affects. Follow all suggested precautions for safety gear and clothing.

No worry on soil nitrogen from ammonia.

Key to slug control is regular sprays until you have their population under control; then back off.

Consider that mulch and wood chips/straw/other moisture control options encourage high slug population, so a more holistic approach may be what's needed until you have them under control.Also amount of rain can be a bigger factor as dry years they have less impact and eggs!

First couple of years in my new garden here in Virginia I killed 100's ( probably 1000's is correct) of huge tiger slugs (4-6 inches long) with a knife and flashlight at night in the grass where I planned to put hosta beds. Don't see them anymore!

Then used bleach/chemical sprays/baits until now I have zillions of baby slugs but few big ones which lay eggs. Still find slug eggs and realize have to be aggressive again.

Beneficial nematodes - work but are costly compared to the other options. Would agree they may not be compatible with chemicals.

Bruce

Bruce - I am probably not the same Pete Kelley from the '1990's AHS national meetings" ... as I have never been to one. In the Twin Cities there was at time when there were 14 of us (Peter Kelley's) including a cousin of the same name!).

Extends a hand of friendship!

I keep in mind that any chemical has risks; hence all the questions here. Slugs are critters that one should not turn ones back on. It is my belief that even when they are not seen they are still a risk and so diligence needs to be kept. I think I can even identify where these slugs came from as there were no sign of them PRIOR to 'x' point of gardening this year.

Your right - different areas of the US have different size slugs. In Minnesota we have the small innocent variety which can probably do just as much damage as any others. Just do not remind me of larger ones or I might have nightmares about them!

No disrespect to you Bruce, and as this is the first time I've asked the question anywhere; what do others think about ammonia vs. nematodes?

Peter Kelley
St, Paul, MN USA

Peter,
I just remembered my previous dealings with Pete Kelley was part of "Kelley Nurseries" from the Twin Cities: is it still in business?

Bruce - if you change your preferences for this site to accept e-mails from members we can take this discussion privately. or you can e-mail me at MstrPBK at q.com.

Peter Kelley
St. Paul, MN USA

I use nematodes and they really seem to work,I have to reapply about every 6 weeks,my last order got lost in the mail and am seeing lots of holes,but it is that time of year when everything seems to be taking a bite out of something.
The brand I use is Nemaslug--I'm in Europe don't know it they are available over there.

Here is a link that might be useful: nemaslug

This post was edited by stoc on Sat, Sep 13, 14 at 12:45

Nemaslug is not available in the US. I wish it were.

Steve

Looks at the other North Americans. I am sure we can find a source for beneficial nematodes on this side of the pond if we dig hard enough.

Peter Kelley
St. Paul, MN USA

P.S. Now off to mount the next page of my blog. It's gonna be along one!

Nemaslug isnt, but the US version Scanmask is. Not a very marketable name Scanmask. Planetnatural if you want to try it.

Here is a link that might be useful: Scanmask

Scan Mask is a good product. I've used it for killing fungus gnats when growing indoors, but it will not kill Slugs. There are no Beneficial Nematodes in the US that are effective, or labeled for use with Slugs. You can use Ammonia and water if you want to spray after each rainfall, but if you want a product that lasts for a while you will need to use slug baits.

Steve

Duplicate

Here is a link that might be useful: Grub away nemotodes

This post was edited by bungalowmonkeys on Mon, Sep 15, 14 at 8:39

Glad you said it didn't work for slugs before I dropped the cash on it. Do you have any experience with this one, Grub Away Nematodes?

Here is a link that might be useful: Grub Away Nematodes

Heterohabditis bacteriophora are the beneficial nematodes included in the Grub Away product. These are commonly used to reduce white grubs and cut worms in the soil. Fall is the time to apply this as there is a temperature range that you need to have for application. These nems do not work for slugs. But it will reduce your Japanese Beetle, Asiatic Beetle and cut worm population. I have seen better prices than those at Gardens Alive.

Steve

Here is a link that might be useful: Arbico Organics

I just assumed nematodes were nematodes and did the same thing. Didn't realize they were not for slugs. Thank you for sharing the link. Probably going to grab the slug baits.

That is what I thought: nematodes were all the same. But then I began to do some cross checking for slug control; and this thread come about! Looks like this was worth my time to ask about here. Will keep looking at all of your responses,

Let's turn this topic on its side. Passing thought; are all slugs the same (global basis)? Have North American slugs become resistant to nematodes, where as European slugs have not?

Peter Kelley
St. Paul, MN USA

No there are many different species of slugs. But it's not a question of ours being resistant to beneficial nematodes. The type of nematode used in NemaSlug in the UK is native to the UK and Europe. If it were used here, we would be importing an exotic and perhaps invasive species. Therefor the USDA won't allow it in the U.S. I had heard that some entomologists were trying to find a native species that would work as NemaSlug does, but that hasn't happened yet.

Steve

(nods) That's kinda what I thought. (nods)

For those who wonder about things like this you may want to consider the case study of the African Bee (accidentally) being introduced to South America.

Thanks Steve.

This post was edited by MstrPBK on Mon, Sep 15, 14 at 15:17

Those african bees were a nightmare when I lived in AZ by the Mexico border. As a a kid, twice a year in school we would have saftey classes about them. I've known many people that have lost their dogs from a swarm, just because it was barking. Scary stuff.

Guess asking family to smuggle back some nemaslug on the next Euro trip is a bad idea.

Let's start with ... Smuggling is never good.

The African bee is one of just a long list of accidents or well intended species introductions to North America that have gone 'bad'. Nematodes, by continent origin. I think we have to respect as well. Many may be microscopic, but even at the microscopic have a way of effecting the world around us.

Wikipedia: Nematode: Anatomy:
"Nematodes are slender worms: typically approximately 5 to 100 õm thick, and at least 0.1 mm (0.0039 in) but less than 2.5mm long. The smallest nematodes are microscopic, while free-living species can reach as much as 5 cm (2.0 in), and some parasitic species are larger still, reaching over a meter in length. The body is often ornamented with ridges, rings, bristles, or other distinctive structures."

As slugs have a range in size; so do nematodes it seems!

Peter Kelley
St. Paul, MN USA

Has anyone else here used the slug bait "Deadline"? I've used it for years, as have some of my gardening friends, and it works great. It's a blue pellet that lasts much longer that Orthos slug bait. I apply it twice a year and I'd be hard pressed to find a slug in the garden. It's not available commercially but I believe it's available online. If not, do as I do and have someone with a pesticide license get it for you.....your local garden center or greenhouse.

Beneficial nematodes can kill destructive nematodes. The best approach is to keep everything well mulched which will work naturally.

Ammonia is used successfully in 10 to 25% concentration to kill slugs. Ammonia NH3 breaks down nitrites in the soil into nitrates which plants can absorb as fertilizer. Ammonia can kill good 'bugs' as well as bad bugs.

It does do double duty on hosta by killing slugs and by fertilizing. A 10% to 25% concentration of Ammonia would be good. It is inexpensive, it fertilizes and it kills slugs. I find it difficult to mix if you put the ammonia in the container first. It foams up easily, so put in the water and then add ammonia to the spray bottle.

No matter what slugs will be back. You simply cannot kill all of them in the world, but ammonia will keep them in check.

Jon

Mac is this it?

Here is a link that might be useful: Amazon - deadline

I know i am about to be naysayed here ... but ... The problem I have with MOST slug pellets is that they all seem to have passive inert ingredients (which respond to water). Sometime they are indicated on the package other times not. These pellets could be a danger to small rodents, neighbor's pets, or even children (even in small doses), This is why I have been examining the ammonia, or the nematode route.

Peter Kelley
St. Paul, MN USA

No bungalow that's not what I use. Google Deadline M-Ps. I'd include the link if I knew how. Supposedly Deadline has a small environmental impact but I'm no pesticide expert. I do know it seems to have no impact on chipmunks or squirrels..... I sort of wish it did with chipmunks ! It certainly has no impact on earthworms as my soil is full of them. As with any pesticide I'm sure it has some negative environmental impact even if I haven't observed any.

Hadn't seen a single slug until the last two weeks. Now every night i'm catching them by the dozens. It has turned into a mini competition between my older girls to see who can find the most. Last night it was 31 between the two.

Here is a link that might be useful: Deadline m-ps

I see slime from dying slugs which ate the pellet even after rains had hit the pellets and misformed them. I read here that Ammonia sprays have to hit the slug to kill it, so a lot more work checking each plant also under each leaf. Think about when you have 350 hostas, slugs are more active when dark and you are turning over all leaves to spray them. I use pellets. Bernd

This post was edited by berndnyz5 on Wed, Sep 17, 14 at 17:25

Bernd -

Your point is very well taken. YES the ammonia has to come in contact with the slug to be effective. Numerous gardeners may have over a hundred hosta - in rare cases a thousand plus; and ammonia spraying may not be the way to go. In my case I have at this time 34 hostas and moving towards bringing that back to 20 by mid summer next year. When I spray i spray in the late afternoon and with a mist effect. This gets on the ground, on the leaves. behind the leaves, and into the eye of the hosta, etc. Even with declining eye sight I ought to be able to deal with some of the slugs; and if I don't get them this time there's always the next ... I also have to deal with neighbors and kids and dogs too.

Those who want to can follow my gardening antics more closely can do so at the blog "HostaByKelley"

Peter Kelley
St Paul, MN USA

I'm enjoying reading through the site. Couldn't find it at first by typing in HostasbyKelley.com. Didn't realize it was a blogspot site. Here is a link to it

Here is a link that might be useful: HostaByKelley