I hope so too Jsvand...they bumped me up also...but we're still 4 days away, so I guess I need to stop checking it till Monday,lol...but its SO hard not to so you can prepare.

The worst part of covering the trees ( using Frost blankets/ sheets/plastic is its usually windy the afternoon before the freeze. I use clothes pins to attach them to the conduit poles and they snap right off when the wind is gusting. Very frustrating, by the time the wind dies down its pitch dark and you can't see anything,lol...We're really crazy I guess!

NWS Miami says this today:

WE ARE NOW FORECASTING UPPER 20S/LOWER 30S FOR THE LAKE
OKEECHOBEE REGION AND LOWER 30S ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE REDLAND OF
MIAMI-DADE. HIGHS WERE TRENDED DOWN BELOW GFS MOS...WHICH HAS A
HIGH BIAS IN THESE ANOMALOUS EVENTS AND BEING SEVERAL DAYS OUT IN
TIME. SO HAVE ADJUSTED HIGH TEMPS MORE IN LINE WITH HPC NUMBERS
BEHIND THE FRONT. WE WILL CLOSELY MONITOR TRENDS OVER THE COMING
DAYS...TO SEE IF MODELS WARM OR COOL...OR REMAIN STEADY. CURRENT
THINKING IS THAT WE MAY NEED A SLIGHT DOWNWARD ADJUSTMENT TO
TEMPS MON-WED...BUT WOULD LIKE TO SEE MORE MODEL TRENDS BEFORE
MAKING THIS MOVE.

18Z GFS (wx model) pops out a 34F for Tuesday morning for Miami . My guess would be Miami will see a temp below 40F on Tuesday, although how far down it gets could depend on a lot of factors (clouds/wind/model errors)...

Just to show how bad this is looking, the LOCAL NWS office here in La Crosse mentioned Miami today in their Area Forecast Discussion (AFD). Basically they said that the SE Florida area is going to have air that is coldest compared to normal (very rare event) early next week.

For comparison its showing -25F here for a low on Tuesday morning.

Here is the latest temps pumped out by the GFS model this afternoon.

Showing Miami getting to 33F Tues morn and 39F weds morning...

Numbers have come in colder today then the past few days. I doubt it drops that low. I'd expect somewhere between 35F-40F... Then again, that is one of the warmest spots in Florida!

24.4 inches of snow on the ground at my house and the temp has been right around 0F all day. It could be worse :)

Just checked in on NOAA and their zip code specific forecast......wherein it says:

Tonight: Mostly clear, with a low around 28. Wind chill values as low as 17. Blustery, with a north wind between 13 and 17 mph, with gusts as high as 23 mph.

YIKES!!!!! It was a balmy 31 F forecasted a short while ago. What the heck FrankTank.......their going in the wrong direction.

Harry

Yah, this is looking quite bad. It went from a 32 mon/ 36 tues low to 29 mon/ 32 tues.

Jeff

I find it too bad a very bad nightmare!

You should hear my Aunt when she calls..She practically wants to cry..She said the other day she saw certain kinds of little lizards motionless in her driveway and on her porch the other night..She says that her her neighbor's yards and lawns look they something she has never seen..Blankets, plastic tarps, lights, fires, foam, water sprinklers and all kind of things they are doing to aviod those frosty temps.
She is worried about her in-ground citus trees too..

Yup.. This afternoon the models came in colder for Miami. Its still *possible* they don't drop that far. Lets hope so. I know in the spring my trees in flower (peaches/apricots/cherries) are safe to 28F, but i'm not so sure how tropicals handle that temp. I can imagine the coconut palms will not be happy!

Harry-

"
Event date: Freeze of February 2-9, 1835
Summary of event: According to Warren Johnson, Meteorologist In Charge in 1958, the freeze of
1835 was the most severe of all historically significant freezes in the state of Florida. During this
freeze, the St. Johns River was frozen, "several rods from the shore," and people were able to walk a
distance from the shore. Many citrus and other fruit trees were killed to the ground, never to grow
again, when temperatures reached as low as 1�F in Charleston and 8�F in Jacksonville. A Florida
gentleman told a newspaper that the state, "appeared as desolate as if a fire had swept over it," after
the severe freeze of that winter season. According to Florida Citrus Mutual, this freeze was so
severe that it is considered an impact freeze. This indicates that the freeze, "annihilate[d] entire
groves across the state, killing both mature and young citrus trees, while causing a profound
economic impact on the citrus industry and� prompting growers to replant farther south." This
freeze ended attempts to grow citrus in southern Georgia, southeast South Carolina, and northern
Florida. "

All of my potted trees are safely stuffed into the garage.... kicked the car to the curb lol. I am looking forward to warmer temps.... this is overwhelming! The 35 gallon ceramic pots were too big for even two strong people to move. I had to get a big hand truck and a big guy to help me move them

Harry have you seen any of those huge green iguanas freeze and fall from the trees?

Marin:

Oh yes, we had falling iguanas with last year's freeze. This year, I don't think I have any left to fall from the trees. I did find a Basilisk Lizard on the ground last week with the cold. The lizard population was decimated with last winter's freeze.

FrankTank:

So I guess what you are trying to say is we shouldn't complain about the cold...it could be much worse. I wasn't even aware that citrus was being grown in Florida back in the mid-1830's. But then again, the Spanish were here in the 1500's so I guess they may have brought it in at some point.

OH well.....I've done what am going to do to protect plants. I'm off to bed......good luck to everyone. I'm not looking forward to seeing the morning's freeze. Hoping for a last minute reprieve with a wind shift or something.
NOAA still says 28 F. Not good.

Harry

Well.....not as bad here as predicted. We were sub 40F for about 7 hours from 1:30 am through about 8:30 am. The low was 31.4 and we were sub 32F for about 2 hours from 5 am until about 7 am. I did not see much in the way of frost compared to last weeks chill. Seeing some damaged new growth on jakfruit (the colder sensitive Tabouey x J 30) and leaves are pretty much gone or burnt on all guanabanas. Other than that, no visible immediate damage. I hope there is good news with you folks further north. Seems the winds died down considerably so hopefully your protective structures held.

Harry

It was 33 here outside of tampa at 9am. At about midnight it was 36. We had a good few hours of hard freeze. At 7:15 this morning it was 24.

Everything was covered but still.. this was way too cold for Dec.

Harry-

Yeah... It could be worse. Christmas 1989 cold blast was also another one that comes to mind. I believe Miami hit 32F with that one and several nights were in the 30s.

Winds should go calm tonite, but the GFS showing temps right around 40F for Miami.

Lets just say we are lucky this came early in December vs later in the year, when even colder air lurks to the north.

For what I have read, it sounds like citrus have been growing in Florida since the 1500's...pretty amazing stuff. Too bad they didn't keep weather records!

I had -17F in my backyard this morning.

I am in zipcode 32780. I ran my sprinklers from 12- 9 a.m. on my 3 mango trees. Here is how my Edward mango looked this morning. My overnight low was 26.2, and it was below freezing for 7 hours.

BluePalm
Great mango/icicle photo/ Please give an update on how that worked out

In my zip 33321 it was 33.6 Fahrenheit at 530AM

That is an awesome picture...I have to admit! Yes, please let us know how it works. Very interesting experiment. Hopefully it will work as well for you as the Strawberry and Citrus farmers!! Keeping fingers crossed!

Very Cool picture Bluepalm!

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/12/08/Three-helicopters-crash-in-Florida/UPI-51721291831216/

Last week three helicopters crashed while trying to blow warmer air downward into Palm Beach county Florida citrus groves. I hope it worked out a lot better with last nights arctic blasts

Here is a link that might be useful: Copter Crashes

Blue Palm:

Yes, very cool picture.....or dare I say cold picture. I hope that mango tree is safe and sound under all that ice. I fear that it might not be that happy in there though. Will be very interested to see how it fares after the thaw. Will you melt the ice with warm water or let it thaw naturally.....that is if it gets warm enough to melt the ice? Please keep us posted.

Harry

I hit 26. Everything looks fine though. The GH stayed above 35 with it being at around 40 closer to the heaters. Looks like tonight may be worse. Calling for 24 degrees. I have about 200 almost ripe grapfruit that will be going in the trash. It's still only 36 degrees here at almost 11:30.

Im interested to see how the igloo method fares.

I've decided to let it thaw naturally. I tried to speed up the thaw on one branch by banging icicles off the tree and destroyed the supportive "lattice-work" of ice (since it extends to the ground it is helping support its own weight). This bent some branches really badly and tore leaves off as the icicles fell...so I've decided to leave the tree alone. I think the tree encased in 32 degree ice might be better off than 26.2 temperatures.

Maybe, but I wonder if being at 32 for such a long time may be worse than 26 for a couple hours. Good luck. I hope it works for you. I know they do this with citrus so it would be great to find out that it works with more tropical stuff.

Let that thaw on its own! I wouldn't touch it at all.

Wow bluepalm - that is so brave! I'll be very interested in your result. Let us know if it fully melts today and what it looks like when it does.

Glad to hear your greenhouse stayed warm jsvand. Are the 200 grapefruit outside your greenhouse? Even if they froze completely if you pick and juice them right away the juice would still be good. That's what the orange groves do with the damaged fruit.

Thats a near future defoliated Mango!. It might have helped to keep large branches and trunk safe though.

.......speechless in the desert.......mangowimper

Looks more like an ice age for the better part North America!

You can almost see the corridor of cold air from my house in southwest WI (-17F) all the way down to western Cuba.

Cancun was 51F this morning.

Last year I covered my mangos in frost cloth and after the harsh winter lost 50%+ of my mango growth...so I said "why not?" and decided to test them under the sprinkler. I was below 32 for 7 hours, so I assumed that it would be better to be at 32 than at 26-28 for at least 3-4 hours.
No, the ice did not melt off the trees today...only melted partially. This should make it a little easier tonight to re-create the ice cocoon. I am under no illusions that mango trees don't like to be encased in ice. However, I also know they won't like tonight's freezing temps from 11:00 p.m.-8:30 a.m. And if they die, then screw-it, I'm going to plant lychees instead and get ripe mangos from my dad's house! My neighbor asked me yesterday "Where are your Christmas lights? When are you going to hang them up?" I said "They're under my frost cloth with my young lychees!"

The dewpoint right now is 10F in Miami... This is insane. The temp only hit 52F so far today.

Coconut palms are not going to be happy!

That Mango tree icicle is very interesting. Hoping for some luck tonight. Covered 5 of my 8ft mango trees which should have been around 12-15 ft if it wasnt for last years freeze. Will post a follow up of success or failure.

Temps by me (Pasco County 33541) went to 28f the night of 12/13 and are going to 25f the night of 12/14. I monitored the plants and protective enclosures through the night and was intrigued that I had no frost. Is this because of such low dew points?

In my zip 33321 it was 36 Fahrenheit last night at 430AM

Two nights ago...meaning the first freeze night it was 33.6 Fahrenheit at 530AM

This coming night will be much better...according to forecasts

The Global Warming promoters are having their conference in Cancun right now as Cancun goes through six days of record cold of 51 Fahrenheit. Too chilly to go swimming there

So it's not just Florida that's getting a cold blast

Here is a link that might be useful: Six straight days of record low temperatures during COP16 in Cancun Mexico

Cold lately?

Note that its C not F...

Odd morning temp wise. The low was lower than yesterday, bottoming out at 30.6. Below 40 F went about 12 hours, from about 8 PM until around 8:30 AM. We had widespread frost on the grass and roof, but vehicles had none. Frost was not nearly as heavy as the second day of cold last week. In anycase, the below freezing temps only lasted a very short time. I am not sure how long as by the time I woke up at 5 AM, the temps were ranging from 34.8-35.0 F.

I'm feeling better that you guys seemed to have a bit of break with the predicted cold temps....hope you're seeing the light of hope starting to shine.....

gary the mangopuppy

Some of my trees took some damage from the cold temps we had in western Broward last night. Two of my mango trees are showing some discolored leaves on their out edges and on top one other has its bloom spikes curled up and looking strange. My green Sapote has some dead and dryed out leaves on its upper edge. Some of my banana plants look like they were blowtorched on the top leaves, although the middle and lower parts seem fine so far. The trees in the middle of the bunches seem ok. On a positive note all my other trees seem fine.

Where do I file my complaint that freesing weather just does not belong here in South Florida? Even if it is the second year in a row its here...

Nice thread Harry.

We've bounced back from highs in teens, lows to 0F. GH perking along, nice not to have to water nearly as much.

I'm struggling with how to manipulate the GH temps to best ensure my Lychee bloom. Sweetheart is trying to push some vegetative growth now. I've been pruning much of it off because any blooms on top of that growth would be out of reach anyway. Brewster is about 4-6 weeks out past a growth flush

Yesterday I dropped the GH thermostat to 48 at night. Reasonable? What do you think?

And guys, my sole Garcinia and the PR seedlings are getting some extra heat, don't worry.

Hey Robert......48 should be good enough for lychee bloom. I am not sure of the magical number of nights at that temp before the inflorescenses will begin to emerge though. This cold spell we have just gone through along with the one we had a week or so ago should be good for our lychee bloom even if not so good for mangoes and other tropicals. The beauty of green house growing is you can control the cool down and optimize the results with little risk of foliar damage. It's just a question of the right combination of cooling that is the million dollar question. I remember reading somewhere that the major factor for lychee bloom is the temp differential between the lows and the highs. I think it is probably a combination of things and not just one climatic/meterologic factor.

I have let my PR seedlings encounter down to 45F while inside a protective structure. I do want to weed out those that are just ultra-cold sensitive as they will have little chance of ever reaching mature size (as if any actually have any chance...LOL). So I have seen some leaf burn on some of the seedlings. Most leaf burn on the Rambutans with slightly less on the Pulasans. Garcinias and Langsats have shown no leaf burn so far.

Harry

This morning our low was 38.1 and there was no frost. Looks like the below 40 window was pretty small as it didn't dip below until around 5 am and was back above 40 by 8 am. We had a week of warmer temps especially during the day, but lows reached the mid to upper 40' several times through the past week. I sheltered the ultra tropical seedlings from Puerto Rico last night, but had left them out with the mid-40's temps. They look pretty ragged at the moment, with leaf burn pretty much on everything other than mangosteen and achachairu.

I'm hoping it doesn't get any worse for you guys and gals.. How frustrating it is when the weather becomes a threat to years of hard work. Believe me, I've grown tropicals in WA state so I know how irritating it can be when cold weather rolls in. Where's the global warming when you need it? Just kidding. Stay warm, guys n gals.

everettsky

This morning we had extensive frost on the grass in all low lying areas and complete coverage with frost on the roof of the house, but none on the car. The morning low just touched 32 F for a very short time (like 10 minutes or so) but sub 40's temps began around 11 pm last night and didn't end until around 8:20 this morning. Forecast highs today aound 63F with a low predicted for tomorrow at around 43F. Will leave ultra tropicals in for another night. Mango blooms seem to be unaffected by the cold so far. I am seeing fruit set on Rosigold and Edward. Other mango blooms are slow to open in this cold.....not a bad thing.

This may be little consolation but in Bermuda we are experiencing record cold weather also. About 7 days this month were the coldest on record for that particular day in December - records that have been standing since the 70s - and one day busted the all time recorded low for any day in December - 48F. Bear in mind the all time record low for any month is 44 and this would tend to occur in February. The average low for Dec is 61.

Being a good 10F below that on a daily basis and with so many record low days, this would appear to preview even lower temperatures in Jan/Feb. We've had several days with hail, something that is seen only once every few years. We've had 2 or 3 batches in the last few days. Lastly, this is the 3rd successive year where winds have been strong for weeks on end.

We have experienced winds persistently above 25knot, many days above 39 knots and gusts as high as 72knots for the last few weeks.

So while cold isn't a killer, winter winds of this duration and intensity and forces that can snap, tilt and kill trees in its path.

Abayomi - nice place to live!

I hate to say this, and I hope I'm wrong but the weather lately is almost hinting at a horticultural armeggedon. A precursor to much worse stuff that may devastate even traditional farming crops and their growth patterns....

but other than actually reversing global warming and these strangely-placed warm and cold ocean currents, making for exotic storms and abnormal temperature fluxes, what can we do???

stressbaby - wanted to comment on your excellent setup (and plants) in your lower STRESS zone....

I just hope this is all just a funky bleep in the long history of the norm.....

mangodingo

thanks mangodog.

a friend recently pointed out "warming" is a verb, not a noun. Media has repeated it as a noun so many thousands of times that folks have unwittingly accepted it as a noun. This is relevant in the sense that if we use it in its proper way, as a verb, E.g. the earth is warming, that would mean providing evidence. Despite all the hoopla all day in the media, you still only need a thermometer to measure temperature.

But back to tropical fruits...if in fact cooler temperatures are coming as some predict (based on sunspot activity plummeting) it will impede our capacity to grow them without special measures. But for me it also opens the opportunity for items requiring chilling hours that we just never get here. Further, for all the hundreds of thousands of tropicals that would experience untold cold, there will be some that thrive and thus can be propagated also to "new" (colder location) uses...

NASA researcher Judah Cohen:
This is one of the hottest years on record, which has caused polar ice caps to melt. This means more water in the atmosphere that's available to make snow. So more snow fell all across Siberia, which acts like a giant cooling element for the Northern Hemisphere.

This caused the polar jet stream, which usually goes eastward across America, to "wander north and south" instead of just eastward. This means that Southern states like Florida get hit with the frigid air.

Here is a link that might be useful: Bundle Up, It's Global Warming NYT 12/25/10

I don't think there is debate as to whether the earth is on a warming trend. The debate is regarding the cause of the warming trend: some folks say natural events such as sun spots, while others say co2 buildup. I could declare my side on the issue and crack open a huge debate.. but probably not a good idea :-).

Jeff

Mango K - fascinating and simple article you attached - the machine of frigid winters - extra snow in Siberia from global warming's excess polar ice melt - who knew!!???

Abayomi - I'm already amazed at how mangos are surviving such frigid Florida temps even as we speak, so you might be right. Perhaps they are evolving with the cold, but that generally is a slow process and these cold streaks seem to happening a bit too much and fast for plant evolution, me thinks, at this point.

Actually, I'm living on the razor's edge (I think) of being able to grow Mangos, papayas, apples, pears, peaches, macadamias, almonds, blueberris etc. due to just enough chill hours bred in to those hybridized "low chill" fruit varieties to produce and not quite enough cold to kill the mangos and papayas, etc. If enough winter lows stay between 32 and 45, as they have been the last 10 years or so that I've lived here (other than a single overnight stretch of 26 degrees back in Feb. 2007 that did some damage and maybe a dozen hits or so of right around 32)I benefit from getting enough chill hours for some fruits, and mere dormancy or slow growth for the semi-tropicals....

THe Mac Tree hasn't produced yet (only 3 years old) but everything else has....

interesting, eh?

mangobiscuit