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dglmichelle

Layout advice - how did I do?

17 years ago

I've been playing around with layouts for a year now and keep coming back to this one.

We will be removing the wall between the kitchen and dining room and adding a wall between the kitchen and family room as well as extending the living room wall by 2 feet. We will also be moving one window and extending the other.

I think I have the flow covered. My husband and I both cook and the prep area would mainly be between the sink and stove with the island as an additional prep space if needed. The dishes and glasses would be stored above the dishwasher and silverware will be in the island.

Usually, one of us is prepping/cooking and the other is unloading the dishwasher from the night before, getting drinks to the table and cleaning dishes. So, we shouldn't run into each other often.

I really wanted the island with seating as my extended family is over frequently. I know that distance between the island and pantry is tight, but if people need to get through, they can go around through the living room when people are seated as there's nothing behind that wall.

The microwave and trash is in the island. Should I switch the microwave to be closer to the range and trash closer to the dishwasher?

Anything else I'm missing?

The current size of the kitchen/dining room is 23.5' x 13.5'

Current Layout

New Layout

Comments (6)

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    On your stove wall and corner FWIW. . .

    We have a similar space and I tried lots of different setups. I finally decided against the angled corner cabinets, since it makes it harder to reach what's in the back of that corner.

    I also decided I liked the look better when the stove was centered between cabinets on each side that were the same width. So there's a super susan (which I love) for the corner base cab, using the same 3' you've allowed. That would make the base cabinet on each side of the stove 21" wide. (Ours are 18".)

    The upper cabinets on each side of the stove match those below (21"). With that as the starting point, I then worked out the sink wall and corner cab (a blind cab opening on the sink wall worked best for us). There was a cabinet with open shelves between the blind cab and the 21" cab to the left of the stove. I'd thought about making that whole corner open shelves, but didn't since I hate to clean. After watching the dust collect for several months ;o), I ordered a door for the one open-shelved cabinet at the same time some replacements for warped doors were to be shipped.

    Anne

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I look at this from the building/installation perspective and have the following questions:

    1. Is this a single story house? If not, have you thought how you will put in the necessary ventilation. I am assuming you moves the stove top/range to the "10" area

    2. Think about extending the depth of Box 1 a couple inches so the counter ends into it. I can send a picture if that does not make sense. Is that a refrig or pantry.

    3. If the island consists of 3 boxes, I would prefer to see a pony wall built to attach the 3 cabinets to. The pony wall provides strength and allows a solid surface for attaching corbels for the counter overhang. The bad part of a pony wall for you is it will limit the amount of overhang.

    4. Will code in your area require power in the island or will you want it? If yes, think about where you want the plugs and how the wire will be run. (A pony wall also helps to address this.)

    5. Will you have access to move the gas/220 line to where your moving the oven etc. It can get pretty expensive (or a lot of your work/time) if not considered early on

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Thanks for your input so far - you've given me some things to think about!

    Anne -
    In the corner base cabinet, we were going to have a super susan. Kraftmaid makes one for an angled cabinet without a pole in the middle of it. I was thinking that an angle would give me more prep room, but I'll have to think about that. Are you saying that I should move the stove to the right and have a larger upper corner cabinet? Wouldn't that then throw off the symmetry on the window wall? My DH wanted open shelves above the center pantry area - I asked him if he would dust that :)

    salmon slayer -
    1) This is a split level house. The second level is above the family room, office, etc and attic is above the kitchen. The person we talked to about this said he would build a box to have the exhaust run behind the cabinets to the outside (he'll be adding the wall there anyway). Is this a bad idea? Should we go up through the attic?
    2) Box 1 is our full depth fridge. I would agree that we have to extend that cabinet to the same depth of the fridge if that's what you mean.
    3) I've never heard of having a pony wall in an island. Is this what most people do? I thought it was free-standing and nailed to the floor...
    4) We would want power in the island and would have an outlet on the side by the range as well as by the seating near the fridge.
    5) We currently have an electric range but am uncertain whether the previous owners installed a gas line behind the current range or not (I thought they said they did, dh does not). Either way, it could be moved/accessed through the basement below, I believe.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    salmon slayer -
    1) This is a split level house. The second level is above the family room, office, etc and attic is above the kitchen. The person we talked to about this said he would build a box to have the exhaust run behind the cabinets to the outside (he'll be adding the wall there anyway). Is this a bad idea? Should we go up through the attic?

    A) the answer depends on what type of ventilation you are going to use. The first questions is: What type of hood are you going to use (microwave/vent combo) or a stand alone hood. If your using a combo, the fan is typically built in and you just vent to the outside and do not need a large vent pipe. If your going to add a hood, there are many more decisions: how much CFM you have/need will dictate the size of the vent pipe. The output of your burners will be one of the primary drivers for how much air you need to move (CFM) and then where the fan will be: Internal, in line or external. Internal fans are located in the hood housing, inline fans are located between the hood and outside, and external fans is located outside i.e. on the roof/wall etc. There are pros and cons for all. You can refer to the appliance forum for more on ventilation - several good threads there.

    2) Box 1 is our full depth fridge. I would agree that we have to extend that cabinet to the same depth of the fridge if that's what you mean.

    A)If you box in the fridge, you will not have the issue. I have seen people install pantry's, oven cabinets etc that are the same depth as the counters and I do not like how the granite gets finished on the end (personal taste). I much prefer the cabinets next to a counter extend a little bit so the edge of the counter does not extend past it. this is an example of how the counter edge is hidden because the oven cabinet extends a bit:

    From 3 Dec


    3) I've never heard of having a pony wall in an island. Is this what most people do? I thought it was free-standing and nailed to the floor..

    It really depends on the island and how it is built. Custom cabinets are generally designed in one or two pieces, are heavy, and are designed with the counter in mind. On those, we nail cleats to the floor (under the island frame and nail or use trim screws to lock the island into them). Some islands are so big/heavy you do not need them but I have always put them in anyway (overkill)

    A pony wall is not "required" for an island made out of boxes but if your going to have a overhang and it can be bumped etc, you need to seriously consider one. It stabilizes everything, and provides a place to run the wires/plumbing etc. I would be interested in comments from people here if they did not have one built and had an overhang similar to what your looking at - would they do it that way again? I do get accused of "overbuilding on occasion" but thats ok with me. In any case use cleats on island boxes. If your using Corbels, recognize you need a good strong backing on the back of the cabinets. Most boxes have thin plywood.

    4) We would want power in the island and would have an outlet on the side by the range as well as by the seating near the fridge.

    The island needs to be designed with that in mind. A small electrical box will be required to be installed inside the cabinet unless your going with a plugmold that has internal conections. local codes will determine requirements as well as the need for armored cable. Bottom line, plan for it now.


    5) We currently have an electric range but am uncertain whether the previous owners installed a gas line behind the current range or not (I thought they said they did, dh does not). Either way, it could be moved/accessed through the basement below, I believe.

    Good, Sounds like it should not be a problem.

    Hope this helped and gave you something to think about before locking down on a final design.

    Steve

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Personally, I like having the MW between the fridge and the sink, since we use it to warm up a lot of leftovers and usually there's moisture or food that needs to be cleaned up from the counter when we're done.

    Have you considered an induction cooktop? I was going to get gas, until I researched induction and learned of its many pluses. I love ours!

    Back to your layout. . .

    We have a KM super susan without the angled front, and it doesn't have a pole in the middle.

    Yes, the cooktop would move 3" to the right so that the base cabs to the right and left of it would each be 21", as would the upper ones above them.
    To the left of this you'd have another 21" wide upper plus a 3" spacer to finish this wall to where these cabs would abut the blind corner cab. Obviously, there are other ways this could be done, but I mentioned this way since it was easy for me since it's the way we did it. It would be possible, for example, to have the blind corner cab on this wall. Some people don't like blind corner cabs, but in the absence of any great choices for corners, I find them useful for storage of seldom used things in the "blind" part. There's a current thread showing a very clever way of hanging pots in an upper blind cabinet.

    Our sink wall was different from yours, since we have a triple window over the sink and the oven and MW where you have the fridge. So I'll let some of the more experienced kitchen people help you on that if they are in agreement on the cooktop wall rearrangement.

    Anne

    Here is a link that might be useful: Storing pots & pans in upper cabs

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    We'll have a solid surface countertop so I'm hoping we will not have to use a pony wall as I don't think we'd have the room to sacrafice those inches. I'll have to look into how they will be running the electrical outlets in the island (maybe behind the microwave?).

    I would love to get a new cooktop, but we're keeping all our existing appliances since they're only 6 years old.

    DH and I love the upper cabinet skillet storage and will probably incorporate that in the design. Thanks!

    So over all, the flow of the kitchen looks good? The spacing between appliances is good?