debbie

you need a load calculation for proper sizing-get it in writing.

what size is AC and has it been satisfactory?

have your ductwork thoroughly inspected as to size, overall condition, leaks, supplies/returns, insulation qualities. any hot/cold spots within your home should be addressed-now is the time.

you want a var speed blower with two stg heat and 95% eff furnace-an 80% with today's high energy prices that will only get worse is a true dinosaur for your area/climate.

Trane,AmStd, and Bryant are all excellent.

AO Smith and Rheem are fine for gas hot water heaters.

I want a stat that is made for handling two stg furnaces.
If Trane or Am Std, then the 802 stat is fine. If you have dehumidification issues in your home in the summer, then Honeywell VisionPro IAQ which can also handle the addition of a dehumidifier. With the high end Bryant, you want the Evolution controller.

I would send contractor #1 packing. He is telling you what he thinks you want to hear not what you need to hear.

IMO

Contractor saying you won't be happy with Manual J results is completely off base. Sure, the equipment is rated at 80 degrees, but you don't use the Manual J results solely. You have to do some other calculations (Manual S) to determine what equipment you actually need, taking into account the latent and sensible capacities (SHR) of the systems. So, if the load calc said you needed 3 tons, you may actually need 3.5 tons if you want to set your thermostat lower, have a high sensible or latent load, etc.

I agree with tiger with you wanting a 90%+ furnace with a variable-speed blower. 2-stage heat would be nice, too. I'm not as big of an advocate for 2-stage as I used to be (moreso for A/C), but I do see the advantage more with furnaces.

Tiger - the high energy prices are why we are doing the conversion now - our oil co projected an 85% (!) increase in prices.

I'm not sure what size our A/C is, I'll have to check tomorrow when it's light out. It was here when we bought the house and I don't have any paperwork for it...would it say right on the unit? I know it's 12 SEER, but not the size. I don't have any complaints really - it may take our house a bit to cool, but once it does it stays cool. Our upstairs is a bit warmer than down, but I don't think it's outside the range of normal, maybe a 5 degree difference. Does that sound ok?

I can see that most of the tape on our ductwork in the basement is loose - is that something we should take on ourselves before they do the work, or expect them to do it? Other than that the ducts seem fine.

Contractor #1 is out then. #3 I didn't really like, and his estimate was through the roof, so that leaves me with 2 and 4. Here's what they recommended, please let me know which system you think is better.

Contractor #2 - American Std Freedom 90 2-stage furnace #AUX2C100A948, Rheem 40 gal power vented water heater #42VP40F - $5890. Honeywell humidifier $525

Contractor #4 - Bryant - Evolution System Plus #355CAV042080, AO Smith 40 gal power vented water heater (no model given) - $5800. April Air 500 humidifier - $475

I was surprised that #2 quoted the same size unit (100K BTU) whether I picked 80% or 90% - that doesn't sound right to me, shouldn't the sizing get smaller with a more efficient unit?

Dehumidification isn't an issue. We have a portable dehumidifier in the basement, and that's always been all we needed. Would the stat we have work, or is there some additional benefit of the new stat that I'm not understanding? I do remember him mentioning that with our current stat the switch between the two stages works more like a timer. However it is dry in the winter - would the addition of the humidifier solve that problem?

So the variable speed blower and 2 stage heating should still be able to reach our second floor?

Ryan - we're not changing our A/C at this time, if that's what your comments were referring to (calcs and SHR).

Thanks for your input, I feel like we're getting closer to a decision!

"I was surprised that #2 quoted the same size unit (100K BTU) whether I picked 80% or 90% - that doesn't sound right to me, shouldn't the sizing get smaller with a more efficient unit?"

-- Yes.

The variable-speed blower and 2-stage heating will enhance your comfort. The variable-speed blower will ramp up to maintain a set airflow, so that means it can overcome a SLIGHTLY deficient ductwork system, which is an advantage. They are also more efficient.

I'm not sure on that American Standard model number. I can't find anything on it, and it's not the variable-speed model as far as I know.

Sorry, my Manual J discussion made me get into A/C sizing, which isn't pertinent with your situation.

debbie

I don't believe the AmStd dealer has quoted the correct furnace.

This is the mdl you want.

Freedom 95® Variable Speed, Two-Stage, Upflow/Horizontal
Model TONNAGE Stage 1 Capacity Stage 2 Capacity H" W" D" Shipping Weight (lb)

AUH2B080A9V3VA 3 49,500 76,000 40.0 17.5 28.0 168
AUH2C100A9V4VA 4 61,800 95,000 40.0 21.0 28.0 197

it is important to know the size of your AC condenser and if existing evap coil can fit new furnace.

also as stated in previous post, you will require a thermostat/controller that can handle and properly stage two stg heating as well as handle auxilliary equipmemt like the humidifier. you do need at a minimum a media cabinet for both indoor air quality and to protect evap coil and blower motor.

personally, I think the Bryant dealer has given you the best quote as far as equipment with the exception of the controller. it is ridiculous to purchase a nice Evolution furnace without the Evolution controller.

IMO

Thanks tiger and ryan.

I will see what info I can find on the condenser when I get home from work. Where would I find info for the coil?

What's a media cabinet (some sort of filter I'm guessing?) and is that separate item from the furnace itself? Does the furnace not come with its own filter?

I will ask about the controller - how much do those run typically?

Thank you both so much for your help!

Debbie

debbie

there should be a model name on the outside of the AC condenser cabinet along with a dataplate on the back(or side) with mdl number and ser number.

the Evolution controller is not inexpensive but well worth it.

IMO

Tiger-
The AC is Hiel model #HAC236AKA4. I didn't realize you needed the serial number (and my baby was squirming, lol) so I'll have to get that tomorrow.

A media cabinet is an enclosure that can house a 4-5" pleated filter. Your dealer will have to determine if your ductwork system can handle it, but they are nice to have as they require less maintenance and are less restrictive (more filter surface area). If you don't go this route, you can always use the typical 1" throwaways.

OK, the AC unit is Hiel, Model # HAC236AKA4, serial # L022821649.

Is that compatible?

Any furnace with at least a 3-ton blower should be configured to provide the correct airflow for your current coil and condenser. Your contractor should know this.