that does not need to BE repaired out of the box.

My suggestion is to not settle for anything less than what you were expecting. I have a BS and am happy with it, so I'm not some sort of anti-BS person.

Plain and simple--you want what you ordered. Time to go to the store in person and speak as if you are having trouble hearing. Be loud without shouting, but loud enough for others to "accidentally" overhear you.

The squeaky wheel get the oil, so it's time to get squeakin'

Once this is all done and you have your NEW range, you will love it. Promise.

Here is a quote from their website: "Our commitment to precision in form and function is why many top chefs consider BlueStar to be the world's top-performing residential cooking equipment."
I'd use this in my dealings with them (and yes, I'd insist on replacement of the range).

Frankly at this point I'd want my money back.

I'm reading these and see two distinct issues that probably have different avenues for resolution.

1. You got a range that didn't have the burners that you ordered and paid for. Seems to me this is a "store issue". The question is did they order it wrong? If they did, then they need to take it back and order the right one. Chances are that the manufacturer is telling them they have to eat it for ordering the wrong unit.

2. You got a range that had damage. This sounds like an "installer, shipper or manufacturer issue". Depending on which one, there are multiple paths to resolution....a claim with the shipper/installer or one with the manufacturer.

So you, as the client, get screwed in that folks are most likely pointing fingers at each other to take responsibility.

My suggestion is to focus. Is the problem you paid for more than you got? Then it's the store who has to resolve.

Is it the damage, then the other three have to figure it out.

But you will say (rightly so) that it's both and they need to fix it.

I would argue that the first issue was you got less than you paid for and it's the store's issue. When you talk to them focus on that. Tell them the damage is secondary since it was to a unit you didn't order. No where have I heard that anyone is really discussing this. An extra warranty on something you didn't order isn't a fix.

Just my two cents......

You protested the charge with your CC company, right? I'd just wait and let AE handle it.
In the meantime, did you ever establish what the answer to Question 1 is:
Did you get the range with the burners you ordered?
If no, can it be easily upgraded, or does it need to be exchange for a completely different range? It would be easy to find out by calling a store and ask if it's possible to upgrade form lower to higher burners.
With respect to Q. 2:
If a good arrives damaged, do you have the right for a complete replacement, or do you have to let the seller/store fix it?

Wow, a whole entire 1 year warranty for all the trouble they've put you through? That must cost them, what, about a hundred bucks? Unbelievable.

GE gave me a free 5-year warranty when our Monogram bottom panel was dented during delivery. And that was just a cosmetic issue! They offered the free warranty to make up for the fact that the panel was back ordered for a few months before they could replace it. We were delighted with how they handled it.

Glad we didn't buy a Blue Star if this is really the level of "service" they provide. I hope they make it right for you in the end.

Because of your issue, I will not consider Blue Star for our new range. I have ZERO desire to work with a company--especially one selling a high-end product--that will not provide outstanding customer service.

When I bought a steam washer and dryer from Sears, the washer was delivered with a dent on the lower front. Sears said they would offer me a new one, but there were no more of that model available (I bought it on clearance sale). They gave me the choice of returning it or taking an additional 15% off (which I took). There was no question that I had the right to a new, undamaged unit or a full refund if I didn't want to accept their offer of other compensation to keep that unit.

You have the right to receive what you ordered: a new, undamaged unit of the correct model. Anything else is non-conforming tender and you do not have to accept it. I have found AMEX to be very good about reversing charges for damaged merchandise. A furniture dealer who wasn't in any hurry to replace damaged merchandise he delivered to me got his act together quickly after AMEX reversed the charge. After all this, you might just want to take the refund and buy something else, unless you still have your heart set on BS. (I can't believe they thought you would accept a 1-year warranty extension as compensation after you already turned down a 5-year warranty.)

AmEx usually gives you an additional warranty anyway. (I think it doubles it; or at least extends things by 1 year.) You might check on that too. I don't think they are giving you anything you didn't already have.

Is there any evidence that you have all 18k burners, instead of 3 22k's and 2 18's? As I wrote upstream, they look the same!

I am also watching for the final resolution in this case. If it's not resolved with a full refund or a new range delivered, I will not consider a Blue Star range. Period.

If a company won't stand behind their product before it's even fired up and used even ONCE, then why on earth would anybody ever, I mean ever, buy from them???

To whomever is monitoring this thread from Blue Star --- it's time to catch a clue. For real. Do you have any idea how many sales this lack of responsiveness has already and will continue to cost you?

I agree, that this is very disappointing and not at all an attempt to make the OP happy. The VP sounds like my bad builder who kept repeating to me after all the mistakes he or his trades made that "He just wanted me to be happy". They seem to think the more they repeat it maybe they can convince you to be happy when they truly fail to give you the product or service you deserve.

Very bad customer service, and with Gardenweb coming up as some of top websites when you do a search for Bluestar this is really going to effect their
business. Even Sears knows to have reps come on here to look for negative experiences and make them right.

I live approx 1 hour from the BS factory and would not have one in my home! I have no interest now in even using one in the local store for demo as I was planning on doing. I will be canceling my appt. Poor back up from the manufacturer as far as I can see. Why is BS not assisting by putting some pressure on the dealer? I thought part of being an authorized dealer involved making sure customer service is top notch. Just get a refund and choose another range. I am not going to consider involving myself with this company now.

I hope this gets resolved to your satisfaction. I am going to pass this info on to my KD so she can share it with her current and future clients.

I, too, hope this gets resolved to your satisfaction.

Also, I thought you should be aware of this post from gardenweb member KENWORTH1 who recently purchased a BS range like yours that has the swing out to the side type of doors. The ranges that were off the line this past fall are such that if you pull up on the doors as you open them they fall off. Please read through his post for the whole story; he had this happen and it caused damage to his tile floor and the range kickplate. I don't want to see this happen to you. It sounds like BlueStar may have corrected this step on the manufacturing line, but it's worth making sure that whether you end up with your current but repaired BlueStar or a brand new one that it does not have this issue.

KENWORTH1 has had to deal with other negative issues around his BlueStar purchase and repair. He's given them a lot of latitude in fixing the problems, probably more than is typical. I wouldn't want what has happened to him to happen to me.

I'm not saying there aren't happy Bluestar owners because there are, but as I continue to research on multiple sites I find enough negative reports that show the disparity between what BlueStar advertises and what they deliver that I have serious and growing concerns. The apparent poor quality assurance worries me. I find I'm much less willing to take a risk on purchasing a range from them.

Here is a link that might be useful: BlueStar problems

This post was edited by pentimento on Mon, Apr 8, 13 at 11:48

pentimento: thanks for the link. i'll read what kenworth1 has to say.
update: my dh and i agree that, although the range is a seemingly great one, we won't feel comfortable with them because of their bad customer service. they need to revamp their whole department! i called the VP, this morning and told his voicemail that his offer to fix my stove/oven and give me a 1 year warranty is unacceptable and if he had any questions to please call me. he hasn't called! as you remember, this offer is less than what the salesman offered me at the beginning! wow! just to confirm that the president knows what the VP is saying to me, i'll update him too!
again... thank you all for your support. i'll be updating you as to what happens in the future.

so i've emailed the president, michael trapp and he responded quickly:

"Thanks for the emails. I have been consulted throughout the process.

I am very sorry that we have not been afforded the opportunity to satisfy your requirements.

I suggest you go back through the channel with Capital. They will reimburse your purchase and you can buy a brand you are comfortable with.

Thank you very much for your time and patience."

WOW!

Wow ... that's pretty amazing that they'd rather just refund your money and lose you as a customer than to give you a range that meets the criteria you ordered and works properly.

Anyway, it sounds like a satisfactory resolution, so I'm happy you have that. I'm just sorry that you've lost weeks of prime cooking time in your kitchen because of it.

I have to say, this has definitely colored my opinion of Bluestar and I'm filing this information away for future appliance-buying.

Sounds like they "fired" you. Sometimes companies would rather walk away then continue with the transaction. They might have decided the risk was high that you still might not be satisfied.

Honestly, I might have done the same thing. What started as a need to vent blew up to a huge group rant. People were writing the company, directing them to posts on GW, ranting that based on this they won't consider buying one now. It got out of control because it was public.

I can't afford a Bluestar range. I think the lesson is to give companies time to resolve issues in private first.

Edit: let me add that I understand your side and I do empathize with you.

This post was edited by 1929Spanish on Mon, Apr 8, 13 at 18:44

i actually felt bad for possible loss of potential bluestar purchasers from this issue i started! i am blessed that i found out how they are before i started using this stove/oven. now i can go out and purchase from a company that wants to keep their customers satisfied! all a learning experience ... i hope i've helped others here on this site.
thanks again to everyone!!! :)

persimmon--

If it will make you feel any better about not wanting to discourage potential customers by your story, I really, really liked the Bluestar and really wanted to buy one when I purchased a range two months ago. But, in the end I didn't have enough faith in the company to buy one. There were just way too many of these types of incidents being reported. And, you also need to take into account that this is a small company. So, they must have quite a large percentage of failure rates if there are so many people with complaints about quality and customer service responses.

I am very grateful all this info is public. And I would be so very grateful if GWers wrote letters on my behalf!

Companies would love for us to stay silent. I hope we continue to share our honest experiences!

I have a feeling this company wouldn't have resolved this properly if it had been kept private. I think they would have strung Pers. along, and tried to make her feel grateful for whatever (little) they did. If I buy a high end range, I want an absolutely perfect specimen installed in my home. If anything is going to get bent or scratched, I get the honor of doing it myself!

I think Bluestar blew it.

I actually think it is a very good resolution that they are willing to refund your purchase entirely. Good for them!

And persimmon3, good luck and enjoy your new range purchase. :)

You have helped others here on this site, so thank you for posting. I know I've learned a lot both through reading and participating. I'm glad to hear about the resolution with Bluestar. I wish you the best as you complete your new kitchen.

Still curious - did you ever figure out if you received the correct burners you ordered or not? That point is still ambiguous and I think it makes a big difference in the tone of this thread. It's a much bigger deal if they sent you the wrong range initially as opposed to you receiving the correct range with some damage to it. In any case, I'm glad it has all worked at for you to some extent.

I agree with you, Weissman. I re-read this whole thread last night for the express purpose of determining the answer to that question. The OP never answered, despite being asked a couple of times. I totally agree that the answer makes a big difference.

This thread was, in my opinion, quite unfortunate and disappointing. Usually GW is better than this.

weissman & nycbluedevil: i asked about the burners and told how many holes i had in the 5 burners that were all the same to the salesman, the VP and the President and none of them gave me a clear answer. the salesman said that although the number of holes were the same the power of the gas going to each was different and, even if i could not see a difference with my naked eye, they were indeed different and they were what i ordered! the VP never really answered my question but veered the conversation in another direction and the president didn't answer at all! i figure that the 5 burners with the exact same number of holes are all the same ... whatever that is! i did get one simmer. the repairman said they were all the same too but the salesman said he was wrong!
update: the salesman is going to pick up the stove when he can find a pellet and a delivery person ... tba! now i start over from square one looking for a new gas range!

I would urge you to change your appliance dealer.
He is the root of your problems.

Good Luck.

I am another would-be Bluestar buyer (48," all the bells and whistles) who has been following this saga with interest, and we're now seriously re-considering our purchase as a result of how the Bluestar President and VP handled "persimmon."

I first learned about Bluestar here on Gardenweb a year or two back, read profusely, went back and forth to the dealer, and asked more questions here. If it weren't for Gardenweb, I would never have heard of Bluestar.

Why on earth, in this internet-driven day and age, any quality domestic manufacturer of large appliances still thinks it's OK to handle such a situation with anything less than a prompt, courteous and positive response, beats me.

We have a reputable local Bluestar dealer, but still, this has been a cautionary tale, indeed.

Oh, this makes me so sad.

I am a Blue Star owner. I love cooking on it. My friends love cooking on it.

With that being said, some of these friends are about to build new houses. They really want Blue Star ranges or range tops. I always thought I'd push my clients to look at Blue Star too.

In all fairness, I'm afraid I have to show this thread to them.

I had a Capital in my last house. It had some issues. But Capital was so responsive to correcting any issues that I really feel that they are more cognizant of the internet and especially Gardenweb. I truly believe they value the customer and know the good that comes from good customer service.

Oh, so why no Capital in this house? Well, for one, the Blue Star is made locally to where I'm located. I liked that. And two, the simmer burner had me at "I had to turn up the burner to melt the chocolate", (that was the rep at the local demo).

I'm wondering, does anyone know if Trevor sells Blue Star now? If so, I'm wondering if he could have helped with this issue.

Bee

Why on earth, in this internet-driven day and age, any quality domestic manufacturer of large appliances still thinks it's OK to handle such a situation with anything less than a prompt, courteous and positive response, beats me.

This thread appeared on the Kitchens forum. Some similar threads that were posted to Appliances instead were deleted after the OPs were attacked. There are multiple ways that fans of a product can affect what appears on a Web search.

Don't agree the appliance dealer is the root of the problem at all. Looks to me like the manufacturer who cannot deliver an $8K stove or stand behind it.

That said, the dealer can help or hinder. But having been through a similar situation, I can tell you that there absolutely was no way for me to have changed the dealer. The credit was issued to the dealer by the manufacturer. Fortunately it was a big dealer with clout. The dealer then issued the credit to me. Credit, not a refund. I was obliged to purchase from the same dealer as a result. I tried the refund route and they let me know very clearly that it wasn't a refund.

This often gets overlooked in the quest for a bargain but where you buy, who you buy from, and what kind of business they have really can ramp the aggravation quotient up or down should something go wrong. It's very important to pre-shop the dealer as aggressively as the product.

Without defending the president of Bluestar, nor criticizing the OP, I think this whole episode might have been better resolved off line, and out of public involvement. At least initially, and then if no resolve was made within a reasonable time ...

This post was edited by ctycdm on Fri, Apr 12, 13 at 9:24

I don't know that I agree that this would have been better handled privately. I suspect that the OP would still have a multi-thousand dollar range that had

a bent frame under the doors so the doors won't close properly, convection fan not screwed in properly and the repairperson said that it's too close to the wall so he needs to make something to prop it out (which mandy at BS said not to let him do!), and screws not screwed into a bar under the grease pan... which is missing altogether!

in addition to the ultimate mystery of what burners are actually installed on that range. Blue Star makes very big promises for a "completely customizable 6 burner gas range to meet your specific cooking needs." Gotta say, my specific cooking needs include actually being able to use the range for cooking. At that price point I would expect better from the dealer than delivering a unit with multiple defects followed by his unwillingness to make it right. I would expect a robust back-up from the company to ensure that their quality merchandise was actually quality upon delivery. None of that happened here. The final resolution to refund the OP's purchase price was delivered by an email that bordered on sulky. Not sure the refund would have happened at all without the spotlight. Were I in the market for this sort of range, I would hope the GW community wouldn't keep this kind of pertinent info to themselves for fear of hurting the manufacturer's feelings. It's kind of like being willing to point out that the Emperor has no clothes vs the lackeys that won't say it.

Unfortunately, none of these sorts of problems with Blue Star are 'news'. Over the years, I've read too many similar sagas over on the Appliances forum to have given me confidence enough to purchase a Blue Star when I was in the market for a cooker three-four years ago. (Bent frames, oven hinge problems, ignitor problems, too hot oven door, dodgy customer service, etc.) I would have loved to have the fire-power of a BS but there were just too many stories like this one. You'd think that BS would have gotten their act together by now but apparently not. Esp. since options for open burner cookers are even fewer now than when I was shopping.

Ultimately, I went with a Wolf range top and I've been very pleased with it except to say that the 15K burners come up way-short for stir-frying. Has been in service just over a year and have had Zero problems.

I completely agree with Suzanne. Great post.

I am coming to this thread late, but I want to mention that I saw a Bluestar "Inspired by Marcus" range that Persimmon has, the one with french doors, on display at Abt Appliances (a huge appliances retailer outside of Chicago). Down the aisle, just a little ways away, was the more "standard" Bluestar RNB range with the single oven door.

The Bluestar Marcus range did not feel solid, and up close, did not have the luxurious appearance I had expected for that price. It was interesting to compare the range with the nearby Bluestar RNB. The RNB was the hands-down winner, looked great. Meanwhile, the "Inspired by Marcus" range's french doors were rickety. Also, the racks did not pull out smoothly.

The thing is, there was a Bluestar REP at the store that day! Very knowledgable guy, but he spent a few minutes trying to close the french doors, which wouldn't close, and spluttered about the racks that wouldn't pull out properly (can you say, "awkwaaard"). Opening the doors was not easy either. The funny part was that when the rep moved over to the RNB, his face lit up - you could tell he really loved that machine. I mean, luuved that RNB. Couldn't stop talking about how great it is; when talking about how you could flip the grate for a wok, you'd think he was talking about the winning the lottery or something, he was so enthusiastic. Did not appear to feel that way about the Marcus, though he didn't say anything of course.

My advice, just from this experience with the rep, is that if you want the wonderful features of the Bluestar open 22k burners, exchange your Marcus version for an RNB. You can gussy it up with a cool paint color if you want (I know there are a few GWers who have done that and posted awesome pics). Just MHO.

This post was edited by akchicago on Fri, Apr 12, 13 at 19:01

Agree with " ctycdm ".
Had a certain member of this forum not intervened with Bluestar, the outcome might have been different.
Now, lets hope the OP gets a new range so we can all move on.

This post was edited by willtv on Fri, Apr 12, 13 at 21:50

The outcome might have been different or it might not have. But the bottom line is that social media is here to stay and what you just saw above is going to be the norm, but on steroids, in the future.

Millenials are growing up in the model of instant online feedback, and a companies like Blue Star had better get good at handling public issues better, because what happened above is just a VERY kind and VERY gentle version of the way they use social media and make near instant decisions on whether a brand is in or out of favor. Millenials arent buying pro appliances (at least not en masse) yet ... but they will be and it's not that far into the future.

After reading this post (and wanting to give Bluestar the benefit of the doubt)..... ok, changing my post...

Went to look at a Bluestar range today and was very impressed. I can see how it is not for everybody and why it has its fans and stirs debate.

It appears to be a very well made range and it is surprising the OP had such issues with it.

It is also too bad BS would not take a more CS approach to solving it if in fact that was the case.

But there must be more to the story that we are not hearing.

There doesn't seem to be much that could "go wrong" with the product. Pretty simple and straightforward.

Hope everything worked out for the best.

I think my initial reaction was to hop in and blame Bluestar. That being said, they obviously are making a significant product with good qualities. it seems the dealer didn't do anyone any favors and deserves most of the blame.

Not sure of the whole story but on second thought - there are always two sides to it.

Good luck.

This post was edited by goodguy2k2k on Mon, Apr 15, 13 at 16:33

Goodguy, I really enjoyed your post before you edited it. It had a lot of good information, I feel they and everyone still could benefit from. :)

I thought it was too preachy so I edited it.

Goodguy2k2k - I wrote in my post above that my impression of the Bluestar RNB is that it appears to be much better quality than the Marcus range that the OP has. Though the Marcus range costs more. I was as impressed as you by the RNB. However, the OP is talking about the Marcus model, and my advice was to switch out her Marcus model with all its problems, and get an RNB which has the high btu's that she wants.

update: the place where i purchased the bluestar came to pick mine up yesterday. the delivery person put it on a crate and our syrofoam around all corners/top and then wrapped it with plastic several times over then wrapped it again with a strong plastic binding. i wish it had been delivered that way ... maybe it wouldn't have come damaged! it just came in a cardboard box with nothing surrounding it! odd isn't it? i was sad to see it leave because i really wanted a blue star. this weekend there's a demo for the new wolf ranges so i'll go look at these. every salesperson i have talked to recently have said the same thing: if you want good customer service then go with the wolf! one salesperson told me that they don't carry bluestar because of the company's 'bad' CS ... and i didn't tell him about my experience!
goodguy2k2k: if you have any specific questions i'd be more than happy to answer them. i think i have been very open in telling every detail on my blue star issue and not holding anything back. i wanted a blue star and would have purchased another IF the president and his VP were nicer about the situation but they weren't. there is no way i can purchase from a company who doesn't care about their customers.

goodguy2k2k - what part of the story do you suspect we don't have? Are you implying that persimmon holds some responsibility for having received a damaged range?

I'm interested to hear that you don't think much could go wrong with it. What makes you think that?

Honestly I think you would have to have strong nerves to order a Bluestar based on this story and the others floating around.

persimmon - I hope you find an alternative range that you are much happier with and that it is perfect and you never need to find out how the customer service is! : )

i will explain since it appears this is an emotional subject with the possibility of people reading more into things than are really there.

Firstly, if I were Bluestar Management, I would have extended her warranty, repaired the range, provided some compensation, taken ownership of the issue and apologized. As I said in my post "it is too bad Bluestar did not take a more CS approach..."

I also said " there must be more to the story that we are not hearing..." which means we have not heard Bluestars side of the issue and we never will. Therefore, as much as I support Persimmon and feel bad for what she experienced, how can I get on here and rail on Bluestar when I can't know all the details?

For example, who installed the range? Was the range tested at install? Was the Bluestar installation checklist filled out? As far as I understand, the installer is supposed to complete the burn-in process before leaving ... Why didn't the installer notice the loud sound then? Maybe the situation was; whoever installed could not test as the kitchen was not yet complete? I just don't know.

I am not in anyway saying these things did not happen or that Persimmion is not 100% justified in being completely frustrated - she is. Perhaps the installer wasn't qualified. perhaps the installer was not familiar with Bluestar. All I am saying is I can never know everything that occurred, how the damage occurred, so how can I crucify Bluestar and conversely, how can I defend them? - I can't.

I think it is easy to get on here and jump on the bandwagon and either defend or crucify without knowing all the facts.

I can imagine all the issues Bluestar has to decipher like the questions I asked above. While I think they should go overboard in compensation as it is the "right thing to do" when you product messes up - I also do not know the issues the company is facing. It is not a $2 big mac and you are giving one free to compensate the customer. It is a big, heavy item, that takes people, trucks, time and a whole lot of money to diagnose, repair or return. I can understand them not wanting to send a return truck the instant an issue occurs.

That being said, BS management needs to read a book on customer service as they could have handled much better. But faced with the obvious emotion of this forum over the issue, they probably just opted to cut their losses and return the item. Can you imagine BS coming on here and trying to explain themselves. It wouldn't work and they can't so they probably did what they thought she wanted. I mean geez, they had non involved parties sending the President emails ... it was obviously spiraling out of control for them.

But I will never have the full story as only one side gets to get on forums and tell their side.

I am counting on you guys to remind me of that next time I am posting my displeasure with some manufacturer....lol.

Persimmion, I am glad you got some resolution and it is too bad you had to go through this in the first place. Best wishes in your search for a new favorite range. I will be incredibly jealous if you end up with a Wolf. Best wishes.

This post was edited by goodguy2k2k on Tue, Apr 16, 13 at 23:32

goodguy2k2k - I really liked the post you deleted with the do's and don't's of customer service and how satisfied customers ultimately cause more cash to flow to the company. It was really thought provoking and spurred a fair amount of discussion here at my house.

One thing I thought you missed was an extension of how a satisfied customer tells, say, 10 people and one of them buys, etc. Of the 9 who don't buy Product X, any of those 9 are likely to tell others that they've heard nothing but good about Product X, so a third party then buys because the original customer told someone who told someone. An example would be silgranit sinks - I don't want one, but if someone was looking for an alternative to stainless steel, I would certainly offer that lots of people find silgranit to die for.

BlueStar products are the best and in my opinion BS did the right thing by firing this customer. Who wants a customer who'll never be satisfied and is so unreasonable and emotional. Whiny too. I love my BlueStar.

I hate it that old threads, long since resolved, are being resurrected.