I googled and came up with two things. First, Insinkerator makes the Badger 5 which from what I read in the specs fits a 1 1/2" drain opening and has a variety of accessories to connect. I've linked below through AJ Madison (bought some of my appliances from them). The other idea was to contact an RV parts place. I thought that was pretty clever. Good luck!

Here is a link that might be useful: Badger 5

Remodefla -- thanks for the google help. I'm not sure that the 1 1/2" spec you see there refers to the opening in the sink -- I think it refers to the connection on the drain side.

I called both Anaheim Manufacturing (Waste King parent company) and Insinkerator and both said that on all of their models, the flange has to connect to a larger opening on the sink.... and that no reducer or adapter is possible.

I have to check on the RV parts place concept, which I kind of dismissed when it came up on my google search but figure it's got to be worth a shot at this point.

Ugh... fingers crossed!

Your sink is a bar sink not a prep sink. There IS a difference as you've discovered. If you absolutely want a disposer, then you need to select a larger sink that uses a standard size drain. I've seen prep sinks from 14" x 14" and up so you need not give up too much counter space. Your granite installer can enlarge the sink cutout to fit the larger sink and might even give you a price break if you tell him your story.

many people live well without a GD. Several threads have discussed this. Many people have never used a GD. Many people no longer use a GD, but did in the past. I cannot recall ever seeing a post from someone who says they just got their first GD and absolutely love it. (Having written that out, I'm sure it will spark someone to write back...). In forums inhabited by Master Plumbers, many of the plumbers joke about GD's being more trouble than the utility they supposedly provide.

So, the answer to "....otherwise it's not much of a prep sink, is it?!?" is NO, no, no, you don't need a GD on your prep sink.

Davidro1: Yes, I know that the world doesn't revolve around GDs. But we're used to having one ... and we're getting one on the main sink. That means,we would be less inclined to use the prep sink for anything that we're accustomed to using a GD for. So for us, that makes a GD-less prep sink much less useful as a prep sink.

GreenDesigns: I was planning on calling my granite people if there's an option to recut it in the field. I'm sure they won't be happy about dragging the granite slab back to the shop. First I have to find a sink who's template covers the old sink and the hole for the faucet.

The comment about it being a bar sink and not a prep sink isn't all that helpful, however; those are basically marketing terms. I'm not even sure what the distinction is -- Is the only difference the drain size?

First time GD owner here - just piping up just piping up about how much I LOVE it! ;)

Beth

Beth -- thanks! Our first GD was life-changing :)

Q for everyone: One of the guys on the GC's team (not the GC himself) suggested that he simply cut a bigger drain hole in the existing sink. He'd backstop the bottom of the sink with a piece of wood, take a 3 1/2" hole saw, and cut a bigger hole. Game over. I'm more than a bit nervous about this possible solution, but figure that worst case is that I'm out the cost of the sink (which I probably am anyhow if I want a GD).

I'm down to 3 options:
1: No GD; deal with it.
2: Get a bigger sink and recut the granite in the field.
3: Make It Fit.

The risk of #3 is that if it fails, I destroy (and therefore wasted money on) the existing sink. Of course, I wasted that money anyhow if I go with #2, (ebay or craigslist aside). #2 is probably the most expensive, though. #1 is the simplest, but we really did have in mind that the prep sink would have a GD.

There is a real distinction between a bar sink and a "prep" sink. I think someone telling you that should be helpful -- the same as if someone pointed out that a bathroom sink is not a good candidate for a prep sink even if you find one in a size and shape you like for similar reasons. Yes, they are marketed differently, but because they are intended for different functions. That doesn't mean you can't use one differently, but you do need to recognize the differences and limitations they present. Not unlike the fact that a toaster oven, microwave oven, steamer oven, micro/convection oven and wall oven all serve similar but different functions. The terminology may not help you with what you already have, but it should help you from making the same mistake when you go looking for sinks. Likewise, if you get a bar faucet for that sink, don't expect the same waterflow or features as a kitchen sink. From one who replaced a faucet that looked perfect but took forever to fill anything more than a small glass and didn't have the spray that DH wanted for rinsing veggies, etc.

Your fabriator should be able to recut the sink hole. If they can't or won't, talk to another fabricator. My marble and granite both had the cutouts done on site.

I chose not to have a GD on the prep sink. We compost everything anyway. For the icky things that get left, i just carry the strainer to the big sink and rinse it there.

I did get this cool Blanco strainer basket (which held up my remodel for a month!) to have a deeper basket that doesn't get blocked nearly as quickly.

Here is the 2inch version of it:

{{!gwi}}

They are at the very bottom of this page.

BTW, your granite looks great!

I guess it would be helpful for someone to tell me what the distinction is. The thing that's not helpful is the comment "Your sink is a bar sink not a prep sink." Elkay markets this sink under "Kitchen" sinks and calls it neither; I've seen it (and many other small sinks) listed arbitrarily as a "Bar" sink, "Prep" sink, or even both. If there are distinctions beyond drain size, I'd like to know what they are.

It's not possible to "accidentally" end up with a microwave when searching for toaster ovens and then get upset that your mislabeled toaster doesn't brown your toast. The distinction among those types of ovens are clear and obvious.

Frustrations for me: None of the sink companies or plumbing suuply web sites that I saw/recalled even list drain opening size as a thing to specify when searching; the WasteKing and InSinkerator websites, manuals and marketing materials don't anywhere call out specifically the 3 1/2" requirement; my supplier didn't realize that this sink had a 2" drain hole, didn't know about the 3 1/2" requirement, or knew them in the back of her mind but didn't put the facts together; I hadn't happened on any threads (until googling once I hit the problem) of people who had run into a similar problem.

I will find out from the fabricator how much recutting will cost, since that will impact our decision.

marcydc -- I appreciate the suggestion. It turns out that Elkay makes a similar "duostrainer" that is supposed to fit this sink listed here for anyone interested. And thanks for the granite compliment!

>don't anywhere call out specifically the 3 1/2" requirement; my supplier didn't realize that this sink had a 2" drain hole, didn't know about the 3 1/2" requirement, or knew them in the back of her mind but didn't put the facts together;

But that's the distinction you're asking about. It's a shame nobody realized and explained this to you. When farmhouse fireclay sinks first came out and were only available in big sizes, I was greatly smitten with a 24" bathroom sized one that I saw. Fortunately, the salesman was aware of the difference and explained to me that bath sinks aren't usable in a kitchen because only specifically kitchen sinks come with 3-1/2" drains.

I'm really sorry you're having this problem. Someone somewhere along the line should have realized and been able to warn you before things got to this stage.

I'm sorry that you found my comment less than helpful. I will list the ABC's. The primary distinction between a bar sink and a prep sink is the drain size. The small drain size of a bar sink is meant to only handle water, not the various particulate matter encountered by a kitchen sink. It uses 1 1/4" sized pipe, the same as a bathroom sink. Kitchen piping is required to be 1 1/2" in order to deal with the possibility of larger debris ending up in the pipes. Your plumbing inspector should have caught this unless the sink was designated as a "beverage" sink. A bar sink is also generally shallower and smaller as it's meant for only washing glasses rather than washing a chicken or filling a stockpot. In a drop in version, the rim only contains two holes rather than the four found on a kitchen sink, because it's meant to be used as with a bar faucer, which is generally cold water only. Of course an undermount sink doesn't come with rim holes for a faucet, but the box probably showed it being used with a bar faucet rather than a kitchen faucet.

In other words, while you can use a bar sink as a secondary sink in a kitchen, there are very good reasons to not do so. I've already given you the correct solution to the problem, but I'll ad that you also need to inspect the pipes going to your sink to make sure they are the 1 1/2" needed rather than the 1 1/4". If they are 1 1/4" you'll need the plumbing redone also.

GreenDesigns -- thanks for the clarification and insights -- especially the explanation of the bar/beverage/bathroom drains as compared to a kitchen sink drain. But based on this, I'm more confused than ever.

The two drain options that Elkay lists for this sink (the LK36 strainer and the LK8 drain fitting) both connect to a 2" opening on the sink, and a 1 1/2" sized drain pipe. (Less importantly, the faucet that Elkay lists as an optional "accessory" for this sink is a hot/cold single hole faucet.) From a plumbing specification point of view, does that make this a kitchen, rather than a bar or beverage sink?

In the end, I think that's not what matters. It feels to me that the terms are not consistent and the message to people should be to be aware of the specific measurements that matter for their application, not that they should look for a label like "bar" or "prep."

Steve,

How far apart are your two sinks? And is there trash/composting close to your prep sink?

I rented a home with a beautifully renovated kitchen which had a well-placed, large prep sink. It should have been fantastic, but I hardly used that prep sink because the sink had no disposer and was also far from the trash. I'd have to carry the dripping wet prep trash all the way across the kitchen. It was far more convenient to prep at the clean-up sink where I had the disposer, compost, and trash right there. The prep sink thus lost much of its functionality because of its lack of 'mess' capability.

So when I moved and renovated my kitchen, I was insistent upon garbage disposals in both my cleanup and prep sink. Ironically, in my new kitchen, my sinks are not too far apart, and my trash is equidistant from either sink. And my long-awaited prep sink disposer is...hardly ever used. The prep sink is a workhorse, but since the mess mostly goes to compost/trash and the clean-up sink GD is just a step away...I really could have gotten away with just one GD. No regrets, of course, but live and learn.

Are you sure this company doesn't make a sink of the same size and shape, with a 3.5'' drain? ELU 1113 for instance?

My point about the ovens is that you could wind up with a problem if you only lumped them together as ovens, especially when you get to micros, steam and speed ovens that come in similar sizes.

I don't know where you were looking, but on some sites I've searched in the past, you have to click to download or open spec sheets or installation instructions. I looked for the model number you posted and it appears to be is incomplete, but I had no problem finding specs, including drain sizes. The one I found listed as a kitchen sink is 1113 and does have a larger drain, but it's only 5 inches deep. It also appears to be a different shape, so it looks like you'd still have some cutting on your granite. I would want a deeper bowl anyway. Bowl size and depth would trump disposer/no dispoer for me.

Good luck finding a solution -- and check the specs and installation sheets if the details are not obvious from the listing.

tress21: Great questions -- thanks for the input. My new PoV (serenity NOW!)) is that with or with out a GD -- even with or without a prep sink -- this kitchen layout is so much better than the old one, that it's not worth getting cranky over. Here is the layout:

We haven't lived with the new kitchen yet, so I'm not sure where most prep work will take place. DW believes that force of habit will take over and prep will take place where it always has -- on the main "L" of the kitchen, mostly between the sink and the cooktop. (We've never had an Island before).

I think it "depends" -- the fridge is on the opposite side of the island from the main sink, so I could easily imagine taking stuff out of the fridge, working on it right there at the island, and putting it into the oven or onto the cooktop, all without ever going near the main sink -- there is enough room for that.

We still have options on things like: where do we put cutting boards, knives, etc -- so I can imagine having a few different ways that we'll work and live in the kitchen. The point was to ensure that we had the option of doing work at whichever sink it was convenient, and not be limited by the desire to avoid scooping gook out.

johnliu: Good thought (I'm assuming you used ELU1113 as a somewhat random example as it is a rectangle, and ours is a quarter-round pie wedge.

lascatx: Yes the spec is listed on the spec sheet. But I didn't even know that drain size was a spec to check, even after reading the specs and requirements from the disposers. Obviously, I know better now.

Thanks for posting the plan. I cannot see dimensions for that sink, and couldn't find that particular model online.

Just from the plan, I think the sink is too small to be a primary prep sink anyway. For prep, you need to be able to wash a colander of greens, strain a pot of stock, hold a big bowl of ice water for blanching, etc. It looks like this sink is more for filling a water glass or washing some fruit. Also, if I am reading things right, there isn't trash at the prep sink anyway. So, I personally don't think it is critical whether the sink has a disposal.

Just my opinion, but I would (first choice) install a larger sink + disposal with trash underneath, (second choice) have the existing sink modified to a larger drain, understanding you may well be buying a replacement as it may not work (the disposal flange might impede draining), or (third choice) live with it.

Steve, I'm totally jealous of your layout. What a functional, happy place to prepare food.

I'd agree with your DW that most daily prep (meat, vegetables) would happen next to the clean-up sink. It's closest to the trash and sink, and you can scoot your prepped items over to the range without having to drip on the floor. The island I would see for less messy jobs (making sandwiches, landing hot pans from the oven, washing hands, washing fruit) or spread-out tasks like rolling pastry, folding tamales or cooking with children.

Prep or not, your second sink will be a real treat if you're used to just one sink. Even if it's just a clean place to wash fruit/hands while the clean-up sink's occupied, you'll love it. I'd guess that many of us don't really prep at our prep sinks anyway. They're usually too small, as Johnliu pointed out, and too far from the trash/composting. But invaluable nonetheless.

johnliu has it right IMO. The placement of the prep sink is smack in the middle of the work triangle and the main traffic line from sink, to stove, to fridge. So I would let the disposer go and use it as a secondary, which is nice to have in any event.

Thanks for the additional comments.
Given the location of the prep sink relative to the cooktop, fridge, and oven, I thought we might (at least sometimes) as this as the main sink in the work triangle. But looking at the sink in person over the weekend, it does seem to be too small for that. It would work for more the tasks that johnliu outlines, but not a lot more. If it had a disposer, it would also be useful as a trash dump for any task at the counter that produces dispoer-able refuse. But it feels smaller than we thought it would.

We're getting a price on recutting the granite. I've found a Blanco sink that I'm considering -- it's a 13x13 square (inside dimensions), 6 1/2" deep. (Not to rathole on the earlier discussions, but Blanco calls this a "bar sink" despite the 3 1/2" drain.) A square (rather than rectangle) sink lets us keep the faucet on the diagonal which keeps it more out of the way and lets us access the sink from either side. There was also a slightly larger Kohler and Ticor. But first thing to determine is the cost of this chage so we can decide what to do.

Thanks again for the helpful inputs.

Here is a link that might be useful: Blacno Bar Sink Model 441026

With most of us suggesting a 15 inch sink as minimal for most prep sinks, the marketing may be shifting to calling those smaller sinks bar sinks -- and maybe there is a demand for disposers for the lemons and limes after they are used? You can't control the way they are marketed -- just try to be aware of what you need for your uses and make sure all the parts work together. The recut shouldn't be too much. Hope you can get it worked out.

lascatx: agreed.

Meanwhile: I just heard from my plumbing supplier that Elkay is willing to take back this sink and send me a custom made version with a 3 1/2" drain opening for no additional charge (!!).

So it seems that I have at least two options... one is free; the other can be done at any time for approximately the same cost (i.e. recutting the granite for a bigger sink down the line shouldn't cost more than it does today).

(I haven't gotten a price yet on the granite recut yet, but having a 'free' option which gets me what we originally planned on is hard to pass up).

Hey, if you don't need to put a put or colander down in the sink bowl, it sounds like you have nothing to lose by trying. As you said, you can always recut and enlarge it. Kudos to Elkay for stepping up and making you a sink with a larger opening.

Free solutions are the best ones. Congrats!

That was supposed to read "put a pot" (sigh)

To me, "free" isn't always the best option. Free doesn't give you a place to prep with a sink that size. It might be worth paying a little extra now to get the function you need of a sink you could actually prep with. That little extra money probably won't even be remembered when you're cranking out yummy food in your beautiful new kitchen with your great rangetop!

If you don't need to put a pot into the sink bowl, you always have the option of a colander that spreads across and hangs over the sink -- easier to do when small. Washing large heads of lettuce might be an issue, but just about anything else I can think of doing at my prep sink would be okay. I still like a larger one, but doesn't mean you can't use a smaller one. Some folks have used trough sinks. And for him, changing it later is still an option that won't cost any more then than it will now.

breezygirl: I agree that 'free' isn't always the best option... but at this point, not spending more money on a modification until we live in the kitchen for a while and see how we end up using the space does make sense and, as lascatx, said, changing lt later is the same price as changing it now. Especially since I have a feeling that my fabricator isn't really interested in cutting on site. So I'd have to bring in a new person who's not motivated to "cut" me a deal (so to speak).

Now, on to the next issue...

I'm not going to weigh in on whether free = best, but I am impressed that Elkay will do that for you. That is good customer service.

I was more than impressed... I was shocked when my plumbing supplier told me. It isn't something that I seriously considered as a possibility, but for now, it makes the choice easy.

Steve, if my experience is any indication, there could be a bathroom or other surface to be redone in your future. If so, that might be a good time to combine the countertop issues and get a "deal". We did the kitchen and want to do the master bath and rework a utility room area to allow for a shallow counter (better than nothing for dealing with laundry). I'm thinking the ideal thing for me would be to have them done at the same time since they are both smaller areas and there is no economy of scale in one alone. Otherwise, when you are past the big expense and you know you want a change, a small expense to make something right will be an easier decision. It's funny how other home expenses are easier to take after doing the kitchen. LOL