Congratulations on your new home, and as a fellow remodler of a 50, well now 60, year old house, you're going to love the update.

Just a couple thoughts --

1st -- switching the dw to the other side of the sink makes a lot of sense. It will mean adding something to attach the countertop to, but most cabinet lines make something (we have a 3" box type thing), or you can search the forum for other solutions of space is too tight to spare the 3".

2nd -- I think you'd really appreciate a second water source (e.g prep sink) -- either on the island or to the right of the stove. Prep space pretty much needs water, and so you will be prepping in your clean up zone without it. Also the counter to the right of the stove has great proximity to both the pantry and the fridge, so that would be a great place for the prep sink -- it will take that long expanse of countertop there and make it an awesome prep space because it's also right by the stove which is where most of the stuff you're prepping will ultimately wind up. If you will be needing to keep an eye on kids, though, you might consider the island for the prep zone.

3rd -- I think 15" overhang is pretty standard, and adequate even for very tall people, but 18" isn't unheard of.

4th -- not sure what your cabinet configuration is yet, but as you figure it out, I'd consider putting pullout trash in two places -- down by your clean up zone, and a second in the prep area. I don't think putting it mid-kitchen would serve either area well, and you'll be happy to have one right there on either place -- where the current dishwasher is might make a lot of sense for one.

Gotta run a child to school. I'm looking forward to seeing the ideas the real experts around here come up with -- you're so smart to check in here at this stage --- you'll be on of the ones posting about how your vision and result line up perfectly because of it.

Good luck!

Kris

I second the thought of a prep sink in the island. Imagine working in your space. You get some veggies out of the frig and will have to schelp over to the other side of the kitchen to rinse then back to the stove. It would really help to have a separate water source near to the stove and ovens if you are bakers in your family. If you keep the DW where it is, you can always think of getting a blind corner corner.

Everyone is a little bit different about spacing issues, so I'll tell you what I think and why, but you decide.

Agree on the dishwasher. I hate it when the dishwasher door blocks cabinets.

Your dude is making those aisles a little tight. 3'3" will get a little smaller due to overhangs (he or she didn't allow for the countertops to extend over the cabinets and their doors/drawers) - so the aisle will be closer to 3 feet wide. I think modern sizes of appliances have just killed the 3' aisle. A tall tub dw has a door that is 28-30" tall. Using a 36" aisle, that leaves a big 6" or so for someone to get by the open dw door.

You have the same problem - or perhaps worse - in front of the ref. How bad that one is depends on the exact ref you purchase, but I always imagine a traditional ref (single ref door) and what passes as "counterdepth". A tradional ref can be nearly 36" deep including the doors and the handles with an average body depth of about 30" PLUS a small required offset for airflow. A counterdepth ref is really about 24-27" deep in the body and the doors and handles add on to that - a good planning depth to think about is 30" (airspace+ref body+doors+handles).

Your dude is allowing for the ref to be about 27" deep in the body! A traditional ref will stick out into the aisle a good bit - about 4" of body plus at least 6" of doors and handles. A counterdepth ref may need to be pulled forward because of the way ref doors are made - the doors open beside the ref and will also stick out into the aisle by its doors and handles. Again just for general planning - use about 6".

For either type, you're now in the land of having to calculate whether you can open the doors in the available aisle space. If it needs repair or replacement in the future, it might be hard to get it outta there without damaging something else.

Because both side aisles are below the recommended 42" minimum, I would look at making the island a maximum of about 4'6" wide between the ref and cleanup sink. I would look at changing its orientation (the short side facing the cooktop instead of the sink), and look at installing a prep sink on the ref side.

Guessing that the actual aisle measurement is again wrong by omitting the counter overhangs, I would ask you to try out spacing the island 3" closer to the cooktop. That should make a 36" aisle, but only right in front of the cooktop. Try cooking in your existing kitchen with a table or even some cardboard boxes 3 feet behind you to see what you think.

Back to that prep sink on the island... If you imagine the steps involved in even a simple meal - do pasta with a jar sauce and see how far you'll walk and where you have to go. Walking around the island can get old pretty quickly and you will do it frequently.

I'd like to see a more compact cooking area. I don't want to have to walk with full pots of water. I don't want veg to drip across aisles. I don't wanna share my water source when I'm cooking.

I'm a little weird - I have a small sink right beside the range with a drainboard. It works well for hand washing, filling or dumping pots, doing dirty things with meats or fish and running an ice bath while blanching. If you can't or don't want to put an extra sink in the island, it's another idea to consider.

I am beyond speechless at the 2'2" (and it will be around 1.5" less because of counter overhang) aisle to the pantry. Are you supposed to put bumpers there? If you have full extension drawers with handles on them, I'll bet they would crash into the oven sidewall. Carrying grocery bags freely takes about 42", carefully takes 36", at 25", it'd be downright tricky.

It would make a little more sense to simply move the pantry wall forward so it was in line with the front of the ovens and have a larger pantry. Don't use a house style door - use a large cabinet door.

Hth

what is behind the wall that has the W and D on it?

I second the other comments but have another question for you- would you consider swapping laundry and pantry? Then you could access laundry thru the pantry and you could get a few more cabinets in the kitchen by eliminating the pocket door and walking around the refrigerator to the pantry. The 26" aisle to the current pantry is a joke. Imagine carrying a big flat of bottled water or something. You would definitely be scrapping your knuckles on the door frame. I also think you could do two things with this option- shift door frame so that you can get a galley style pantry. Or, you could leave the pantry where it is but that would be much less functional for me and how I use my pantry. How do you plan on using yours? Food storage? Occasional items?

Your kitchen is a generous space but the plan needs tweaking to make the best use of it. You've received great suggestions from bmore, kris_ma and remodelfla already. bmore's idea to move the pantry wall forward is a good solution for the tight quarters others have pointed out.

I wouldn't want my pantry and laundry room to share space as brianadarnell suggested (sorry). I would not want the excess heat and humidity generated when doing laundry in my pantry. I hang up a lot of laundry to drip dry so that increases the moisture levels in my laundry room.

What are the interior dimensions of the space? The 9'6" along the top wall and 17' along the right wall include an outside wall. It looks like your stove wall is 194" (added 6'5", 6"9" and 36" for range together). Is this correct? Can't figure out the other dimensions well enough.

Lots of good suggestions so far -especially regarding moving the DW and looking at your aisles widths. One other thing I would consider is exchanging your fridge and oven/mw stack. It will put the fridge closer to the work triangle and you use it a lot more during the day than the oven.

Welcome! This looks very much like my (currently being painted) kitchen. I had a hard time placing things with the narrow and long space. I would shift island closer to stove. This won't be a traffic thoroughfare, and you can have easy access to prep on island and turn-around to cook. Don't know how large your family room is, but I had issues with the island with stools crowding the couch, so this could help that if it's an potential problem. I'd also add a prep sink in island on fridge end. Yes, move the dw to the left of the sink. Much easier access for more "help" in cleaning up. Shrink the island as the two short aisles will be used a lot, and you don't want appliance door blockage. I kept my fridge on the outside so snack retrievers wouldn't get in the way of cooking.

I think Breezy has a similar layout, and has a corner pantry where you have your skinny hallway. You'd lose symmetry on stove wall, but would gain storage and easier access.

I should be up and operating in a few weeks...so I can let you know how it functions IRL. Good luck!

We just finished a remodel with a very similar layout to yours and ours also opens towards family room. Only difference is our wall with range is shorter and our other 2 are longer. We added a peninsula to one side of the U instead of an island. Our DW is to the left of the sink and garbage pull out to the right. Fridge is in the same spot as yours and our 2nd range and microwave are in the peninsula.

Awesome suggestions! Thanks to everyone! I will move the dishwasher to the other side of the sink, make sure all aisles are 42" from the edge of the countertops, and also add a small sink either on the island or next to the range (thanks bmorepanic for that idea). I don't want to move the pantry wall forward in line with the oven so that I can have more counter space and cabinet space. Will look for more ideas for the aisle to the pantry. lisa_a - laundry room is 5.5' x 5.5' (interior) and pantry 4.25' x 5.5'. ca_mom and sskit - glad to know you have similar designs. I hope this will work out as well.

davidro1 - behind the W/D (laundry) room is the dining room.

How is he proposing to do the electrics for the oven and microwave and hang cabinets when the wall will be hollow to accommodate the pocket door?

Are you willing to try a layout that opens the wall to the dining room? It will give you a butler's pantry. You will have more storage.

dekeoboe - good point! Have to talk to him first thing tomorrow. Can't thank you guys enough!

bmorepanic - Thanks for all the feedback. I am now thinking I should move out the laundry from behind the fridge/oven and push the refrigerator back (door inline with the pantry). Then I can make the aisles b/w island and DW as well as island and fridge 48". The island can then be 3'6" by 6', with a prep sink. How does that sound?

This?

Ok to me. My normal workspace is a 54" stretch of counter and I like that. I gots some other bits that can be pressed into service, but I don't have as much as you will. The only thing I would change is a tall cabinet right outside the pantry for baking grains and gear if you're a baker. It seems more convenient there but it also trades a little bit counter for a wider pantry door.

Remember two things about islands.

The back side needs a cover of some sort so plan on adding at least 3/4" to its depth for that. You might also consider the slightly curved out shape on the island. side note - maybe think about fancy end panels too. I do that where they're seen because I think they're pretty BUT I think plain ones would work well in your case because the range will steal all of the attention.

The other thing to remember is the island needs electrical outlets. Where we are, you get an automatic pass for the sink area, but otherwise its "no point on the counter shall be more than two feet away from an outlet". With a six foot island, you might have to have an outlet in the middle somewhere - it depends on your desires and your local building codes. Check it out and see if they require something before committing to exactly this island.

Good solution, bmore, if the laundry room has to stay put.

andydad123, since your architect cut things a bit lean in the aisle to the pantry, I want to double check that he or she has allowed enough space for the fridge and ovens. It looks like you have enough space for fridge, ovens and their cabs but it's hard to tell for sure. 30" ovens can go in 30" to 30" cabs (depends on oven and cab construction), fridge cabs can run about 39" to 41", IME.

One way to gain a bit of space is to lose the side wall to the left of the fridge. 2x4s and drywall eat up more space than cabinetry.

That should read "30" ovens can go in 30" to 33" cabs

Wow...Great suggestions. I've been without internet so I couldn't check back in until now. I really like this layout. I think the pantry will definitely be more accessible and usable. It also provides the separation between the laundry and pantry but allows them to utilize the same space like I was thinking above. Can you live with a stackable w/d combo? Do you air dry anything? Do you have somewhere to put that stuff?
On the island- My island is 7 ft X 4.5 ft and I did fine with an outlet in each end. You should consider what appliances, etc you plan on using at the island. Just make sure your cords are long enough for whatever you plan to do.
I can't read dimensions, but I wonder if you could fit the oven/micro on the wall on the other side of the pantry door facing the island? What would work best for you?

One more thought. . . putting your oven and fridge next to each other causes a couple of problems, the main one being your inability to open the fridge door without banging into the oven. This can be resolved by not doing a french door or side by side, and by hinging the door opposite the oven, but not sure if that is what you are planning or not. It would drive me nuts to only be able to open my door to 90 degrees, plus I would think it would make it impossible to slide out drawers or remove them without sliding the fridge completely out of the hole . ..

Another idea with only slight tweaks to your plan:

{{gwi:1946279}}

I reduced the laundry room by 1'-3" but if you go with stackable W/D, it's still a room, not a closet. Front load machines usually run 28" wide - even full capacity units - which leaves room for a 26" wide cabinet and counter between the W/D stack and the doorway. I changed the swing door to a pocket door. Light switch would go on the wall shared with the kitchen behind the fridge.

This allowed me to expand the pantry, giving you a wider aisle between cooktop wall and fridge space. I switched the pocket door, too, so that you won't have issues with outlets on the fridge wall. Pantry light switch can go on the wall between laundry room and pantry.

Yes, the oven/MW column is now in a pathway but if you are like most families and only use your oven 3xs a week, this may pose fewer hassles than your original 2'-2" wide aisle to the pantry, which will be used many, many, many more times than that a day. Moving the oven/MW column reduces the chance of door dings, as noted by athensmomof3.

The 18" wide cab next to the fridge (oops, forgot to mark that) can serve as a landing spot for pantry, fridge and oven. It also helps make that area a bit more open in feel.

I added a prep sink to the island and switched the DW to the other side of the sink as others suggested

I'm not sure why your architect marked the cook top side of the island as being 2'-6". It should be 2'-2" (actually 2'-1.5" but I didn't want to mess with fractions on the plan): 24" deep cabs with 1.5" counter overhang. Is he or she suggested 27" deep cabs? But that implies a 3" overhang there. Very confusing. Anyhoo, I changed that and also enlarged the counter overhang from 12" to 15" (reduced the aisle between island and FR at same time).

Great suggestions everyone. bmorepanic, lisa_a: special thanks for the detailed analysis and the layout pics. Really appreciate all your advice. Will post our final plan once it is ready.