IMO, your towns water report should be all the testing needed. There are several independant labs that charge $35-200 for a test. With what you have provided, your hardness is about 24 GPG (404/17.1). Sizing is done by multipling the hardness by the water used. Lets say you have 4 people in the family. The average usage per person is 65 gals per day. So 65*4*24=6240 grains removed each day * 7 days=43,680 grains removed per week. So based on the figures I've provided, the unit will be a 45K (1.5 CF) or 60K (2 CF).

Now you can work the figures backwards. A 45K unit set at an efficiency setting has 30K capacity. 30,000/24/65/4=4.8 days between regen using 9 lbs of salt per regen so 30 days per month/4.9*9=56.25 lbs of salt used per month.

A 60K efficiency setting is 40K so 40,000/65/4/24=6.4 30/6.4*12=56.25

Both system will use the same amount of salt, but the bigger one will regen less which in turn will last longer and use less water.

Your water hardness is high, but not extreme. You have 24 gpg (grains per gallon). There are areas in the US with over 60.

$8000 is crazy expensive for a softener, unless you have a very large home and a very large family, requiring a very large softener.

1. How many people in your home?

2. # of bathrooms?

3. Any fixtures that use a lot of water, such as a jetted tub or mult-head showers?

4. Can you post your city's entire report? There may be something there that stands out as a potential problem.

1) 2 including a 6 month old. I would assume we will be a 2 adult and 2 child house soon.

2) 2.5 BA

3) The Master BA has a 14" rain shower head, hand held, 2 body sprayers, and a 6' soaker tub. I REALLY love my showers which can be 2-3 a day.

4) I thought I scanned it but I can't find it! I'll take a look tonight.

I had a local company come over and got quoted $1950 for Water Right EVRC (EVRC-1054) and additional $700 for the RO system. The price includes shipping. After doing my inital research, I asked the following questions:

Who makes the control valve? Clack, Fleck, etc.?

• Water Right, manufacturer of the "Evolve" professional dealership series, utilizes Clack control valves.

My family consists of 2 adults, and 1 baby but we are planning for another. We have 2 ½ BA but the master bathroom will consume a lot of water due to the shower and soaker tub. Will the model support our water consumption?

• The 10"x54" EVRC contains 1 cu. ft. of American manufactured Purolite 8% cross linked high capacity ion exchange resin (32,000 grains of softening capacity per service run) & 1/2 cu. ft. of Calgon Granular Activated Coconut shell carbon (GAC). In regards to your home's plumbing system (3/4" & 1/2") copper domestic water lines, water hardness (12 grains per gallon), total chlorine level (0.7 ppm) and potential occupants (3-5 people), this size unit is more than ample for many years of soft, chemical free water throughout your home with uncompromised flow rates, regardless of the type and number of fixtures/appliances being used at any given time.

How many gains doe the system support? What is the flow rate?

• The EVRC is fully ported in 1" npt with peak flow rates of 15.6 gpm. The systems advanced electronics are able to monitor your homes water usage, while only regenerating proportionally to specific water flow demands, thereby maximizing system efficiency.

What type of bypass valve does the system use?

• The system utilizes an industry standard 1" Clack bypass valve, which allows for easy "no tool" bypassing for service and/or an emergency.

Are there replacement parts available or are they proprietary to the WaterRight company?

• Although NMP Water Systems, LLC is the exclusive Evolve dealership in north jersey, there are other local service providers with affiliation/access to the Water Right family of products. The system is very serviceable, not a proprietary "throw away" unit.

Does the unit support a slow rinse during the regeneration cycle? The web site indicates that it only supports a fast rinse.

How long before regeneration is the brine tank filled?

• Regarding system cycles, they go as follows: 6 minute brine fill first, 4 hour brine solution make up, 8 minute backwash, 90 minute up flow (counter current) slow brine rinse, 4 minute rapid rinse, return to service position. These cycles allow for maximum efficiency (ie minimal waste of softener salt & water), while regenerating the resin bed with soft/filtered (chlorine free) water, while preventing brine tank salt bridging via dry salt storage.

What is the maintenance for the carbon? Does it need to be replaced?

• The GAC carbon is recommended to be "rebed" ie replaced after 5 years of moderate to heavy usage. This is a service we provide, currently in the $200 range.

You said there is a 10 year bumper-to-bumper warranty on the entire system. What happens if I have issues after 10 years?

• Our warranty for equipment & workmanship is indeed for 10 years from date of install. This includes all mechanical, electronic and tank components and associated pipe work. After 10 years, any worn out components would be replaced at standard list pricing.

I only have a minute right now, will be more detailed later.

I would tell this company to take a flying leap. Even if they were sizing for the MINIMUM amount of hardness you will ever see, they are offering you an undersized softener. You will be wasting water, salt, and your time and effort while your softener moving parts wear out three times as fast as they should.

Another point is how can you use regenerate with softened/chlorine free water? " while regenerating the resin bed with soft/filtered (chlorine free) water"

There's no way a single tank unit can soften the water and regen at the same time. This one either does not understand the regeneration process or is lying.

This is not promising. Please help me understand.

At your reported minimum hardness the suggested softener would work for now, but when you add to your family it would regen every 6-7 days. At your reported maximum hardness, it will regen every 2-3 days. 7-8 days is what we shoot for to minimize wear, salt and water usage. You need a 2.5 cubic ft softener for most efficient operation.

The EVRC is available as a twin tank. If that is what they meant, with 1.0 cubic ft of resin in each tank, that would be an acceptable size and regen with soft water, BUT a split tank design with carbon in the top and softener resin in the bottom is just a bad idea. You can't rebed the carbon without rebedding the softener resin. The carbon will need to be replaced in 5 years so it's just added expense. If they are telling you they can successfully rebed the carbon without disturbing the resin they are either lying to themselves or to you.

I have another local company coming over tomorrow. Should I just ignore this quote or should I inquire about a twin tank with 1 cubic ft of resin in each tank. The problem is that I am spewing what you are saying so it is difficult to have an intelligent conversation.

If you are saying that 2.5 cubic ft. is necessary, than why consider the dual 1.0 cubic ft.? Or is that the only available option for the EVRC series? Is it a bad idea to have a split tank due to the fact that replacing the carbon will force the rebed of the resin? Won't all carbon regardless of single or dual tank need to be rebed every 5 years? Therefore, an adding expensive for every system?

When a single tank is used, we have to account for a 15-20% reserve factor to ensure you don't run out of soft water. With twin tanks, one tank is used at a time and when that tank's capacity it used up, the other tank is placed in service while the first one is regenerated. There is no need for a reserve so the total resin volume can be smaller.

Yes, all carbon will need to be rebedded approximately every five years. However, when the carbon is in the same tank as the resin, the resin will also need to be rebedded at the same time when it would normally last 2-4 times as long as the carbon. For that reason, I would avoid the EVRC series entirely and, if you choose this company, opt for a model that doesn't incorporate carbon into the same tank. Did you request carbon filtration, or was it their suggestion?

The 2nd company just came and recommended the WaterCare's CareSoft Elite RC (10X54 I believe?). Similar to the first company, it uses split tank with carbon on top and resin on the bottom). This system includes a 18X40 (What does this mean?) brine tank with a safety valve and a bypass valve. I am not sure if the other quote including these valves. I requested a dual tank system and he said that is reserved typically for commercials but it was also a split tank design. He said he would happily sell it to me but that 1 cubic ft. of carbon and 1 cubic ft. of resin will suffice for my household. He mentioned that it would take 1 1/2 hours to regenerate and that can be done in the middle of the night to avoid using any unsoftened water.

When I pushed for a twin tank system, he seemed confused as to why I wanted this. He said that there is a plate in between the carbon (which he says needs to be changed 5 years at $225) and the resin (He did not say if/when this needs to be changed).

I requested the carbon as it will remove chlorine from the water and provide better drinking water throughout the house. However, we are also looking into adding on a RO system for $700 or so. If the carbon is the issue, both companies often a carbon-less feature.

At this point, I guess I just don't know enough to know the best decision.

Unfortunately, you are seeing the problem with the entire home water treatment industry. The folks selling the systems, in general, know little more than then homeowners buying the systems. Most of these companies offer little or no technical training to their employees and stock softeners in one size, which they recommend to everybody. It's pathetic, and you shouldn't have to deal with it, but it is the current state of home water treatment.

If you want carbon to remove chlorine, get a separate system. You are better off with no carbon and 10% crosslinked resin. Install a point of use carbon filter or an RO system at the sink for drinking water. Either can also be installed in a utility room with water plumbed to drinking water faucets wherever you may want them.

Either a 2.5 cu ft single tank or a twin tank system with 1.0 cu ft in each tank will work for you. You should use 44 lb salt per month with three people, 58 with four, up to 9 lb less with a twin tank system.

Ask these companies how often their softeners will regen and how much salt they will use per regen and per month. Ask them how they determined appropriate size. If you like the answers, get performance guarantees in writing.

What are the advantages of the carbon? Just chlorine removal? Will the RO system remove that for drinking water purposes? Both companies said regen occurs on use so they could not predict if it would be every 5 days or 7-8, etc.

What is the difference between 8% and 10% crosslinked resin? Also, both quotes were made by the owners of the company which are Angies List rated. That doesn't necessarily mean they are good but it wasn't a "rookie".

I am was very comfortable with the EVCR especially the owner so this is a big set back. However, that system has a single tank with 1 cu ft of resin which you are saying is not enough. How do you determine how much resin is necessary for a household? If you are recommending a single 2.5 cu ft single tank (100% resin) or twin 1.0 cu ft tanks, then both companies are vastly underestimated the sizing. Correct?

usingCity water is safe to drink so, yes, carbon solves strictly a taste issue, primarily chlorine. An RO system has carbon filtration prior to the RO membrane so chlorine is removed.

With city water, I recommend 10% crosslinked resin because it resin is more resistant to damage from the chlorine in city water.

Yes, of course regen occurs on use, but we have to estimate usage based on the number of people in the home. In general, 60 gallons per person per day is a good estimate. It is lower for some, higher for other, but it is a good average.

A great many factors go into proper softener sizing. In simplified terms we estimate usage based on the number of people in the home and the water analysis. Hardness is the primary analytic, but we also look at iron, manganese and TDS as well because they will change necessary capacity as well as required salt dosage (with affects size as well). We shoot for the best balance among salt usage, water waste and equipment wear and tear. Generally, that point lies at 7-8 days between regens, using six lb salt per cubic ft of resin. A cu ft of resin starts with approximately 32,000 grains capacity (different brands and grades vary slightly). It is not possible to maintain that capacity without using obscene salt dosages. As we reduce salt dosage, capacity decreases, improving salt efficiency, but increasing the required softener size. In your case (click on it to see the full equation if only part of it is showing):

using 44 lb of salt for three, or 58 lb of salt for four people, regenerating 36-45 times per year.

The size recommended by both companies you spoke to would regen every four days for three people or three days for four people. That's 91-122 regens per year. You can see how that would increase wear and maintenance on equipment.

If, however, you want to try to decrease wear on the smaller softener, you can increase your salt dosage and get 4-5 days before a regen, but at the cost of 76-122 lb salt per month.

Short answer: Yes, both companies are vastly underestimating the size you need.

You are the softener guru. OK. Given the lack of local companies, I am not sure where to go now. I prefer the 1st company with the EVCR series as I liked the guy and their 10 year service plan. I could ask for their system w/o the carbon but I am not sure if that increases the amount of resin. I could ask for 10% resin as you suggested but not sure how to 'explain' the desired for increased quantity or if that is even possible. I suppose they could add another tank but that would increase the cost from $2K to $3K. Do most folks with correctly sized systems have twink tanks with 2 - 2.5 cu ft?

Most homeowners opt for a single tank. There is no reason they can't get you the larger, single-tank softener. As to explaining, simply tell them you want your softener to regen no more often than once per week with four people in your household. Print the equation for them - perhaps they will learn something.

Regenerating once a week is only a recommendation from resin makers. IMO, a 2.5 CF system is overkill. The risk of it channelling is greater than that of a smaller unit. The use of a twin tank system in a residential home, again IMO, is not needed. You do not need soft water 24/7.

Resin manufacturers recommend the longest time possible between regens, provided the water is perfectly clean with no particulates. Each regen cycle causes the resin beads to swell and contract. Resin can only go through so many cycles before they will start to degrade and break down. Like all structured materials, they will only bend so many times before they break.

While it is true that most residential applications do not require 24/7 availability of soft water and a twin tank system is not a typical recommendation, a twin tank system is a good option under certain circumstances: where a single tank softener would be overly large, where soft water regeneration is desirable (such as with iron-laden waters), in homes where water usage varies wildly, or instances where salt usage must be minimized, to name a few. It would not be my first choice in this particular case either.

Please explain the reason you think there is a channeling risk in this case.

It seems like both quotes are of a similar system that includes a split tank with 1 cubic ft. of resin and carbon (One is .5 cubic ft. while the other is 1 cubic ft.). Should I ignore the carbon all together to avoid the split tank? Should I inquire about increasing the amount of resin? Should I push for the 10% resin? What other concerns are there?

Yes, yes, and yes.

You want to ensure you get the following:

1. High quality American or German made
   resin. This will provide a tight size
   distribution for optimal flow within the resin, longer resin life, and more
   reliable, predicable water softening.
2. Since you have CITY WATER: 10% crosslinked resin. The oxidizers that city water treatment
   plants use, such as chlorine or chloramine, are harmful to softener resins. Higher crosslinking will resist chemical
   attack longer.
3. Top basket. This serves two purposes. It sets up a proper water distribution during
   normal operation and prevents resin loss during backwash.
4. Gravel underbed. The gravel underbed is there to set up proper
   flow patterns, improve backwash, keep the bottom basket in place, prevent
   basket failure, and prevent
   channeling. Many softener sales
   companies like to leave this out or sell softeners with a vortex system
   instead. Vortex systems weigh less than
   gravel so they cost less to ship. In
   addition, they are a more expensive item that adds profit for the softener
   salesperson, but provides no additional benefit to the homeowner . It simply adds another piece of equipment
   that can break.
5. Fleck or Clack valves. These set the industry standard. Be aware that you will not be able to purchase
   Clack valves online. This is not a
   problem if you purchase locally.
6. The valve should regen based on water
   usage, not time.
7. Install the softener with a
   three-valve bypass. This will make it
   much easier if you ever need to remove the softener for repairs or wish to take
   it with you when you move. Use
   full-port, quarter-turn valves.
8. Noryl bypass. Most softeners are available with either
   Noryl or stainless bypass valves. Both
   are good valves, but the noryl tends to be more reliable when not used for long
   periods of time. This is a redundancy if
   you install with a proper three-valve bypass.
   I prefer a bit of redundancy but
   it is your call.
9. Brine tank: Although either round or square will work,
   round brine tanks are more structurally sound and will not deform like a square
   tank will. Additionally,with a
   softener 1.5 cuft or larger, a square tank will most likely be too small.
10. If you live in a cold climate, ensure
    equipment is stored in a climate-controlled environment. Frozen softener resin is damaged softener
    resin.
11. Purchase a Hach 5-B test kit. You will want to periodically check to
    ensure your softener is working correctly and this kit is your best option.

I see the confusion. Both companies got 12 and 13GPG of hardness whereas my water report averaged 404PPM (24GPG) which is why they recommended the 1 cubic ft.

Your report says a hardness range (108-404) so when it was measured by the companies it was on the low side. The risk of channeling occurs in bigger unit because of low flow rates like ice makers and leaky toilets. I'm not understanding the purpose for 2 bypasses. Most unit come with a bypass.

If both companies see 12-13GPG, shouldn't that be the # to determine sizing rather than the 108-404 (24GPG) that was measured by the average of 5-6 wells in my town? At least this explains why they both recommended the 1 cubic ft size.

OP: Feel free to ignore the following, unless you are interested in a few details about channeling - where fluid flows through only a small portion of a media bed rather than distributing evenly throughout.

Channeling may be cause by either high flow, low flow, fouling, particulate loading, compaction, poor resin size distribution or damaged resin. I'll only deal with high/low flow since that is the current topic.

High flow channeling essentially blasts a hole or a lower-density trough through the resin bed, resulting in very little contact area. The channel persists after the high-flow event and the softener resin is essentially bypassed until regeneration.

Low-flow channeling, on the other hand, is not a "permanent" issue once it occurs. Given the constantly variable flow rates in a typical residential application, unless a softener is extremely oversized (not the case here) where flow will never or only rarely reach the threshold rate (1.8 gpm for a 2.5 cu ft softener), the chances of channeling are almost nil. Even if low flow conditions occur for a long enough period of time to cause some hardness bleed during the low flow condition, once a higher flow resumes the bleed will be non-detectable on a grain scale, although possibly on a ppm scale. If low flow rate resumes again, since the "channel" was not physical, it would take a long time to reform a new "channel."

Sizing a softer for the flow rate to a leaky toilet is ludicrous at best - fix the leak and be done with it.

Now, let's take the case of an ice maker. The typical home ice maker produces eight cubes of ice at a time, about 1/2 C of water. Just for argument's sake, let's say you have one that makes 12 of those semi-circular cubes. That's 3/4 C of water. Most home ice makers work by opening up the fill valve for 5-10 seconds to fill the trough, followed by the freezing period and cube ejection. Even with the valve open for the shortest possible time with the largest ice maker, maximum flow rate is only 0.56 gpm (and most ice maker are closer to half this flow rate). Why does this matter? If you are honestly concerned about the ice maker causing channeling and wish to install a softener that will prevent that ever-so-remote possibility, you would have to install a softener with a 7" or smaller diameter. With a softener that small, however, you would virtually guarantee high-flow channeling. Even a 0.75 cu ft softener, the smallest practical non-packed-bed residential softener has an 8" diameter.

The moral of the story is: If you undersize a softener to reduce a virtually non-existent risk you will, at the same time, guarantee the development of an actual problem.

LOL

The real question is what source of information should you use for size? For me, should it be the 404 (24GPG) which is the high end of the average of 5 wells or the 12-13GPG measured at my house by 2-3 different companies. That's a huge difference.

When you live in a city with multiple water sources, you size and set your softener for the high analysis (unless it happens to be a source that is seldom used and you would know when it is used). If you size for the low end, when the city switches sources your softener has no way of knowing that and you will spend over half of each week with hard water. If you don't like that answer and choose to size for the analysis from the companies that have been to your home, 13 gpg, you want a 1.25 cu ft softener. If you choose to size for the median of the city's range, 17 gpg, you want a 2.0 cu ft softener.

I would size for 24 gpg and buy a 2.5 cu ft softener, but it's not my house. You will have to decide which compromise you want to make. If saving some money right now is your primary objective, get the smaller softener. If soft water at all times is the objective, get the larger softener.

Please explain how the OP would not have soft water all time if they went with a 1.5 CF softener provided it was set up properly or even a 1 CF for that matter?

I did not say the OP couldn't achieve soft water with an undersized softener programmed for the highest hardness - I said it would come at the cost of increase wear and tear, and higher water usage.

I did say, however, that if a softener is sized and set up for 13 gpg and the city switches to the 24 gpg water source, hard water will result after 3-4 days. Residential softeners aren't capable of automatically changing regen time with changes in water hardness.

It would be silly to size a softener for low hardness and thenprogram it for high hardness. If the OP were to receive notification from the city when the water source changed and manually changed the hardness setting on the softener, that would work, but that isn't going to happen.

"If soft water at all times is the objective, get the larger softener."

This statement is the one in question. It sounds as if buying a softener smaller than you are recommending, then the OP will not have soft water all the time which both of us know is not the case.

The post was about which analysis for which to size and set up the softener. If a softener salesperson thinks it is appropriate to size a softener based on the lower analysis, they would think it appropriate to program it to that same analysis, yes? Quit being deliberately obtuse.

I understand all to well so you choice of words is mute. And IMO, a 2.5 CF is overkill. nuf said.

I am learning so this is good. Is 6lbs salt the defacto setting? I could increase that at a financial and effort expense, correct? Since hardness can fluctuate, how will the softener compensate? Will I have to constantly check for hardness and adjust as necessary? I am reading typical #s of 20-24K of grains removal for 1CT/6LBS but my convo with the owner of the 1st company mentioned 32K @ 15LBS? The specs do say it removes 23,600 @ 6LBS but I am not sure which data to use with regards to salt usage. What is the typical reserve amount?

I am still on the fence about the carbon as from conversations with the companies, there's a barrier between the carbon/resin so they don't mix. Is the concern regarding carbon/resin split tank ONLY due expectations that both are mixed together? This was a big benefit to us.

Also, 3 different companies within a 7-10 day spread each got 12-13GPG. Yes, my water report shows 404 (24 GPG) but I can't imagine a drastic change. To me, a fair solution is to shoot for 15-18GPG to have some "room". I'd rather do that than increase the salt as that is an added monthly expense rather than a fixed cost of an increase of 1CF to 1.5CT assuming that increase is LESS than the increased salt. How do you determine the GPG for the 1.5CT? 23,600 (@ 6LBS) * 1.5? Where did "45K (1.5 CF) or 60K (2 CF)." get calculated from?

OP,

There's no magic bullet answer to your situation only a choice of compromises. The difference in price of resin volume when buying a softener is not great but finding that you need to increase the resin volume of an undersized softener is significant.

Once the peak SFR considerations are met your uncertainty is what gpg results to use, right?

I'm in the same situation you are... my water coop hardness ranges from 11 gpg to 46 gpg depending on demand and which sources they draw from to satisfy the demand. These changes are fairly routine as demand is cyclic and occurs at the same times of year. The water coop notifies its members monthly what the harness in GPG at the main pumping station is.

Considering SFR and water usage I sized using the median number @ a 6 lbs/cu ft salt dose. The gets me good efficiency a large chunk of the year. That sizing also allows me to decrease effiency by increasing salt dose which increases the capacity to accommodate the jump to 46 gpg and increase efficiency by reducing salt dose to lower the capacity when the hardness drops to 11 gpg based on the coop's notification and my own test results.

If you're interested in getting the soft water you're going to pay for and avoid hardness leak through this is a reality whether you buy a single resin tank or twin resin tank softener. The "C" (capacity) of the resin volume and GPG setting will need to be changed by changing the salt dose to accomodate the harder or less hard changes in the water. You can choose to ignore changing the salt dose when hardness drops below the median number and will just waste some salt and water if that's easier for you, BUT you'll have to increase the salt dose and C and GPG setting when the hardness rises above the median number.

In short, you'll increase salt dose and change the C and gpg setting in your softener when the water is harder and lower the C and gpg setting in your softener when the water is less hard or not bother. When the hardness is at the median number then you set the C and gpg setting in your softener for efficiency.

Experience has found that is the most cost effective and easiest solution IF you're willing to buy an accurate hardness test kit like a Hach 5B (not test strips) and put in a little time to be part of the solution.

1 cu ft of resin will remove approximately the following amount of hardness.

• 21,000 grains @ 6 lb salt [best salt/water efficiency balance]
• 25,500 grains @ 9 lb salt [less salt efficient, slightly more water efficient, water feels softer, some people can tell the difference]
• 30,000 grains @ 15 lb salt [inefficient]

Some resins will remove a little more, some a little less +/- 2500. If you know the specific resin I can locate the engineering bulletin and provide exact numbers.

Your softener will NOT automatically compensate for varying hardness in your water. You have to manually program the hardness. You have three options:

1. Constantly check and adjust as necessary. If you had some notion when or how often the city switches sources or how they mix their sources this might be a viable option. Most folks who think they will put in the effort, don't actually do it.
2. Set for mid-range and live with some excess salt use and some hardness bleeding. This option guarantees there will be times when you have hard water.
3. Set for maximum and forget about it. This option requires the least intervention from you

Reserve is typically set at 15-20%, as state previously.

Problems with a split tank are as stated previously - mixing isn't one of them (unless something breaks). Additionally, a split tank requires compromises for both media in the tank:

• GAC does not allow as much water flow per sq ft of area so the tank diameter must be increased. Even at a 10" tank (the EVRC recommended to you), GAC should only have a flow of 6 gpm.
• Increasing the tank diameter to accommodate the GAC reduces the softener resin bed depth accordingly. Unfortunately, this places the bed depth below manufacturer minimum specifications.
• During backwash, GAC and softener resin require different water flow rates for proper backwash. With both in the tank, either one will get too little, or one will get too much. In your case, the resin needs 1.9 gpm while the GAC needs 5 gpm backwash.
• Insufficient freeboard. During backwash, both media beds must be expanded 50-75% to remove any debris or broken media and reclassify the bed. A single tank generally doesn't allow enough room. It is possible they are using an extra tall tank, but they don't provide tank height in their specs, only tank+valve height.

The benefit of avoiding a separate GAC filter may outweight those compromises for you - your call, of course. Hopefully the information will allow you to make an informed decision.

@ aliceinwonderland_id The resin is 1 cu. ft. of American manufactured Purolite 8% cross linked high capacity ion exchange resin which the spec sheet says is 23,600 grains @ 6LBS of salt NOT 21,000.

At this point, I am more comfortable with the sizing (Thank you everyone!). I am going to investigate the cost increase for the 1.5CF of resin. I will also purchase the Hach 5B (http://www.amazon.com/Hach-145300-Total-Hardness-Model/dp/B008FM7WLU) so I can take my own tests. I will call my local water department tomorrow. I don't believe the water fluctuates in my town. They just don't average the wells rather than report the specific data per well ( I am not sure why). I feel more comfortable sizing in the 15-18GPG range for piece of mind. I think I need to decide if I want to increase from 6LBS to 9LBS of salt and/or 1CF of resin to 1.5 CF. To me, these are fair compromises.

The biggest concern now is the split tank design for the carbon which was one of the biggest benefits to me (and my wife) with a new born and a new baby (soon?). I prefer not an additional tank but I'll look into it. I am trying to balance everything but a line needs to be drawn somewhere. With a 10 year warranty, if I had to regenerate more often causing more wear, I am at least more comfortable with the warranty but perhaps I am just trying to talk myself into it... :)

The Hach 5B seams to measure to the whole number and not the tenth. Is that acceptable?

23,600 grains/cu ft at 6 lb salt sounds right for a Purolite resin.

Yes, whole number analysis is acceptable.

OP,

You may be right or wrong on your choice and time and you will hopefully return to tell us all "The biggest concern now is the split tank design for the carbon which
was one of the biggest benefits to me (and my wife) with a new born and a
new baby (soon?)."

Removing anti-bacterials added to the municipal water supply for safety
at POE is a subject of great debate. What is not debatable is that
removing anti-bacterials added to the municipal water supply for safety
at POE creates a risk of bacterial colonization in your plumbing system.
Is that what you're looking to do? Anti-bacterials are added to water supplies for a reason.

As Alice pointed out, in great detail much to the dismay and apparent confusion of biermech, mixed bed, even with separate chambers,
compromises the working characteristics of a resin bed. While a favorite
solution for salespeople I've never found a water treatment pro who
has any detailed (book or real world) knowledge of the physics and mechanics of softeners who
favor that approach. There are better ways to do that... among them a
separate backwashing carbon filter pre softener and another is a separate piggy back
carbon tank as Kinetico often does, but that requires design consideration from the beginning not just as an add on for a drop-shipping regional warehouse.

More intelligent to deal with that at POU with an RO for cooking,
drinking, and ice maker water and/or location specific filters for
shower, etc.

LOL. You guy are just too funny. Book smart trying to out do field experience. That is a roit.

sagosto, you can buy a 5B test kit cheaper buying it straight from Hach.

Most of us are capable of disagreeing without that sort of behavior, biermech. We can compare credentials if you would like - simply post your query as a new thread. In the mean time, let us focus on providing technically sound information to the OP.

Now I agree with that, but you need to read some of your own posts before calling the kettle black.

biermech,

Quoting your post on your home forum... "Not sure why they are going nutty. It appears to me that they have book
smarts were I have 25+ years of field experience. Notice if I say
something that they do not like or if I disagree with them, they will
try to discredit me with there long drawn out answers."

You are confusing knowledge and fact with subjective opinion. When you disagree defend your position with fact and site your sources
rather than reply with the frustration that you can't defend your position. Your "oh yea, says you" attitude is getting tiring and adds nothing to this forum.

"Book" knowledge and hands on experience are not mutually exclusive in all cases... though it seems so in your case.

Your 25 years in the field is not necessarily experience and you may just be lost in the field.

No one here is looking to sell anyone anything except you which on its face taints anything you post.. even when you may be correct.

For the record, I greatly appreciate all the help I have gotten as it has given me a good crash course.

I get tired of yall trying to discredit me just because I do not agree with everything yall say. You are the worst with your jabs and name calling. I have never claimed to know to all nor will I ever, I believe I have a lot to offer but it seems everytime I disagree with yall, the name calling starts. If I post something that is wrong, please by all means correct me, but don't chastize me. I want you to point out in this op's post where I have tried to sell him. And no, the bickering does not help.

Biermech - I don't see a way to email you directly, so will reply here.

I have absolutely no problem with you being here, not that it would matter if I did since this is not my site. In general, you have contributed and offered sound advice and I've not seen you attempting to sell anything. I have no problem with you disagreeing with me, and have not engaged in name calling when you have done so.

When you posted something that was incorrect, I pointed it out and provided an explanation. Any time I disagree on a technical matter I will include an explanation. Otherwise there is no discussion, just an unproductive volley of opinions.

I had respect for you up to the point where you responded to my reasoning with "LOL." You expect me to take you at your word regarding your experience and expertise, make erroneous assumptions about my background, and are dismissive and rude. I can't imaging why you would think experience coupled with education is a detriment, unless that is just a red herring you rely on during technical disagreements.

Please feel free, at any time, to explain why you disagree and we will all have the opportunity to learn. Disagreement on technical issues is not a personal attack - please don't take it as such. If I point out an error, it is not to discredit you; it is simply to correct the error.

I agree with most of what you have said. I reason for the "LOL" was you stated that channeling can occur during high flow rates. In this case, that would be almost impossible whereas, low flow rates would be a much higher risk with such a large system. I try to give short clear answers only because of lack of time. With running a business and coaching my granddaughters softball, my time is limited. I will however, in the future, try to give more of an detailed reason if I should disagree with anything that is posted.

sagosto - Who did you end up going with?