The insanity is starting. Summer squash, tomatillos, beans multiplying like bunnies, eggplant, tomatoes, beets - I can hardly keep up with eating all this stuff!

Hey if you can't keep up with any of those tomatoes, I am sure I could find a mouth for them! I have a few tomatoes, but not that many and none that are ripe yet.

I know what you mean, mathewgg! My squash is just starting to come in here - a couple of zucchinis and one Piccolo so far, but there are lots of blossoms so I imagine the other plants will be producing soon so I will be overwhelmed with squash before too long! I have had several meals of potatoes, too, with lots more to come. My Romano Purpiat beans are large enough to harvest - with lots more coming in - though my other bean varieties aren't quite there yet, they have lots of blooms and tiny beans developing - some of my peppers need to be harvested now and the tomatoes are soon going to be overwhelming me, too. But those are all good things, right?

@popmama - we live pretty close and I am thinking I will soon have more tomatoes than I can deal with, so there will be some to share, if you are interested....

@Zach - I wasn't aware that the Nineveh's were considered cooking tomatoes. I guess they have some tartness to them, but mostly they are delicious and I have just been eating them right off the vine, so to speak. I will pay more attention to the flavor next time instead of just gobbling them up, lol. There are at least three about ready to be picked now, and I have another three sitting on my kitchen counter ready to be eaten, so I will be able to give them quite a taste test!

Holly

I wish "insanity" was the word for it, LOL! Though, the pace is starting to quicken.

I spent a good half hour this morning picking beans, thank goodness! I have been growing and saving top crop seeds for several years now, and I always try out new varieties, they out preform anything else each and every year. This year their competition was a hybrid yellow "gold rush" which I think has a sweeter flavor, but, in sheer numbers it doesn't hold a candle to top crop.

I have FINALLY started picking tomatoes, I've got seven fruits off of nine plants. A disappointing showing considering I had DOZENS of fruits off of just just two of my plants last year. I like determinates, I have very limited garden space and I can pack more of them in there. Plus, I like to can and make sauce and salsa out of them. Determinates give me a big harvest all at once so I can (usually) put up several jars of them. Picking onsies and twosies off of indeterminates, they tend to go bad (or get eaten) before I have enough to fill jars.

Here's the beans that got frozen this morning, ready for some casserole later this year ;).

Holly, thats what they were described as, but, like you, I didn't find them overwhelmingly sour when eaten fresh. My mom got to all the ones I've picked so far, so I haven't had a chance to try them this year. I did notice last year they crack very easily, so I've been picking them under-ripe and letting them finish on the counter. Just got three more this morning, and mom is up in Ft. Morgan for the weekend so I may get to try at least one of these haha!

lol - hope you get to try one of your Nineveh tomatoes, Zach. I did notice that they seem to prone to cracking, but, you know, they still taste just fine!

Holly

It's great to hear the food is rolling in! It always starts as a trickle, and then *boom*.

Zach, it's great to hear your beans finally produced. Those are some beautiful looking beans!I've been happy with my harvest so far, also freezing them as you are. I grew Trionfo Violetto, which is very robust and purple, and then also Gold Marie. I've got a few others I'm growing for dry beans, too. Not a lot, because I don't have the space, but enough to get a pint or two of dry beans. It's fun.

oakiris, I'm jealous you have peppers! Mine are weeks away, I think. I've been able to give away a few squash to co-workers, but I grow more than I need on purpose, lol. Generally, four kinds, in 18-inch mounds, with three plants in each mound. My favorite each year is the tromboncino, in large part because it climbs so readily and has velvety-soft leaves. And yes, all of those things you mentioned are good things!

popmama, I don't have any tomatoes to spare! Nope! LOL. Seriously though, I freeze and can them, which allows me to work with the small and large harvests. When I've got a pile of 10-12 on the counter, I blanch, peel, quarter, and roast in a lasagna pan, with a quartered onion and drizzled with olive oil at about 350. I just keep an eye on them, and when they've released all their juice and broken down a bit and look like I think oven roasted tomatoes should look, I let them cool and pour it all into a quart freezer Ziploc, or two, if there's enough. Then when I'm really overwhelmed, I can them in small batches. I grew nine plants this year, which is a record for me, but I also plan on going to Miller Farms the weekend they open for harvest season, and hopefully get a bag or two of tomatoes.

Speaking of which....if you haven't heard of Miller Farms, it's north of Longmont off of I-25. It's an organic farm, and starting Labor Day each year, you can pay an entrance fee of $20 per person, and bring five of your own re-usable shopping bags, and then you take a hayride around the farm, and when it stops at each crop, you jump off and harvest all the vegetables you want - or up to five bags, per person. I go each year and generally get tomatoes, peppers, onions, sweet corn and sometimes cabbage or leeks or melons or potatoes - last year they had beets and beans and carrots, too. The options depend on how early or late the season is. It helps to bring gloves, and a trowel, and it's very family and kid friendly. It's a lot of work to bring it all home and process it for the freezer or canner, but I find it a fun way to spend a weekend. The farm itself is somewhat eccentric and weird, which is part of the fun. They also have a deal where you can load up a wagon with winter squash and pumpkins for $30.

http://www.millerfarms.net/fall-harvest-festival.html

A few pictures.

The corn patch and the dog! That bed is 6x14, and I used 3 feet of that width for three rows of corn, and the other 3 feed of width for summer squash.

The flip side of the corn patch. The summer squash on the left/foreground and my 'herb' bed on the right side. The arbor is for the tromboncino.

The winter squash and melon patch in the back part of the yard. Butternut Rugosa, Lakota Squash and a small white fleshed watermelon in the foreground. I've got four little watermelons out there, cue-ball sized and larger! Red zinnias poking through - this is the first time I've tried planting tall zinnias with the winter squash, but it won't be the last - I love the effect with the yellow squash blooms. You can see part of my bean teepee on the left, and the tomatillos in the back/left. And a basil and two dahlias, slowing being engulfed in squash. The hostas are still in pots, to keep their necks above water, so to speak. They'll be permanent in this spot, but the vegetables will rotate each year.

Um..I'm speechless. Your garden is amazing! Gosh.

I really do like the tall zinnias in the squash. It's a very pretty combination.

The Miller Farms thing sounds like a lot of fun. I'll keep that in mind. Last year, I stumbled up on this amazing roadside farm on my way back from Windsor. Darn if I can remember where it was. They had the most delicious tomatoes and yellow watermelon. I'll have to set out on an excursion again to see if I can locate it.

The method for bagging tomatoes sounds really good. I'm going to make a note of that. It sounds much easier than canning. Thanks.

Matthewgg,

How do you eat winter melon? What is a good recipe?

Popmama, thank you so much for your kind words! My gardening 'style' or whatever you'd call it is largely influenced by my years of ornamental gardening. Only in the last 5 years have I taken up vegetables, before that it was all flowers...so I treat the vegetables like ornamentals. I do wish I had the space for a big garden with rows - because trying to get into that mess of squash to get some basil isn't easy!

gardenchloe, I meant winter squash, and melon. My apologies if I implied winter melon. The melon I'm growing is just a plain old watermelon!

Picked the first flush of green chili yesterday, picked about half of it and after an afternoon's work with the broiler, ended up with 3 gallons of roasted chili. Thats a pretty good yield for me. 2nd pic is winter squash growing up, and all over, trellises, and knock on wood, no powdery mildew yet. Looks like a decent crop on the way. And 3rd picture is row of shallots - they're starting to bulb up now. They're actually bigger than my onions - where I tried an experiment companion planting with peas and kale. That won't be repeated.:)

Both your guys' gardens look amazing! Glad to hear we've had some re-bound the past couple weeks, my tomatoes are finally starting to put it in gear, and my green ones are at long last putting on some color. The problem is, there's not very many green ones out there, so, I don't think I'll be making sauce or canned tomatoes this year.

This comprises nearly my entire pickings of tomatoes this year... I did eat two, and mom ate three so thats.... 14? I think...

I did get to try a Nineveh, Holly, and, once again, not super sour, but they are super good. Their production fell off immensely from last year, but, I'm not blaming the plants themselves, and I will very likely grow them again next year. Better Boys are not living up to their name, sad to say, the only indet's I'm growing and they are not much bigger than the my det's and very little fruit set. I don't think they will be setting any records in my garden.

The eggplant is doing pretty good I think. I wasn't expecting (nor was I really wanting) an enormous harvest off them, but, it looks like we'll get a good handful by the time it's all said and done, just enough I think, for a family that has never really eaten much eggplant.

Late in June I broke my promise that I would not be growing any squash this year. I planted two, a yellow straightneck and zucchini, and they have just started to flower. I am cautiously optimistic I will get a few squash before the year is out.

Since I only grow bush beans, like determinate potatoes, after one big haul, I might get a few smaller loads off them, but it slows way down. Got some this morning, but nothing like I got out there on Friday. Perhaps I should consider pole beans, I'm just always too lazy to put up a support for them haha.

One of the The only things that was really great this year was the blackberries. The first round was just ripe. Went out this morning to pick them. Flipping raccoon beat me to it, and tore up the bushes to boot. Ugh indeed! He/she /they climb over my 8' fence. I put a LOT of moth balls around the perimeter today, but need to look at other solutions, preferably that don't include the hubby sitting out in the yard all night with a 22. Anybody have any experience with electrified fence?

Hey zach, I saw your post above and want to bounce an idea off of another person with a problem property line with an ugly weedy view & icky-neighbor problem. You may have heard me carp on this subject before.

I keep seeing gorgeous stands of Smooth Sumac around here and it got me to thinking. What if some rooted starts were sort of accidentally found growing along the property line? This stuff forms thickets. Thats the plus. In my bad-ugly situation the property next door sits about one ft to 15 inches higher than mine making the view even worse since I get to look at a stair step of ragged dirt being held in place by tree roots & an old cut off fence. Eyesore stuff that would normally be shorter is at eye level (or you always see it out the corner of your eye hovering like an ugly elevated mess). A cheap, sagging hog wire fence is along this nice line separating me from the horror next door. Its easy to reach my arm through it to plant. He lets whatever wants to come up, come up which means tall weeds, privet & hackberry saplings along with wild stuff I've never been curious enough to ID. Over the years I've been steadily weeding it and replanting with stuff like salvia greggii and lantana. But those are not tall enough.

What I'm wondering is, if that higher step up will keep the sumac on his side as a backdrop to block the view. I read its shallow rooted when I was googling to see how hard it would be to dig up in the wild. I wouldn't mind seeing a thick bank of the stuff growing there, it being red in fall with berries and all. Anyway, driving around I am suddenly eyeballing smooth sumac with intentions in mind of covert activity and have a spot all picked out by a railroad track where I used to get grape leaves that was once a dump. I know this probably sounds awful but it beats privet, weeds and hackberry saplings & being a visual victim of a neighbor who doesn't seem to care or notice anything since he's got trees growing up under his siding and all around his foundation.

What do you think of my solution? I don't want a privacy fence, I wouldn't be able to keep volunteer trees dug out each year if there is a real fence and that would mean more hackberry trees.

@texasranger - In my opinion, I think you will be introducing a whole new problem by using smooth sumac to try to hide your neighbor's ugly mess. Smooth Sumac, Rubra glabra, is extremely invasive and unless you are very, very attentive, or set up something like the bamboo barriers folks put in to control running bamboo, you will have it coming up all over the place and not likely where you want it.

I gave it a try because I really like the way it looks and I think the fall color is spectacular; I thought I would be able to control it OK. The spring following the season in which I planted my sumac - it was only about 3 feet tall, so no where near mature size - I found a new sprout coming up from this sumac. It was at least 20 feet away from my little sumac, and at that point I realized that I was very unlikely to be able to control this plant. My compost heap gained a couple of new candidates and I haven't tried to grow the plant since.

Smooth sumac would be great planted in the "back 40," if you have enough acreage, otherwise, I would avoid it.

Holly

Anybody have any experience with electrified fence - several gardeners around here use them to keep raccoons out of their corn. They set up two strands, one about 6 inches off the ground, the other 15 inches.

Texas Ranger! Hey, nice to see you drop by at my "usual hangout" here on RMG!

Unfortunately though, I don't have enough experience with sumac to be able to tell you if the step up will keep it contained. My limited experience with the plant has been that it is a GENEROUS spreader. I have a feeling you will be finding little sumac suckers in your (gorgeous) landscaping and also baby saplings from the berries, though, they would be easy enough to pull if you caught them early. If you do find out that having them planted in a "raised" area will work, I think it's a fantastic idea! I have tried "covert planting" in my neighbors yard, too. Goatheads and buffalo bur... I'm about to just say !@#$ it and put up a barbed wire fence all along that edge because my congeniality and let sleeping dogs lie attitude is wearing VERY thin! Anyways, the sumacs are pretty, no doubt about that, and if they hide the atrocity next door, all the better! Sorry I'm not more help though.

About the electric fence! My brother in Illinois does what David is describing, but a little bit different! He has bunnies/racoons AND deer, so he puts one low wire (I think it's about 8" above the ground--might be lower than that--for the "little" critters, and a second one at "deer nose" height--don't remember exactly what that is! The idea is that when the critters, whichever ones, hit the wire a couple times with their noses they decide to go elsewhere for dinner! It works for him! And with his system it's pretty easy to just step over the low wire and duck under the high one to get into the garden without needing to turn off the electricity all the time.

Skybird

Thanks David and Skybird re the electric raccoon discouragement. I think I will give it a try. Went out today to the garden enclosure, and my eyes were literally watering from the mothball perimeter I put out yesterday! I don't think there will be an animal within a block of the garden for now, but that might include me! I'm guessing the best placement for the wire will be fairly low (where they begin to climb) and at the top if they make it that far. Now I just hope whatever berries are left don't taste like mothballs!

Sorry to report that my garden is mostly a bust so far this year. Only one each squash and cucumbers on the vines this year. My black krim and San marzano are both loaded with tiny green fruits.
The kale is robust at least. And the peas did great this season in all the cool weather but alas they are finished.

The onion sets I plan to have all flopped over and seem like they stalled with about 2" bulbs.

The peppers are a mixed bag some of them have set fruit but some of them are suffering from neglect too.

I guess I have 60 more days to see what happens but I'm not holding out a lot of hope for preserving this season.

Thanks guys for the responses to a forum crasher living down here in Oklahoma. Holly, 20 feet from the original plant? Was it connected to the original plant by underground roots or just a seedling? That is definitely something to consider. Seedlings by hundreds are something I deal with from the hackberry trees and privet already. I've been online trying to learn as much as possible about smooth sumac especially concerning how deeply rooted they are since his dirt is so much higher up than mine. I'm open to other suggestions if anyone has any. I like the idea of a native plant that forms thickets or groves. I also like the idea of free $$ and smooth sumac is very common around here. It really is pretty.

My sumac had not yet flowered, it was pretty young, so no seeds - this was from its root! 20 feet may be an exaggeration - it was a lot of years ago - but it was no where near the plant so I was quite surprised to see it sprouting up there.

I agree that sumac looks really pretty. If you can get free sumac, why not experiment and plant a few to see what happens? Theoretically, it should be easy enough to eradicate them the next spring (don't wait until they are fully established!) if they start getting out of hand. And since your neighbor doesn't care about his/her yard, you don't even have to worry if the sumac starts sprouting up in their yard - they probably wouldn't notice, and it sounds as if that would be quite an improvement, really, over the ugliness that exists there now!

Hey, just noticed yesterday that my Pink Banana squash plant has about a 5 inch squash on it; only one so far, though there are lots of blooms, but maybe it will mature in time before the season is over! This is a winter squash and I wasn't able to get the seeds in quite as early as I had hoped - we all know what the weather and thus the soil was like in May and much of June - so I wasn't sure if it would have time to produce fruit, let alone time to allow it to mature and ripen, but maybe so and maybe we will get more than one.

And my Mexican Sour Gherkins are finally getting blooms on them - I have three plants planted in a hanging basket on my patio. It has been great fun watching them grow, such a tiny cucumber-like vining plant, very delicate looking, but it is supposed to give us a bountiful crop of 1 inch fruits. It better hurry up; barely blooming and it is mid-August. Does anyone else grow these? I got my seeds from Territorial Seeds; here is some info about the plant:

http://www.territorialseed.com/product/Mexican_Sour_Gherkin_Cucumber_Seed/all_cucumber_seed

Holly

Holly, I talked to the grower at Farmer's Market today and asked about smooth sumac. He said 15 inches lower on my side wouldn't make any difference to the sumac and that what you see above ground is minor compared to what is below ground. He kind-a looked at me like I was crazy even asking about them. I am back to the drawing board. I do have two small Three Leaf Sumacs started. I might get more of them.

Holly, I have grown the gherkins. ... mostly, couldn't figure out what to do with them.

My Junes are usually pretty miserable. Not so much rain as cool and windy ... they came on late and really kicked out their little fruit.

I have saved seed from the La Madera squash from the 2014 garden. Despite growing 2 others of the same species, I don't believe it crossed. One fruit is HUGE! I'll be lucky to have a pumpkin that big. (Course, I disadvantaged the punkins by missing with the sprinkler for an entire extremely hot week, early in the season.)

Steve

The old garden is coming along this year. Still seems a few weeks behind. Squash, beans and cucumbers are heavy producers. The tomato plants look good with quite a bit of large fruit but very few ripe ones so far. Hopefully there will be a big flush soon before summer starts running out. Potatoes are looking good but it's always a mystery until they're dug up. Been a good year for strawberries but okra is small again this year.

photobucket quality photo

Love the pics getting posted here! Your gardens look amazing!!

I just read this article I copied below and wondered what folks thought about it:

"If
you’re like most people, you probably find yourself looking with
disdain at insect-eaten ‘holey’ leaves. You’d probably certainly never
think of eating them!

If
so, you’ll probably be surprised to learn that those damaged leaves
actually contain far more health benefits than leaves, even from the
same plant, that are uneaten.

Okay, here’s a bit of a biology lesson to start.

Leaves typically release small quantities of a chemical called ‘plant
volatiles.’ This chemical, despite its slightly intimidating name,
actually has very strong anti-cancer properties. As such, it greatly
improves your health to eat leaves which have a high quantity of this
chemical.

When you stumble upon a leaf that has been damaged by an insect,
you’ve actually stumbled upon a leaf that has much more of this chemical
exposed. The exact amount of plant volatiles contained in the leaf will
vary based on both the plant and the species that is eating it.

So why does the plant release cancer-fighting chemicals as it is
being eaten? These chemicals attract insects that will in turn prey on
the insects that typically eat plants. So, essentially, the plant
releases these chemicals as a means of defending itself by attracting
predators of insects that prey on it. Pretty cool, I’ll say!

So next time you stumble upon a leaf that has a few holes in it –
hint: sometimes farmers sell these at a discount – you might want to
consider making use of a few leaves in your next salad."

Whadya think? This year, I mainly have tomatoes, pumpkins and watermelon - so no leaves to eat there. But I do have one Basil growing that's getting some holes - I won't throw them out now just in case ;^)

Marj

Sorry the Smooth Sumac is a no go for you, texasranger2. I am sure someone will come up with an idea for you; I take it the nurseryman who dissuaded you from using the Sumac had not suggestions that would work for you? You should think this was a relatively common problem that someone local would have some suggestions. Perhaps you should start a separate thread about it so your need for help wouldn't get lost in what is basically a vegetable garden discussion. :-)

"Holly, I have grown the gherkins. ... mostly, couldn't figure out what to do with them." Well, you EAT them, Steve! :-p (Sorry, I couldn't resist.) Put them in salads, grab some as you walk by the plant for a quick snack, pickle them, etc., etc. Well, that's what they tell me, anyway. There is actually a lot of info out there about the Sour Gherkins and their uses. Here is an article that includes some ideas about "What to Do with Mexican Sour Gherkins" as well as an interesting sounding pickle recipe:

http://www.bonappetit.com/test-kitchen/inside-our-kitchen/article/what-to-do-with-mexican-sour-gherkins

I have none to try out as yet, but the sour gherkins are supposed to have a nice lemony cucumber taste and a great crunch to them, so in theory they should be quite tasty! Were they not very good?

That is an interesting article, Marj, and it sounds like a viable theory, but I certainly have no way to prove or dispute it, lol. Do you by chance have a link to the article? Does the author give any links to studies/research that has been done to substantiate her/his conclusions? A quick search on the internet brought up nothing but info about insect damage to leaves, I couldn't find anything about damaged vegetable leaves being healthier for the consumer, but perhaps I wasn't using the right keywords.

Holly

Holly, I peal things. They had appeal. I remember being pleased with the gherkins but it would be rather atypical of me to just eat them. It's been about 10 years ago and I only grew them once. You can imagine me trying to get my digits around them to do that pealing.

Steve

who doesn't need to peal a carrot, will eat part of his baked potato skin, but who does a lot of spitting in the cherry tomatoes.

Here's a link to the article, Holly:http://www.realfarmacy.com/youll-be-surprised-at-the-health-benefits-youre-just-throwing-away/

It came up on my facebook page from Homegrown and Happiness. I don't see any links within the article itself, so don't know all about it's resources!

Marj

Texas Ranger, have you looked into mountain mahogany for your "screen" it wouldn't be free, but I don't think they spread by suckering, at least not as much as smooth sumac. Hopefully you come back and see this, or I might post in Native Plants forum as well for you...

Greg, looks like your doing pretty good there! My potatoes never got very big, not holding out much hope for them when I dog them up... I've been debating whether to leave them be and die back on their own or get an early start to garden cleanup and cut them back now. You'll probably be alright without the okra. My aunt from Alabama swears by the stuff, I guess I didn't inherit that particular "southern gene" haha!

Marj, you know, I think if we gardeners threw out food that had a few holes in it, our yields would be decreased tenfold! I don't even throw away tomatoes half covered with BER, just cut out the black parts and eat the rest, LOL!

Zach, I planted a mountain mahogany one year and it died. Not that it means others would, sometimes a plant just mysteriously dies which is what I think happened with that one. I got it from Great Basin Natives and I think they have both tube & gallon sizes. I first saw a few when I was visiting Colorado and NM one year with the curly seed heads in the sun and really liked the looks, these were big. They would get late afternoon shade coming through the trees to light up the seeds, even more after getting the trees limbed up this fall. Otherwise they would get morning till noon sun. The soil gets extremely hard & dry from tree roots on that whole side, makes choices difficult.

I think Cercocarpus montanus should work well for you. It grows well in hard dry clay here on the front range, often on very steep slopes.

If you still like the sumac idea, 'Tigers Eyes' staghorn sumac reportedly suckers less than others sumacs and may be easier to control? There is also skunkbrush, Rhus trilobata, which I am not sure if it's as aggressive with suckering as other sumac species? You would have to look into that. It has a pretty strong smell when you cut it which some people really don't like but I think it smells kind of nice. It's also adapted to harsh, dry conditions and I often see it growing with C. montanus.

I have two small three leaf sumacs already that I started from seedlings last year. I could transplant them there, you've got me thinking. I already planted 2 Texas barberry along the border on his side as well but they are still small too. In that dirt plants take more time. I imagine the Mountain Mahogany will be a slow grower too but it would fit right in and I sure like them. I'm tempted to go for instant gratification and just line the whole damn eyesore with a row of Giant Sacaton. I could do that, seriously I could plant several a bit further in on his side along one section where I have a row of Silver King Artemisia growing right on the property line currently, that I started from an original plant I got years ago -- one plant goes a long way. I have a hedge of sacaton all along my east side where the neighbor is lower making it much easier to block the view. Lots of volunteers come up in a gravel path which I weed out each year & the grasses are monsters now. Free is always appealing & I have three good sized homeless sacatons sitting in pots out back. Yep, I think I'll add those.

While we're talking, have you any experience with 'Pawnee Buttes' Sand Cherry? I have a plant coming here from HCG in September. What I'm wondering is if it comes up easy from the seeds or is easy to start new plants from cuttings? I was thinking I could use them on that cut-off hill and they'd grow over it to cover the ugly step. Its real dry there. Anyway, when I ordered the plant this was something I had in mind for future use since its a tough ground cover and will get by on very little moisture.

The skunkbrush (three-leaf sumac) doesn't get SUPER tall, maybe 3-4 ft. but, with extra 15" that would be a good 4 1/2-5 ft. I like the idea of giant sacaton, which I WISH I had room for just one! Hey, and they're free? Sure can't beat that! I would definitely go the route before spending money on something!

You know, as I am visualizing it, I think anything you plant as a clear delineation between your properties will make it look better. Obviously you can't help what your neighbor does (or doesn't) do, but I think as long as there is a strong visual "line" that separates your's from theirs it will help ease the pain, even if it doesn't necessarily "hide" the ugliness.

I do not have experience with sand cherry, sorry. Most my experience with wild/native plants comes from them being in the wild rather than in landscaping uses and you know, I have never noticed a sand cherry! Where I have seen PBSC used is on road medians (which I am noticing are being planted with more xeric/native plants), I could stop and take a look and see if there's any seedlings around, indicating that it reseeds well. Also, in my experience with a lot Prunus species is that they are suckering plants, such as P. virginiana, P. americana, and P. pensylvanica, so I imagine P. bessyi will readily give you extra plants that you can dig up even if cuttings or seeds don't work out for you!

I have both the purple leaf sand cherry and the "regular" one - don't know the cultivar's name, but it could well be the Pawnee Butte, at least it has similar characteristics in terms of seasonal color, flower, etc. I have had them both for quite a few years and neither of them has suckered new plants nor have any volunteers shown up from seed. They are worth growing, however, in my opinion, and quite care-free. The only problem I have had with the sand cherries is that one year , many years ago, the purple leaf sand cherry had a very minor infestation of pear slugs (sawfly larvae.)

Another shrubby tree you might want to consider adding to the mix is scrub oak - Gambel Oak. Quercus gambelii. This will form a little clump/grove of oak trees, the acorns feed wildlife, the orange/red fall color is quite nice.

I imagine you are aware of the possibly problems you can run into by planting a bunch of the same thing - a disease or pest that "favors'" your particular plant might go right down the row, so to speak, and wipe them all out. I think a combination of Mountain Mahogany ( another plant I have had for years - it may get a few suckers around the trunk so that it forms a small clump, but it is not at all invasive,) maybe a Gambel Oak, some ornamental grasses and sand cherries would look very nice and definitely differentiate your yard from that of your neighbor. Sadly, all of these suggestions will cost you money, but I think the different sizes, shapes and colors will add a lot of interest and be well worth the price in order to take your eyes and mind away from your neighbor's messy yard.

Holly

For the love of God do not plant scrub oak lol that is my #1 biggest problem plant... And that's out in NATURE where it belongs! I thought about planting scrub oak once, but quickly abandoned the idea. It suckers like mad and then the suckers sucker and so on and so on until it forms a HUGE dense stand. Its just like aspens and choke cherry soon your entire yard will be a forest of the stuff!

Here's my bad neighbor.

I pulled up a whole lot of old pictures of the property line. The first ones are before I started planting and weeding along the border but after I removed the tall stack of cut branches he'd lined along the hogwire fence. Scraggly looking enormous volunteered hackberry trees grow right along the property line, they lean every which way and put my yard in shade making everything lean. The land all slopes downward adding to the effect. It looks like a creepy dark tall wall of ugly due to the trees so there really is no blocking the view just a lot of tree trimming on our part. Pictures don't do it justice because you can't get the effect of trees looming down at you and feeling like the whole area is trying to escape from the hovering darkness.

I think the answer is a back hoe machine and some major tree removal. I keep wishing he'd move and someone would come in and clean up the neglect.

It gets really thick back here toward the rear end of the property which has more trees and stuff, his looks like a jungle back there and there is a pond I don't even want to think about. He piles crap on the ground.

After digging out dozens of baby hackberry trees and other crap. But that fence........gads!

This was taken last year, since then I've added lantana and several more Salvia Greggi, but still THAT FENCE.....

Here you can kind of see how much higher his yard is. What used to be hackberry saplings and weeds is now artemisia, gregg salvia and lantana.

The dark wall showing about 1/2 the tree height. Its creepy. Remember, this was once a prairie, hard to imagine.

Here's how it looks in summer, I shot these today.

First thing I would do, if you are able and it's not holding any critters at bay, is get rid of the fence. It draws more attention to the "problem". The Artemisia looks great, and a I think a perfect plant for the situation, the brightness of it definitely helps seperate their "dark and creepy" from your bright and beautiful landscape! I think without that fence it would be a great facing to a row of OG (like the sacaton you mentioned) or a row of tall shrubs/short trees.

I see what you're saying Holly, about diseases and pests but I think a patchwork of different plants would only mirror the "problem" and having a clean line to make a solid distinction right there would be much better. Plus, one of the added benefits of planting native plants is the fact they tend to be less prone to problems like the ones you mentioned.

P.s. I know if I've told you once, I've told you a thousand times, your yard is an inspiration, TR! It's a joy to see some one taking such great care to bring back just a taste of what this region once was before people came through and decided it was "ugly" and "sterile."

Thanks zach for looking. Its his fence. He put it up 'temporary' about 15 years ago after the tree roots finally knocked over his leaning & rotting stockade fence into our yard. Its to keep his dogs in. (cough) Thats the purpose of the blue ice chest full of rotting logs that fills with water when it rains that I keep knocking over and he keeps sitting back up and pushing against the 'fence' cuz the dog digs back there. Ice chest = problem solved.

We keep talking about building a wall. Its a mass of big roots though there and expensive + we aren't rich. Anyway, is it as bad as your neighbor's yard or worse?

Below in that bare ground is where I plugged in little bluestem plants a couple weeks ago. I have trouble finding anything to grow along this side, everything leans so bad but grass stays upright. It was too dry for the switchgrass I planted last fall. I've got artemisia and a swath of Pine Muhly. Sorry its so over exposed, thats afternoon glare in Oklahoma you're seeing. You can see how I've been planting along the border on his side, I shot this from my upstairs window. Anyway, you now have a visual.

The fence is on his side & we have to live with it. The contrast of light and dark is almost as nice as the feeling of being eaten by his trees that seem to lean into my yard.

Hi TR,

Have you considered growing grapes on the "fence?" It wouldn't do anything about the trees, but it would hide the "fence" and the T-posts, and it would give you visual separation from all the weeds/junk on the ground at least. The white Artemisia in front of a nice green "border" would give you a pretty background for your amazing gardens! Grapes grow FAST and aren't invasive at all, so you wouldn't be creating a whole new problem--and you'd get the bonus of something to eat or make jelly (or wine!) depending on the varieties you picked.

The house behind me was abandoned about three years ago and this is what I dealt with for two summers! Somebody bought it a little over a year ago--and now the weeds don't get as tall--but the air has been full of milkweed fluff ALL summer. My lawn, front and back, is now a mass of every kind of milkweed you can think of, and just about every other kind of weed you've ever heard of too. I'm trying to keep it "knocked down" with Weed-B-Gon in the backyard--where I Play, but I've conceded in the front yard and just mow the weeds! (I have a privacy fence and can't even imagine not having it!)

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/iWKbq34oL9VKrOB_ptDQeyBSYmmwY9H2l2_c2XnH6Os?feat=directlink

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/uUDHhwmCi4SIE5FUVzVR6CBSYmmwY9H2l2_c2XnH6Os?feat=directlink

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/KmzWI6IJoNMnQ8gvcZK03CBSYmmwY9H2l2_c2XnH6Os?feat=directlink

And, speaking of roots! I empathize! Oh, how I empathize!

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/j0wd25Y-eSonmbntdyfi-CBSYmmwY9H2l2_c2XnH6Os?feat=directlink

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/9QK-qCGB-0Oaujuh-SUA9yBSYmmwY9H2l2_c2XnH6Os?feat=directlink

Skybird

P.S. Maybe we should start a Neighbors From Hell thread! ;-D

skybird I'm a gonna send you right over to the Natives Forum so "Miss Prissy No Chemicals EVER" can leck-shur you. I just had an ongoing pleasant & productive discussion with M.P.N.C.E. but I'm done with it and should have my head examined as it is.

Mine is so far beyond Weed-b-gone its ridiculous although I have used Brush Killer and I can straddle that 'fence' with ease to hop right over there with various tools while the dude is at work. We could swap horror stories of butt ugly crud and covert activity. Or, maybe have contests?

I'm working at my desk right now and will review the pics later, I can't wait to see. I've often said we should start a forum like that but never had any taker-uppers. Zack sounded like someone with a real fine nex-door neighbor so here I am all the way from Oklahoma carping to you Coloradians. I have no shame.

LOL! Carp on, TR! Or might that be Carpe Diem and Carp On! I'm not so sure about your Rocky Mountains in Oklahoma, but we welcome Friendly Faces from anywhere! We used to have a guy from Australia that checked in here every now and then! And it looks like Obnoxious Neighbors are EVERYWHERE!

About M.P.N.C.EVER! When I first found GW I started out posting on the perennials forum and then added the grasses forum, but there were too many of "those kind of folks" on the other forums and after a knock-down-drag-out with somebody on the perennials forum I was about to opt out for good--and then I discovered RMG! That's all they wrote! I won't even lurk on the other forums anymore--I don't like being mad all the time! We have folks here on RMG that don't use chemicals--EVER--too, but we all agree that it's not up to "us" what other people should do! My theory about gardening is that if it works for you, it's right! I mostly use Palmolive dish washing soap for my garden "cure all," (have you tried WASHING his yard!!!) but when I need something Real, I use it--as little as possible, but I do use it! But fighting about "it" doesn't accomplish anything for anybody.

You're gardens really are amazing! I hope you're able to find a solution to Your Problem that will work for you. And you're welcome here on RMG anytime! I really wish you had a couple mountains to look at, or walk on, or something, but, who knows, maybe if you hang out around here long enough you'll decide to come out and visit us!

Skybird

I think I remember those roots skylark, did you post that on the P. forum? That picture looks real familiar.

Some N.E.sterner old time dragons over there didn't like me much when I started posting there talking about prairie plants and turned me into the mods three times for my 'disruptive attitude', said I didn't fit in, that they'd been there XXXX many years and didn't appreciate new people from 'down there' barging in with no manners & who didn't know how to behave. Got a quote from New York Magazine thrown at me along with some lyrics from the movie 'Oklahoma' and a comment about my granny out on the farm.

Manners? I have manners. Okies are downright friendly matter of fact.

Anyway, I had to change my name and rejoin under a different name because it was Three Strikes Your Out deal on the P. forum. I think they thought I was a troll making waves because I was growing 'weeds'. Ever get ganged up on, on GW? Well, I have and I survived.

Disruptive behavior??? Say what? From what I've seen you've been real Down Home (Okie) Friendly around here--and I suspect you were the same on perennials! Xeric perennials ARE perennials! Do they decide WHICH perennials you're allowed to talk about over there now!!! I've never been "ganged up on," but the person I had the Problem with on perennials knew THE answer (even if she was wrong!), and I have a BIG problem with people who know THE answer--for anybody but themselves! She was also dissing newbies who were already clearly "nervous" about asking questions, and I couldn't deal with that AT ALL!

I've posted the root pics here on RMG, but I haven't even poked my nose in over on perennials for at least three years now, so, no, they never showed up over there. Here on RMG I'm ranting about (my neighbor's) cottonwood roots ALL the time! It takes me an hour or two to plant a 3" plant! RANT!

I'm glad you're still here!

:-)

Skybird

What a nightmare you are dealing with, Skybird! I hate to think about the roots under my yard and in my neighbor's yard as well.-previous owners planted a white poplar in the front yard - a close relative of the cottonwood. Or, what is more than likely considering the way the rest of the yard looked when we moved in 20+ years ago, the previous owner allowed a volunteer white poplar to take root. There are several other of these beastly trees in the neighborhood. Like most - all?? - poplars, it suckers all over the place . I have tons of suckers that came up in the darn crawl space under my house - they have all died due to lack of sunlight, but..... The first few years we lived here, I was chopping out suckers that were growing from the roots that had reached the back yard; they no longer return, but the darn thing still suckers in the front yard.

Oh, these same previous owners allowed a Catalpa to grow right next to the house. Literally - the trunk is about an inch from the wall at this poing and still growing. Both trees need to be removed, but they are huge, I can't afford to remove them. We have spent probably about $3000-4000 through the years - just guestimating - having the dead stuff removed from the poplar, but never have enough money at one time to just have the tree removed. More dies off every year, so by the end of the season after having the tree trimmed, the tree has just as much dead branches as it did before. Like the cottonwood - poplars are fast growing, brittle, trash trees, IMHO, like Siberian elms and so many of the other crap trees that we easterners in our vast wisdom planted here on the plains so that we could have trees.

Ha ha! - I knew I would get a response from you, Zach, regarding my suggestion of scrub oak. I know you have had bad experiences with it, but I have had no problems at all with it here in my yard. I love oak trees but don't have room for the really large ones. I now have a small oak grove consisting of two Gambel Oaks ( I allowed one sucker to grow into a tree next to the original specimen,) a Mongolian oak and a couple of semi-evergreen Wavyleaf oaks (Quercus undulata) that I got from Harlequin's in Boulder - these last two are only about 2-2 1/2 feet high, very slow growers, perhaps rather more shrubby than trees though they have a single trunk. Anyway, the Scrub oak only suckers right close to the trunk and the suckers are very easily removed in the spring; I don't find it a problem at all. I doubt that they are better behaved in an urban garden, but perhaps just a lot easier to deal with as a single specimen as opposed to an established grove out in the wild.

Sorry that you have run into some unpleasant "my way or the highway" gardeners, texasranger2 and Skybird. We all have opinions, and, of course, our opinions are bound to be those that are most correct for any situation, lol, but most of us don't think "opinion=absolute truth, opinion=fact." There are a lot of jerks in this world and somehow the anonymity of the Internet seems to bring out the worst in some folks. I wouldn't presume to tell other people how they should garden or what they should grow; if I am asked, I will give my suggestions - and opinions - but, to make of the cliché "beauty is in the eye of the beholder," if someone prefers plastic flowers to the real thing, that's their choice and it's their yard and I can avert my eyes if the sight displeases me!

Holly

Heres an UGGGGHHHH! Moment....

It would seem that August magic doesn't work on spuds. Dug up this paltry sum this morning. 30 row foot of potatoes produced not much, if any, more than last years 10 row foot. So disappointing.

Oakiris said, "We all have opinions, and, of course, our opinions are bound to be those that are most correct for any situation, lol, but most of us don't think "opinion=absolute truth, opinion=fact." There are a lot of jerks in this world ..."

We don't seem to find it here but the more general forums have folks who just can't get it into their heads that there are different circumstances, different gardeners and different gardening environments. We are in a drought with less than 1/3" of rain since June 1st. Other locations in the US might commonly have an 1" or 2" in an afternoon ... Shoot. Commonly, a summer month will pass without that much rain. Still, a gardener in Tennessee - or, wherever - may have not the slightest notion of the differences. For some, a little light bulb comes on. Ha! Fun to see. Others ... never!

Zach, my potatoes must have the lowest production in the last 7 or 8 years. Partly, it was the weather. Partly, it is being a slave to the local garden center and of whatever seed spuds it decides to carry any particular year.

Steve

I'm not sure what it was this year. I don't think weather, it was wet and cool, but, so was last year and we had a pretty decent harvest off of them. The red ones are the same variety I grew last year that did spectacular, Sangre. Sadly this year, 3/4 of the red's never grew much bigger than twigs the whole season, the browns looked big and healthy, but I guess they weren't all together interested in making the parts we eat lol. It's just a shame we really do eat so many potatoes, that little bit wont last us very long. But, better luck next year I suppose.

P.S. been thinking about you up there, glad you seem to be doing alright where you're at. Stay safe Steve.

Real time air quality for Idaho: http://t.co/HLZtzU6lJP

Real time air quality for Washington: http://t.co/WIxi30P37T

The smoke has been horrible.

Steve

Wow! That's pretty nasty! Usually us folks down here in Colorado are the ones wearing respirators and SCBA's all summer and you guys are getting the biblical floods! The fires up there have been making it awful hazy down here, but I'm sure "hazy" would be pleasant for you right about now. Reminds the spring of 2012 when I was brushing ash off my car from the Lower North Fork fire burning just a handful of miles west of me. You could see the glow from it at night, too. Like I said, stay safe my friend, and I think I have a respirator around here somewhere if you want me to fedex it to you.