Hi Steve, Not sure if you'll see this post, but did you ever find a solution for your cracking tile problem? We are in the middle of a remodel and are experiencing the very same issue with our 4x12 glass tile. Thank you.

Hi Steve,

Could you tell me the name of the manufacturer and the tile line that you used?

Im currently experiencing the same issues in 3 showers that I installed in December.

I am a 20 year veteran installer and have installed several glass tile showers before, but have never had an issue before now.

Many information would be helpful. Thanks!

Name of the tile was ocean wave and the manufacturer was MSI. The box information and the limited directions that came with each box of tile never mentioned that you could not use it for wall tile or only as a decorative piece of tile. It was when we had the tile dealer bring the tile manufacturers representative to our job site that he said three things. One: Wow this shower in our tile looks awesome! Two: You have installed and drilled each piece by following our guide lines, in fact you went beyond. Three: Our tile is really made for decorative use like for an accent piece not for total wall coverage even though it does not disclose that on the box or directions.

Thanks for the info Steve. The tile I installed was Arizona Tile Islandia series. So a different distributor, but identical issues

We are scheduling an on-site meeting with a distributor rep. Cross your fingers for us that we can find a solution. Good luck in your future ventures!

Hello, my wife and I bought a new home 4 months ago in central California. Our bathroom tile has one wall, sort of an accent wall, that has Arizona Tile as well. It has cracked in 6 different locations on the wall, some as small as a half to three quarters of an inch and one as long as three inches. I find it quite a coincidence that the manufacturer, Arizona Tile, is the same manufacturer and has failed (to my knowledge) to address it. There are no grab bars or anything else on the wall for that matter. I would appreciate it, John, if you would be so kind as to post what the distributor rep has to say regarding this problem. Thank you, Mark

I took a class on Schluter shower systems last week. During the class the instructor would reference the international tile council association book which gives installation recommendations on tile installation over multiple substrates. It also gives details as to how the tile will react once installed. One important thing I learned other than getting this book and applying the knowledge to my profession and tile tradesmen is that not all glass tile is made the same. In fact the type of thin set can cause problems. I think you will find that the manufacturer and the distributor will be insulated by the tradesmen who installed this job did not follow the right install protocol. Your best bet is to hit the installer up and make a deal. One of the huge problems with the construction industry is that the technology in this industry is slow moving. Second too many tradesmen were taught by someone and none of them pick up the directions and and install from them.

Third, potential clients think that every tradesmen they meet are trained and certified in the area for which the client is hiring them. Homeowners really need to do their homework prior to hiring and ask good qualifying questions, call references and throw the lowest price out the window. I recommend once you hire a tradesmen and you the homeowner are acting contractor that you meet with your trade guys before they start, review their part, what the end result you are trying to achieve, what special items you are requesting, and what problems or issues need to be handled. This is done every morning. And every afternoon. Most importantly if the tradesmen or the contractor has an issue that affects quality, usability and performance then what written standards do they use to grade their work performance. In the case of our glass tile issue we followed all the manufacturers directions, even the manufacturer's representative said we went above and beyond, but their tile is meant for decoration accents only. So we had the dealer who assisted in the selection and is the contractor split the cost to remove the glass tile and we installed another tile. Because it was not entirely the client's fault. Now we have a procedure that when our client selects a tile the dealer sends us the spec sheet, data sheet and installation directions on each tile selected. We review before we order. We wish you the Best of luck on your tile issue.

Mark,

Arizona tile has given us very little help. They have not even been willing to send a representative to the job. Their stance is that it is not a product failure, but an installation failure, drastic change in temperature(the house has been heated consistently since before tile), or caused by serious structural movement (the house is a double wall 2x6 exterior with spray foam insulation and 2x4 interior). I'm not too proud to say that I do not make mistakes, but if so I would love for someone to point it out

I drove to Salt Lake City (5 1/2 hrs) to speak with the general manager there. He could find no flaws in my setting methods or setting materials used (at least by my verbal explanations since I can't get a rep at the job). I should outline that I used a 1/2" FiberRock backer board, CustomBuildingProducts RedGuard (for crack suppression and waterproof), a white Custom VersaBond Flex thin set, and Laticrete epoxy grout, all of which are approved by Arizona Tile. The epoxy grout is not typical and could be a potential culprit by creating too rigid of a wall, and not allowing for any movement, so any slight movement would cause tiles to crack. However, the cracks are random.

I don't want to slander Arizona. We are still in process of trying to figure this all out. I am glad that you posted, though, as this gives me support and maybe more leverage.

I will post progress, and would appreciate the same. Thanks!

John

Hello John,

Sorry for the delay in responding. I just now ran across your post. It sounds like you have a somewhat typical response between installer and manufacturer with both pointing the finger at each other. We are fortunate in that our house is still under warranty, though this has been going on for months without complete resolution. The installer, Dickenson Tile, has agreed to replace the tile, but now we have 11 cracks versus the 6 previously commented on. So my concern is that after the contractor replaces the tile, will we soon have further cracks not covered. The owner of the company asserts that the cracks are from "a new house just settling. My feeling is that, yes, perhaps it is from the settling of the home, but shouldn't that be factored into the construction of the house? Also, you mentioned that you suspected the epoxy grout being a problem (for lack of flexibility), and I suspect that may be. I will hold the builder, Williams Homes, ultimately responsible.

Have you had any resolution with your problem? Thanks for your response and I hope you've had good fortune in taking care of the problem.

By the way, if you'd like to further collaborate, my email is: jonesma61@gmail.com

Sincerely,

Mark

I'm so sorry for the problems and lack of service you're all experiencing. I appreciate this information, because it has changed my mind about glass tile I was planning to use in my kitchen.

Before the contractor fixed the Arizona Glass Tiles in our shower there were over 30 cracked tiles! Three days after fixing them there were two more. It is such a drag because the look is sweet...

Cut the glass around a piece of porcelain tile, matching the glass color as close as possible and making sure the shower door hinge or mounting bracket covers it completely... drill and mount into the tile.... caulk around fixtures to hide edges of tile.. the porcelain tile will serve as a good anchor, Alleviating all of the pressure on the glass tiles.

Dan

All Natural Stone

dan@allnaturalstone.com

We have an entire shower that was installed less then 3 months ago and are having a horrible time with all the cracks. The contractors wants to pull out the cracked pieces and replace them but my fear is that it may end up causing more problems than we already have. Does anyone have any resolution at this point? Not sure what steps to take next.

If the tile is glass tile then as a contractor I would not go down that Rabbit hole of removing cracked tiles and installing new ones. The reason is that was our gut reaction and did just that. Guess what happened? Other tiles started cracking and not even tile that was close to the repair/tile swap. The best advice to you and your contractor has two parts. One you both live with the cracks and use it as a life lesson not to do again. Or tear it all out and install another tile and you both take an equal hit on the cost of the first tile installation and demo. Best of luck.

I agree with Steve... live with it. Or replace it all.... there are several reason for the glass to crack.

#1. Wrong thinset mortar

#2. No caulking at perimeter joints & hinge joints...

#3. Bad glass

the porcelain tile suggestion was simply for behind hinges or mounting brackets....

good luck

Dan,

All Natural Stone

Would the caulking looks different then the grout? I'm assuming so, I don't think this was done so that could be the issue right there. thanks

As a tile representative, I only ran into this problem twice with glass. The true comment here is that not all glass are made to go on shower walls. There is glass made to withstand the fluctuation of temperature and pressure. It there is a price tag that goes along with it as well.. usually $30-$60
The glass needs to move, as it expands and contracts with heat (shower install), installation is a big part of it as well, and it needs room to move so tight grout joints does not help. You need 3/16 grout joint to allow it to move.
The last job problem, around the windows and grab bar we did silicone only around it, no grout, no caulking - its a bit of an eye sore but so far it worked.

I realize this is a year late, but just in case it helps someone... The manufacturers will always blame the installers (not fair!), but if the manufacturer uses recycled glass in their product, that is likely your problem. In an environment where there can be extremes such as heating up quickly (like in a shower), or freeze/thaw conditions (like a swimming pool), there will be differential expansion and contraction from the different glass materials used in the manufacturing process, resulting in stress cracks. The tell-tale sign will be glass fracturing in all different directions. I only know of two manufacturers for sure that use virgin materials in their process, and they aren't mentioned here. I'm sure there are more out there, we just haven't found them yet. If you want to put it to the test, set the tile in question out in full sun, and watch what happens.

we are having a rather extreme example of this is a small shower we are doing. We put up two walls of the shower about 2 months ago and have NOT even grouted it yet (let alone used the shower) and we went from having about 7 tile cracked on one wall as of a few weeks a go to twice that number now. From Ann Sacks (who we purchased it from) I received this after reviewing our installation: "Based on what I see here, most steps of the install look good. No incompatibilities between thinset and membranes, nothing spot bonded. However, the issue I do see is rather serious, which is a lack of control joints – also called movement or expansion joints. Per TCNA section EJ171, pages 416-421, these joints need to be included at any change of plane. This is touched on in the specifications for both the Laticrete 9235 and Mapei Ultra Flex, the instructions included with Metro Nuovo (see attached), as well as ANSI ASTCM C1193.

It may seem like this wouldn’t be an issue prior to grouting, but the membrane alone requires 7 days cure time, and thinsets typically continue to cure and shrink over a period of months. During this time, it is quite possible for shock to transfer across the installation, even without grouting, and so it is vital to account for these joints early on. In contrast to standard grout joints, control joints also need to be filled with an appropriate urethane, polysulfide, or silicone sealant. Grout cannot be used in these areas in lieu of sealant.

I’ve circled some areas from the original batch of photos where there is a clear sign of insufficient joint, as well as the technical sheets for the materials (see highlighted sections in each), though the specific guidelines will vary depending on the materials and requirements of the install area. The TCNA handbook offers a number of diagrams that illustrate these variations, but most specify joint width of ideally ¼” and not less than 1/8”."

Have been working since 1980 and have done probably close to 300 custom bathrooms and have never seen anything like this. I replied with this: "There is no logic to the location of the breaks. In this case I really don’t understand how a control joint would have made any difference. I find it hard to believe the a lack of a control joint in the corner would have this dramatic an effect over the whole surface unless the tiles are absurdly fragile. (What I think is likely is that the tiles ARE absurdly fragile and they have broken individually as the mortar behind them has cured)."

It remains to be seen how they (the supplier and the manufacturer if they get involved) are going to respond.

Any reputable glass company will not recommend mounting a glass door on glass tile. The weight is too much stress on the glass tiles. While glass tiles expand & contract, since glass reacts differently than ceramic tile. If you want to use glass i would recommend mounting instead on a stone jam..if not be prepared to "try" to replace glass tiles even months after the installation.

Reading these comments I am scared to death to have glass tile installed again my bathroom shower tub combo...of course I brought the tile already

Bah. We have a beautiful glass tile accent in our bathroom - a 12” stripe of tile running up the middle of a rectangular column. The tile is not in the shower - it’s outside. The tiles were installed last September, and started cracking in March. One a week - we’ve got four cracked ones now. Grrr! Glad the house is still under warranty, but I’m going to miss my beautiful glass tile. :-( (4x12 Grey Mink translucent dunes, from Surface Art)

I remodeled my entire bathroom, 3 full walls, with glass tile from Home Depot. I did a "wet room" style bathroom. The concept being every inch of the bathroom can get wet with no worries. Two tiles have cracked so far. My contractor is reaching out to the tile guy....I am reaching out to Home Depot for selling something they know is an inferior product! Jeffrey Court Siberian Gloss 3 in X 6 in. X 6 in. X 8 mm Glass Mosaic Tile

We ended up removing all of the tile and using a different product. Our client was not that set on glass tile and after this experience neither were we. Not as beautiful, but no cracks with the new (similarly sized) porcelain tiles. I still believe the cracks were a result of the differential curing of the mortar and tiles that were not strong enough to withstand that which in our case would explain the time span over which these cracks occurred. BTW - Ann Sacks did cover 50% of the replacement tile cost but would not help with any of the significant associated labor costs of removing and re-installing the tiles.

We had the entire shower redone with a different material! I love the look of glass but the installer has to be very very knowledgeable for the install of the glass tiles to go smoothly and last!

You cant glass tile cracks and should not be installed or sold larger than 2"x2".