Ismatthys - You are the one that is incorrect. Running a straight lay like you have has a much better chance of hiding any bowing in the tiles. When you do a broken joint you have a much greater chance of showing this imperfection if the tile bows. This is because the bowing happens normally in the center of the tile and the corners will either be lower or higher than the center.
Unless the tile is rectified, the size of tiles will not be uniformed. As I can see in your photo your tile looks to be a glazed ceramic tile. The tile with the light glare is slightly smaller than the tile below it. And that tile is also slightly larger than the tile below that one... Your grout joints help point this out. - Your tiles are not uniformed.

Now if the customer wanted to hide this eye sore they should move their lighting to the center of the shower vs being in the corner. The lighting in the corner is highlighting all the imperfections causing shadowing. They will never be happy.

lsmatthys needs to buy and read a TCNA manual. Nothing like responding to a dilemma from a position of ignorance of actual industry standards.

It honestly looks fine. This is just what happens with longer tile sometimes. Manufacturers can only make an edge so clean and a tile so flat, so you're bound to get some imperfections.

Live with it a while. If it still bothers you in 6 months, have it redone, but specify that you want rectified tiles and buy 20% more than you need. Then the tiler can go through and choose the best ones so you get the smoothest surface. Yes, that's more expensive, but the results are gonna be a lot closer to what you envision.

In the meantime, switch out the overhead light for something that doesn't exaggerate the shadows on your wall and you probably won't even notice it.

Industry pros repeatedly try to warn consumers of this and consumers continue not to listen. It has become an ever increasing problem because of the popularity of large format tiles. An installer cannot overcome the inconsistencies in clay fired products that, per manufacturing standards, are NOT perfect. A running bond pattern exacerbates the inconsistencies inherent in these products. A straight pattern helps to hide it (nothing eliminates it).

We see tile warpage in expensive tiles and in cheap tiles. It happens due to the evaporation of water in the product during the firing process.

Thanks everyone. I was not warned about this and I guess I relied on experts to advise me when I was picking out tile. The tile store also said they had not had complaints about the tile before. I'll talk with the contractor and see what we can come up with. Moving the light to the center is not an option because of the rainshower head.

I asked the question and was told the tiles would butt up flatly with minimal grout line. No one mentioned this possibility and I bought from a tile showroom, not a big box or discounter. I've also never seen lippage in pictures in Houzz ideabooks, including the one that used the exact tile I used. Just saying.

I got mine from a reputable showroom too and they didn't think this should happen with these tiles.

Homeowners, it's about setting expectations at the beginning of the job, which is the contractors responsibility. Our clients sign a waiver indicating they understand that there can be lippage on any tile larger than 12x12" or longer than 12", and depending on the layout. Also, if large or long tiles are used, we make sure every wall stud is perfectly plumb and straight with each other (by planing, shimming, or replacing, and making sure corners are square), and we check this every 12" going up the wall. We do the same with floors to make them level, and even then you can still get lippage because large or long tiles simply are not flat. This extra labor makes the job more expensive, so we ask what level of quality the client wants. Communication and education can really help to avoid these issues.

The problems here is Co's are now run by people selling products who have zero idea or care as to how they will look installed. Add to this them being made offshore where quality control is non existent.

Tiles are designed to look good on a small sample at a showroom. It used to be the tile person chose a few that would work and present them to a homeowner. Now homeowners go themselves and have 100x's the choices. Problem is the homeowner does have the knowledge as to which tiles work for that application.

The last problem is most modern tiles do not have rounded edges or distressed looking edges to hide installation issues.

Long thin tiles are the hardest tiles to get correct. Homeowners should always consult with your tile installer before ordering to verify the tile will work and can be installed how you want. It takes both the installer and the homeowner to be on the same page to have a happy end result.

Pictures usually highlight the defects as you probably had to adjust the light or angle to get the defects to show. We are now developing these crazy expectations of perfect tile jobs. They do not exist end of story. Anybody who has ever done a tile installation knows the amount of variables from wall, thinset, tile, etc, etc guarantee there will be an issue somewhere.

In the end it looks like a nice clean install. Don't focus on the so called mistakes and enjoy your new bath. Funny thing is very high end hand made tiles look exactly like this on purpose and cost easily $35-50sqft.

Hi everyone- I wanted to provide an update and hopefully help others who might be planning similar projects. I did some more research in the TCNA manual and ANSI standards and learned the following.

ANSI A108.02 standards state for running bond tile patterns (tiles are installed in a staggered or offset pattern) using tiles where any tile side is greater than 15” (380mm), the grout joint size shall be on average a minimum of 1/8” (4 mm) wide for rectified tiles, and a minimum of 3/16” (5 mm) wide for calibrated tiles. The grout joint width shall be increased over the minimum requirement by the amount of edge warpage on the longest edge of the tiles being installed.

For this project, my tiles are 16 inches long, are calibrated, and have at least 1/32 warpage. Therefore, installation accordingly to tile industry standards would necessitate at grout joint of between 3/16 and 1/4 inch. In our case, the tile was installed with a 1/16 joint, which is incorrect.

I also want to point people to two really helpful articles if they are planning tile projects.

http://www.tileletter.com/2016/02/7950/

http://www.tileletter.com/2016/03/tech-talk-march-2016/

Ok, finally for my question. The tile on my shower are going to be replaced and I need to decide what we are going to replace them with. My options are:

1. Use the same tile and just use a larger grout joint - will need to be possibly almost 1/4 inch because of the warpage of these tiles.

2. Use a white 4x16 tile that has less warpage. I would use white grout and the shower floor would still have grey grout.

3. Use a 3x12 rectified tile that matches my shower floor and main bathroom floor.

My vote is for # 3 because of less risk for lippage and it matches well. I'm interested in other's opinions.

TIA

Great research youve gone to exactly the right place in TCNA/ANSI. I hope you mean the whole shower will be torn out and replaced and not an attempt at just removing tile or tiled walls only....

Tip for : Any homeowners reading along that are getting a tile installation done. Request from your prospective installer that you get a detailed scope written into your contract refrencing :

"TCNA/ANSI, local building code, and all MFG's instructions will be adhered to throughout the tile installation"

I would go with #3 as well and get the rectified tile. A 1/4" grout joint on a long subway would be distracting.

I honestly think it looks fine. I know you're ripping it out but I would have lived with it.

Given that you're ripping it out I'd probably go with 3.

Tundra Finish Works- the shower walls are being torn out...apparently able to preserve the floor though.

I would have concern about removing wall tile and not the whole shower. You are breaking the waterproofing when you remove the wall tile and could create future issues.

Your shower looks great. Yes, you are being too picky. That happens sometimes when a project is first completed - you see every little issue. As you step back and look at the whole room, and live in the space, the issue of that tiny overlap will recede. If anything it adds a handmade quality that's charming.

Emily!!!! May I suggest a slight paradigm shift. You are dealing with multiple layers of materials installed by 2 or 3 different people in a house that was built many years ago by many other different people. The materials themselves although manufactured are not always the same and all will have variations. NOT imperfections. Is there such thing as a perfect tile or 2x4? What is perfect? Nothing! The nature of this shower and any shower is that it is in of itself unique. Installed with a varying material by an individual craftsman.

You said you hired a reputable contractor. He did not get that reputation by doing bad work. Trust him, the character of the materials and the human element and craftsmanship that went in to installing your shower.

just my 2 cents

bostongc.com

If it were merely about aesthetics at this point I would agree, but it was not installed according to either the manufacturer or ANSI standards...for that reason, it is being corrected. Failure to follow the standard could lead to issues with the longevity of the shower.

anyone else have an opinion about which option I should choose for the re-installation? The options are listed above.

As long as there is proper waterproofing behind the tile, this issue IS just about the aesthetics. You are not going to trip on the lippage on a shower wall. It will function as a shower just fine.

Now, if here isn't proper waterproofing, removing the walls isn't going to work at all. You would need to remove it all.

According to one expert-

http://www.tileletter.com/2016/02/7950/

"A 1/16” (2 mm) wide grout joint is too narrow to adequately fill to full depth for maximum support of the tile edge. Failure to fully fill the joint can result in grout coming loose later."

On my project, the grout didn't fill the joints and had holes...that won't withstand the test of time.

It depends entire on what grout was used, and the tile orientation. BIG difference between vertical orientation and a horizontal walking surface. . You cannot take a statement like that as an automatic fail. It isn't. What grout was used on your job?

Sanded epoxy grout, not sure what brand

You have to 100% know which brand of product was used. Because what you just said makes no sense.

with those grout joints, unsanded should have been used. I think the walls look fine. It's the nature of the tile.

Beth, she says epoxy was used. Which has microfines if it's not pure resin. Which is why the actual product needs to be known. If it's epoxy, it's fine.

1/8"+ sanded grout. 1/8"- non sanded grout. There's a reason why grout can be bought sanded or non sanded. I will not use Epoxy grout in grout joints smaller than 1/8" -- But that's me.

We did a tile job using Daltile Kimona Silk in 12 x 24 and 2 x 24 size. The wall was visibly crooked. Although my contractor was somewhat resistant, I insisted that he use the Raimondi leveling system and it came out beautifully. We used Laticrete epoxy grout and I'm very pleased with it. The leveling system is a bit expensive but after three years, I still admire those walls every time I walk in that bathroom. I've worked with various contractors over the years and have done both large and small renovations, and one thing I have learned is to research every product and to familiarize myself with the correct way to do a job. I have very few "cringe-worthy" moments these days. Occasionally, I come across a contractor who does not like to be questioned. I get rid of them fast.

I think there has to be some blame as to who sold you these tiles and if they knew their intended placement. Tile stores sell tiles all day and the majority of salespeople haven't a clue about guidelines or it the tiles are suitable for the intended area. Selling people tiles in sizes that will not fit in a set 60" shower area for example.

You have a tile setter getting paid by the day who shows up to install the tiles that are already purchased. He has to make the decision to install them with a unconventional large gap or install them as he normally would with a 1/16 gap. If he installed them with a 1/4" grout there is no way you would have been happy. Tiles especially marble mosaics are being sold where they can't be installed as per the guidelines leaving tile setters on the spot to decide do I go with aesthetics or an ugly install that looks acceptable but a better install.

Yes the tile itself is what you want but does it work for the intended area, NO! That tile requires a large grout line which you do not want in a shower. So the decision would be not to use that tile in the shower they should explain that to potential buyers but they themselves are uneducated.

This is where dealing with the actual owner/installer works to your benefit. Pic out a couple tiles and show them to the installer. Explain what your expectations are an they will explain how they can be installed. You then can make an educated choice as to what you want the intended outcome to be and hold them responsible for meeting that goal.

They installed those tiles as if they were lugged subway tile. Grout has nothing to do wit securing the tile to the wall. Tiles are installed everyday with 1/16 grout lines and it does not effect the install one bit.

Get a different tile if that is not the intended look you want it has ZERO to do with walls. Buy the next installer drywall shims but those tiles will still look as they do now.

By the way as I had said earlier I think they look fine as is. Go to Fireclay's website you will see handmade tiles probably cost 3-4x's the cost of yours that look exactly the same way. Not all tiles are dimensionally perfect. Some people are paying huge amounts to get the exact look you already have. Again you have the wrong tile.

Wow, we just bought 12×24 inch tile to have our shower done. I'm wondering if we should take them back and get smaller til.e

Charla, just make sure your tile setter knows how to set these large tiles.

spot bonding is not recommended in a shower. the tile should have 95% coverage, per tile standards. he should also use one of the leveling systems available for those large tiles to make sure there is no lippage. I would question your guy on these issues first.

We install large tiles on shower walls all the time. The key to a proper installation and a good finished look starts at your wall studs. We make sure each wall stud is perfectly plumb and straight across the wall to the other end, meaning each stud lines up perfectly with the other studs. We checked this using a level and placing it across the studs, starting above the tub or shower pan and checking every 12 inches for any deviations, all the way up to where the tile will end, usually at or near the ceiling. Sometimes we have to shim out the studs or even take a planer or belt sander and shave or sand down the studs. If you do this, then the cement board will be perfectly flat on each wall, and the tile will be perfectly flat as well. But not so fast - you can still get "lippage" up to one sixteenth of an inch because these large tiles simply are not perfectly flat. Be sure to use the proper mortar designed for large format tiles.

I wish I had seen this comment first, Beth. They have already started and are using the acrylic glue to attach them. I know now we should have hired a professional.

Charla, what do you mean acrylic glue?? they're using this in the shower? why aren't they mixing up regular thinset? they aren't using Mastic, are they? If they are using premixed stuff in a white tub, have them stop immediately.

send a picture of what it is.

Acrylic ( mastic) adhesive should never be used in areas where there is wetness. As Beth points out if this is a shower you need to stop immediately and start over with the proper adhesive.

Not a chance! That is a crap job! The uneven tiles make the lines look wavy, its very amateurish! I can do better myself and im not a master tiler. Beware, this happened to me as well and they tried to convince me to live with it by saying they would have to break the tiles and redo it and would take more time bc the tiles had to be ordered! I told them tough, i would wait! Get a good job, that is the first line of defence for protecting your drywall from moisture!

If it is a standard problem with the tile, the professionals should have warned you of the probable unsatisfactory outcome! No one would spend that much on product and installation for a crappy finished look!

You may have to suck up the cost of new material to get them to redo the job for free.

what is thinset?

the contractor said they would be using mastic inside the little instead shelves they have made. what color should it be?

Charla cook, is this for a shower? Mirror installers use mastic, tile installers use thinset. I don't think you can use mastic for tiles, never hear of that!

Charla, its better to start a new thread instead of asking questions on someone else's thread because the answers can get confusing for people reading. At any rate, mastic can be used for tiles if it is used in the right settings, but it should not be used in a place where it is exposed to water( i.e. A shower). Thinset is a cement based adhesive that is the correct type to use tiled showers. You are talking about shelves now so perhaps you should start a new thread with pictures to clarify your questions?

Ok, I'm sorry, I didn't think about it.

No worries...it just means you are more likely to get helpful answers to your particular issue.

Charla, no no no to mastic. do not let them use that anywhere in a shower. it won't dry.

your tilers know what thinset is. it comes in a bag, they mix it with water and looks like cement.

Ok thank you Beth.

Emily is it just me or is that stripe going up and down crooked?

Tbh this material isn't perfect, but can be done better.