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cercis47

PNW Soil Testing Service

8 years ago

Any recommendtions?


Our vegie garden is mainly in raised beds and this year I am having difficulty germinating beets, chard, spinach from direct sowing. After planting several times, the few plants that germinated are stunted. Cucumbers are still tiny. Peas and tomatoes (started from seed and transplanted) were slow to start but doing well.


The beds are a mix of topsoil and bagged organic compost. Last year I added screened manure from our local outlet. I am wondering if there is too much organic material.


i am hoping someone will recommend a good soil testing service from personal experience as I put too much work into our vegie garden for 2 inch chard!


Thank you.

Comments (16)

  • 8 years ago

    WSU - the WA state land grant university that sponsors the extension service/Master Gardener program - has excellent resource materials on local soils. Included in this publication are links to various soil testing labs. None are 'recommended' - it is just an access resource.

    I live in Kitsap and most of my clients utilize Twiss Analytical Labs in Poulsbo.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Not sure where you are, but I would go to your local extension service for recommendations. That's not "personal experience", but at least you can be assured about who is the real deal. OSU and WSU have web pages specifically for questions like this one. If you get a "personal experience" recommendation, make sure the outfit recommended is on these lists. When I was in the PNW, I had my own favorite, but they aren't there anymore.

  • 8 years ago

    Soil tests work for chemistry but not so much for organic qualities. If the soil chemistry is off in macro or micro nutrients, the soil test will tell you. If you have organic problems, the soil test will not be able to tell you that.

    It is possible to temporarily ruin good soil by burying or blending in wood chips or sawdust. Wood requires certain fungi to decompose, and those fungi will rob nitrogen from everywhere to survive. Normally wood decomposes above the ground, so nitrogen comes from the air. When you bury wood then the fungi will take the nitrogen from any fertilizers you use. If wood remains buried it can take years for the soil to recover. This often happens in a lawn where a tree was removed and the wood chips used to refill the hole were the roots were. Grass won't grow until the wood is fully decomposed. I would suspect the bagged organic compost as the culprit. Compost should go on the soil, not in the soil. The fastest way to fix that soil is to keep turning it up so any wood gets enough air to decompose. So for now you might need to abandon that particular piece of ground and relocate the garden. Once the fungus is working on the wood, nothing can stop it. Weekly fluffing the soil should really help.

  • 8 years ago

    The above comments tend to be in direct opposition to what is horticulturally recommended :-) Compost is generally intended as a soil amendment, not a mulch (although can certainly be used in that manner). Its benefit as an addition to most soils is hard to overstate! And the additions of a wood based mulch, wood chips or even chunks of undigested wood in compost is entirely workable - it does not "ruin" the soil (as readings on the Soils, Mulch and Compost forum should clearly point out). The effect of nitrogen unavailability due to the incorporation of wood is entirely temporary, does not last for years and can be easily offset by additions of a high N fertilizer.

    And there is certainly no need to abandon that portion of the garden.....unless it has some sort of chemical contamination. Which can also be determined by a soil test if you have concerns that might be the case.

  • 8 years ago

    I was a little confused on the numbers in 1). Maybe a typo?

    Please repeat for me. Very much appreciated.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Your problems aren't going to have anything to do with soil pH or details about the organic composition or earthworm census. You can grow stuff in pure compost with zero worms. You've got plants that you transplanted that are doing well. Your direct seeding was problematical, it appears, however. Direct seeding requires care to keep the soil moist because even as seedlings, the roots aren't deep. Without enough moisture, germination will be poor, and what germinates will be stunted. It may also be that a soil crust is forming that inhibits germination.

    You say THIS YEAR you are having troubles. Did you not have these troubles last year? Or is it a first-time garden? If the latter, then a soil test is certainly in order. If the former, then not so much.

    Be careful about "topsoil". Bagged "topsoil" is often just junk. It may have come from the top of a parking strip. If you want garden soil, get that from a nursery. I'm assuming this was quality compost. Incompletely composted organics will be trouble.

    Can't help you more without extra info.

  • 8 years ago

    Thanks for all replies. To answer some questions:

    The topsoil was a vegie mix from Cedar Grove and the compost was at the onset Cedar Grove. The beds are several years old and have produced well and germinated well until the last 2-3years. I have added Gardener and Bloome Harvest Supreme or local screened manure on a yearly basis as well as leaf mold we make every year. We seem to have some worms. I either use kelp/fish fertilizer during the growing season or Gardentone/Tomatotone. I cover the beds in local straw in the winter to keep,the soil from compacting in our heavy rains.

    I am pretty good at keeping seeds moist for germination and cover with a light netting to keep the robins from pecking them out. Germination is sparse and and plants plants never make much growth. We are used to eating chard, beets and spinach by now and have zilch. The few beets that germinated don’t have any signs of enlarging roots.

    Hope this sheds some light for any suggestions.

  • 8 years ago

    I guess you have to think hard about what's happened to your beds in the last 2-3 years. You seem to be doing stuff right. I assume you're using fresh seeds every year? Beet roots won't enlarge until they are well along in growth.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    If you don’t know what your soil already contains in terms of nutrients, how can you possibly determine
    how much OM to add? It is simple and cheap to have your soil tested for OM content and nutrient levels
    and this should be done at least once to determine baseline values. This information can help you
    determine if you need to add more organic material, and which nutrients in particular are at minimal
    levels. It wastes resources, both financial and natural, to add excessive amounts of OM without these
    baseline values

    Last fall we collected soil samples from a local organic demonstration garden and sent them out for
    nutrient analysis; this garden had recently experienced some soil and plant health problems. Every single
    one of the sites that was tested came back with nutrient readings off the scale. In large capital letters the
    report warned “DO NOT FERTILIZE THIS SOIL.” The excessive addition of nutrient-rich compost to
    this landscape contributed not only to plant health problems but to nutrient loading of adjacent natural
    waters

    https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/403/2015/03/soil-amendments-3.pdf

    cercis47 thanked Embothrium
  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    There are those that maintain it is not necessary to test soils for soil pH or nutrient levels however, "Soil testing is an important management practice on all farms, whether growing vegetables for fresh market or pasture for livestock. It’s nearly impossible to determine what a soil needs to be productive, without a soil analysis." This not only applies to farms but to the home garden as well.

    http://smallfarms.oregonstate.edu/soil-testing

    cercis47 thanked kimmq
  • 8 years ago

    The manure may be the source of the problem due to "herbicide carryover" in organic matter.

    Can you post images of the affected plants?


    See this: https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/411/2014/12/Paper_Clopryalid_Garden.pdf


    And this for a simple bio-assay: https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/411/2014/12/PDF_Clopyralid_Bioassay.pdf

  • 8 years ago

    The presence of any persistent herbicides in almost any PNW soil products would be extremely low. There is a slight possibility they could be present in feed lot manures but both the Cedar Grove and Gardner& Bloome products will be very clean.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I am particularly concerned with two classes of compost contaminants: pesticides and heavy metals.
    Recently, compost feed stocks east of the Cascades were found contaminated with clopyralid and
    picloram – two broadleaf herbicides. These relatively persistent herbicides have been found in hay and
    grain residues and the manure of chickens, cattle, and horses. Compost contaminated with these
    herbicides can injure or kill broadleaf ornamentals and vegetables. While the source of this particular
    contamination problem was agricultural, these broadleaf weed killers are also used for lawn care. If
    treated lawn clippings are composted either at home or elsewhere, they will contaminate the compost
    and
    kill or injure susceptible plants. The long-term impacts of these herbicides on human health are not yet
    known.

    Heavy metals, such as lead, arsenic, and mercury, are less problematic for plants than they are for
    humans. If ingested, these metals disrupt biochemical pathways and cause a number of health problems,
    particularly in children. Lead is the most commonly found heavy metal in residential urban soils,
    primarily as a remnant of lead-based paints and fuels. There were frighteningly high levels of lead,
    chromium, cadmium, manganese, and other EPA-regulated heavy metals reported in a recent, world-wide
    study of compost. Sources of toxic heavy metals include sewage sludge, industrially-contaminated soil,
    and the previously mentioned lead problem. It’s not a bad idea to have your soil tested for lead,
    especially if you grow produce for human consumption. The cost is minimal and the information invaluable

    https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/403/2015/03/clean-compost.pdf

  • 8 years ago

    Your source is outdated.

    Picloram and clopyralid have been off the consumer/homeowner marketplace since 2005. Entities that ARE authorized to use these RU herbicides in western WA (DOT and golf course groundskeepers) are prohibited by state law from including them in any municipal composting operations.

    And Washington State was the first to institute requirements on all commercial fertilizers and soil amendments to restrict the amount of heavy metals they contain. If they do not fall below the considered acceptable risk "background level" (significantly lower than what commonly occurs in unamended soils) then they are not allowed to be sold in this state.


  • 8 years ago

    Re "excessive addition of nutrient rich compost". Mythbusters! Fully composted material, and actually even organic fertilizers, are actually pretty lame sources of immediately available nutrients. What little nutrients compost has (compost is of order 2-1-1 in NPK) is mostly available over the long term. Compost is a SOIL STRUCTURE amendment, and not really a fertilizer amendment. There are good reasons not to have your bed awash in organics, but those reasons have nothing to do with over-fertilization.