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whaas_5a

Honeymoon is over

7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago

I thought we were going to escape with a mild/average winter but with this atypical blast of cold we’re going to see some damage in zone 5.

As of last night they forecasted -14 and we ended up with -23. I am northwest of Milwaukee and the all time low since recorded keeping is -26.

-23 is the lowest I’ve recorded for my area in 15 years. The forecast is marking me a little nervous with so many young plants.

I have a few snow mounds going to hep protect a few.


anyone else in this cold blast seeing potential for records?





Comments (52)

  • 7 years ago

    Zone 3 here, we are getting below average temperatures but nothing record breaking.

    Planted some 1gallon spruces in the fall that are mostly buried in snow now, at least we have decent snow cover this year.

    whaas_5a thanked Novice Gardener
  • 7 years ago

    No severe temperatures yet but we’re supposed to get it next week. Just south of MSP I only have about an inch of snow on the ground. Kind of a mixed blessing we’re supposed to get 6-10“ of snow Sunday night before the arctic blast hits. That’ll set up for potential to really go off a cliff at night with the fresh snowpack. I’ve seen forecasts for a few nights next week ranging from -22 to -32.

    whaas_5a thanked pennlake
  • 7 years ago

    We hit -21 F last night. What worries me is the duration of cold yet to come. Going from -20, to a whopping -10 high, then right back to -20. That's a long time well below zero. Have my fingers crossed.

    We at least have over a foot of snow on the ground to help the young plants. I too shoveled snow over plants that were still above snow.

    whaas_5a thanked coniferbros
  • 7 years ago

    This coming weeks temps are the coldest in several years. The projected high for Wednesday is -12F. I don’t know if that’s a record, but it has to be close.

    This will be a good test for several marginally hardy woody plants, especially those planted in 2018 since we don’t have much snow cover. My larger concern is the potential for our septic system freezing up. That would really stink.

    whaas_5a thanked maackia
  • 7 years ago

    Not anything out of the ordinary or record breaking here.

    All of December was snow-less but fairly mild. Then we received almost 2 ft. of snow by end of Dec., before the bulk of below zero cold hit. Everything got covered!

    January got cold but normal lows for Zone3. Our coldest day so far was -27 F. and we might have a -32 F next week. We had a few continuous strings where it went below zero at night and stayed around the zero mark all day.

    I see the days are a whole hour longer today than they were on Dec 21, 2018.

    The sun is starting to be a factor (higher sun angle) as it was -8 F last night but as soon as the sun came up, thermometer on the south side of the house rose to +22 F., even though air temp was +5 F., anything in the sun gets extra warmth. The snow has settled in depth some with a hard crust on top.

    Nothing that is Zone hardy here should experience any damage. Be a good test for Tsuga canadensis and native Sugar maple, that are claimed to be Z3 from some sources and Z4 from others. :-)


    whaas_5a thanked User
  • 7 years ago

    Looks like its mostly WI and IL as far as atypical. In my first photo you can see the wind stripped the snow right down to the grass and mulch the other day. Surprisingly -23 didn't feel as cold as I'd expect as there wasn't any wind.


    Monday night through Thursday night is really the problem with the sustained low and incessant wind. -13 for a high is a few degrees off the record high low.

  • 7 years ago

    Update: The projected high on Wednesday is now -16. I don't recall ever experiencing a high temp of -16. We're likely to go more than 72 hours without the temp getting above -7. I expect high losses of plant material, but hoping I'll be surprised come this spring. If my Stewartia survives this, then I can safely say I've got a bona fide bone-hardy z4 plant. We desperately need snow cover, but I will not be shoveling what little we have onto plants. They're on their own.

    whaas_5a thanked maackia
  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Two important factors will be inherent genetically determined hardiness and how deeply the soil freezes. It only takes a comparatively short time below a plant's built in ground floor for there to be damage. And the soil freezing deeply interferes with the uptake of water by roots. This latter factor is why zonal denial enthusiasts claiming that because a plant came through a certain minimum temperature for a few nights in the south one time without visible effects it has been demonstrated that the same kind will be hardy anywhere in the north where that same temperature is also infrequent is incorrect. A few nights in the south, probably nearly always followed immediately by mild southern temperatures does not freeze the soil deeply. And keep it frozen for an extended period.

    whaas_5a thanked Embothrium
  • 7 years ago

    ^^- Yes,

    Even in my north Z3 area, snow cover, or absence of it, can make the difference between the ground actually freezing at all, or going substantially below freezing.

    We've had winters with early, heavy snow cover, then extended periods of sub zero temperatures, where, later that winter, you could dig through the snow with a spade, and continue to dig into non-frozen or barely frozen ground underneath the snow. Then other years, like maackia mentioned, without snow and sub zero all of January, where the ground freezes solid several feet down from the surface, causing problems like septic systems freezing and water pipes bursting from expanding ice freezing inside the pipes. (one of the things you learn to plan for when installing and building).

    This also affects native plantings (just my own observations) where native trees and perennials start pushing buds much later in the spring, noticeably not as robust and with seemingly less total seasonal growth than when a more protected year.


    maackia: The old timers used to cover their septic system with hay or straw bales and didn't know whether it needed it or not. Which always seemed to me like a lot of work for nothing, so I never did do that and never had trouble all the 40 years I lived out there. The last year out there, the end froze by the drain field, late in the Feb. We had the tank pumped a couple times until the weather warmed up and all was good. :-)

    OTOH: The old farm house we started out with, had a porous foundation and every sub zero event, we had the chance of bathroom water pipes, under the floor freezing. So we either left the water faucet in the bathroom running a tad, or put an electric heater under the floor at night. Ah, the good old days! :-))

    whaas_5a thanked User
  • 7 years ago

    We have had the odd combination of cold temperatures without snow early in the season followed by alternating rain and snow. So the ground is frozen so that water doesn’t drain. I went ice skating on the farm field next to the house today.

    whaas_5a thanked NHBabs z4b-5a NH
  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    So if I want to give a borderline plant the best chance to survive should I put it in a shadier spot on the north side of a structure with ample snow cover or put it in the warm micro climate on the south side of a structure where it's much warmer and the soil doesn't freeze, but there is not snow cover?

    BTW, I'm no stranger to the -30s, not every year, but it does happen now and then. Stay warm, upper-Midwesterners!

    whaas_5a thanked L Clark (zone 4 WY)
  • 7 years ago

    We had alot of freeze thaw going on as well. The soil literally froze several inches deep early November. Then we had more rain than snow up until the first real snow fall of the season of 6" just this past week. Hadn't had ANY sub zero temps until this past week. So far -8, -13 and -23.


    Lane, it just depends on the plant. For example if I planted a Japanese maple out of the sun it would be a good thing but the north wind would terrorize that thin bark. But if I put it in a southern exposure it will break bud too early in the spring and get blasted by spring freezes. I can only grow them in a protected northeast to east cove. I have a Acer palmatum Red Dragon on the east so we'll see how it does. Generally protected east to southeast is the best exposure for anything where you're using plants in the upper part of your zone.

  • 7 years ago

    Here in Maryland, the core of the cold isn’t going to hit. More of a glancing blow. Not just because we are milder anyway, but even the departure from normal won’t be as severe.


    The cold has also backed off in the forecasts I see. Yesterday morning, it showed four days below freezing, three with highs in the low to mid 20s, and low temps in the upper single digits. Now it’s basically showing one really cold day, and then highs around freezing the days before and after that.


    We might hit mid single digits one night.


    Cold, but no big deal, even here in zone seven.


    We had colder weather in the first few days of January, 2018, and similar, but much longer duration cold in February, 2015.

    whaas_5a thanked hairmetal4ever
  • 7 years ago

    Looks like we will get at least one night if not two in the -25 to -30 range. Wednesday high around -15. Todays Paper says it will be the coldest air to hit MSP since 2004. The soil temp readings from the U of MN-St Paul from Friday are already a bit concerning. We‘re still forecasted to get 4-8” of desperately needed snow tonight.

    whaas_5a thanked pennlake
  • 7 years ago

    maackia, to keep your septic pipes thawed, you and your family keep drinking alot of beer.....


    Hair, yeah, Feb 2015 here had mornings -3 to 5 F much of Feb and even first week of March. Something like 4th coldest Feb since records started in 1890.

    whaas_5a thanked bengz6westmd
  • 7 years ago

    1982 for coldest and 1963 for coldest max.


    This cold air has no business hitting upper end of 5a.


    I agree with desperate need of snow.


    I actually don’t care much about the plants at this poi


    More my septic and dogs. They are from the south and one keeps getting stuck in the yard even with it being -9 with no wind! Lol



  • 7 years ago

    Upper 60's to low 70's in Okinawa,Japan this week.


    Frank



    whaas_5a thanked deltaohioz5
  • 7 years ago

    Good time to be there vs Ohio!


    Arizona is in my future

  • 7 years ago

    Normally I hate any and all snow but I know it's a necessity for insulation against the severe cold. So for a rare change I am okay with the snow preceding the 72 (or more) hours it will remain below zero starting tomorrow night. The snowpack has been only one or two inches nearly all winter. Guess I will find out this spring which cultivars I have started planting in recent years aren't as hardy as claimed.

    whaas_5a thanked mntreegrower
  • 7 years ago

    Picked up another 3-5" snow today.

    One more Polar blast on the way. Hitting the bottom for lows in Z3.

    The ZDE's will be able to correct their lists after this one. :-)

    Looks pretty good after that at least for the ten day forecast.

    Glad to have the snow with temps like this.


    whaas_5a thanked User
  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    After reading all this, went out and shoveled some snow over my not yet established Sciadopitys earlier today. -14F high on Wednesday.... Brutal.

    whaas_5a thanked Chad 5a
  • 7 years ago

    I'll be learning something about my Gleditsia triacanthos also.

  • 7 years ago

    Wednesday will be a furnace test. I sure hope mine passes.

    whaas_5a thanked maackia
  • 7 years ago

    Down to grass in several areas Including exit pipe to septic and then a few trees like Ginkgo.


    The wind is just insane here even after what looks like 6” of snow.


    -65 windshield possible on Wednesday - that gets a big WTF for my zone.


    sliver lining is that it returns to 30s this weekend

  • 7 years ago

    About 6" of snow overnight. Better than nothing before the deep freeze. Some forecasts still showing the potential for -30 2 nights this week. Then +39 on Saturday.

    whaas_5a thanked pennlake
  • 7 years ago

    Does bluegrass lawn provide much insulation?

    whaas_5a thanked L Clark (zone 4 WY)
  • 7 years ago

    Around here, if we don't get snow, the cold will many times kill the grass.

    whaas_5a thanked User
  • 7 years ago

    I see -27 for Tues and Wed night in Waterloo, WI. I'm more worried about my bathroom water pipes in my porous old farmhouse like Bill was talking about. Maybe this will kill some bugs.

    whaas_5a thanked nurseryman33
  • 7 years ago

    It's frrreezing, I wasn't sure about picea omorika hardiness in zone 3, maybe I'll find out

    Windchill values hitting - 51 Celsius tonight

    whaas_5a thanked Novice Gardener
  • 7 years ago

    Good luck with the dog, Ron. Thanks for trying to take care of her.

    whaas_5a thanked indianagardengirl
  • 7 years ago

    Ron good on you for trying to help. Amazing how many animal abusers are out there.


    One of my rescues thanks you and good luck!




  • 7 years ago

    Some impressive cold occurred. Some place called Mather, WI got to -43 and Illinois set an all-time record temperature of -38 in Mount Carrol. Wow!

    whaas_5a thanked L Clark (zone 4 WY)
  • 7 years ago

    We've had the coldest temps in a generation. Tomorrow will be better. I had a robin eating under some suet cakes. Poor thing.

    whaas_5a thanked maackia
  • 7 years ago

    Lane, are those windshield temps? I didn't see any air temps recorded at that level unless they are unofficial from this morning.


    Official low for me yesterday was -24 and -26 today. Windchill did hit -60. The image attached will depict how INSANE the wind was.


    As of noon today it finally warmed up to single digit subzero. So we've been at double digit subzero temps since Tuesday night around 8pm.


    Seems that stretch of zone 4b to 6a from MN to WI to IL really took the hit.


    The greatest deviation from extreme minimum annual average temp I saw was metro Chicago. Zone 6a hit -22. That would be equivalent to zone 4a hitting -42.




  • 7 years ago

    -37 F actual temp here this AM. -15 now.

    Wind chills were in the -60's in some parts of the state last night.

    We may still get some -20's next week but according to the ten day, the worst is over.

    whaas_5a thanked User
  • 7 years ago

    Your current weather situation in eastern US is starting to make headlines in european media now. Frost in Florida, snow in Atlanta and so on.

    whaas_5a thanked Huggorm
  • 7 years ago

    It was a relatively benign -2F in my backyard in zone 6b/7a, Howard County MD.

    whaas_5a thanked hairmetal4ever
  • 7 years ago

    Nice! The air temp in my attached garage was colder than that lol

  • 7 years ago

    We hit -33 F (not wind chill) last night here in Western Illinois, according to the local airport, beating the previous record. Very glad to have an unusually deep snow cover. It will be interesting to see this spring what made the cut and what couldn't handle it.

    50 F forecasted for Monday, what a roller coaster.

    whaas_5a thanked coniferbros
  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    I bottomed out at 2 above 0 in Zone 7a, NJ.

    My detached, loft, garage houses all sorts of tropicals (Citrus, palms and cycads). So far, so good. Temps have been above 30F.. I HATE this kind of cold!

    This coming Tuesday, above 60 F.!

    How crazy is that?!

    And there has been NO snow since before Winter actually began..., in mid November.

    I fully expect to see record-breaking, HEAT this coming growing season.

    whaas_5a thanked User
  • 7 years ago

    72 in Naha Okinawa. Not going home until February 19. Hope the weather is better in Ohio when we get home.


    Frank


    whaas_5a thanked deltaohioz5
  • 7 years ago

    Some parts of northern MN had colder air the morning of sunday the 27th. The town of Cotton reported -56f.


    Nothing really record breaking here but that wind wind was brutal.


    whaas_5a thanked pennlake
  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    Only -1 F Thursday morning here, even tho it was 0 F before going to bed in the evening. Sky was clear, little wind and ground snow-covered, so a bit odd didn't get lower.

  • 7 years ago

    saw that dog out there both wed. & thur. in 14 below

    she must have a spot for shelter

    have to talk to neighbor across creek ,,, he used to leave garage open when we had all those cats

    the dog goes off that way after eating

    ron

  • 7 years ago

    Beng my low was at around 2:30 am. I think the wind stirred up a bit between 3 and 6. It was 4 degrees when I got up at 6:30.

  • 7 years ago

    We have had between-10F and -15F the last three nights. Cold, but well within the realm of what we see every winter. I typically plant woodies for zone 4 since we get between -20F and -25F every few years and I have learned that if they aren’t hardy enough there is extensive damage.

    My sympathies to those of you in the Plains and Great Lakes region. Here is to hoping that the snow cover was sufficient.

  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    "My sympathies to those of you in the Plains and Great Lakes region. Here is to hoping that the snow cover was sufficient."


    I have a question about the value of snow cover. It seems a bit of a paradox as snow does protect the roots of plants, but doesn't extensive snow cover also cause temps to bottom out even lower at night and inhibit there rise in the day time. I have wondered about this. There has been NO snow cover in NJ/Zone 7 this year, all precipitation events occurred during warm periods of heavy rain followed by cold and drier air masses (the complete lack of snow cover is a bit unusual..., especially given its abundance in recent past winters).


  • 7 years ago

    The difference in temps is negligible for hardy plants in my opinion.


    For lower growing woody plants if they are buried their roots are safe and they are much less likely to see damage from air temps, winter sun and dry desiccating winter winds. I've certainly had conifers have lustrous green needles half way up the plant then transition to brown on the top half with the latter being exposed above the snow line. In addition many plants will regenerate growth from the roots.


    Smives eluded to this earlier in the post (at least its my interpretation of why he posted it). If you have such extreme temps early or late in the winter your cutting off the plants ability to uptake moisture through the roots so early in the season or so late when its desperately looking to replenish. Hence why snow cover is our best friend. Winter winds and sun are usually more damaging than solitary extreme temps if you have a long duration of frozen soil.


    If we don't see any more extremes and the soil starts to thaw in March I don't expect anything but minor twig and bud damage.


    Although I haven't had gardening experience with these solitary extremes like this year (-23, -24 and -26).



  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    " but doesn't extensive snow cover also cause temps to bottom out even lower at night and inhibit there rise in the day "

    To a certain extent. The temperature of snow is around 32F so while it doesn't pull our kind of cold down any amount, it can keep daytime temps subdued moderately.

    And that can act as a buffer, keeping things from warming too fast when they're expected to stay dormant.

    Feb. 1996, record highs were broken here (into the 80'sF) then returning to normal, killing plants that started growing during the 'heat wave'.