Well that’s just silly. Call him in just to slap him across the face before you fire him.

Hi Beth, I tried to use the grid on the camera to level bottom of countertop..

It doesn’t seem to matter if your photo is not level. I visually traced one row of tile horizontally across the field. There was a definite slant from peak to peak of the pattern. That would drive me batty. Do-over.

oh yes, you can see a definite slant.

it needs to redone. Have you spoken to him? Do NOT let him grout it.

read all the other things I wrote too and make sure he addresses those issues.

Make sure he uses the speed square when he tiles, to check as he goes.

how's the corner? I can barely see it. they almost looked matched up.

I think this is where the problem started. First tile was not installed straight:

Where walls meet:

Glad you all feel the same way. Will bring this up with the contractor/tiler tomorrow to settle the rework. Ugh was just looking forward to be one step closer to a finished project.

Acceptable?! HELL NO!

@Beth H. : That bookmatched corner. Wow! Will be using that to show him what I want when they reinstall the corner where the walls meet

There should be a grout line thickness space between the countertop and the bottom tile that is filled with color matched silicone, not grout.

yeah, that's not a good match up. at all.

with herringbone, you don't start in the corner. you start on one wall, in the middle, and work your way out, and around to the other wall. This way you're assured of continual match ups and symmetrical bottoms, tops, and ends.

I can already tell you he did it incorrectly. see how the left side tiles don't match the right side ends? tiles are diff lengths. If you start correctly in the middle and work out, each side will be a mirror image.

if he did each wall independently, or started in the corner, he's a goof ball.

you need an experienced tile setter w/this design.

I did a herringbone floor, this is how we started (see the blue tape on the one piece? You have to get a 45 degree measurement of that, run two lines on the floor or on the wall, and carefully line up the 45 tape measurement) that's how you start a herringbone.

this way you get perfectly even sides. see how each end piece at the wall is the same size?

I also just did an inlay in my kitchen w/zellige tiles. Same thing. we carefully started dead center and measured off the first tile. worked outwards. perfectly symmetrical

This is so interesting! Beth, when you install herringbone on two walls, do you start on the center of each wall? I love a herringbone pattern and suspected that it takes an experienced hand. This (unfortunately for the OP) is a great example of when/how things go wrong.

Were there 2 tile installers working independently? It seems very odd that one wall would be perfect and the other one 'off'...

@Beth H. :Thanks for the additional info. Will pass it along to the installer. i think this job can be saved by redoing the botched wall and starting with bookmatching the corner and ensuring a 45-degree angle.

@howistyle There was only one installer. Clearly inexperienced with the pattern...maybe started feeling more comfortable with it on the second (straight) wall?

hhowlett,,you could. It would take a lot of dry layout work to get both walls to match up perfectly though. I'd prob start on the most prominent wall, and then wrap the design around to the other wall (in her case, the sink wall) and just continue on w/the design. That would be the easiest and look the best. The far left end of the sink wall may not be a mirror image of the right side, but it should be close enough to work out ok.

Kristine, as a suggestion, I'd continue up to the ceiling. If you must stop where you have it, what are you using for the edging on top? a pencil liner? a Schluter metal edge is another alternative.

@Beth H. :Thought about going up the wall, but decided not to as the width on either side of the window is not the same. We used this metal edge piece:

UPDATE: Spoke with the contractor and tile setter this morning and they agreed it's off on the one side, but they don't know why or how to fix it. They say the tips of the tile are level, so they are worried if we take it all down on Wall 1 and reinstall the bottom row will be uneven.

HOW DO WE FIX THE INSTALLATION ON WALL 1?

following

Not acceptable. It's a re-do. The points of the herringbone pattern should point straight up. Tell them to rip it out and the additional material is on them.

I think we figured out what went wrong:

Oooooo ... that would drive me bonkers. I'd ask them redo it.

they have to rip off the entire wall. they can't 'fix it'.

secondly,,,look at these pics.

This photos shows what most people do. its wrong. you'll end up w/different end cuts on the sides.

NOPE:

I marked on this one to show them how to start it. take a 45 degree measurement of the end of the tile using a speed square. now move that line over to the left on the center line. see my solid black line? that should be on the center line. The dotted line is where all the subsequent tiles will join the pattern.

the bottom row tile cuts should look like this.

he needs to find center on the wall and start like I showed, following this bottom line diagram. (he can stick in the triangles after he's done.

btw, on this photo I noticed a lot of mortar issues. he needs to do a better job at cleaning off the thinset. I can also see faint scratch lines he's causing when he's wiping it off.

Also, have you pre-sealed your marble?

he's using white thinset yes?

your grout should be unsanded. please make sure those tiles are sealed before grouting. That's why doing them first, before they go on the wall, is recommended. seal only the tops, not the sides

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Sounds like they are willing to replace the crooked wall, just waiting to settle the details next week. They are receptive and we haven't paid a dime for the tile install and won't until we are happy.

@Beth H. : Thanks for your continued input! MATERIALS: Grout (Sanded/Unsanded? Not sure how that works), Mortar, Sealer (tile store said to seal before/after grout). REINSTALL: If they are only replacing Wall 1, where do you recommend they start: middle of wall or corner connecting two walls? I will be over his shoulder this next time around.

always unsanded for marble. marble scratches like crazy, so he needs to be careful during the install portion and wiping away excess mortar. (Mortar, or the Thinset, will have course grains in it. It's not like the unsanded grout. So when he sets his tile and he has oozing up between the joints, he needs to be careful when wiping that off. that's how you get those fine swirls of scratches. If he's really good and uses the exact amount of thinset, he won't have oozing. and oozing, if not cleaned up correctly, will dry in those joints. Now when you go to grout, the grout won't be able to get all the way in, or you may see dried portions of the mortar peek through the grout. this is why those joints needs to be kept free and clean of any 'oozing' thinset. )

Verify that he's using White thinset. (like Versabond or something)

Sealer- for mine, I used Sealer Choice Gold. I gave each tile (front only) a wiping of the sealer before they went on the wall. it absorbs quickly, so I might have done 2-3 coats of sealer. Follow directions of whatever sealer you use. Once the tiles go on the wall, if they're sealed, it will be much easier to wipe away any mortar or grout residue.

If your tiles are honed, you have to make sure the sealer is OK for honed marble. some aren't.

these are two other brands that work well. read the label to make sure it fits your type of marble.

where should they start? Well, they are going to have to draw a bunch of lines if they want to make sure they line up correctly w/the corner of the other wall. Honestly, I'd be less concerned w/that since corners can be hidden.

This wall is a big focal point. I'd start center on this one. (which is to the left of the middle of the stove, yes?)

he should chalk off two parallel center lines (one for center, and one for where the 45 line of the tile you're using is (like shown above w/the tape marks)

then he should run a line horizontal that shows where he will join up w/the tiles in the corner.

Are those corner tiles at a tru 45? if so, it shouldn't be too hard to match them. if they are slightly off, then the 45 on the new wall won't match exactly. Running the horizontal lines will let him know that he's staying on track as he's working outward from the center.

I'd prob start center but work the first bottom row to the left to see how the match up looks.

Havent read all input...but i would question using the same installer again..you shouldn’t have the responsibility of training the installer...

The installer may have legal rights to an attempt to make it right.

I got dizzy just looking at it. It’s a huge fail, so no, you’re not being too picky. I like your analysis of the error too. Best of luck getting it fixed.

Kristine:

Check your countertops for level. When they do the do-over, have them place a level continuous shim, maybe two pieces of plastic laminate, on the countertop. Lay the tile on top of the shim, grout, and pull the shim last. Fill the gap with color matched silicone.

Now you have the TCNA required caulk joint between plane changes which will look and perform well for decades or more instead of the nearly un-caulkable dirt catching joint you have now.

To me the cabinets look crooked too ..perhaps another tile idea would be better ...?

Thank you all for your input! I will update once we get this all "straightened out" lol.

Kristine, I think there may be another issue: in your 3rd set of pictures, top picture, the 4th & 5th tile down from the stop line looks like they are either narrower on one end or slightly off-kilter. It is really hard to tell because it is out of alignment. I am glad that you are making them fix it. Horrible job. Sent someone who did not know what they were doing. Shame on them.

Beth, OMG. I learned so much about tiling this morning. Thank you so much for the indepth and easy to understand writeup! I am saving this as well as bookmarking. SO GOOD!

This problem is why math is important in everyday life. The base should be an isosceles right triangle. You all intuitively know it; now you know what it's called.

Ugh, this is why, even though I'm a busy general contractor with a good team of subcontractors, I never let anyone do tile work but me. What is truly bizarre about this installation is how much extra "work" it would be to mess up an installation this badly. I've done loads of herringbone installations and you will know almost immediately if your first cuts (the ones abutting the counter) aren't 45 degrees. Because, if one side of the tile was cut accidentally at, say, 40 degrees, when you set up to cut the other angle you'd have to re-set the saw at 50 degrees to compensate. And the guy didn't notice this right away??? Like I can't even comprehend how this could happen. Look at the little triangular pieces, the smallest ones touching the counter, on the crooked wall. You can plainly see they aren't even close to being right triangles. How could you not catch on that something was f****d up when you saw that? And every single tile at the edges had to be deliberately cut with these stupid off-angles. Somebody had to work really hard to mess up that spectacularly.

A couple of herringbones I've done...

I don't have anything of use to offer (and @Beth H. : is amazing!), but I just want to say that herringbone, done right, is absolutely dreamy. @Home Reborn - gorgeous work! I think I swooned a little...

You have installers working with a product they dont understand it will be a fail the 2nd time around also. Probably offshore cheap marble and they are mounted different on every sheet.

Buying products that fits the projects budget is a key issue. People today see these pictures and the cheap kind of products and then dont understand why they dont look right.

Your installer has no idea how to install marble tile. The the will be stained and scratched when done besides the pattern. They have no clue how to wrap a herringbone pattern. I will wager that its premixed thniset and will easily pop right off.

I can bet that a REAL tile installer would be charging 2x's what your paying to install a marble backsplash. We haven't even gotten into the look one sheet is a different color deal yet. Every tile setter make your homeowners sign a waiver with marble.

Ask them if they want out of the job. Either buy a material on budget or within your installers range of ability or hire a real tile artisan and be ready to pay for quality work and product.

Any evidence this is a licensed tile contractor? If so maybe let them regroup and redo with their better skilled setter, but otherwise they're in over their heads & terminate without payment.

In Florida, one of the most strict licensing states, tile setters and countertop and cabinet installers are specifically exempted from licensing law.

Kristine:

Swami Joe knows your future.

How did it turn out? Did the contractor fix his mistake? Also, what tile is it that you used to create your herringbone. I love it

That’s bad: it needs to be redone.

Kristine, that actually turned out very nice. I love it! ( I wish they would have used the busier replacement tiles off to the right instead of right over the stove) But I actually like the marble and the design you chose. Doing a white subway would have looked like every other white/gray kitchen

one caveat, your lights are hung a tad too high. 30-36" is usually the space from countertop to the bottom of the light.

It looks lovely. Enjoy your home.

Much better, I so glad it worked out for you. You have a very nice kitchen, enjoy

Love your counter tops...

What is the marble tile you used, and what size? Looks beautiful!

Hi im actually having the same problem rn. the grout is already in is there any saving this tile? can the beckerboard possibly be taken off and just moved a little?

Hi im actually having the same problem right now is there a way to save the tile and beckerboard? tile is already grouted.

HU 31399,,,,, you need to start you own post w/your own pics. this post is 4yrs old and no one but those who have commented on this will see it.

off the bat w/o seeing what you have, no. the backerboard can't be cut and shifted.

why was it grouted if it was crooked? who did the tile work? have you discussed it w/them? have you paid in full?

too many questions that you haven't answered to get proper help. start your own post, pics, and I'll see it