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Is this a non-removable hinge pin?

4 years ago

Hello,


I am on a repair spree before winter sets in :-)


I was trying to do hinge adjustment for an exterior door due to misalignment but in the process noticed that two screws are missing for one of the hinges. One of the screw holes on the hinge is not in alignment with hole in the jamb. So, I was trying to remove the hinge and correct the problem (You would not believe how many hours I spent on youtube learning the terms and the process as I am a newbie :-) )


I have been having real hard time to remove the hinge pin. Is this a non-removable hinge pin? Can someone please help me? Is there an identifying feature to a non-removable vs. removable hinge pin?






Comments (31)

  • 4 years ago

    My guess would be your problem is rust and/or paint

  • 4 years ago

    Get a screwdriver the size of the pin, set it on the bottom side of the pin, and give it a good whack up. But, to adjust a door out of alignment usually doesn't require removing and relocating a hinge. A typical scenario of a door, which 99% chance was initially installed right, is that settlement, screws pulling out from the hinges, or expansion of the wood is causing the "misalignment."

    If the other 3 screws are in and old, and the missing screw is not aligned with a hole, no big deal. Put a new 3" screw into the missing screw hole that goes into fresh meat of the jack stud.

  • 4 years ago

    1. A "non-removable" hinge pin is held in place by a small set screw threaded through the side of the barrel, and, if you unscrew it, the pin can be removed. The set screw is located so that it can only be seen and accessed when the door is in an open position. Hard to tell if one is present based on the somewhat fuzzy photos and all the paint slopped on the hinges.

    2. Those hinges are incorrect for the door as is evidenced by the screws that are very close to the edge. Someone took a too-wide hinge and cut it down. I'd install new, appropriately-sized hinges to deal with the problem.

    Kiran K thanked kudzu9
  • 4 years ago

    Edge of hinge is hidden by weatherstripping.

    But, it doesn't look mortised into door slab so could be a rehung one.

  • 4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    I called a door professional whom i paid by the hour and he informed me that there is not much he can do about missing screws in the hinges and it should be fine as far as load bearing is concerned. And he mentioned that hinge pins cannot be removed as they are "commercial" hinges.....


    Thank you all for your suggestions! I appreciate that.

  • 4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Thanks all. I have a question.

    Door misalignment is causing cold drafts and situation is exacerbated by it being an exterior door.

    Professional today did all he could. He got lot of tools (tool to adjust hinges as well) and spent around an hour trying to resolve the misalignment. Finally he could not correct the alignment and said that it might possibly be due to sagging wall? He did not have correct screws to fix the missing hinge screws. He readjusted the weatherstripping to meet the door but unfortunately cold drafts are still persisting. He thought that hinges cannot be removed because of it being a commercial condominium door?

    Do you think I should get a second opinion and is it worth it? Would somehow installing new set of hinges would resolve the misalignment?

    Can you please share your opinion?

    Thank you!


  • 4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    That amount of gap at the top of the door can't be explained solely by hinge alignment or a missing screw (especially given that the door appears to still be relatively tight to the jamb at the top left) -- either the door itself has sagged (what does it look like at the bottom?) , it was planed down to prevent sticking, and/or the door frame (and perhaps the whole wall) has racked or shifted...

  • 4 years ago

    Thanks Tim. Enclosed are the pictures of the bottom part of the door. If it is due to whole wall, I need to again involve HOA and the city....I am not ready to fight the fight :-(


    If it is wall, how did the home inspector and city also not catch it?! Disappointing.







  • 4 years ago

    The wall probably shifted and the door is wracked in the opening. A home inspector would not catch it as it happens in older buildings all the time and really not much can be done about it. Realistically it is not considered a defect, dangerous or something that must be repaired. It is an inconvenience that's all..

  • 4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Thanks @millworkman. Unfortunately, I need to repair it as it is becoming uncomfortably cold when the temperature is dropping below 50 outside. I have already spent decent amount trying to fix it.

    So, do you think even if I remove the hinges, tighten or install missing screws, issue will persist?

  • 4 years ago

    You are in a condo but with a door to exterior rather than an interior hallway? Is the gap so large that the top of door is below the door stop and it's weatherstripping mounted next to that door stop, which is letting in air (so you can see light from the hallway/outside)? What does the city or HOA have to do with your door maintenance? I don't think you answered from before, but does the door rub on the bottom corner now? Does the latch and strike plate still line up? Do you have a full frontal photo that shows the entire gap around the whole door at one time? Can you use something (like a flat bar) to lever up on the bottom corner of door and does that action make the door move up a bit?

  • 4 years ago

    Yes, we need a picture of the whole door. From what you've shown, the uneven gap appears to be only at the top -- the gap at the bottom appears to be even to my eye, and the sides seem evenly spaced all the way down. What material is the door made out of (wood, metal, fiberglass)?

  • 4 years ago

    @Tim Allen @3onthetree:


    Yes, door is to the exterior and the gap is large enough that the top of the door is below door stop.


    Weatherstripping was not snug with the door but the professional tried to move the weatherstripping so that it at least tries to fit snugly with the door now but it is not 100% due to misalignment. It is the aluminium/vinyl weatherstripping that needs to be screwed to the frame.


    Door used to rub on the bottom corner and there developed a crack in the outer panel of the door which is a metal sheet. He put in a couple of screws and patched it up (I included picture below). Door seems to have a metal panel cover with wooden core?


    Weatherstripping is making it difficult for me to get a full frontal photo but I tried to include photos anyways.


    I am sorry if the pictures are not helping you but I will try to get some more pics tomorrow.








  • 4 years ago

    Sorry, I said "frontal" but was meaning to still see from the inside to compare the gaps around the entire door in the same picture. I do see the seal is a little lower on the bottom, but can't tell if that's an adjustable one. I'm not sure how a sag in the floor can cause the hinge jamb to lean in creating the gap at the opposite top. Floors sag over a large area, and slowly over time, so the strike jamb would also have sagged. I also don't know what a "door professional" is, but if he looked at the hinge condition, they were tight to the door slab and jamb, and the condition of the door slab is good then I can't tell what happened without being there.

  • 4 years ago

    Thanks @3onthetree. Yes, the seal on the bottom is screwed. I will unscrew it and then share the picture of the door. Professional had to "adjust" the latch to accommodate the change he made to weatherstripping. Essentially weatherstripping had to be screwed closer to the door to make full contact and that resulted in us not being able to lock the door. So, he shaved off some of the latch opening to be able to lock the door.


    I really want to get to the bottom of the root cause. I believe even the previous owner tried resolving the issue without much luck but that is just my guess.

  • 4 years ago

    So, I removed hinges and took them to home depot to get a new ones. Home depot technician said that those hinges are from 1920s and they do not have them and need to go to a specialty hardware store.


    Now when I tried to put the hinges back on, one of the screws broke and got stuck in the hole. Now I cannot remove it or replace it with a new one. Now the sagging is more pronounced.


    Does anyone have any suggestions to fix the hole and put the screw back on, please?

  • 4 years ago

    Get proper hinges and use new screws. I doubt there is another solution with the situation you have.

  • 4 years ago

    thank you @kudzu9 but the screw got stuck in the jamb hole. What can I do about that?

  • 4 years ago

    1. If you get new hinges, the holes will likely be in different locations.

    2. If you have a stub of screw sticking out (when the hinges aren't in place) you should be able to clamp a Vise-Grip on the stub and twist it out, or use a Dremel tool to grind it flush.

    The screw isn't a big issue; the issue is putting in proper hinges with proper, possibly longer, screws so that the door is supported. I suggest you get help with this from a handy friend or a professional as new hinges will likely require routing new mortises, and I have a feeling that you may not have all the tools and skills to get the result you want.


  • 4 years ago

    thank you @kudzu9 that makes quite a lot of sense.

  • 4 years ago

    Steel door and a steel buck. You are not mortising new hinges. Should have made provisions to change the whole magilla or left well enough alone as you may have a large mess on your hands now especially being you have broken off screws now.

  • 4 years ago

    Thanks @millworkman :-(

  • 4 years ago

    Is both the door and the jamb steel? If so, unlikely that those hinges are a hundred years old.

  • 4 years ago

    It looks like you need to lift the hinge side frame. This will close the gap at the top and align the catch on the lockset. The hinges are fine. See if you can get a flat bar or similar under the threshold directly under the frame and shim it up. Make sure the hinge screws aren't penetrating the framing. Get a composite shim and force it under the threshold, again, directly under the frame. Once the frame is lifted and the door is in the correct position secure hinges and put a couple of longer screws in the top hinges to penetrate the framing.

  • 4 years ago

    If for some reason that doesn't work get yourself a hinge adjustment tool. When your done you can give it to your handyman for Christmas...

    https://www.fastcap.com/product/knuckle-bender

  • 4 years ago

    Thanks @ksc36. Could you please explain what do you mean by "See if you can get a flat bar or similar under the threshold directly under the frame"


    Are you saying that I should unscrew the threshold and then place the shim on top of the frame or did you mean just place a shim on top of the threshold so that I can lift the door and then adjust hinges?

  • 4 years ago

    First we need to know if this is a steel door, with steel frames and "trim". Is the door installed in a masonry opening or wood framed opening? Is the floor concrete slab? We need better pics as yours are too close in to see the "big picture".

  • 4 years ago

    @ksc36 yes both the door and frame are steel. I was able to put magnet on both the door and frame. What is a trim? Yes, it is a concrete slab.


    I will try to get pictures as soon as I can.

  • 4 years ago

    Meant to also say the top corner of the door would catch the door frame when trying to