Its such a shame RVR has such a problem with inventory management. I'm truly puzzled how its become such a difficult thing for them.

I'll probably make a few cuttings of 'Grandma's Pink' for distribution next spring (or maybe this fall)

It doesn't get much better than this. Most of the Austin roses can only dream of performing as well as 'Grandma's Pink'. Oh, and another thing: this is an excellent cut flower, lasting in a vase for up to 10 days.

There were three issues which prevented Grandma's Pink from succeeding...lack of scent and limited distribution with none of the Austin media push. Had it enjoyed the massive advertising and distribution the Austin machine possesses, it might have overcome the lack of scent and been grown all over. That's why most of the Moore roses are dancing so close to extinction. If you're searching for one of his creations, your best bet is finding it in a garden where it hasn't been culled, killed or the gardener him/herself hasn't passed, like this one.

What Kim says is quite accurate. Ralph Moore didn't have nearly the same ability to market and push his creations, and that is especially true in the last decade of Sequoia Nursery. He was far more focused on doing as much new work as he could with what time he had left.

And its also true that - for many people - a rose that lacks a good fragrance is only "half a rose"; incomplete. Well, as much as I feel the same way about many roses (how many of us would bother to grow 'Fragrant Cloud' if it wasn't intensely scented?), this is one rose I consider vastly superior to most of the Austin catalog in every way except that one - its mild fragrance. If you can set that one thing aside, 'Grandma's Pink' will probably exceed your expectations, supplying bushel loads of cut flowers that last and last. Very few other roses bloom in such astonishing volumes as this one does.

Just one of MANY benefits of breeding with minis.

Knockouts have zero scent, and they’re EVERYWHERE! 🙄 Another example of marketing machinery. Grandma’s Pink is total eye candy!

Carol...."eye candy" is the exact right description!!! I so agree...total eye candy!!!

Holy Hannah...absolutely fabulous, fabulous rose!!!

I agree that GP is spectacular. The fact it makes a good cut rose is another plus. It's SO good that I might take the (gigantic) chance and order (the purported) GP from Rogue Valley.

Someone talk me back from the edge, please! lol

Oops, I just nudged you, @fig_insanity Z7b E TN!

I'm new here, but could someone enlighten me about why ordering from RVR would be considered taking a "gigantic" chance? Thank you.

@Meg-zone8aOR Welcome to the rose forums. First of all, my comment about RVR was (somewhat) tongue in cheek. Most of us DO take the chance on RVR for some of the more rare offerings, just because no one else carries them! The reason it is a little risky is that RVR has a problem with inventory control. In other words, there's a chance you might not get the actual rose you order, but another one which is mislabeled as your desired rose. It's not intentional on RVR's part, but the chances are greater than with some other vendors. It's still not a deal breaker. Many of the surviving antique/heritage rose sellers are mom/pop affairs, some with no other employees. And they do what they do out of love, certainly not for love of profit, lol. So we try to overlook all but the most egregious mistakes. Plus, Janet, RVR's owner, is quite elderly and has been supplying us rose junkies with our "fixes" for many years. She's like family.

RVR is a marvelous source for hard (impossible!)-to-find rarities. For many cultivars, they are the ONLY source. That's part of the problem: they offer so many different roses (into the hundreds) that mistakes are bound to happen, either in propagating, labeling, or handling. You take a chance that *this* year this particular rose is mislabeled, whereas *next* year it might be correct, and another one is the victim.

It's just one of the risks we take to get the roses we love.

EDIT: I'll still take any rose Paul propagates over any other source, just because I KNOW it's correct, lol.

Thank you so much for answering my question, I just ordered 7 bands from RVR (I am entirely new to attempting to grow OGRs, I didn't have space for roses before a recent move). I guess I'll keep my fingers crossed that they're actually the varieties I hoped for! I agree, RVR has an amazing selection of roses that don't seem to be available to purchase anywhere else.

Wow, Grandma’s Pink is gorgeous! I’d love to try her sometime.
Abseraka, for instance, last fall I ordered Madame Joseph Schwartz from RVR. This spring when she started blooming, I realized I don’t have MJS at all… it’s a China looking rose and white… maybe Ducher? But the rest I got from RVR seem to be accurate, so I’m not complaining. They all survived and are thriving and I’m happy.

You're lucky. Reading the RVR complaints on Facebook rose pages, there are some who have purchased MANY roses from them in the past several years and at least one who states over HALF of her orders have been mis named. No, thanks. Particularly that there is no one there who has ever cared to learn what they sell so going to them for help identifying what they sent you is fruitless. Searching here and browsing the Facebook rose pages will perfectly demonstrate that.

I have had some wonderful mistakes from RVRs in addition to the correctly named. I figure them out eventually usually and that can be fun too. Of course, it would be great to solve the inventory problems too.

Oh goodness, now I'm worried. I ordered several shade-tolerant varieties for areas with partial shade...now I'm hoping I didn't just plant a "mystery" rose that won't do well there. 🤞

If you buy more than 3 or 4 roses from RVR, the odds are very high that at least one will be mislabeled. Its truly puzzling how their inventory system has failed so badly, for many years. If a nursery staff actually knows their products, errors would eventually get corrected (hey Errloom, remember "La Ville de Bruxelles"??), but it seems the RVR inventory problem persists year after year. To be fair, with once-bloomers, once you've introduced an error, it can be difficult to catch when the plants you ship out likely don;t bloom before they get sold. Most unfortunate.

But as Sheila has pointed out, RVR introduces a mystery component, and it can be a pleasure to solve a mystery, so..... We are a curious species: we enjoy solving a mystery, but we dislike uncertainty. Those two conditions are close cousins, and yet we tend to have diametrically opposed reactions to them in practice.

Does grammas pink have any scent,light? Or absolutely none at all?

Does RVR replace mislabelled roses? Seems that would be expensive for them if they're mislabelled frequently. I don't know how or why they would keep that up.

Burling says she doesn't offer Grandma's Pink.

@Alana8aSC 'Grandma's Pink' has only the very faintest of scents - a very "modern" scent that is typical of many cut flower varieties. You have to use your imagination a bit to be able to say you detect its fragrance.

And no - Burling doesn't have it. I may offer her cuttings if she's interested in carrying it.

Okay, I don't mind faintly scented, as long as it has some, the humidity might bring out more. I might try it next year. Especially with such a high recommendation ☺️

Holy moley.!I am stunned at this rose. If I could have a rose with half that many blooms of that quality and beauty I would be seriously thrilled. I am very, very intrigued.

Wow, Paul, amazing!

@User,

I guess I will just have to embrace the mystery! I'll let you guys know once they bloom,

I ordered Armide, Sydonie, Treasure Trove, Hettie, Walferdange, Bubble Bath & Bouquet Parfait.

I just ordered two Von Abrams roses from RVR that weren't available anywhere else. One of them, Red Ruffles, was obviously the wrong rose; they sent me a pink miniature instead of a dark red floribunda. But in their defense, they immediately replaced it with what looks like it could be the correct plant. So I would not avoid ordering from them, in spite of their issues they seem open to sorting things out.

Paul - this rose should win Rose of the Year!! I'm stunned by its beauty and the amount of blooms. WOWZA!!

The prettiest!

Perhaps it would have done better commercially if it were named something other than ’Grandma’s Pink’. That’s not a great name

Far better than 'Weight Watcher Success'!

I believe the biggest obstacle to getting it distributed was the modest size of Sequoia Nursery - the sole entity distributing it - and the fact that Sequoia didn't have a big, expensive promotional engine behind it. In fact, in its later years, Sequoia barely marketed at all. They produced a very modest color catalog that was "quaint" by modern standards, and there was barely a paragraph written to accompany the postage stamp sized photo that displayed the variety. Sequoia probably produced less than 100 plants of 'Grandmas Pink' annually, perhaps far less.

So comparing its relative success in the market to varieties promoted by an entity like David Austin Roses is something like comparing a bicycle made in 1965 to a Tesla S.

I love the name!

And, what Paul relates is what the "little guys" always battle. When there were actual, REAL rose companies doing introductions, where Armstrong would take on Renae to flesh out their catalog until Cl Pinkie came along (they owned Cl Pinkie's patent, so that's the rose they put all of their might behind) and displaced it. They repeated that performance when they introduced Sequoia's Shadow Dancer until their Fourth of July was ready. It was the same situation. Sequoia gave Wayside Gardens "exclusives" on Linda Campbell, Topaz Jewel, Red Fairy and a few others over the years. At least that got those roses out into nurseries, big box stores and gardens. When those businesses disappeared, it was up to Sequoia, run by a nonagenarian who took a very hands-off approach to the actual operation of the business side for many years and his two main people who literally did everything necessary to operate and maintain the business. There wasn't money for marketing and there were no longer any other businesses out there to market for them.

Grandma's Pink is a good enough name to me. Connotes old fashioned , or OGR look.

Well Paul, I'm excited to have a plant of Golden Century on its way to my garden from you. And now I'm wondering if there's any updates on Grandma's Pink. Have you successfully propagated any of these little marvels and will there be any up for grabs this coming spring?

@judijunebugarizonazn8 I didn't propagate 'Grandma's Pink' this year - there was very little interest in the variety so I skipped it. Sorry.

judijunebug - I am just curious about your comment that the Madame Joseph Schwartz you got from RVR is wrong - "a china looking rose, and white". MJS is, of course, totally white most of the time, with a pale pink flush in the middle of some blooms sometimes. Are you still sure the rose you got is not MJS? Just wondering...

Re Granma's Pink - that certainly is remarkable. Personally, I don't mind roses with little scent - many of my beloved tea roses have only a slight, not very appealing scent.

Jackie

That’s ok, Paul. Just thought it was worth checking. If you ever do produce a few plants to sell sometime, I’d really love to try one.

Well Jackie, a picture is worth a thousand words. I’ll let you decide. I still think mine may be Ducher. To me, this does not look like MJS. I’m ok with whatever it is as it’s a happy bush, always in bloom.

I ordered Grandma's Pink from RVR not last year but I think the year before. It is not a spectacular plant yet but needs a decent location. My plant was crowded out by some ageratum but is still alive. I propagated it and have two other plants of it. Roots easily.

For me Mme. Joseph Schwartz often has ivory/ cream blooms with a pink blush on the edges. Is not stark white much.

Ducher

My tea/china with the white blooms never has even a hint of pink blush, even in cool weather. The blooms are quite white in the heat of summer and creamy white when it’s cool. Your MSJ is decadent, Erasmus. My Duchess de Brabant has powdery mildew about 8 months out of the year here, so I suppose if my bush was an MJS, it would also suffer from mildew since it’s a sport of the Duchess. However, my white blooming bush has no mildew issues. Your Grandma’s Pink is pretty as well, but hasn’t measured up to Paul’s plant yet. Maybe it will get there in time? I’m normally pretty hung up on fragrance but that rose doesn’t need to smell good to make me want it.

Your white rose, Judi, does look like my Ducher.

Judi, We hardly get any mildew here so I can't comment on MSJ's susceptibility, but you are probably right since your Duchesse gets it. I don't blame my Grandma's Pink plant at all for not doing very well....I really think it's the location. I plan to move it. Just saying I think RVR has their Grandma's Pink plants correctly labelled if I can generalize from mine.

@mosesmoses Have you ever considered taking cuttings of Roun'toitRoun'toit? It seems the same to let such a great rose disappear. I'm fascinated now.

erasmus_gw, how is your GP now?

I took a chance and ordered it from RVR a couple months ago. I'd love to have this rose. Fingers crossed it isn't mislabeled.

@Jena Ithaca, NY 6a/6b

That’s so exciting that you will have a Grandmas Pink! What a wonderful rose! She’s on my list for next yeat! I don’t see any available now. RVRs seems ti be only supplier-sold out.

Erasmus & User, I t woukd be winderful to hear how your Grandma’s Pink does this season?

I also got one last fall, Jena. I’m pretty excited to see how it grows in my garden! It’s just a bitty little thing now, but looks healthy and happy.

Judi, so exciting! I never get over the pleasure and wonder of watching plants develop from infantile twigs and seeds into majestic beasts!

Kitty, we can root a cutting for you once mine is big enough! (Provided RVR sends the right rose, haha!).

Jena,

Thank you! You are very kind! First, enjoy it! It will be a baby rose this season. By second year it will probably flourish. I often see 2nd year , own-root roses, do really well in our climate.! It is an amazing blooming rose.

Protect it when next winter comes. It may be kinda small. I put burlap on my first year small roses over winter which keeps warm small canes. My first year baby Japanese & European roses look like they made it through this freezing winter with mostly green canes. I wish I even put burlap on my 2 year old roses for winter. Last winter was a cold one.

I look forward to seeing you in June after ai choose all the roses to dig up. This week is warm and I begin clean-up. tomorrow. It’s going to be a beautiful spring! I’m so excited about digging up roses, redesigning beds, and plantning new roses! It is going to be a beautiful seasin for your new gardens! Great to hear from you!

Kitty, lovely to hear from you as well! I’ve had a contract job the past three months which has been intense, but I just switched into a milder job this week and the timing is perfect because I have so much dormant pruning/clean up/winter gardening to do!

It’s unfortunate that the first winter for most of my roses at the new house was harsher than normal. I’m glad I panicked and dug almost all of the dahlias. I’ve been resisting the urge to assess allll of the roses for survival yet, but I did check some of the small roses from High Country and they all have green stems, so I’m cautiously optimistic! I’ve never ordered from RVR before, so I’m not sure how their bands compare in size—Grandma’s Pink may require additional care.

Are you still creating new garden blueprints?! I thought you had everything mapped out (I was SO impressed. The nitty gritty of my gardening plans is always in flux). I am halfway through a detailed list of plants that need to be moved this season and where new plants are going. I have plenty of space, but any garden expansion requires deer fencing, which is a headache. I’m trying to fence in the woods and yard myself, bit by bit, as money and time allows, but in the meantime I’ve used everything from welded wire to stacks of bush trimmings around garden beds.

I hope all of your roses have weathered the winter! And good luck with cleanup and pruning!