I had a Kenmore FL for 10 years that I was happy with, although the capacity at 2.7 cu was not sufficient for me. My LG had a 3.5 or was it 3.7 cu capacity but it never wanted to spin with a full load. I am content with our current SQ TL, but I would explore a FL again when the time comes to replace it. If I found one that had a water heater and a 4.0 cu capacity, I would probably be thrilled with it. martinca you have some great people here who will give you solid advice; I am very interested in seeing which washer you select.

“ martinca you have some great people here who will give you solid advice;“ For sure, armjim , and cannot overstate my apprecistion to all. I am down to two…I think!… choices, both Whirlpool front loaders:

1. The 4.5 model, an Energy Star which will be water stingy.:(

2) The 5.0 which is not only bigger, but more importantly, not an energy star.

How can I not buy from Costco with to their unbeatable 90 day return and two year warranty…right?

But( always a but) they only offer the 4.5 energy star model.

What would you do?

Lastly…ha!.. I can find no mention of the important onboard heater. I assume thry both have it, but specs do not mention it.

Ok, you’re, almost rid of me 🥴

I am no longer a fan of the WP Corporation. They now own Maytag and KitchenAid among other brands. The quality is a far cry from the storied history of these brands. Our kitchen is full of KitchenAid appliances, all TOL (we were building the house in 2017 and believed it was worth investing in what we thought was the best). We have had some type of problem with all but our Wine cooler and the vent hood. I will say our dishwasher is the best performing dishwasher I have ever owned, but we had a service call on it in the first year. I had to replace the middle rack materials this past Spring. Our wall oven was replaced under warranty, and the slide in range's oven and the wall oven are terribly calibrated. We like using all of these things but it is very disappointing to have had so many problems.

Is the Costco warranty 2 years in addition to the manufacturer warranty? That helps for some peace of mind if so.

I HATE front loaders. Speed Queen top loader. Clothes are super clean

@armjim I agree. We bought a standup freezer by whirlpool. Didn't even last 5 years before it stopped maintaining the temperature. It was just replaced 2 days ago with a GE. We had a GE in our garage at our previous house. We had it for 15 years with no issues. When we moved we gave it to my sister and she had it in her garage for an additional few years.

IF a front load model has Sanitize w/Oxi, it has no onboard heater. The panel cycle option should be Sanitize and/or Allergiene. Those cycles assure very hot washes.

Very Last Question! Whirlpool 5.0 , no energy star vs. WP 4.5 WIth energy star. Is tne water difference enough to make a marked difference in cleaning?

Need the specific model numbers for comparison of features and details.

>>> IF a front load model has Sanitize w/Oxi, it has no onboard heater.

True with my SQ FL. I knew that before I bought it. Calling it Sanitize is bogus, IMO. However, It does not dumb down the HOT setting for any of the cycles.

5.0 Cu. Ft. Front Load Washer with Quick Wash Cycle

Model: WFW6605MW

Model: WFW8620HWWhirlpool 4.5 cu. ft. Front Load Washer with Quick Wash Cycle

Item 1714032 Model WFW5605MW

BIG thanks for looking at this!!!! believe both have heaters onboard, which

may have bigger impact than water amount?

Both have a Sanitize option that doesn't reference oxi. Both have a Steam Clean option which requires a heater. Both show the EnergyStar logo on the Energy Guide documents. The smaller capacity model is estimated 20 kWh / $3 less per year (at a national average rate of $0.14/kWh) than the larger model, an insignificant difference.

User manuals 20 years ago referenced a specific temperature reached for the sanitize cycle. Temp points are rarely any longer referenced so manufacturers don't have to support a target temperature per the documentation.

The best way to confirm a heating element if there's any doubt on a given model of any brand is search-out parts diagrams but sometimes diagrams can't be found. Both of your WP choices have it.

This is my Maytag.

I love it. Cleans well, no odor. A true Sanitize cycle is a must for me.

LG has been making some of the best-rated and most durable front load washers for over a decade, at least. I'm a big fan, and when I bought this house I immediately replaced the Samsung pair here with an LG pair. I will never own a top loader again (for longer than it takes for my front loader to be delivered). I also love the extra space provided by stacking them, and I like that I only have to bend over for one machine if they're stacked (rather than for both). They all have on-board heaters.

Buy an LG

LG makes a very good compact FL washer that i would have bought (for half the price of my SQ) if it had a pedestal option. Alas, it does not and a pedestal is mandatory for me.

Well, I got too excited seeing the WP 5.0 hadn’t the energy star rating so might provide more water. Nope, it carries the HE label instead: same thing/different name. I just cannot fathom how the newer washers with 80% less water…80%!!…can do a decent job. Seemingly some do. Since I want a larger FL, and won’t pay $2500 for a SQ, it’s down to WP , Maytag and LG as both got the most positive reviews . Thanks to De Wayne for info re WP being American made with better service, expect I’ll go that route,

I cannot believe how hard its been to decide on a …WASHER..!!

i am so appreciative of the pros on here, and to all who contribute their knowledge and experience.

I have had my Bosch FL washer for over 17 years & I have loved every minute. Never had all the problems people complained about. I would never get a toploader again. A few months ago it started quitting during the cycle. I unplugged it & got it to go again. Last Sunday it did it again & i headed to my appliance store Monday & bought the Electrolux 7637 pair & they will be delivered on Wednesday. I know it's not everyone's first choice right now, but my store does not sell LG & I value their repair service. Some appliance stores around here have quit servicing even their own appliances. I have gone to this store for 40 years. It has an onboard heater. Manual states 152 for Sanitize & 131 for Allergen. Doesn't say if it dumbs down other temps, but if I can up the temp when I want, I will be happy. It has too many bells & whistles, but I can't wait to get it. Good luck on your decision!

Sounds like you made a nice choice Cadyren. Several of the upper end models of Electrolux washers of which yours is one have a feature called a recirculating pump. This particular pump brings water up from the bottom of the washing machine and pours it over the clothes. While most all modern front load washing machines are high-efficiency, and do not use nearly the water washing machines once did, I like this recirculating pump feature because more of the water that does get used saturates the clothes More heavily and this might explain why many people who have Electrolux washers claim that their clothes get cleaner or as clean as some of the other well-known brands. I cannot say the same for all of Electrolux products and their dryers do not get lots of love necessarily, when reading over reviews. But when it comes to front load washing machines, I think the Electrolux offerings use their limited water volumes better than many.

I found the exact opposite with my Electrolux. The clothes built up biostink. You could use hardly any detergent without a sudsy mess. I would have to run extra rinses all the time. Who would think a 2 hour washing cycle would still leave clothes building up biostink. I hated that machine with a passion and ditched it while it was still fully operational and pristine at 5 years old. Got an LG and have been very happy with it's performance. I still have the Electrolux dryer which matched the old washer. We replaced the heating element once on our own but other than that it has worked fine.

FROM NYT in 2021

THIS CERTAINLY SOUNDS GOOD…AND MADE IN US, NOW. UNSURE THE SIZE OR MODEL # IN 2023

ANY THOUGHTS?

Why We Love the LG TurboWash Washer

By Liam McCabePublished April 13, 2021Save

LG’s TurboWash does better laundry, faster.

Since our very first guide to washing machines, in 2013, our favorite washer has been a front-loader, built by LG, with the TurboWash feature.

Front-loaders are clearly better than top-loaders, on most counts. One of the few downsides to a front-loader is that each cycle can take an hour or more. But not in an LG washer with TurboWash (like our current top pick, the LG WM3900H). It can wash a big pile of laundry in about 30 minutes—just as quickly as a traditional top-loader.

Our pick

LG WM3900H

Fast, gentle, effective, reliable

This front-loader is quicker, gentler, and better at removing all types of stains than almost any other washer we’ve tested, and it has a solid reputation for reliability from multiple expert sources.

$1,100 from Best Buy

TurboWash, which first appeared in 2012, is essentially a water circulation system. Most front-loaders fill with water from the rear and then recirculate the water with a low-pressure sprayer. TurboWash models add higher-pressure nozzles to the front of the drum that soak clothes much quicker than the standard design, and they use less water and (usually) energy.

LG has arguably the best track record for reliability among front-loaders at this price.

The obvious spraying also makes it look like the washer is using a lot of water. That can help some people feel more at ease with front-loaders, if they’ve recently switched from a top-loader machine.

Even setting aside TurboWash, LG has arguably the best track record for reliability among front-loaders at this price, according to every source with statistics on the topic. They are also excellent cleaners and even have a few features to help combat the dreaded mildew stench that can sometimes afflict this type of machine. And they’re also now made in the US.

• The Best Washing Machines (and Their Matching Dryers)
  Of the 21 full-size washers we’ve tested, we found that the LG WM4000H is one of the quickest, gentlest, and most effective at removing all types of stains.

LG product manager Sandro Ledesma told us that LG has basically maxed out what it can do with TurboWash. The spray pattern already reaches almost the entire tub, he said, and if LG added more nozzles, there would be too many moving parts and tricky engineering problems to solve. So the current version should be with us for a while—and with any luck, this clever design will become the industry standard.

Any reason not to buy from LG online? Ive never NOT bought from a dealer. ?

Wash™ 360° and Built-In Intelligence

$799.00

$500.00 OFF$1,299.00

@martinca_gw sunset zone 24 I have the LG3900 model. Maybe look at the 4000.

FWIW, LG's WM3900 model was superceded by the updated WM4000 a couple of years ago. In turn, the WM4000 now has been superceded by the further updated WM5500. Noticed today that the WM5500 was on offer at the local Costco for $779. Slightly more at the local Lowe's Hardware ($798). Black Friday pricing.

Also, Martinca, that 2021 NYT/wirecutter article has been superceded, too. Here's a link to the May 23, 2023 update: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/the-best-washer-and-dryer/

As luck would have it, the updated article was recommending the WM4000 just as the WM5500 models started appearing in local stores where I live.

Jwvideo…Ty!! But cannot find WM a 5.0 ( 5.5?) FRONT LOAD WM5500 AT Costco ?? That would be awesome. Checking that NYT review, I do not see the cu size. Sorry I was not a better reader. COSTCO does have the 4.5. AND ”my” 5.0 , but only with the dryer too. :(

As long as I’m STILL HERE…😔… Is there any disadvantage ordering from LG direct vs. a dealer? Costco has their 90 day returns, but other than Costco? I know I’ve become tiresome, sigh, I must order by tomorrow to save my marriage JK!

The question about where to buy is ... who will install it? (IDK if costco installs)

Costco certainly installs, at least in Canada - I bought my LG Washtower from them, and they removed the old set and installed the new - it's part of their service (they won't unhook the old set, but they will take it away).

The 5.0 cu. ft LG front-load model is now the WM6500. FWIW, It is listed as in-stock and available from Costco's online site by itself (w/o dryer) at $849. Here is the link to the U.S. Costco page for the WM6500 by itself: https://www.costco.com/lg-5.0-cu.-ft.-mega-capacity-smart-front-load-washer-with-turbowash-360-and-ia-dd-built-in-intelligence.product.4000103312.html?preselect=color%3awhite

Price includes home delivery & installation. Delivery is available in some but not all zip codes..On my computer, using Firefox as the browser, the delivery information is in a box at the upper right corner of the page. Don't know how the page appears if viewing on a phone or other device, but when you find the delivery info, entering your zip code will tell you if there is installation in your area,

I've been following along but not really sure why, however this thread has convinced me to look into the front loader that matches my new dryer. It's a GE and I like the dryer a lot.

This washer looks like it has the allergy/sanitize feature that was mentioned in order to get hot water.

https://www.geappliances.com/appliance/GE-5-0-cu-ft-Capacity-Smart-Front-Load-ENERGY-STAR-Steam-Washer-with-SmartDispense-UltraFresh-Vent-System-with-OdorBlock-and-Sanitize-Allergen-GFW850SPNRS

I've never owned a front loader but stacking them would allow me more useable space in my laundry room. If stacked, does it matter which is on top & bottom or is it personal preferance? dryer above washer or washer above dryer?

I still have to convince DH since our current washer (Maytag) is only a few years old.

Dryer has to be on top of the washer when stacked. Think about it, if the wasgher is put on top, of the dryer, it's not sitting on a firm structure such as a floor vs. on top of the dryer and that's not as firm a foundation when dealing with the forces of the washer spinning at 1200 rpms.

Thanks. Yeah I figured that but wasn't sure.

With encouragement from this forum I just bought LG’s 5500 set from Costco, in graphite (which is about $100 upcharge anywhere) for $1599 plus tax delivered, installed, old set removed. A week is too soon for a full, honest review but so far I’m very happy. Depth is a concern for me and I got the 4.5 in the space of previous 3.5, as big as I could go. By math that’s about 30% bigger but I’m fitting at least twice as much in. (I’ve hated the small washer since I moved here.) I was also looking for onboard heater. The WiFi connectivity might seem hokey but I’m using it all the time on the washer: I set up the laundry and go about my day doing errands or whatever, start the cycle when I think I’ll be home in an hour. Push notifications to remind me the cycle is over and warn me not to leave wet laundry in the washer are welcome for this forgetful user.

Ah I just remembered my biggest issue: the dryer door does not open 90°. Awkward in my setting.

I think you mean the dryer door doesn't open 180°. :-)

Ha, I sure do!

For those looking for a heater onboard just keep in mind that no non-european washer uses the heater to MAINTAIN water temps and most dont use the heater in cycles other than sanitize or with a ”heavy” option.

Miele is the ONLY brand left that both publishes water temps in the manual and makes them selectable in every cycle. The heater is also used in every cycle.

Therr are tax incentives that manufacturers receive for meeting certain energy star goals.

Bosch and Asko both use the heater in most cycles, but they don't publish temperatures.

Caution would be warranted if there is an expectation that the onboard heater on a large american washer will be used in any cycle other than sanitize. If you think about it, heating a large volume of water to 120F or higher takes a considerable amount of energy. Factor in a cold tub as well and it will take a significant amount of time and energy.

Bosch and Miele are both compact laundry. That makes loads smaller and water use lower for the same volume of clothes.

4-5cu ft washers that heat to 120F and above in reasonable amounts of time are all commercial, run on 240V high current circuits or rely on external hot water loops that stay at 140F or above. Expecting that type of performance from an residential washer that costs $900-$1000 and has a 120V electical connection is unrealistic without waiting 2.5-3 hours for a full cycle. Most of that being time waiting for water to heat.

Hmm, I hear what you’re saying. There’s a steam feature that’s either standard or optional in half the cycles (including Allergene of course) apparently creating enough heat to warrant warnings. I guess this is creating steam at some point but not maintaining hot water as part of the cycle? My washer is almost directly above the heater so that water’s gonna be pushing 130° on the way in so that’s a start. Will play.

Jwvideo.. You are DA best! So really nice of you to check that out for me…and find it! I called Costo and was told they only have it black, Also that they have no pedetals for that model in stock . She was wrong on the first, so hopefully wrong about the pedestal. At least I spoke with a person. LG wants it all done online it seems. No help at all on annoying phone try. Im going to call Costco one more time, then just order online from LG.

Hope I said thanks enough to all of you!

FoodOnAStump, I expect that steam functions typically involve a minimal amount of water, enough to fill the sump and submerge the heating element so as to reduce the heating time required for steam generation.

Martinca, if you get the LG consider avoiding the “normal” cycle since it is the cycle that uses the least amount of water and it doesn't wash well. I mostly use perm press (for my clothes), whites, sanitize and towels. I am overall very pleased and I ll consider buying another LG when this on goes. Also for an idea of temperatures: warm is about 30C, hot about 40C and sanitize about 64C. Temperature changes a little when heavy/light wash is selected and it is not maintened as another poster said.

Those temperature points illustrate one of my irritations with washers nowdays. Lack of range between the temperature choices. 40°C (104°F) to 64°C (147°F) is 43°F difference. There's often no way to get something between those points such as 115°F or 125°F.

Alex, many thanks for that tip. Well, TA DA! The deed is done. Cannot believe how much time spent on getting a washer….some of it YOUR time, which, again was a huge help.

Got the 5.0 (6500) LG at a local dealer. Coming Saturday. Tried for COSTCO, but they did not have the pedastal and was smpler to order both from same place.Price was same. I just lost one year of warranty.

WHEW!

Horray! You may now think about other things martinca! I'm sure that was a lot of mental space being taken up. I hope you have many happy years with your new washer!

August 2021 I had to replace my 27 y/o Maytag dryer. I replaced it with the LG DLEX4200. In November, I had to replace my 10 y/o Whilpool Duet front loader. It was replaced with the WM4200, which is the 5.0 cu. ft. version of the above referred to WM4000. These models are still available. I"m going to provide you with informaiton you may find valuable or not. The temperatures I'm going to provide you will be in Celcius, not Farenheit.

I am an old-fashioned guy weary of all the energy restrictions. I don’t approve of all the dumbed down water temperatures, and I believe contributes to the mold and smell issues in washers, along with poor laundry habits.

For the following cycles Whites, Perm Press, Bedding, and Towels warm is 32 to 35C and the heater may come on or not to bring warm to those temps. Hot is 44 to 45 and heater will come on to reach those temperatures if needed, but once those temps are reached by the heater it turns off and won’t come back on to maintain temp. Adding steam option to Whites & Bedding will get the temperature up to 68 to 73C.

For Normal and Heavy-Duty cycles, the only time the heater will be used is if Extra Hot is selected. For Normal warm is 32 and Hot is 35 to 37. Heavy Duty isn’t much better temp wise.

In the old days warm was 37 to 40 and hot was 54 to 63C.

For some average clothes, depending upon soil, I’ll opt for plain warm and maybe hot for the above-mentioned cycles.

If I want hot water wash for towels and sheets and other items that involves pet needs, I will select the Sanitary cycle with lightest soil level. That will get water temp to between 57 & 62C. Heavier soil levels on that cycle will result in higher temps.

As for rinsing, I always add at least one extra rinse for all cycles, particularly with TurboWash. When washing towels, I always opt for the maximum allowed additional rinses, usually the 3 offered.

The WM4000 and WM4200 are still being sold but are being replaced with the 4.5 cu. Ft. WM5500 & WM5700 and the 5.0 cu. Ft. WM6500 and WM6700. The WM5500 offers and typical detergent dispenser drawer and the other 3 models feature auto dispensing of liquid detergent & softener. The new models could be a bit more frustrating in trying to access some functionality vs., the older WM4000 and WM4200 due to new control panel design. But all the new models offer a drum light in the washers.

Hope this helps.

Bob, Yes it will , I’m sure. TY!

SEA SEA, Ty for your good wishes :)

"There's often no way to get something between those points such as 115°F or 125°F."

My workaround on our SQ FL machine is switching the wash water temp to HOT halfway thru the initial fill that starts with a WARM setting. it gives me a Very Warm wash.

Cavimum, your SQ doesn't modulate/restrict the hot temp setting by mixing in or alternating it with cold flow. Many machines do. I also may want a higher temperature without the longer wash time that may be required by way of a Heavy cycle or ex-heavy soil selection. For example, 120°F for washing a pillow on the Delicate cycle to avoid mangling it with aggressive agitation. I have workarounds to do that but it involves filling a machine with tap-hot via diagnostic mode that thankfully recognizes that it's filled and carries on when starting a cycle instead of draining and refilling. I also have three machines connected to a single-spout faucet on which I can feed hot water or whatever mix temp I want even if the machine tries to moderate it. One of them electrically swaps the valve solenoids if it can't get the hot or cold flow it expects on premise that the hoses are connected wrong but that doesn't matter with a single-tap supply Y-connected to both valves. The other two may bleep a fault code but they continue filling when it's acknowledged.

I'm really glad that you're happy with what you chose.

Wonderful martinca! Happy laundering! : )