As a generalization anything you find at Home Depot or Lowe's is not "original" stuff. They will tell you that if you ask. Bath fixtures? They say Moen or Delta but they're a cheaper version of what you'd buy at a bath supply store. Tools? It may say Craftsman or whatever, but it's a cheaper version. You get what you pay for. Shop around at reputable light shops.

Snobby? Yep.

Littleleetoile, Wranglers and Lee Riders are great quality and very inexpensive and can be purchased at Walmart, Amazon, etc for under $50 a pair. Yet people spend hundreds of dollars for a pair of name brand jeans that do not perform better.

So does a light fixture that costs thousands of dollars perform better than a hundred dollar light fixture? No!!!

@Kate Cowers I disagree. Right on Deltas website it states this:

There are no differences. All Delta faucets are of the same quality, regardless of distribution channel. https://www.deltafaucet.com/node/257#:~:text=There%20are%20no%20differences.,quality%2C%20regardless%20of%20distribution%20channel.

If it is the same exact model number it is the same product.

@vinmarks I disagree with your disagreement. I doubt Delta's website is truth and I speak from some personal experience. No further comment you do what you want and believe what you believe.

When it comes to faucets, there is at least some truth to what Kate Cowers posted.

We have used all Price Pfister in our last house (1991-2011) and our current house since then.

PP makes a "homeowner's" version and a "professional" version in many of their designs. The pro versions are often double the HO version.

shirlpp: Thanks so much! That's spot on, but this is exactly my point! No reviews on the product, nonsensical company name means it's clearly a Chinese dropship company (they intentionally utilize odd, unique names that will easily grant them the ability to incorporate without running into US patent issues), seemingly the same or similar lamp to others I've seen in that style... So how do I know if this product is safe or not? And do the more expensive lamps have some other quality that make them worth the higher price point (e.g., the high-quality glass allows more light to get through and/or in a more consistent way)?

It's so strange!

@Mary Elizabeth Do they go by the same exact model number? Not the same name but exact model number.

JAN MOYER: "But there is a V.A.ST difference in quality between Visual Comfort, Arteriors, ilk etc.......or the Home Depot for far less knock off."

Got it -- but so what are the difference in quality? That's what I'm asking. I'm trying to understand what you get when you pay more for a visually similar, or even seemingly identical, light. You said there is a vast difference, so can you share what that is? Would be super helpful!

"It depends what you are looking for, willing to pay. It's no different than a sofa or a cocktail table."

Sure, and I'm not making a case here for always buying knock-offs. There are plenty of pieces that you definitely want to invest in, a sofa being a perfect example. You physically interact with/utilize it every day so comfort matters, it receives a lot of wear-and-tear, so quality materials are important, you sit on it so the structural integrity is critical... That (as with a cocktail table that gets a ton of wear on it, so you want high quality materials/design for similar reasons -- you don't want it to scratch, stain, fall apart, etc.) totally justifies a price difference because there actually *is* a massive difference in manufacturing/design on the aforementioned elements of a couch.

So what is the equivalent for a lamp? What are the actual features that make it worth investing in higher-end lighting (other than simply an aesthetic appeal if it's a design you can't find a lower-price knockoff of)?

@ShadyWillowFarmAaaah, got it! I misunderstood. I don't really wear jeans, so I thought those companies you mentioned are considered high-end brands. Thanks for clarifying!

@Kate Cowers: FYI, and for anyone else reading, @vinmarks is correct. Delta and Moen both state, under no uncertain terms, that so long as it has the same model number, it is the exact same product, and product lawyers on this forum (and others I've seen) state that it would be absolutely illegal for a manufacturer to sell a product under the same exact model number, but with different parts. The reason it's less expensive at Home Depot than a specialty store is because Home Depot gets discounts for buying in large qualities, and Home Depot also has an overall lower overhead, so larger margins to play with, which means they can still keep the same profit at a lower price point than specialty stores.

The exception to this is when Home Depot (or Lowes, or other big box stores) has a Delta/Moen/etc. "exclusive" product. In that case, it's absolutely something to be wary of because it may have inferior parts.

BTW, I've had this happen more than once. I see an outdoor fixture I like so I do a google image search looking for the best price (a must). There it is on Amazon, being sold by the manufacturer for 50% off. No explanation to why there is ONE new lamp available at 50% off. I buy it and the price online jumps back up to full price. I just got lucky I think. Turns out the manufacturer changed the color temperature on all the new lamps of this style and this one was from the old batch. I'm ok with it. If I had not done the google image search I would have paid double.

Back in 2021, I found some sconces at a local lighting store. We ordered them but of course with all the supply chain issues, the lights were back ordered indefinitely. I started shopping around online and went to the manufacturers website. I wish I could remember the name but can’t. At the site, there was a very clear message about the lighting that appeared to be theirs sold at the big box stores either wasn’t theirs…or was lighting determined to be seconds. It was definitely meant to be a deterrent to buying from a big box store. Did it stop me? No! I needed lights so I got mine from Lowe’s. 2 years later, so far so good. The chandelier in my DR that came with the house looks fine at first glance, but it doesn’t hang straight. An electrician adjusted a bit but it’s just a bit wonky. If I cared more, it would drive me crazy but due to light and door place,ent, our DR table isn’t even centered under it. Wonky under wonky!

Cheaper versions of lights can be made of cheaper materials--brass vs fake brass, for example. Or nickel instead of nickel-colored something. Sometimes it matters. Sometimes it doesn't. Ceiling fixtures don't get handled much and as long as the material doesn't age poorly (or rust), it shouldn't matter (as long as it started off by looking good).

Switches might be made better in more expensive fixtures (but don't count on it). Plastic switch parts on table lamps that get use can degrade over time.

Functionally, they're all gonna be the same. The lightbulb and shade will be what matters. They will probably all be UL listed or pass whatever safety requirements are required in your area.

(I'm not talking about the same item rebranded at different price ranges...)

“Wranglers and Lee Riders are great quality and very inexpensive and can be purchased at Walmart, Amazon, etc for under $50 a pair. Yet people spend hundreds of dollars for a pair of name brand jeans that do not perform better.”

Not true at all regarding Wranglers (I’d never wear Lee jeans to ride in, so don’t know about them). How and where they’re made, as well as quality, are NOT the same.

What are the differences? as asked above for instance in lamps ?

I'll tell you what: ) Order a splurge for yourself.

Feel the difference in weight. Look at the finish quality. Look at features, like a toggle that dims. look at proportions.

Want an example? A lamp.

Here below alongside a sofa

Traditions refined · More Info

The lamp again on the Arteriors site and elsewhere if you look, it is 1,160. 00 on all sites.

Put it in a Google search - looks good, basically half the price, who would know? It's still pricey.

So , even at those pricing levels....what makes one different from another.( Isn't close enough good enough? )

Size, the two bulb dimmable switch THE WEIGHT, I defy you to pick up the Arteriors with one hand unless you lift weights regularly.

The proportion, shade to base, the dangle of chains. It is packed to survive the eruption of Mt Vesuvius or at least a tornado. The marble gleams and is translucent.

There are more, suggestive of the same, different trims. But you aren't going to find the exact Arteriors at varying price points. And it won't turn up in your local Marshalls or TJ Maxx or Home Goods any time soon.

The bottom line in all things? It is worth what you are willing to pay. Not a dime more or a dime less. You determine the value of any of those things to YOU. You determine if it pleases you, brings you joy, or if can afford it. But.....when your life is about evaluating the value, the look, the function for OTHER people, as is mine? You'll be able to answer your own question.

If hell will freeze over before you spend more that 99.99 on any lamp? You know where to find them.

Here is my cautionary tale about inexpensive lighting. After an extensive online search, I opted for the cheapest version of the style I was looking for. When I opened the box I realized it was cheaper because I had to assemble the entire thing. All 60+ pieces. And I did count each piece, I am not exaggerating.

We recently remodeled our master bath and used Visual Comfort lights. Our contractor (friend) commented he could tell by they weight they weren't from Home Depot.

My husband used to have a client that made smart light bulbs in China. He came to find out they were skirting all of the UL listing requirements by fabricating information. That would be my big fear of any lighting made in China.

I can tell you Visual Comfort is made in China. So too most of the iron, stone, metal tables of current rage. Two tons of wood accent pieces that bear "USA made", but were merely FINISHED here. China doesn't mean inferior, and more than it will be exemplary.

We are over regulated to the point it's a fortune to make a darn thing here. Hi or low. I need a China produced Tylenol to even think about it.

In my previous house almost all the lighting was bought through Home Depot or Lowes. Lived there for 15 years and never had issues with any of it.

I just can't see how someone spends $2K or more on one light fixture. Maybe if I were loaded it would be a different story.

I would rather spend my money on other things than $2k for one light fixture when I can buy cheaper fixtures that do the same thing...provide light. Plus there is not a lot of wear and tear on lights. You turn them on and off. Of course it has to be UL listed. And just because a light is expensive does not mean it is not made in China.

And the bottom line of the discussion is.....to each his/her own. Buy what you see/want, if you like it, keep it, if you don't' return it. If it falls apart, you'll know it was cheap. If you don't care that it falls apart, you've not spent any money on it and can replace it.

I don't do Home Depot. And I'm not "loaded", I just think their stuff is garbage. Don't care what a brand website says. Mary Elizabeth, thank you for the HO/PRO distinction that's what I was getting at and couldn't think of the best way to phrase it.

Skipping down to reply that these days more than ever, price is not a reliable indicator of value - if it ever was. Learning to recognize and evaluate materials and workmanship is a better way to discern quality. And of course some folks are more interested in status than actual value.

And with designer items, you're paying for the designer's work as well as the resulting product.

@carolb_w_fl_coastal_9/10 Great point! So how do you recognize good workmanship, as you said? Especially when so much shopping is now done online?

To some extent? Price IS an indicator, but it isn't foolproof.

If you are near a mid size to major city? Go to a design center on open to the public days that are offered. Chairish.com and 1stdibs sites for new, antiques and very gently used are to some degree an education . Unbelievable what you can turn up in gently enjoyed categories.

Ask yourself how much abuse the item will take. Where is it going in your home? If you think I never scooped a lamp from Marshalls? You'd be wrong. But you will never see me buying a chair in that store. A bench ? Maybe ! But it is for a second home, a guest bedroom, a kids room, usually. In the end you have to have seen and kissed a lot of frogs, to recognize the prince or princess in the marshy land and weeds of the internet.

I mean, if you look at a midrange bathroom faucet, the brass is most expensive, nickel second, chrome cheapest. Do they perform differently? No, it's fashion, which means demand, Price follows demand, which follows fashion. Cutting-edge design always costs more. (Sometimes it's genuinely better quality, but other times not!)

In my experience, expensive lighting is not a rip-off. If it is something one wants and can afford. I always look for the best price The nicer fixtures I have purchased were hand forged, antique or bought new from a few the better brands mentioned above. There is a vast difference in material weight, craftsmanship and visual difference.

A good rule of thumb is shop in the price range that fits the house price range.

I think we all need to pick and choose where we are willing to spend the extra dollars.

If you look at your spending over the past year you probably spent $1000 on non-necessities. Did you spend it on a light fixture or on a hobby or a day trip or at a spa? Some people buy a Starbucks coffee every day.

Most of us don't have unlimited dollars to spend, so we have to make choices. I bought my light fixtures for most of my home from Lowes. I wanted and bought a Nelson Saucer Bubble Light for my living room. My other light fixtures are nice and work well with my décor, but that one light is a statement piece. I didn't buy it because it will function better or last longer than my other fixtures.

As far as safety, most light fixtures are UL certified. I wouldn't buy one that wasn't and if I did I don't think my electrician would install it.

I purchased a bunch of inexpensive ceiling fixtures from Wayfair and Home Depot when I was staging my house. When I got fixtures for the kitchen in my new house I splurged on Visual Comfort. I knew the difference before I opened the box. The Visual Comfort fixtures were solid, heavy, real brass, real glass. The Wayfair ones were more of a painted metal made to look like brass and the shades were plastic made to look like glass. It is personal preference whether you care of not about getting one or the other, but it certainly costs a company much more money to manufacture something with brass and glass.

With the Wayfair cheapo flush mounts, the shade never fit exactly and there was a sliver of light that would peep out between the shade and the fixture. With the Visual Comfort the base had great threading on to which the glass fit perfectly, no light leaking.

Sometimes more expensive fixtures are made in countries with stronger child labor laws, which means it costs more to pay workers, and they pass that cost along to the consumer. Sometimes though, really expensive stuff is also just crap made by kids in China.

I often find that more expensive options have a bit better design - the proportions are just slightly different and look more appealing to those who bother to look and discern.

One place I don't get at all is Rejuvination for lighitng. Expensive and feels like cheap, lightweight crap. Some of my inexpensive Home Depot pieces looked pretty nice too.

I have enjoyed this discussion and just returned to look at it again.

As I mentioned, I would study the photos, really read the reviews and then think about it some more. Now, I don't know if it's the lighting in the photo or my monitor, but for the less $ version, where the wire/rod meets the fixture, it looks black to me..........whereas in the desired item photo, it is metallic. Now, that might be a reflection but now I'd say it is likely not the same item.

That difference in looks might have no impact and it would still be a great buy and a beautiful fixture, but I don't think it's safe to assume it's the same item.

As for plumbing fixtures, I used to avoid buying at big box stores but I do agree that if the item number is identical it is the SAME item. I know I have had Delta honor their lifetime warranty ( they are wonderful as is Moen). They did not even ask where I purchased it from. editing to add, the last several faucets I purchased were from big box as well as amazon and wayfair. All good and all better priced at the time for that faucet.

Actually Jan, most regulations are there to protect the average person. Because of regulations most of us can get on a plane and fully expect to arrive at our destinations in one piece. Even though flying is a miserable experience, it’s not because of regulations. The miserable experience is due to corporate greed. Companies started manufacturing items in China out of greed, i.e. cheap labor and because safety measures might cost a few pennies more.

And also, just to note: Everything that is made in China is not of inferior quality. In fact, to the contrary. The reason why so many items are sourced from China is high quality workmanship at highly competitive prices. Many households in the US would have nothing in their houses, if it were not for China. They make everything. Including many of the designer bags, etc., that people would like to imagine are made in Paris.

All due to sweatshop labor!

“All due to sweatshop labor!”

Where do you think your cheap Wranglers and Lees come from?

I think you guys may be stuck in a bit of a time warp.

When I was a kid the only stuff made in China was stuff you bought at the 5 & Dime.

That was when America led the world in manufacturing output. The best cars were made in the USA, the best electronics were made in the USA, the best clothing was made in the USA. The USSR was #2, followed by Japan and Germany.

Things have changed. China is winning... followed by the USA, Japan and Germany. . .

How many of you own the Librem USA cell phone (only cell phone that I know of that is made in the USA - including components).

• I was unable to get the Librem 5 to make calls.
• The Librem 5 is plastic and massive.
• The Librem 5’s battery lasts about an hour or two tops (which I was informed of by Purism).
• The Librem 5 device gets really hot when charging (again, I was made aware of this).
• Wireless was incredibly slow,
• The Librem 5’s screen is less-than responsive.

How many own an Apple (made in China) or a Samsung or Sony (Made in South Korea)?

China's middle class is growing, while ours is shrinking.

We didn't loose our positioning just because of labor costs. We invested in the CEO's and Stockholder pockets instead of infrastructure.

As far as safety, if a less expensive light fixture is marked as UL listed then you don't need to worry.

https://aerosusa.com/everything-to-know-about-becoming-ul-listed-or-certified/#:~:text=Though%20UL%20certification%20is%20not,that%20are%20not%20UL%20listed.

Wranglers and Lee are made in Mexico.

Not all of them, Shady, and especially not the cheaper versions.

My dad wouldn't wear jeans. Most men of his era were reluctant to wear jeans. He grew up in a household, like many, where you had 4 outfits. One for good, one for wear, one for the wash and one to spare. He was poor, so his pants were denim. It was cheap, wore like iron, and lasted for years and told the world you were poor.

You can check the tags to see where they were made. Mine were made in Mexico.

@ ShadyWillowFarm and @ Jilly - Do you really think it makes a difference if they are made in the USA, Mexico or China? Manufacturers are cutting corners and making things that are cheaper and don't last. Why would they make something that lasts for decades if they can get you to buy a replacement in a year?

A friend of mine just burned the motor out in his newer KitchenAid Mixer. The warrantee is now 1 year and they are no longer made to last a lifetime.

You know France is fighting back on planned obsolescence. They fine companies if they are caught. They require packaging to include how long products are expected to last and most products require a 2 year minimum warrantee.

When it comes to Wranglers, yes I do. I used to be in the business.

I’m well aware of your other points.

ETA: France is also fighting back on shrinkflation.

My friends primary job at Amazon was to study sales statistics of the highest selling items on Amazon's own website. From shoes to backpacks, light fixtures, you name it... everything that was a breakout best seller.

He'd send this select list of items to the 'redesign' department, who worked closely with their legal dept to narrowly skirt any existing patents in order to apply for their own patents on the same product. Then the new prototypes were made in the US, my friend would fly with them to China where he would stay for weeks or months working with the factories that were gearing up to mass produce these items.

Amazon having ripped off their own paying vendor clients, the knock offs were then sold in the US under the 'Amazon Select' or a few different brands, always undercutting the price of the original creator of the item.

Jeff Bezo was was called before congress in an antitrust lawsuit because of this and other schemes. He denied it all. I personally know that he lied under oath. My friend quit because of the relentless schedule of the redesigning and the rebranding of thousands and thousands of items. Bezos agreed to dissolve certain Amazon brands but I'm sure the redesign department still exists.

Wranglers and Lee Riders DO LAST- that’s why I buy them and wear them!!!

I do believe we've completely lost the intent of the original posting......lights, people, not jeans!!!

Jeans are kind of like lighting. Some made in the USA, some in China, some somewhere else. Some are more durable, some are more fashionable, some that cost $30.00 and some for $400.00. How do you balance cost, quality and aesthetics?

One of the big differences is that lighting that is UL certified is going to be safe.

How do we know when the bigger price tag is simply a bigger price tag and when it means it is truly a necessary spend to get something that doesn't fail in a year.

Big box lighting fixtures may not cost as much and will probably not last a lifetime, but will they look good enough and last long enough to sufficiently meet your needs. For most of us, yes. For a few it will make them unhappy. It will feel cheap or not stylish enough and they won't be happy without spending the additional money on a high end light fixture from a high end specialty store. Some really inexpensive internet sites may offer even cheaper lighting fixtures, but they may not be UL certified and may be made of painted plastic instead of metal and may fail very quickly, may be dangerous and are probably not a wise investment.

It's insane to me that this conversation is still going. Past the popcorn this is insane

It is no ‘church pew dilemma’, but yes, it seems to have legs.

Details are definitely a big factor. What is the exact color of the metal, what's the weight of the glass, the transparency/opacity of the fabric. In some cases, you might be able to get the cheaper version and replace the shade to get close to the better lamp you were looking at; in some cases you'll wish you'd just gotten the more expensive item to begin with. Since we're comparing to clothing, I'll add a clothing example: Gap and Old Navy ... same parent brand, lots of items that look very similar, but if you actually try them on, you'll find they are cut slightly differently; maybe they'll both fit you, and maybe they won't. There's a reason one similar product can be sold cheaper than the other ... you have to figure out whether that reason has an impact to your needs.

Sorry everyone! I made a comment that I ride horses in inexpensive jeans and felt they were high quality because they performed well despite the cheap price tag (it’s hard dirty work) and it triggered a tangent discussion. I only meant that an inexpensive price tag does not mean a product won’t do a good job.🙂. Did my MBA with a thrift shop desk lamp and Toshiba computer.😉