Kevin does want to do other kinds of work, and ideally he would want to paint and sell paintings, but I do not think that is practical. He has a Master of Fine Arts from SUNY Albany, and so he is qualified to teach art, but I don't know whether he would want to do that either. He has sold paintings in the past, and we have a lot now that we could sell, but I do not think that is a dependable income at this point. He's had art shows at prestigious galleries in the past, but nothing recently.

I believe that I am going to have to rethink our timeline, and that is causing me a bit of anxiety as well. I don't know how quickly I can get rid of everything here that I do not need - I am not good at that.

I have my next physical in late April, and at that time, I will discuss switching doctors, as I have a lot of prescription medicine that I take for blood pressure that I will need to get from a new doctor when I do move. I do not want to move during the summer - I did that in Texas when I was much younger, and it was not pleasant.

No advice to offer, but thinking of you and your brother Lars, and wishing you both the best.

I don't know how quickly I can get rid of everything here that I do not need - I am not good at that.

Hire it done. There are all kinds of small personable companies that you could look over and choose one with a good rep, to pick up and sell your items. Look into how they want to be paid, it may be that a percentage commission might mean in order to well for themselves they would have to do well for you..

Maybe Kevin can learn how to code. Good luck!

Lars,

If renting the other house covers the mortgage, and he can get on ACA, for instance, why can't he just paint? Maybe he can sell his paintings enough to cover of the outstanding expenses? Seems pretty doable. Alternatively, if you sell the house that will cover a lot for a long time.

Why do you worry if he just paints? Seems like there are a couple of ways he can cover it. Might just be the uncertainty?

He's not likely to get a job, because of his age (per Kevin upthread) but he's not the kind of person to be covered? Right.

Re the stuff, consider getting a storage unit if the sorting is overwhelming. Then you can choose what you know you want in the CC house and organize and move the rest to storage. Oh, I wish I had that bowl! just means a trip to storage for the bowl. After a year, at a convenient time, go through what's left in storage and it should be easier to sort forgot -it-don't-need-it, I-was-looking-for-that and whoa-can't-let-that-go. I can't tell you the number of times I've committed to quick and ruthless and really regretting something I'd shed.

Why wait to start interviewing physicians? Even if you remain splitting your time (i.e., Keven gets a dream job in L.A.) you should have a local doctor in (or near) CC anyway. You can call your L.A. doctor's office to see if they have recommendations, as well as your friends in CC. Start researching the reviews and backgrounds. If you're in CC, make an appointment or two at a time to interview.

For Kevin, HR at Sony might have jobs or placement help for work from home jobs. It doesn't hurt to ask. It also doesn't hurt to ask people he knows for the the kinds of jobs he thinks he could do. Re selling art, there are some online galleries that seem pretty good, as well as Etsy, Shopify and similar where one can open one's only online shop without having to deal with infrastructure. Also, check with the PS tourism bureau for info on street art fairs and similar that are aimed toward tourists. It's a truism in art sales (another thing I used to do) that tourists make the best customers at all levels of retail art sales. Tourists are usually with their share the walls partners, unstressed, and in the mood to spend money.

The good news is that PS has enough cachet to support decent prices. People still buy art, and always will. The competition is prints, especially giclée. If Kevin can stoop to making a series of particularly appealing PS and Valley paintings, in his particular style, and find a good printer who can make giclées, he can have walk away with a tube, inexpensive art to sell to the masses. Even big time artists do $300 prints like this for bread and butter. Perhaps a good day job will be a good idea to start with, but since your skepticism seemed to be about the practicality of art sales rather than the quality of Kevin's art, I'd like to add some encouragement that if it's done in a businesslike, rather than fussy artiste, way, art sales is a possible moderate living.

Change is a shock, but change has positive potential too. Accept that this is the end of the job with Sony, regardless of the HR department's company-speak.

We're easing past a recession. Inflation is coming down. Mortgage rates will come down too.

IDK about LA, but here, a major reason for fewer sales is because there are so few homes on the market. The number of sales has dropped, but the price of homes has risen. Not every buyer needs a mortgage, and some people are comfortable waiting for lower rates to refinance. You'll do what seems prudent for you, looking out over the next year or so.

I'd be getting one of your houses ready to list. You might want to sell both if neither location appeals over the long haul.

First, give yourselves some time to recover from this sudden change.

Basically it is a tough call to have renters. Some people absolutely have horrible times being landlords. The best way from what I have seen is having a management group manage the rental.

As far as work goes I'm sure that Kevin will find a way to move forward that will be comfortable enough. I know quite a few seniors who changed their careers and went on to pick up jobs more in their field of interest. I don't know much about Kevin's work but a lot of people are now doing computer and digital art as well. Perhaps a melding of his art and his career could yield him continued financial stability.

Perhaps Kevin could sell his art at your Etsy store if that is in line with what you sell. Perhaps if it's some kind of interior design his pieces of art could compliment whatever it is you are selling. :-). Anyway there are a million things that one can do.

I suggest you start downsizing now.. How do I know? 🙄 It takes me forever to get the packing done...

I wish you and Kevin the very best in your exciting new life.

Lars, I am sorry to hear about Kevin being laid off. It sounds, though, as if you are both coming up with possible plans for your next moves. The only thing I can offer is, would Kevin be open to trying meditation to ease his anxiety? I went through a period when I couldn't sleep and that really helped me. I started with an app and had to try several different people, but I did find one whose voice and method worked for me. I listened every night for a couple of months. Then, I was able to "hypnotize"/calm myself to sleep. Worth a try.

I hope your brother comes through this difficult time better than ever (and you, too!).

Oh Lars! I am so sorry to hear that you and Kevin are going through this stressful time. It cannot be easy.

I have no advice to offer you but you and Kevin are in my thoughts.

As fas as investing money from the sale of the house, I'd put most of it in Bitcoin, the rest in Ethereum and Solana for a well balanced portfolio.

I see you having the house in Cat City paid for...your Social security alone would pay the utilties, property tax, insurance...food/gas/clothing. Kevin can look around at the job market while his severance pay is still in tact. You've got time. If you sell your house in LA...lets just say for $1.5 mil...you can earn 5.5% interest on the money in a CD...= $82,500. "IF" you rent the house out for $4500 X 12months...you'd only make $54,000. There is NO way you should rent it out!

I can imagine the stress and anxiety for your brother, and for you as well - here's hoping for the best outcome.

Or it might be worth nothing. Boomer style investing has been pretty successful for a couple of generations.

As fas as investing money from the sale of the house, I'd put most of it in Bitcoin, the rest in Ethereum and Solana for a well balanced portfolio.

Lars, don't listen, that stuff is nothing but risk.

Boomer style "investing" is leaving the next generation 31 trillion in the hole, and counting. They poisoned the planet, consumed the resources, wallowed in opulence, and left the kids to pay the bill. Thanks boomers

Our friend Lars needs our help and suggestions, not some nutcase saying nasty stuff.

Our friend Lars needs our help and suggestions

Got it. I'm on it.

I posted the original message from Lars into ChatGPT, and here's what it had to say:

Your situation encompasses several important decisions, each with its own set of considerations and potential paths forward. Let's break down the main points to help you navigate this transition more smoothly.

### Relocation to Cathedral City

**Pros:**

- **Lifestyle Change:** Moving to Cathedral City might offer a more relaxed lifestyle compared to L.A., which could be beneficial for both you and Kevin, especially considering his recent job situation.

- **Consolidation of Living Space:** Having one primary residence could simplify your life, reduce maintenance costs, and focus your resources and attention on making the most out of your new Etsy store venture.

**Cons:**

- **Employment Opportunities:** As you've noted, Kevin's job prospects, especially in manufacturing, might be limited in the Palm Springs area. Remote work could be an option, but it would require research and possibly new skills or certifications.

### Renting vs. Selling the L.A. House

**Renting:**

- **Pros:**

- **Steady Income Stream:** Renting out the L.A. house could provide a consistent source of income, which would be particularly useful given the uncertainty around Kevin's future employment and your reliance on SS for income.

- **Property Value Appreciation:** Keeping the property could allow you to benefit from further appreciation in the L.A. real estate market.

- **Flexibility:** You retain ownership and can decide to sell later if the market conditions are more favorable or your circumstances change.

- **Cons:**

- **Management and Maintenance:** Renting out property requires ongoing management, including dealing with tenants, maintenance issues, and possibly vacancies. Hiring an agency can mitigate this but will eat into your rental income.

- **Market Risks:** There's always the risk of the rental market downturn, leading to reduced rental income or difficulties in finding tenants.

**Selling:**

- **Pros:**

- **Lump Sum Payment:** Selling the house provides a significant amount of capital upfront, which can be used to pay off any remaining mortgage, invest for future income, or upgrade and settle into your new primary residence.

- **Simplification:** Selling the house eliminates the responsibilities and uncertainties of being a landlord.

- **Cons:**

- **Capital Gains Tax:** Depending on how long you've owned and lived in the house, and the profit you make from the sale, you may be liable for capital gains tax, although primary residence exclusions may apply.

- **Market Conditions:** If the market isn't in your favor, you might not get as much for the house as you hope, or it could take a long time to sell.

### Health Insurance Options

Regarding health insurance, it's crucial to understand the specifics of COBRA (Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act), which allows for the temporary continuation of health coverage at group rates. The fact that Kevin has been laid off (as opposed to quitting) should still allow him to qualify for COBRA, despite his earlier comments about quitting. However, COBRA can be expensive because you pay the full premium yourself, including the portion previously covered by the employer, plus an administrative fee. Since Sony is covering health insurance for six months post-layoff, it would be wise to explore other long-term options during that period, such as marketplace insurance, especially before the COBRA eligibility expires.

### Starting an Etsy Store

Focusing on the Etsy store is a constructive way to channel your energy and creativity, offering potential income diversification. Given your new stability in Cathedral City, dedicating time to this venture could be both fulfilling and financially beneficial. Research successful stores for inspiration and strategies to make your store stand out.

### Financial Considerations and Downsizing

- **Budgeting:** Keeping your food budget low and managing expenses carefully will be crucial during this transition. It might also be helpful to consult with a financial advisor to plan the reinvestment of funds from the house sale or to manage rental income effectively.

- **Downsizing:** Embrace downsizing as an opportunity to declutter, simplify your lifestyle, and focus on what's truly important. It can be emotionally and physically freeing, although challenging.

### Conclusion

Each option comes with its own set of challenges and opportunities. It might be beneficial to sit down with Kevin and discuss each path's pros and cons in detail, considering your long-term goals, financial security, and lifestyle preferences. Consulting with a financial advisor, real estate expert, or career coach could provide additional insights and help you make informed decisions during this significant life transition.

Lars, I know you planned on AirBnB in CC. Is your LA home a candidate for that type of rental? You could keep many of your furnishings and your gardens. I would think if your location is desirable it could be quite lucrative and allow you some time to make longer term decisions.

I second the AirBnB idea, if you can find someone to manage it. Go on AirBnB and see what similar houses in the area get per week.

AirBnB does sound like an option, but the rental prices seem a bit low. Based on this listing that is relatively nearby, and adjusting for our having three bedrooms instead of four, we would probably only get to charge $1,100 per week (although our location is better, being in Westchester instead of Hawthorne), whereas for long term rental, we should get at least $4,500. I would keep it in mind only because we would not have to move furniture, although I might want to switch dining tables with the one we have in Cathedral City at the moment.

The house we had in Venice would have been much better for AirBnB since it was on Abbot Kinney Blvd, walking distance to the beach, and just a few blocks from many restaurants. I think the next owners did list it on AirBnB, but I don't know what they charged for the rent. I believe that they use it now as long term rental property.

I'm not going to invest in Bitcoin or anything that risky.

The current value of our house in L.A. is only $1.3 M, but we do have a small mortgage. The house in CC is paid for, but of course we have property taxes and insurance to pay for.

Kevin has a good amount in his 401K, but he won't touch that until he retires.

Kevin has also considered selling giclee prints of his art, and so that is still a possibility. If we wanted to sell paintings on Etsy, I think he would need to make some smaller ones that would be easier to ship. A lot of his paintings are quite large, but he would be willing to sell those locally in the Palm Springs market. He also wants to start a new collection of Coachella Valley paintings, and I think he could possibly create a collection that would sell.

In addition to Palm Springs, there are also a lot of art galleries in Palm Desert, which has high-end stores on El Paseo.

How does one find a financial advisor? This is what we need most. I think Kevin might be able to get a reference from Sony, but I'm not sure about that. I'm leaning more to selling the L.A. house just to be done with it, but we will need to have the best info on reinvesting the money. I do not think we will be hit with capital gains taxes, as the amount we will get (divided by two) will not reach that threshold.

My main concern is Kevin's health insurance, and he does have health issues because of his recent colectomy, which requires him to have an ostomy bag.

I would ask around among your friends who they use for financial advice. We went with Edward Jones because they dealt with our inheritance from DH's folks. If they were good enough for them for 50 years...

plllog, Regarding changing doctors, right now I have Medicare HMO, and that only pays for doctors in my medical group, which is currently UCLA. There are UCLA medical centers east of Pasadena and therefore none in Coachella Valley. I have the option to change my medical group if I move, but I can only have one at a time. Currently, Medicare (and my supplemental insurance) will not pay for me to see a doctor in Palm Springs, except in the case of an emergency

I will talk to my doctor in April about changing to a medical group in Palm Springs, and I think that the Eisenhower group is the best option, as I mentioned above.

Personally, I would sell out of the house in LA and get that off of your shoulders unless you feel like you would want to move back there at a later date. I would think that having all of the expenses of a second home would be eating your money up. Having a rental property can be a huge headache especially if cannot fix your own repairs as they come up! The handyman type that can do all the work him/herself has a huge advantage when it comes to owning rental property.

I also would decline the Air Bnb idea. Here....a clean out with laundry is $375. So you rent it out for a week @ $1100 then pay $375 for a clean out. Then a property manager is another 10%. Then...who would water and care for your gardens? Then once a year you pay for a professional heating & cooling company to check the smoke detector/ carbon monoxide detector/ furnace filter & AC....another $150. Then a radon test every 5 years. $150 (Yes, I schedule & pay for ALL that here) You bleed slowly.

Sorry to hear that you are going through this. There is always a way if you seek. It looks like renting out long term might be more beneficial than Air Bnb if you keep the house. There are many landlords on this forum and there is a good reason we still are after all these years. We started from zero. You could do the same. There might be a landlord assoc. in your area, you could start there by asking questions. $4,500 rental income sounds great.

I agree with Summer.

Since this is your home, you know it inside out. My first thought would be how the rental market is in your area? Would the school district play a part in your renting? We own multiple properties and none depend on the school year. There is a window to getting a tenant in by September and if not, the property could stay empty for the year.

If your neighborhood attracts a different demographic, it's a bit easier.

When renting out single family, DH always has a deal that the renter takes care of the property in certain ways. For snow removal, making sure lawn is kept up etc. In multifamily buildings, one tenent would be responsible for cleaning the halls, putting out the garbage etc. These things are all compensated.

DH rentals are all below market.

But, these are things you need to become educated and see if it works for you.

Before getting too excited about renting or doing Air BnB, don't forget the gain exclusion rule. If it's been your main residence for 24 months in the 5 years preceding the sale, an owner can exclude up to $250K of gain. If owned jointly with your brother, you can each get an exclusion.

^DH reminded me of what Elmer just posted.

Re art sizing, wall space is a bigger deal than shipping. Small (longest side up to 2’) and medium (longest side under 3’), tend to be most practical and saleable. Giclées can be rolled and put in heavy, acid free, round mailing tubes (never triangular, which are fine for bluepints and similar documents, but not art). These can also be taken on airplanes, or at least checked. They'll fit in large duffles, as well. But tubes aside, they're sizes easy for buyers to find wall space for. Much more cost effective for them to frame near their homes, as well.

For framed originals, or upsold framed prints, if Kevin doesn't mind doing his own framing, it depends on the level. Under about $1500-2000, Kevin can get one or two sizes of shipping boxes with inserts to block the frames in tight. Weigh out the standard pieces ahead of time and find out your true shipping costs. Much above that, or above 3’ longest size, it's worth using a professional art shipper to properly crate them. This is a separate charge straight from the shipper. If they're buying in person, you can offer them the shipper for crating, or one of your boxes, if it fits, for carrying. There may be other strategies I can't recall as well. The important thing is to make it easy on the buyer. Know what shipping will cost, or a realistic estimate if it has to be crated. If easy for them shipping is available, at a known and fair price, it will make sales a lot easier.

For Kevin's last show (which was at Bergamot Station in Santa Monica), he and I did the framing, and we went to a molding shop in Van Nuys (I think) to get the framing wood. We gilded some of the frames and stained some of them black, and some had a combination finish of black and gold. He would have sold more of his paintings at that show if he had been willing to lower his prices a bit, but he was firm on what he wanted for his work. Of course this would not be an issue for prints, if he decides to go that route.

Kevin has also built large crates for some of the paintings that he has shipped. This is a painting that I bought from him before he moved to L.A.

and it is 48" x 64". He crated it, and I had the shipping company that we used at work for furniture pick it up and deliver it to me. Not sure where I will put this in Cathedral City, but it might fit in the dining area.

If you rent, also be prepared on how you would handle another covid-like event where your renters might stop paying rent for a long time and your ability to evict them will probably be restricted, but you will still have to pay your RE taxes and other expenses.

My cleaning lady in LA had an apartment unit in her home near USC. She rented it to a family with 2 young children. No sooner they moved in, a couple of adult kids and a grandmother also showed up and moved in. They stopped paying rent and made her life miserable. The renters managed to get free legal help and knew exactly how to scam the system My cleaning lady spent $20K and it took 9 months to get the renters out ... and of course on the way out they trashed the apartment, feces all over and clogged all the pipes.

Excellent that you have the experience. Obviously, if you can frame and crate yourselves, that's more $$ you get to keep, and, again, offering frames (artist's choice), crating, and shipping helps incentivize lookers to buy.

I'm so sorry to hear this news, Lars. Best of luck to your and your DB.

I love that painting two posts above -- I find it soothing.

I'm sorry to hear you and your brother are going through this, especially while still dealing with health care concerns.

I would consider not dealing putting employment feelers out, for the targeted professions. You never know what my pop up, and the process can take a while. Ageism is also an unspoken truth in many fields.

We've done both short-term and long-term rentals. The long term is less hassle, as it sounds like your location isn't a prime short-term location. There is always a tenant sourcing fee, so be aware of that, along with property management fees. BTW, I believe the rental income counts in a person's MAGI for ACA qualification. In California, he should also be eligible for Cal-COBRA after regular COBRA, for a total of 36 months. Although it is discounted, it is still expensive. He can request the rate sheet from HR.

I did find https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/, but you had written the link incorrectly. I forwarded this to my brother, as I believe I am already too old to be considered early retirement. I might join the forum anyway, to get info for Kevin.

I've started looking for a financial advisor, but I wonder if I should try to find one in Palm Springs instead of L.A.

oops misspelling on my part. Thanks for the correction. Im glad you found it.

you dont have to be an early retire person to benefit from the forums.

They have topics of interest to all people who are retired or thinking of retiring.

I made an appointment with a financial advisor (very close to us) for an initial consultation, which will be by phone tomorrow (Thursday) at 7:30 PM. I'm going to have Kevin take the call, since he will have more to talk about than I would. Her website responded with a message that there is a three to four month waiting list for new clients, but I think that is acceptable. She works by fee only, but I do not know what her fee will be yet. I assume that she will charge by the hour, but that is just a guess. First consultation is free.

I also made an appointment with the real estate agent that we will want to use, whether we rent or sell. One of her assistants (Amber) called me and set up an appointment for Feb 28 to do a walk through. I need that much time to get the house ready for her to see it, and we will not start moving out completely until May, although we can move some things before then. I need to find out from Amber how much of our furniture we need to leave here while we have our house listed or rented.

Kevin has already started participating in the early retirement forum, but I have not joined yet, although I plan to.

I am glad to see you address this huge change in your life in such a methodical and thoughtful way. I realize moving is not fun and hope that it is as painless as possible. I know it is too soon but await hearing about the fun part which is a possible Etsy store.

Man I'm sorry to hear abt your brother's layoff. It is definitely a tough thing to have happen. Sounds like you are thinking things through. I know it can be extremely stressful, but you guys will figure it out and be fine. You have each other! May I ask how old is Kevin? I think I recall you saying he is younger than you?

Kevin is 58 and will be 59 in March. I think I did mention this above. He is 15 years younger than I am.

Sony has provided some assistance for resumé writing, and they told him only to list them as his employer, since he has worked there for over 20 years, and they told him not to put years on when he went to university, so that his age will not be revealed. It is illegal for employers to ask someone's age in California during a job interview, and Kevin has interviewed prospective employees as part of his job, and so he knows what is legal and not.

I baked a loaf of 100% whole wheat bread yesterday, and Kevin liked that, but his appetite is still not back to normal and he is still having trouble sleeping. I did make a deviling turkey salad on Monday that he liked, and I served it in a flour tortilla that I heated with Monterey Jack and rolled into a wrap. We were out of bread, which is why I had to bake some.

I'd say use the same principles doing a CV for art. List only prestigious shows, and only 3-5, don't give dates, do use a full body picture, keep it to no more than an average sized paragraph, don't use fancy art words, give one sentence to the motivations or themes of past work, and something cheery and up to the minute about the inspiration and beauty of the local scene (sales puffery). If a gallery wants more, fine, but no one enjoys reading long artists' statements. Buyers want to know a little about who the artist is, but mostly want something intriguing or relateable.

I am sorry that you both are dealing with this big upheaval in life. It sounds like you are both being careful and thoughtful in your response.

As far as art - be careful about making it a cornerstone of future financial plans. Kevin should make art that he wants to make, especially as he navigates a major life change. It can be a sustaining enriching part of life. If he does that he may find an audience for it. If so wonderful.

But if he hasn’t been actively an artist for years it might take him awhile to find his vision. To refine skills. Doing that with the addition of making money might just add yet more stress for him.

I come from a family of artists. As in mother, father, uncle, aunts and maternal grandparents. And have many friends and acquaintances who are artists. Some have been very successful financially. Some moderately. Many not so much. The most serious consider success in other than financial ways - in the quality of their work.

Kevin has never stopped being an active artist and has been continuing to make art at home while working at Sony. One room in the house here was designated as his art studio. He has never been good at the financial aspect of it, however, and I think he will try to make art that will appeal to galleries and clients in Coachella Valley once we move there permanently. He does not expect it to be a major source of income and wants to find part time work, which might be difficult, or else work remotely ideally.

I'm sorry that you're dealing with this big change that was not of your planning or control. Uncertainty is always the hard part but it sounds like you both have it well under control and will figure it all out and make it work beautiful for you.

I don't have any suggestions, but look forward to seeing what you decide.

Lars I was thinking of you this morning and hadn't seen an update in a while, how's it going?

The financial advisor that was supposed to call us Thursday night did not call, and I got an email from her to reschedule, but I did not see that until just now.

We have an appointment with the real estate agent for Feb 28 for a walk-through, and it is going to take me a while to get the house ready.

We're going to Cathedral City this evening and will be there for two weeks, during which time we will try to make more space for things we will be moving.

Kevin's anxiety has gone down a bit, and he is starting to think of ways that he can get a job to work remotely, possibly in customer service, but I'm pretty sure that he would have to interview in person to get such a job. At Sony, his clients included Amazon, Walmart, Target, and Best Buy. Best Buy was the first of these to stop stocking DVDs. Anyway, Kevin has a lot of experience with inventory management and also managed several employees below him.

Hope things will go well for both of you. If you’re not yet sure to sell the house, you may want to try a short term leasing to see if you feel comfortable, if not then list it.

Lars, i just learned this while putting my mother’s house on the market. The comps (comparable houses, recently sold, im sure you know that) are generated by software. Ask the realtor to look at them his/her self.

Im so sorry you two are going through this. Dont make too many decisions too quickly while you are both somewhat stunned by the sudden change. Things always seem to work out, one way or the other.

Lars, you and what I've heard you tell of your brother seem like real go-getters! I have no doubt that things will be fine! Your brother will probably be able to find a good job with all his experience with no problem. Seems that after covid, employers have gotten a lot better about not passing over the older people because we are dependable and experienced! Something that employers had lost sight of pre-covid.