Is it a "waste of space" or is it "room for the inhabitants to walk" ;)

Post a measured layout of your space a la the "New to Kitchens" read me post, to get substantive advice.

Speaking as someone whose kitchen is smaller than yours and doesn't even have a window, lol, I think both ideas have promise but the measurements matter.

Welcome to the Kitchens Forum!

We'd like to help, but we need more information to start.

First - what is your budget? Major changes will likely require a significant amount of money.

Next - See the "New to Kitchens? Read Me First!" thread, especially the Featured Answer. This thread describes the process as well as discusses what information we need to help you. E.g., we will need a fully-measured layout and a sketch of the entire floor the Kitchen is on, not just a snippet.

^^

NO screen shots, use jpegs

Add pictures of your reality, lights on , daylight

Neat, tidy, BOLD legible use graph paper

Show the WHOLE, all angles

If the kitchen is dark, turn on the lights. Not every room can be well lit with just natural light, hence a lighting plan. The problem is the location of the slider (is that what it is?). It limits cabinet and furniture placement.

all five windows in this part of the property are undersized.....kitchen lighting gets upgraded wiith kitchen renovation though. the 5 windows are a question as to their size / separate issue in reality. With all things like walls/ windows remaining as shown I''d run a galley in order to eliminate corners.[ 3 corners - in your 2nd plan /no no no ]...Galley kitchen with left wall for stove and fridge...opposite side comes off wall between window and patio door..all drawers/ sink here and overhang for stools.....Dining room??? widen opening? or extend kitchen there is alternative........But given a good basic galley kitchen, no corners..... use small wall [laundry rm wall ] for a shallow pantry or coffee bar/entertainment setup....a nice bonus.

Do you have a budget range in mind or are you in the gathering ideas stage?

To start no island it works as a barrier . Waht is the top pic showing us ? Space for walking is not wasted . A to scale floor plan is what we need you have been sent to the place where it tells you how to do that. I agree lighting is a must in every kitchen regardless of natural light . I like all LED 4000K bulbs in kitchens . Kithen renos cost money so some clue as to budget . Change just for the sake of change is rarely a good idea. you need to have a good plan. THat patio door will eat a big part of any budget

With the 200K+ type invasive project that you have in mind, your first stop is a paid professional kitchen designer who works with a contractor as Design Build.

Consider a large window over the sink. Will it look out on something attractive?

Large Window Over Sink · More Info

I refined the plan from earlier widening the kitchen window, swapped the DW and sink to provide more space between the butts of the people who are cooking and doing dishes or prep and moved the range a foot toward the sink to allow a bit more room between the fridge and the range. I also had an upper in my previous kitchen over the peninsula next to the sink. I kept glasses and paper plates in that cupboard so my husband could get a drink or snack without coming into the workspace while I was cooking.

This is a picture of my old kitchen to give you a visual of what it looked like.

This picture is very helpful. Thank you Jennifer, for sharing. It seems like your old kitchen is very large.

About the lack of natural light and light in general:

1)

Have you considered a Solatube skylight? THey run a few hundred dollars for a simple installation in my area.

2) Replacing the old melon-style light with a close to the ceiling (seim-flush) fixture with three 60-watt equivalent or two 100-watt equivalent LED bulbs would brighten up the room enormously. Many selections under $200 or so available.

https://www.lampsplus.com/products/possini-euro-deco-collection-16-inch-wide-warm-brass-bowl-ceiling-light__1f903.html

Your island looks like it is just in the way. I'd get rid of it. Your second design withe the blue highlighter is, frankly a stupid design. In a space you call "cramped," you have two different seating arrangements right next to each other. You'll never use both at once.

In design #3, the "waste of space" circle is the space that allows you to move around your kitchen. It still has too much seating, but at least it won't feel as cramped.

SImilar 1 and 3 are bigger than similar 4.

Idle conjecture until

a measure as asked above:)

You aren't understanding that humans require space and circulation movement. You cannot cram a kitchen full of crapola and it still be usable. The island is more than half the issue. Frankly, I get the feeling that you are the other half of the issue in the kitchen, and that no one has ever walked you through a time and motion study of how you actually work in a kitchen. You must have all kinds if inefficiencies built in to your workflow that need correcting.

@ HU-403443659 - My last kitchen wasn't much larger that what you have. It was 10 x 14.5
Your kitchen is 10x12, but your kitchen doesn't have the door to the garage on the back wall, so you may actually have a bit more actual workspace. The soffit in my old kitchen demarks a 10x10 kitchen.

Your kitchen is a great candidate for this design and I guarantee it will feel so much bigger without the bottom of the G and without the island in the middle.

Before I renovated my last kitchen (not a gut - just cosmetic - it had uppers on the wall where the peninsula is with the ones at the end that went from counter to ceiling - leaving a service window opening to the other room. Lost a few cabinets, but it was worth it to have something that felt better and worked better.

That long, wide peninsula was used for everything. Baking cookies and having the kids on stools decorating them or the kids doing homework while I cooked dinner. A place to lay out material for a new dress or curtains. A place to set the puzzle board where everyone could reach and help. It was our main dining area and main space friends to come and sit.

I really miss that kitchen.

The most used workspace in a kitchen is the prep space between sink and range. Any good design tries to maximize that space. And it doesn’t put obstacles in the way of the path to the refrigerator. Counter space in the wrong spots does not make a kitchen work better. It just makes places for unused junk to accumulate.

start w that 12 foot wall..your most ample wall....Jennifer Hogans plan is a good start.....youll be able to have an aisle wider than this......but the sink has a few options for location....and you acquire overhang for seats. I would do a straight galley with two runs opposite each other and no coners but you can make a U if you want. you'll have to decide at some point about the opening to dining but this does not interfere w that decision process. Do you need inspiration pics, or time w graph paper , or going over budget or what ?

Traditional Kitchen · More Info

For those that didn't notice, this is actually the floor plan:

In order to get help beyond general concepts, the 114"x147" dimensions are not adequate. It requires more and marked up on a drawing as indicated by the "read me kitchens" thread.

But first, it seems like you are very, very early in this process. Like generally frustrated, and finally clicked that you want to act on it. However, there are 30 different directions this could take. So to help you form this project, other pertinent information would be helpful. For instance:

- A little deeper insight to goals, including budget. Because just saying "dark," "outdated," or "clutter" is too generic.

As examples, for "dark," the low window (caused by a 9' ceiling) allows more prominent shadows above the cabinets. The bulkiness of the shutters exacerbates blocking natural light. So no shutters, or adding a transom, could help that. Or opening up the back wall with bifolds, could be a $50K+ project unto itself, and I'm guessing you are in Canada from the Builder's "Parlour" spelling, so a bi-fold door may not be worth the price. The single boob light does not help at night. So, is it just the wood color, the lighting, the window, all of it?

For "outdated," maybe switching out laminate, getting new hardware, and stainless appliances is enough. Or maybe you want shaker style or inset. Is the flooring, house furniture, street exterior, deck, etc also outdated? Will the kitchen be on par with the house, it's bellweather, or unicorn?

For "clutter," that may mean everything has a hidden place, so lots of cabinets or a huge Pantry. Or it may mean in reference to design, so you don't want upper cabinets along a prominent wall. Is it regarding "stuff" or minimalism?

- The thread has run with a peninsula, but you have not stated that you would like to eliminate the Breakfast table, and still show it in your sketches. So your way of living in this house might determine if you should open up the wall to the Dining Room. It could also determine if having an island is a dealbreaker for your family. It could determine if an addition is more appropriate.

- The hallway soffit is probably because of a header. There is a second floor which eliminates a Solatube suggestion and explains why there would be a header. But that keys in on why it stands out to you, do you want to open up the Kitchen to front or upstairs circulation more? Make the Kitchen more physically central to the home?

- The above are just big concept ideas, you still have the kitchen. Like evaluating your cooking style and needs, and family/guest interaction with that. That would determine storage, appliances, how you move and

Edit: hmm, lost the last paragraphs. Oh well, you get the gist.

Here's an example of what we're asking for:

And from the "New to Kitchens? Read Me First!" thread:

Please post a fully-measured layout of the space under consideration and a sketch of the entire floor. Both can be either hand-drawn, computer generated, or drawn up with computer/app tools.

By "fully-measured", we mean a layout with the widths of each wall/window/door/doorway and the distances between each wall/window/door/doorway labeled. See a sample above. If something cannot be moved or changed, label it precisely on your layout (see post in sample) and tell us why it cannot be moved/changed -- we may have some ideas for you.

The sketch of the entire floor lets us see how the Kitchen relates to the rest of the home. It doesn't have to be to-scale, but it should accurately show how the rooms relate to each other and should include all interior & exterior doors. In addition, it will help us see how traffic flows in, around, and through the Kitchen. Label the front entry and family entry. The family entry is usually a garage or side entry, but it might not be. It's helpful to know which door you use to bring in groceries.

Regardless of how you draw it up (by hand, computer, etc.), please be sure all measurements are labeled. (Note: Computer generated layouts often lack key measurements and, sometimes, measure to/from things like the middle of a wall or the middle of a window. Neither are useful. Measure each item and the distances between each item.)

Other questions...

• Tell us about you and your family and how you plan to use your Kitchen. All-adults? Empty Nesters? Children (now or in the future)?
• What appliances (& their sizes) do you plan to have?
• Where are you flexible? Can walls/windows/doors/doorways change (move, change size, add, delete)?
• Do you have a basement under the Kitchen or are you on a slab?

I am sorry for making so many mistakes. Thank you Buehl for helping me. I hope that I adressed all your notes. As for future sizes and plans for future appliances, I have none and will appreciate any recommendations you can provide.

No need to be sorry. We don't expect people, especially new people, to know right off the bat what's needed. We just keep asking until we get enough information to help! I will look at the additional info in the original post that you added over the next couple of days. (I'm also working on my Kitchen!)

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of a 12-14 foot glass sliding/ bifold door. Sigrid suggested that this is a bad idea but I don't know why. I was hoping for something like this picture. Maybe the kitchen is just too small? Wrong style? Is it just bad design?

A 28K door, plus reengineering the entire home's support for that span, which will probably be another 28K???? Are you nuts? Get a better kitchen design first. Then think about adding windows or doors that fit around the kitchen design.

Some questions:

1. Special needs - does that include wheelchair or other mobility issues? (I.e., does the Kitchen need to be designed for someone in a wheelchair, using a walker, etc.)?
2. I understand you replaced all the windows three years ago, but are you willing to modify the Kitchen window - move it and/or make it bigger? You didn't explicitly state windows could change & they're relatively new, that's why I'm asking.
3. Do you need both a Dining Room & Breakfast Area? Can you extend the Kitchen into the Breakfast area?
4. Would you be willing to change out the patio door to a single, 36"W door? (That would give you more room to work with on the "top" wall.)
5. What is the view out the Kitchen window?
6. Range - I recommend going with an induction range for safety's sake. It's difficult to accidentally turn on a burner and have it work. They don't work unless there's an induction-compatible item on them.

Edited to add: I see a fully-measured layout is now in the original post.

I dont mind the u shape design you have right now, but, that island should never been put there, and it needs to go.

What would be helpful now is the answers to the above questions.

Thank you Buehl . Please see the answers to your questions below.

1. Special needs? - vision challenges.

2. Modify the Kitchen window? - yes

3. Dining Room & Breakfast Area? - I use both areas. The dining room has a table with 6 chairs, and the kitchen has a table with 6 chairs. I am willing to extend the kitchen into the breakfast area.

4. Change out the patio door to a single, 36"W door? - yes

5. View? - Backyard with trees and a fragrant garden.

6. Induction range? - This seems like a good idea.