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dibbit

tree suggestions

18 years ago

I need to plant along my back boundary, which runs approximately ENE by WSW - the neighbors are planning to build, and have put their drive along the property line, off about 40' at the closest and then veering off at the end to a couple of hundred yds, to where their house site is. The beginning of the drive is not visible from the house, and there is a small grove of (Virginia?) pines along the property line anyway. There is rather less than a quarter mile that is clearly visible through trees that already grow along the fence line (ranging from oaks, pines, persimmon, sweetgum, tulip poplar and a stand of sumac [that I keep under control by bush-hogging, or it would be 3 times as large]). My house is sited about 100 yds from the property line. I think I want to plant a double row of loblolly pines, and in front of that a mix of red cedar, oaks, etc.. I have some oaks already in pots (mostly water and willow oaks) and will have more come spring that I can dig out of flowerbeds, as well as tulip poplar and dogwoods, and may be able to get more beech from a neighbor, but would like more, and more "decorative", trees along the front of the planting - I will see most of this from the house, after all. I imagine that with leaves on the trees, there will be less visible, but right now, it is quite obtrusive!

I really would like trees that can block noise and dust, as well as sight of the drive and house - I assume the drive will be gravel, but it may be asphalt - BUT, there is also one section of about 25 yds. where I have a small area of mountain view in the winter, which I would like to keep, so would like to have short evergreens and tall deciduous trees there. I don't know if I am asking the impossible, and may as well resign myself to losing my winter view down the road as trees grow up and block it. I do have 3 ginkgos planted at the far corner, and want to leave them room to be specimen trees, if possible - I think there is enough screen there already, anyway, and they won't block my mountain view.

I MAY be able to talk the neighbors into sharing the purchase of trees, and planting along their side of the line as well. If I can, then I won't have to plant in as wide an area on my side of the property line, which would be nice. My septic system leach field runs between the house and the fence, so I can't plant too thickly along the closest section of the property line.

I thank you in advance for any and all suggestions. I hope I was clear in my description, but since I KNOW what I mean, if it isn't clear, I'll try again...

Comments (21)

  • 18 years ago

    For the area where you want screening, consider adding Wax Myrtle to your mix. For the area where you have a mountain view, I think the tulip poplar would be a good choice because it drops its leaves so early in the season. Of course as you said, you may not need anything additional there.

    Loblolly pines are a good initial choice while other things grow in - they are easy to remove later (even a 20 footer can be taken down with little effort) if you decide the screening is too heavy or the other trees have grown enough.

  • 18 years ago

    This tree (link, below) has caught the interest of many posting here, as can be seen by searching the forums. It won't do much for noise - no vegetation does - and if you've watched a vehicle drive by plantings dust blows right through also. For noise you need something like one of the tall concrete walls they are putting up along freeways where I live. Without that kind of height and solidity, you are pretty much stuck with the din.

    Here is a link that might be useful: The U.S. National Arboretum presents Thuja 'Green Giant', a large, evergreen

  • 18 years ago

    Bboy, 'GG' is not one of my favorite trees - I may add a few into the mix, if I can find them at a reasonable price. I like them better than Leylands, but that's not saying much! However, I REALLY do not want a green wall running down my fenceline, which is why I am looking at a mixed planting, with the loblollies in the far side/middle. I do have 2 3-gal. 'Emerald Green', which I will grow in pots for a few years, and then plant out as visual blocking for a virulent yellow house next door. Same for 2 Cryptomeria 'Yoshino', although if they don't start looking better - they were cheap at the end-of-season last fall - they may go to the back fence line!

    One of the reasons I am considering the loblollies and cedars in combination is that when a conservation development of 1200 acres went in less than a mile down the road, they planted loblollies in rows (from 3 to 8 rows, depending on space available and where house sites were) along the perimeter and to block noise and light from I-26 (and the SC Welcome Center) which runs along part of it for half a mile or so, on advice from SC Dep't of Forestry and independent foresters. The red cedars were planted as a single row in front of the loblollies in some areas, for the looks as well as for the blocking. In the past 6 years, the loblollies have gone from tiny seedlings to large trees, about 10-15'. No supplemental watering was done, but most seem to have survived. The cedars didn't do as well, but most seem to be growing. Since there is a large, and growing deer herd(s) in there, I assume that the deer are finding plenty of other things to eat - I hope, since the herds sort of mingle, that the ones that frequent my property haven't learned to like eating the pines and cedars either. I know they may rub on them; they have already killed off 3 arborvitaes for me, planted as blocking along the road!

    I am thinking about using tree shelters for some of the hardwoods I want to put in as well, since the deer's preferred path runs along that fence line - they do also get into the pasture, my vegetable garden, and the blueberriess, but.... I think some of the hardwoods will be more attractive to deer and rabbits than the pines and cedars, so would NEED the protection. I may, depending on cost, go with wire....

  • 18 years ago

    Dibbit... Have you considered some magnolia grandifloras? They make a great natural fence and grow pretty fast once they get going.

    Savannah holly and other hollys, are also good evergreen view blockers.

    Terry

  • 18 years ago

    Terry, magnolias are on my want list, and hopefully can stay there. Hollies are also, just to add to the mix, although I may add in I. vomitoria, since it's native.

    Bboy, there will be the construction noise which I am NOT looking forward to, but once that's done I hope that since they will be retiring here that the noise from kids will be minimal. Dogs, well, they will have to put up with my hound barking, so I guess I'll put up with theirs. And if they are the type to have loud screaming arguments outside, I can crank up the boom box and put on the Ring Cycle to drown them out! Since it will be one retired couple on 25 acres, I trust the din will be not much - I just want to screen out visually, and as much audially (auditory?) as I can.

    His brother and sister-in-law, with 2 teenage girls, live on the 25 acres adjoining the far side - I sometimes hear their dogs (6, mostly rescues), and the kids in the pool in summer. Since SIL is very conservation minded, I think she would object as much as me to ATVs, and the like, so doubt they will happen.

  • 18 years ago

    If you want something a little different from Loblolly you could plant Spruce pine (P.glabra). They don't seem to get quite as tall.

    {{gwi:328055}}

  • 18 years ago

    Alabama, I've got two little spruce pines in containers that I'm growing to plant out when they fill up their 3-gallon containers. Have you ever grown any yourself? Do they grow fast or slow or what? I've always loved their look - the foliage is thicker than loblollies.
    Sherry

  • 18 years ago

    Sherry, I have never grown one myself. I may eventually order one or two though. From what I have read they are actually shade tolerant, so growing them among hardwoods would be no problem. I get the feeling they will grow a bit slower than Loblolly, just because of the fact that I don't see them in wild areas nearly as often. All of the ones I see around here look to be intentionally planted, like the one in the photo.

  • 18 years ago

    ATH, I will add P. glabra to my list, it looks like a good addition. Thanks for the suggestion.

    I have to refine the list a bit, and then see what the SC Forestry has available. I may order from Indian Mound as well, and from some of the more retail suppliers also - there are only so many bundles of 25, 50 or 100 trees I can plant in my space after all.

  • 18 years ago

    ATH, I looked up P. galbra, and it may not grow well for me - it seems to want sandy soil, and mine, for the most part, is clay. It supports Virginia pine quite well, but I'm not sure if the spruce pine will like the amount of clay I usually have. My soils range from solid, sticky clay, to a mix with sand - over where I want to plant may in fact be sandier - I'll have to go dig a few holes - as soon as the ground thaws out!.

  • 18 years ago

    There are quite a few old spruce pines that look intentionally planted around here - all the soils in this area, except creekside, are clay with varying amounts of topsoil on top. So, even though the only place I see what appears to be naturally growing spruce pines is in gritty creekside soils, they must tolerate clay pretty well. I don't know how long it took the planted ones to reach their size - not too long, I hope!
    Sherry

  • 18 years ago

    Here's a young P. glabra growing in "pure" red clay...It survived the drought but experienced 10 F(12.2 C) this morning....It's much to early access possible damage.

    {{gwi:328056}}

  • 18 years ago

    Most of my soil is heavy clay. The tree in that photo is just one mile down the road so I'm sure that soil is probably clay too.

  • 18 years ago

    Is the specimen ATH posted typical for Spruce Pine? I don't know a thing about them (waaay outside of my zone), but that is a really nice looking pine. If they all take the form of that one, I'm thinking it must be a pretty popular tree.

  • 18 years ago

    Basic, all the ones that grow in people's yards have that form, but then they're all growing in fairly open areas. In the crowded, wooded areas where they naturally grow, they aren't that dense. They can tolerate shade, but they become much more beautiful in a mostly sunny situation - they have darker needles than most other pines.
    I looked up pinus glabra in my best tree book, and it says that they grow rapidly - great!
    Sherry

  • 18 years ago

    That large P. glabra in the yard is a GREAT looking tree! Reminds me just a bit of some P.strobus that develope a low, squatty form in the open. Who wouldn't welcome a tree like that to their yard?

    +oM

  • 18 years ago

    Everything that has been suggested so far is a coastal plain tree. Maybe Dibbit can clarify but I thought she was in the "upstate" region of SC. NEeding to pay particular attention to cold hardiness and performance.

  • 18 years ago

    Yes, I am in the upstate, nearly at the NC line and where Spartanburg and Greenville Counties come together. I do think that the Spruce pine, lovely though it is, may be marginal. A couple of the sites I looked at about it said z7, but more said z8. While the zones are supposed to be recalculated, and I will probably become a warmer z8, I don't know if I will trust the pundits for the moment!

    While I don't get the cold that further west and north in the mountains get, I am not in the thermal belt either - my SIL's mother, on the other side of Landrum (to the west) by about 6 miles, is much warmer than I am - her first, light frost of the fall is usually my killing frost, after several lighter frosts.

    I do have to think about cold - the temperature on my porch was 11F at the coldest morning so far this winter - GSP Airport reported 18, so there is a difference between the official temperatures and the actual ones I have!

  • 18 years ago

    What grows in the woods close to you? I'd plant some of the shrubs and trees that grow there.
    Sherry

  • 18 years ago

    I won't suggest specific trees, since zone 7 is just a bit different from what I've got here. (As I write this, the temperature outside with wind chill is -50)

    Many people fail to see landscaping with trees as dynamic. Plant once and forget. I recently had a customer who wanted a hundred white spruce to plant on 8' intervals aon either side of his driveway. I told him that this was a mistake. They would look cute for a few years, look like a hedge of christmas trees for a few years, and in 20 years his driveway would be a dark canyon.

    A better way to approach this would be multiple rows, with more space between them. I suggested that he alternate spruce with 'Dart's Gold' ninebark, the ninebark being in front of the spaces in the spruce. The shrub would grow quickly and add interest while the trees were small. Later, the yellow leaves would add brightness, and be a sharp contrast to the dark bottom branches of the spruce.

    I think this is generally a good idea. A solid row of anything looks funny if one is slower growing, or dies. Alternation adds contrast. I have one side of my driveway lined with shrubs. Originally I put in lilacs with large spaces. Then I put a cotoneaster between each lilac. Then I put a potentilla between each cotoneaster and lilac, but the potentillas alternate with two abbotsford (white) and coronation triumph (yellow). At each end there is a bog rosemary.

    At another point on the driveway each side goes Bog rosemary, darts gold nine bark, diablo ninebark, darts, diablo, rocky mountain juniper, purple twig dogwood, sea buckthorn, purple twig, buckthorn, rosemary. So ther is an irregular height climaxing at the juniper. The purple of the diablo echos the purple twig, but the buckthorn is grey green compared to the bright yellow of darts gold. Patterns of broken symetry.

    For trees, you have to be very patient to do it all at once.
    Some of the trees would be short lived, fast growing trees. Others would grow into the space left when the live-hard-die-young ones shuffled off this mortal coil.

    So, for example, put in a row of willows or poplar. In your climate willows should block the view of vehicles in a couple years. Willows, poplar and birch have invasive roots. Keep 70 feet away from septic field. (Candidates for HIS side of the fence?) Willow and poplar are diocious. Male plants are less trouble. Spruces are generally shallow rooted, and probably won't disturb the septic field. They will grow quite tall. Perhaps plant a pair of them where they will frame your mountain view when mature.

    One of the advantages of willow is that when it gets ratty looking, you just cut it off a few inches above the ground, and it will regenerate into a good looking hedge in a summer. Willows have a huge range of height, stem color.


  • 18 years ago

    Why plant a spruce pine when you can plant a spruce?
    Are you at a high elevation? If so maybe the native red spruce? I don't think anyone has brought up hemlocks, birches and maples. Too ordinary I guess.