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Struggling with two incompatible elderly dogs

18 years ago

I'm being driven mad by two dogs that I love.

Angel is a 14-year-old Briard (or Briard mix...we found her as a puppy). She's never been very tolerant of other dogs, and she's had the house more or less to herself for a long time.

Wolfy is a 12-year-old husky-shepherd. My late daughter adopted him from the shelter when he was around two. Since his housetraining has never been all that reliable, he used to spend most of his nights outside in a doghouse. When he was in the house during the day (or on cold nights), we kept the two dogs on separate floors.

Wolfy has developed arthritis, and I knew I couldn't keep him outdoors for any significant period this winter. Plus he injured his paw this fall and had to stay indoors for that. So he's moved into the house permanently.

It took a couple of months before I could leave both dogs in the same room. Angel is profoundly deaf now, and sleeps a lot, but she's quick to express her anger if Wolfy bugs her. And Wolfy is the buggiest of dogs. He bugs me constantly....nudging my arm whenever I land in a chair .....standing when I stand, following me from room to room ......click-click-click go his nails on the wood floor. He bugs Angel by sniffing her and always being in her face. Or her butt. He has never been a laid-back dog.

They always seem to be aware of each other in a challenging way, and I think it's getting worse. I can't feed Wolfy his old treats because Angel's stomach can't handle them and the last thing we need around here is a food fight. (I feed them their meals in separate rooms, door closed.) But even when each dog has a stuffed toy, they seem to be jealous and want the other one. Today the two of them arrived at the water bowl at the same time and had a physical confrontation. I was standing right there so I stopped it immediately. But yesterday the same thing happened over something else, and Angel has a small laceration on her nose as a result.

At night I cut open a black plastic bag and lay it on the kitchen floor covered with newspapers. Wolfy is fairly good about using it. He stays downstairs, and Angel sleeps upstairs. Most of the time she manages the stairs okay. I don't know what I'll do if and when she can't.

I just want them to have some peace in their old age.....and me, too, in mine. It gets very tense around here from the effort of keeping them from doing each other harm. Any suggestions? I'm tired!

Thanks,

Susan

Comments (19)

  • 18 years ago

    Suggestion #1 Give Wolfy more exercise. E.G. long walks, treadmill, games, and so on. That is what Wolfy is trying to tell you when you sit down is that he wants needs to play. What you didn't realize all those years he was in a doghouse outisde was that his breeds need lots and lots of exercise and they get bored very easily that can lead to trouble and unwanted behaviors.

    Suggestion #2 Try to housetrain Wolfy and by that I mean potty outside not on plastic bag.

    Suggestion #3 Don't leave plastic bags laying around on the floor they are a hazard especially to bored dogs.

    I'm sure you will get other suggestions.

  • 18 years ago

    Thanks for your input. The need for exercise is a good point, and I'm not unaware of it. In fact, I meant to ask for suggestions re boredom when I posted last night. I've been trying to think of things I can do with him. He never cared much for fetching a ball or other toy. He loves to catch treats that I toss to him, and he LOVES snuggling with me on the sofa.

    Despite his medication, Wolfy's arthritis (in his front legs) makes walking awkward, so our walks have never been all that long, at least not in recent months. But the winter weather curtailed them even further. The ice on our property is treacherous, and in the past few weeks our "walks" have consisted of me taking them out the back door on a 20-ft. leash. It's unfortunate, but the best I can do right now.

    As for house training, is that even a possiblity at his age? I've house-trained a lot of dogs, and my daughter and I gave it our best shot with Wolfy, but never fully succeeded. During the day he lets me know when he has to go out, but nighttime is another story.

  • 18 years ago

    Invest in a few baby gates. Just keeping these 2 out of each others' hair will help while you pursue other tactics. We've had Jack Russell Terriers for 15 years, and there have been so many times when they come in so useful for timeouts, feeding separately, handling little snits, sanity breaks for us, and so forth.

    Years ago we invested in a couple of wall-mounted steel gates with one-handed latches that are unobstrusive and problem-free (I think we got them from Drs. Foster & Smith.) Much easier to use than those accordion-folding wooden temporary ones that you have to set and reset every time you use them.

    The baby gates (one between the foyer/basement and the kitchen, and the other between the kitchen and the family room) give us several zones to play with. The dogs can see through the gates, so it's not like they are being banished to solitary confinement in a separate room. Our two even learned the command "Switcheroo!" and we'd open the gate between the kitchen and the family room, and they would squeeze past each other to get into their new rooms.

    Good luck with your two oldsters. Older dogs can get very set in their ways. My 15-year-old (who we just had to put down due to cancer/seizures) was a nudge who used to wander endlessly and drive the 10-year-old nuts by invading her space, sniffing her while she was sleeping, and just generally pushing her buttons. Just the tic-tic-tic of the old girl's claws coming down the hallway would start a throaty growl in the younger dog and she would stalk off in a huff.

    These 2 are probably never going to become buddies, so I would forget about them both being able to be in possession of toys together in the same room, or eating treats together. Regarding the confrontation at the water bowl, why not put out another water bowl in a different location? I worked with horses years ago, and learned that if you have 3 horses in a paddock together, put the hay out in 4 piles - that way, the lowest horse on the totem pole always has a pile to go to when he/she gets chased off by the others.

    Ditto on the suggestion to increase the exercise the younger dog is getting. I found that getting out of the house and spending some exclusive quality time with each dog individually helped a lot with the jealousy and competitiveness between my two. I'd take the older one out for a gentle stroll where we would be sure to run into some nice friendly people, and then take the younger, much more athletic dog out for a major outing in the woods where she could run, hunt for squirrels, dig holes, etc. The dog who got left home alone got over it really quickly and seemed to enjoy a nice uninterrupted nap while I was gone with the other one.

    Good luck,
    Susan

  • 18 years ago

    Even tho Wolfie has arthritis, walking/exercise will be good for him. Is your yard not fenced? Is he on meds for the arthritis?

    Be careful with the plastic bags since you could slip and fall if you step on them! Plus, your dog may be hesitant to use the pee-pad you made because it's not secure under his feet.

    Wolfie's traits sound more like Husky to me, based on what I've seen in my neighbor's Husky. Difficult to house train and always nudging them!

  • 18 years ago

    Thanks, Susan and Ann. The open floor plan of my house makes it difficult to use gates, but I'll check out that metal one for my stairs. Right now I close the stairs door, but that blocks heat circulation.

    Yes, Wolfy is very much a Husky in temperment. And looks, too. The yard isn't fenced, and when he was younger he used to take off at every opportunity. These days he doesn't have quite as much wanderlust, but I'm still reluctant to let him off the leash for fear he'll head for the road. Previous dogs were good about staying on the property (we have 31 acres) and close to the house, but not Angel and Wolfy.

    Yes, he's on Previcox for the arthritis. Expensive stuff ($2 a pill), but it's made a big difference for him.

    He's good about using the pee-pad for the most part, although the whole process isn't quite as neat as it used to be. Plus Angel's flawless housetraining has undergone a bit of a reversal in her old age, so let's just say I do a lot of floor cleaning these days.

    Here's Wolfy and Angel. Wolfy first:

    and Angel:

  • 18 years ago

    I would echo the recommendation for baby gates, if possible. I can also recommend the Foster & Smith Level 3 joint supplement for Wolfie. My 15 yo Catahoula mix has been taking it for about a year now and it has made a huge difference in her ability to get around. She needs Rimadyl when the weather is cold and damp but in warm weather the supplement alone keeps her going.
    Angel looks more like a deerhound or wolfhound than Briard to me.

  • 18 years ago

    I thought about that when I put up her picture. In that shot, especially, she doesn't look much like a Briard. But she sure did when she was young. I had never heard of the breed, but someone pointed it out to me and I eventually sent her picture to a Briard breeder for her opinion. She thought she was a purebred with a flawed chest. (It isn't supposed to be white.) We've wondered if Angel was abandoned for that reason, and because of her heart defect. She's taken medication for it all her life. She's outlived most Briard life expectancies, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's some hybrid vigor there.

    I'll check out the joint supplement--thanks very much!

  • 18 years ago

    There are gates available for wide openings - I've been looking into them myself, wanting to enclose an area that has a 6' opening. Let me know if you want info on what I've found so far.

  • 18 years ago

    As for wolfie, Put him on a regular schedule of play, work, affection, potty and feeding. This will also require you to more than likely follow more or less the same schedule too to make it easy if you spend a lot of time at home.
    I think this is the key to not getting annoyed during dinner by a dog that insists on playing or eating or whatever.
    I don't know much about ice or sever winter weather but it sounds like you could benefit from a doggie treadmill. I haven't used one myself but it sounds like a good way to exercise a dog in inclement weather. Obedience training is a good way to exercise wolfie's noggin. You get get the dog a backpack and put several water bottles in it and have him walk around the house with it. Teach him to do something. It sounds like you live on a farm, isn't there some job you can give these dogs? Do you have any stairs in your house? You can train dogs to walk up and down stairs for food rewards. They seem to enjoy that although I'm not sure why. Do you have a basement or somewhere you can walk around or play fetch with them?

    You can teach an old dog new tricks, it's breaking bad habits that can be challenging. So need to go back to puppy mode and confine wolfie to a crate or bedroom until it's potty time. Our potty times around here are first thing in the morning, again after breakfast, then at 4:30-6p or on walk which is 6:00-7p then they eat dinner at 8:30 and potty after that then potty again right before bedtime.
    Right after you take him out of his confined space, potty immediately in the yard, you must put on a coat and take him out on leash and wait for it to occur then praise with excited baby talk and pop a food treat in his mouth.
    Hopefully he'll get the idea after a while. If he can learn to go on a bag then he can learn to go in the bushes.

    For the husky I would suggest no less than an hour and a half of exercise per day. That probably sounds like a lot. And it is. That's a tough dog to manage. They were meant to pull sleds for days and days not to be housepets. Snuggling alone isn't going to satisfy his need to work and think.

  • 18 years ago

    Dang I don't have any other suggestions for you. How about building a "second" house? Okay that is a joke that I hope made you laugh. You are in a difficult position. Is Wolfy crate trained? That could give Angel a reprieve from getting sniffed all the time.

  • 18 years ago

    It's not too late to get Wolfie on glucosamine chondroitin if he isn't taking it already. You might also give it to Angel. It helps to rebuild and perhaps Wolfie can get to a point where he's less dependent on the NSAIDs. My older guy got completely off of the NSAIDs after 2 or 3 months of G/C. He runs like a puppy, and has only an occasional stiff morning. It's not a panacea, but may be of help.

    You can use an x-pen as a 'fence' across a wide door way, or use it to keep each dog in specific areas of the room. I use one to keep healthy dogs from accidently bumping sick dogs in my house. Very flexible configs.

  • 18 years ago

    Everyone has talked about Wolfy and forgot Angel.

    You said she is 14, has had the house to herself, not tolerent of other dogs, sleeps a lot and is deaf.

    My guess is Angel doesn't like Wolfy in her house for one thing. Second thing, she cant hear him walk up behind her, he is just there. Her humans at least pet her and let her know they didn't mean to scare her.

    He moved in and drinks and eats from her dishes and takes her humans attentions and she doesn't understand why the world is silent.

    Arthritis can be helped to some point. Angel will still be deaf, doesn't understand why and her humans love this other dog more.

    You do you know, you talk more about Wolfy and posted his photo first. Angel feels that you know.

  • 18 years ago

    You do you know, you talk more about Wolfy and posted his photo first. Angel feels that you know.

    That's not quite fair, Gammy. I posted Wolfy's picture first because we were talking about his Husky qualities. We were talking about him because he is the squeakiest wheel and the one who is bugging the hell out of me.

    Wolfy is special to me because he's a wonderful dog and because he is such a strong connection to my daughter Jill, who died six years ago. Angel is special to me because she's a wonderful dog and because she has been my loyal, protective, and fun companion for 14 years.

    You make some good points about Angel's reaction to Wolfy, and I appreciate that. But her human does not love the other dog more, and I think you're out of line for saying that.

  • 18 years ago

    The reason I didn't comment on Angel is because I am not familiar with that dog's problems. An in-home consultation with a behaviorist might be good to evaluate the situation and suggest ways to re-introduce the dogs to one another. I also think that once wolfie is dealt with, he will be more calm around the house and this problem with angel being annoyed by him might go away.

    If I had 31 acres, I would find some place to dig a hole. Then I'd wrap some food treats in a paper towel and bury it in the hole and backfill with dirt lightly. Then I would drop crumbs to leave an extra scent trail back to the house. I would then take your active dog and go outside with him on a leash and let him follow the scent back to buried treasure. Tracking and digging may not be as exciting to all breeds as it is for my dogs but it's a lot of fun for mine to track down the treasure and dig it up. It gives them an opportunity to uses their senses and their noggins and it's not that physically strenuous on me. I'd rather do that than a long walk. If I had as much land as you, I'd have some rather extensive trails and would set up lots buried treasures.

  • 18 years ago

    What a great idea! Right now the ground is frozen (and covered with snow and ice) and the temperature is 4º in the sun. But this is something I would love to do in the spring. If I can dig a hole to plant a rose, I can dig a hole for Wolfy. I'll bet he'd love it! I'm not sure Angel's up to it, but I could certainly find out. Thanks so much.

  • 18 years ago

    By the way, before you give Wolfy any extensive amount of exercise, I'd check with your vet. Many people on here jump to say "are you exercising/walking your dog enough" in response to mostly any issue. It's meant well, but it is our responsibility as owners to find out whether our dog's health issues can handle strenuous exercise...even harmless walks.

    My dog has back end weakness, and I wanted to increase her walking time and exercise to increase the muscle mass back there, but my vet strongly advised against it. He told me not to do more than a 20 minute walk a day, because otherwise she would be so worn out that she might not be able to walk for a day or more afterwards. Now that I think of it, he's right...the last time she went swimming she could barely move for 3 days!

    So a note for all who have dogs with health issues: check with your vet to make sure what and how much exercise is ok.

    Alisande, I wish you much luck with your situation.

  • 18 years ago

    I don't have any answers for the issue you face but I just want to say I am sorry. Geriatrics is difficult enough with our pets without the added problem of them not getting along. Good luck with both of your dogs and the situation you face. Oh and I agree Angel does look a lot like an Irish Wolfhound or Deerhound.

  • 18 years ago

    The buried treasure game is a great idea!

    Here's a variation: When we stack firewood in the fall, we make a separate stack in the fenced dog area and liberally lace the bottom layers with sunflower seeds. It becomes a mouse house in the winter, and provides hours of climbing and snooping fun. I can't say I've ever seen either of my terriers actually catch a mouse or chipmunk there, but they burn a lot of calories (physical AND mental!) trying. And the mice have a food source and some shelter under the frozen stack.

    Susan

  • 18 years ago

    Go get both of your dogs on pain medications - this is probably most of the problem - the Briard is probably in some pain and needs relief, once on a pain medication routine you can walk your dogs - this is a great way for you to establish yourself as a pack leader, and give the dogs the movement they need every day, collars up by the ears shouold prevent any issues with pulling excessive sniffing or other annoying habits. I firmly believe dogs pester people beacuse they were born to move and are not getting enough outside time. Especially a husky and a briard - both working dogs, husky being more primitive and the briard is a sheep dog - use to bossing others around....If you can not walk them find some other thing for them to do to get rid of all that pent up energy and let your dogs be dogs.

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