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chaolzp

Need help on kitchen remodel electric work

11 years ago

We are in the middle of our kitchen remodel and our GC just handed us an additional bill for electric work.

Originally, he quoted two things (as per original contract and his own wording):

1. Recess Lighting: install, including all required wiring, including all wiring of Romex cables (material & labor included) $159 per light (6" LED recessed)

2. GFCI outlets: move/add/change GFCI outlets including adjustable electrical box & Romex cables (material & labor included) $249 per outlet

We are not familiar with electrical work and thought these prices were not cheap, but assumed this meant it covered everything related to completing installation of these two types of items.

So his electrician came and worked for two days, and started reiterating that because we pulled the permit and want everything up to code, he had to rewire everything. Then he said that our original wires were all wrong, basically only one wire ran from the main panel to the whole kitchen, and additional wiring all branched off this one. Therefore, he said he had to redo it all and removed a great deal of sheetrock. During this whole time, neither him nor our GC informed us that this would involve increased costs...and then we were handed this bill:

1. Electrical Diagnostic: electrical inspection, diagnosis/remove&recycle old wiring, upgrade electrical wiring in kitchen to new code (title 24): $575

2. Run 4 new Romex wires from main panel for hood, two for small appliances, dishwasher, new gas stove: $245 per wire = $980

3. 10 GFCI outlets: $249 each = $2490

4. Sheetrock & frame: new sheetrock on effected area walls and ceiling, taping and mudding new sheetrock walls, texture walls and ceiling (material & labor included): $941

5. 18 recessed lights: $159 each = $2862

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So, my questions:

Is this ridiculous, especially for #1, 2, 4? We were able to get him to remove #1, but is it truly BS for what should be part of install as per original contract?

For GFCI and lights, do the cost go down as the number increases? Homewyse estimates suggest this.

What recourse/suggestions do you have if he is ripping us off?


Comments (10)

  • 11 years ago

    Does 'Title 24' mean California?

    Not sure why #1 and #2 would be separate since it seemed a full rewire was required to bring to code. And separate circuits as listed in #2 sounds about right.

    #3 depends where the GFCIs were going. Ten is a lot. You may have been able to conserve by using GFCI breakers for the 4 new circuits and skipped the GFCI outlets and used regular ones, depending on their price for installing regular outlets.


    I C thanked weedmeister
  • 11 years ago

    Thanks weedmeister.

    Yes, we are in the Bay Area of CA. So, for #2, is it right that they should "after the fact" realize that the wiring is the way it is (i.e. must walls be torn down to know this?) and must be redone?

    So the GC never mentioned the GFCI breakers option...he just said GFCIs are by code, and one is required every 4 feet, so that's what was put in for above counter, plus the behind counter ones for the fridge, oven, and dishwasher.

  • 11 years ago

    Title 24 primarily deals with putting higher efficiency lighting in, I think. So this amount is primarily to replace the ceiling fixtures with ones you can't stick incandescent bulbs in.

    Even if you use GFCI receptacles, you only need one per circuit, not 10 (but it's possible the electrician already figure this into the bid, it's not really 10xGFCI, but 2xGFCI plus 8 regular).

    I C thanked Ron Natalie
  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    GFCI outlets dont cost that much. Like... $10 each. Nope, not kidding either. Yes I understand they install them but installing an outlet takes 10 mins TOPS. Sounds like this price includes wire between each outlet, which should have been part of the entire rewire.

    Running the wires is a realistic cost, its not that easy especially in finished areas on the way to the kitchen. But, #2 should pay for #1, they are the same thing or they should be combined.

    Also LOL at them for claiming to charge you to recycle the old wire. I would keep the wire and take it to the scrap yard myself and get cash for it.

    #4 is a normal price for drywalling, mudding, and texturing an area that takes 18 recessed lights.

    #5 Sounds like the price includes wire runs between each light, should have been part of the entire wiring.

    Basically there should have been a base price for doing ALL the wiring, then they could charge a realistic price for each fixture (and labor to install). But it sounds like they are double dipping. Their pricing doesnt make sense either, considering the recessed lights should be more than the outlets because you have to make a layout of where they go and measure and center them, etc. Outlets you just put the box on a stud every so many feet.

    I C thanked Vith
  • 11 years ago

    FYI

    TITLE 24

    Deals with the entire set of codes including building, plumbing, electrical, gas, green, etc.

    I C thanked User
  • 11 years ago

    Yes, but most people refer to title 24 meaning the things that are different than the model codes. As for the electrical code, (and specifically the recessed lighting mentioned), the code puts strict requirement on energy efficient lighting.

    I C thanked Ron Natalie
  • 11 years ago

    Thanks everyone for all your detailed answers! Really appreciate the help!

    A few things to clarify:

    The sheet rock he took off was around 120 sqft. Isn't that cost too high?

    The 18 recessed lights was for kitchen, dining, and living room.

    All 10 GFCIs went in the kitchen only on walls behind new cabinetry, total size of this room is about 14*14 in a L-shaped configuration, no island. The original GFCI quote was high and when we asked, he had said it included all labor and materials (also as stated in contract), but this new bill he presented as "additional unexpected costs all due to you insisting on a permit." What a load of BS.

    Also, I dug up my original home inspection from 2 years ago, and the electrical part did not mention any "messed up wiring" as our GC had claimed.

    I talked to my city's Bldg Dept and our state's License Board yesterday and learned more about the extent of our GC's dishonesty and shenanigans. The inspector is coming in a few hours and I'll confirm with him too.

  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    It is hard for me to visualize how much drywall work was done, but it really is not that easy and is an art form. If you tried it you might be happy to have someone else do it. The square footage isnt the problem here because if you were doing a whole room they would use whole sheets and cover much more area. The problem is the mudding, the edges of the drywall are not tapered, doing patchwork is more work to make it look good. They also use a cut out saw to get your recessed lights correct.

    It was a good thing you got a permit and inspectors involved. Inspectors are there to protect the homeowner from ignorant or dishonest contractors. If you find your GC to be problematic, you may want to cut him loose instead of continuing to deal with him because he could sabotage your reno if he gets vindictive.

    I C thanked Vith
  • 11 years ago

    A home inspection would not be that relevant. I doubt that it would indicate to which electrical code the home was built to. But revising the wiring requires it to be brought up to the current code which I believe is what the contractor was talking about. It is also implied that if you had not pulled a permit he would have not necessarily brought it up to code.


    I C thanked weedmeister
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