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AF/GF breakers

10 years ago

I'm installing a 220v, garage heater in the greenhouse that has a 100 amp subpanel. Up until now, auxilary heat has been a pair of 110v portable heaters, each on separate circuits, but I got a really good deal on this 5,000 watt, ceiling-hung unit at Northern Tool.

With a max load of 22 amps, I figure a 30 amp, double pole breaker will do...but is an arc-fault or ground-fault breaker needed? While 2 pole "regular" breakers are reasonably priced, the arc- and ground-fault units are a exponentially more expensive. I'm not really sure why the difference in price is so substantial.

Cheers

Comments (16)

  • 10 years ago

    Except in certain special cases which do not seem to apply here, Ground Fault and Arc Fault requirements only are required for 120V 15 and 20A branch circuits. An exception would be if the installation instructions for your heaters requires a GFCI.


  • 10 years ago

    No mention of that.... The unit will be out of reach, plus, it will be grounded and I'm running BX (armored) cable to the panel. I just don't understand how AFI and GFI breakers can be so much more - like x3 or x4 - expensive....

  • 10 years ago

    Because they are a lot more complex devices than a simple circuit breaker and they aren't used as often, so there isn't the mass production volume discount that regular circuit breakers benefit from.

    Look at a regular receptacle vs a GFCI receptacle. Your talking more like 20x the price! 2 bucks vs 40 bucks

    It's the same reason a Lexus is more expensive than a Honda Civic.


  • 10 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I hope you're not using BX (which isn't made anymore) but rather type AC or MC that has that same armored appearance.

    Greg...you should shop around. GFCI receptacles, even 20A go for closer to $20 here.
    Builder grade stuff down around $10.

  • 10 years ago

    Sorry...force of habit...and showing my age. Meant to say metal clad....Plan on using 10/2 with ground a ground wire. The 10 ga. is for minimal drop for the 20' run....

  • 10 years ago

    Yes, that sounds fine. Be sure to use the appropriate fittings on both ends.

  • 10 years ago

    When I built the greenhouse a decade ago, I did the install on the 100 amp sub-panel and a nearby hot tub. The inspector was rather impressed that everything was up to code - but then he had to ding me for *something*. Since the greenhouse had interior lighting, that switch had to be illuminated. The final couldn't happen until that switch was replaced....

  • 10 years ago

    Genius....

  • 10 years ago

    Since the greenhouse had interior lighting, that switch had to be illuminated

    Do you have some goofy local code or did the inspector just make that requirement up?

  • 10 years ago

    He claimed it was "the code" - which I took to mean the NEC at that time. It was a simple/cheap enough fix and it didn't really delay anything. (IIRC, there wasn't any additional 'reinspection' fee....) Sometimes, it doesn't pay to argue with city hall....

  • 10 years ago

    There is no such provision in the NEC. I agree with your statement, sometimes its easier to smile and say I'll fix that and go on. It's amazing how sometimes things get secretly changed back to the way they were before after the inspector leaves.


  • 10 years ago

    A decade ago, you may have been on the BOCA codes rather than IBC/IRC. There were some illuminated switch codes in BOCA.

  • 10 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    That was only for interior stairwells illuminated by artificial light.

  • 10 years ago

    Not the point I was trying to make. It doesn't necessarily have to be an NEC requirement. Local codes, prior to the IRC, were all messed up by "improvements" by local inspectors over the years, some of which may have even made it into the IRC, and some rejected repeatedly.

    Before adoption of ICC codes, most local codes were a conglomeration of several different codes. BOCA, UBC, CABO, NFPA, etc. The local "amendments" were written as a memo to the local contractors that was generally just something thought up at a coffee break. The local codes had gotten so many amendments and addendums over the years that people actually started believing that the codes were supposed to be made up by the local inspector, until a few court cases ruled that stricter codes for different locations would be considered housing discrimination. It has still taken many years for THAT memo to reach the local inspectors.

    Before the IRC, codes had morphed over the years into some over the top stuff if you look at it from a different perspective than the inspectors. An NFPA requirement for a second disconnect for oil burning furnaces that needed to be a safe distance from the furnace, changed to outside of the room. Then to the other side of a door, followed by all the way to the top of the stairs if the furnace was in the basement. And in some places became a universal code for all furnaces, even natural gas and electric, just in case someone ever changed the furnace to an oil burning type. The same occurred with lighted switches when everybody thought they were the neatest thing since sliced bread. The codes went from interior stairs, to all stair switches including exterior, to all entries into structures since most of them had stairs anyway. And what if nobody left the front porch light on for you?

    A lot of cities were using the same codes as their commercial buildings for houses, which also inadvertently brought in local OSHA and fire code requirements that don't usually show up in the newer standard code (IRC), thus the reason the ICC recognized the need for a separate code book for residential rather than just the IBC for both residential and commercial. I see architects still getting confused by this at least weekly.


  • 10 years ago

    Nope, and I even asked in my post if it was some goofy code or was the inspector blowing smoke. Looks like the poster doesn't know. It's certainly not in the NEC or the model codes.