Software
Houzz Logo Print
ss1114

Newbie looking for guidance

10 years ago

Hello,

First off, a big thanks to all contributors on the gardenweb forums - I've been doing quite a bit of reading the last few weeks. I have a few questions that are too specific to get answers from basic googling or reading the forum.

Some background - This is my first time ever trying to grow anything. We moved into our first home with a yard last summer and went on a trip to Italy, where I ended up buying some seeds as a souvenir for my Mom. Long story short, I'm attempting to grow Cuor di Bue Tomatoes, San Marzano (2) Tomatoes, Cayenne Peppers, Basil, and Mint from Seed. I have 3 of the Cuor di bue, 4 of the Marzanos transplanted last week. Seed date was April 1st. I also transplanted some Cayenne peppers over the memorial day weekend. only got one of seed pots to germinate for the Quadrato d'asti rosso Bell peppers and hoping that the solitary plant gives me something - I only have myself to blame since I had supplied no bottom heat and was stingy with the seeds in the pot - like I said, total rookie.

I have a 3.5 ft square raised bed with soil about 6 inches deep filled with 3 cu. ft Nature's care organic raised bed soil, 1 bag Black Cow composted manure, and 1.8 cu. ft. Whitney farms planting soil. This bed has one each of the tomatoes, the solitary Rossi Bell Pepper and 3 Cayenne Peppers. I also got greedy and added an eggplant as well.

Is this way too much for that small raised bed? Roughly 40% to almost half is for the 2 tomato plants, the rest is the other stuff. Picture attached.

Rest of the seedlings are in a 3 ft x 10 ft in-ground plot that I fenced off in between the landscaping. On this one, I added 4-5 bags 0.75 cu ft of Miracle-gro garden soil, 1 bag (1.8 cu ft) Whitney Farms planting soil and one 40 lb bag of Black Kow Composted Manure. I tried to "till" and mix the soil by mostly digging and turning the soil over with a spade. And ended up doing a crappy job leveling the soil. I only realized this after adding a soaker hose, I ended up with a puddle in the centre square area where the soil is all compacted since I stand there to do most of the work. I tried poking holes in that soil with a trowel, but didn't really do much.

Question is, should I try to level this up by adding some top soil? Or just let it be instead of taking the risk of sending the puddle water to some other areas where the plants are?

Another question - I have attempted to fence the plot with U-posts and 3-ft plastic coated poultry fence. I asked the lawn mowing guy to do this, thinking he would know better than me, and he was sloppy and did a rush job - the bottom of the fence is not inside the soil, in fact there are a couple of spots where its above ground. I'm thinking of adding a bunch of top soil along the fence perimeter to address this - will this work? Or should I do something different? I would hate for all my newbie hard work to be destroyed by rabbits and I do have a few that are always running around my backyard. Currently I have left some wadded up black plastic trash-bags along the fence bottom, I had used those to cover the plot after adding the soil amendments. I'm starting to worry that these might turn into a breeding ground for unwanted creepy-crawlies.

Also, in general, would greatly appreciate any sort of guidance, advice, opinions etc on how to take care of the plants. For example, I've done some reading online, but still not sure about when, how often, and how much to fertilize.

Thanks for reading my super-long and overly detailed post. Good luck to all!

Comments (6)

  • 10 years ago

    Forgot to include, I am in Central Jersey - Zone 6b. Did I start too late with the seeding and planting?

  • 10 years ago

    Thanks for the input rgreen48! I think what you are referring to as foam is the taller side of the raised bed I purchased. They were extra composite-wood pieces that snapped on. In hind-sight, I should have left those pieces unassembled if I wasn't going to fill in that side deeper. Chalk up another one in my long list of rookie errors.

    Also, I forgot to attach the picture of the 3x10 plot that I asked questions about - see below.

    The "centre square" that I referred to in the earlier post is where you can see I threw a couple of empty jiffy seed pots to soak up some of the water. The puddle disappears about 10-15 minutes after I turn off the water.

    Unable to make up my mind whether I should fill up the fence bottom areas with top soil so I can remove the black plastic, and also whether I should put a bunch of topsoil in that square where I will be standing on to access the plants.

    I have 4 tomato seedlings along the "back wall" where I'm planning to put a PVC-trellis - but holding off on that for now until the plants grow a bit. Trying to be a bit disciplined & keep costs in control, already have ended spending much more than expected.


  • 10 years ago

    This is what I've planted in the plot pictured above:

  • 10 years ago

    It is really difficult to sort through a massive post and address all the issues in one thread without creating more confusion for you or giving mis-information, much less writing a whole book long answer. So I hope you don't mind if I sort of pick and choose some of the issues you are dealing with to discuss.

    First, AFTER the bed is constructed and planted is not the best time to seek advice on how to do it. That time is before you do it. :-) So unfortunately you are going to get more done-wrong replies than done-right replies. But that is part of learning too and we were all there at one time or another.

    You have some problems to fix and they do need to be fixed.

    "3.5 ft square raised bed with soil about 6 inches deep filled with 3 cu.
    ft Nature's care organic raised bed soil, 1 bag Black Cow composted
    manure, and 1.8 cu. ft. Whitney farms planting soil."

    6" is not deep enough for the plants you have there. They are tap root plants and that tap root is often 1-2 feet long or longer. So hopefully there is good soil below that bed that they can access. 6" is not deep enough for much of anything except some shallow rooted leafy greens. So yes the bed needs to at least be filled to the brimand before next season increased to at least 10" deep and deeper if possible. I couldn't find the info on what is beneath it, what it is sitting on?

    The fill components you used, while not ideal in some respects, are ok but they lack the needed minerals so yes, use good quality top soil and try to mix it in well with all the other ingredients. Do it now while the plant roots are still small so you can mix it well as close as possible to the plants.

    That first bed is also over-planted. A 3.5' bed can hold 2 tomato plants and 1 pepper plant MAX. Since it is so shallow all the roots are going to have to run horizontal just below the surface. San Marzano is normally a large plant and if it was given ideal growing conditions it could easily be 6' tall and 4' wide. It is going to shade the pepper plants badly. I would move the egg plant and most of the pepper plants out of the bed and into containers. Pepper plants will do well in a 5 gallon bucket if necessary.

    I don't understand the purpose of the PVC pipes so won't talk about those. But I agree with rgreen that the extra boards need to go.

    On the 3x10 plot what is all the black plastic? Hope fully the whole bed isn't just soil piled on top of black plastic or you are going to have real serious problems with drainage and rotting plant roots. The plastic needs to go ASAP.

    The plot diagram for the second bed is crowded but since already planted, too late to fix now. The spacing on the tomato plants is too close to be ideal so will require some extensive pruning and a great deal of support to keep them from taking over the whole 3 foot width and shading out everything else. And you need to get your trellis support in ASAP so installing it doesn't do root or plant damage. How deep is this bed?

    You are going to have some problems this year but you will learn a great deal in the process so treat it as a learning season and don't let it discourage you. Keep your expectations focused on that learning. Keep good notes to refer to next year, do some research in to the nutrient needs of your plants and how to feed them, learn about the differences between the water needs of tomatoes vs. peppers, keep adding more and more growing mediums to the beds as much as possible, and fix as much of the problems as possible.

    Hope this is of some help to you.

    Dave


    ss1114 thanked digdirt2
  • 10 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Thanks Dave. Agreed that I'm asking questions a bit late. And please do not hesitate, any and all input is very welcome. And yes, I'm taking this first year as a learning experience, still hoping to get something grown though :)

    To address some of the points/questions you raised -

    Raised Bed:

    Soil depth - below the 6 inch raised bed, there is soil that was already there in my landscaping. I believe there were rose bushes there at one point before I moved in, but dead since - very prolific according to the neighbor when they were alive. I did weed out and dig that area to about 6-7 inches before placing the raised bed there, so hopefully soil depth won't be a deal-breaker.

    PVC - Its used as a frame for a DIY rabbit-fence with plastic coated poultry fence. There's a family of rabbits that scamper around the backyard all the time.

    # of Plants: Yeah, I guess I got a bit carried away with the over-planting, but the way I thought about it was the whole "square foot gardening" 1 plant per sq ft etc. And I have 12+ sq ft and only 7 plants, with more space allocated to the tomatoes. I guess as a newbie I still have trouble visualizing how big these plants can get. Also, it was too tempting to use all the seedlings that I had - I even had a hard time thinning out the seedlings where I had more than one in the jiffy pot! I still have 4 Cuor di Bue tomato seedlings hardened off that I don't know what to do with.

    Plot:

    The black plastic is only stuffed into the fence bottom along the fence perimeter to plug some gaps because I'm worried about rabbits getting in, since the fence is not buried into the ground. I'm planning to buy a bag or 2 of cheap "top soil" to plug those gaps and remove the black plastic. I had earlier used the black plastic to cover the soil area after adding the amendments for a couple of weeks.

    Trellis support - I put in slim bamboo stakes as place holders to minimize root damage, where I will put in 1/2 inch electric conduit with PVC on top of it. I'm just hesitant to work on the trellis, because as a newbie I don't even know if the plants will survive the next week or 2, let alone get to the point where they need the 7 ft tall trellis I'm thinking of making.

    Questions:

    1. Regarding your advice about adding minerals, any specific recommendations? I do have one 40 lb bag of Black Kow Composted Manure (0.5-0.5-0.5), and some Whitney Farms "organic" tomato and vegetable fertilizer (2-4-2). I was concerned about over-fertilizing, and thought to wait about 10-12 days after transplanting before I added more. Also, I did throw in a spoonful of epsom salt when I planted the tomatoes. But, specifics on what/how/when to fertilize is one thing I'm confused about and could use some help.

    2. Another thing I was considering was 'mulching' with newspaper - I read somewhere that 6+sheets of wet newspaper can be used, and can help control weed growth. Should I proceed with this?

    3. I have diatomeceous earth - trying to use it to fight ants on my patio - should I consider dusting the plants if I see aphids?

    PVC frame fence for Raised bed: