I've never tried freezing pollen but I know some people do that and it has worked for them. I haven't had very good luck with cross pollinating either. If they do take and start to grow a lot of times they'll just abort and fall off before ripening. All I can suggest is to keep reading about it and trying new things until you hit on the one that works for you.

Thanks, Seil.

I imagine the hips need some heat to develop. We have had cool weather and rain/hail every day for July and August. Every day as far as I can remember.

I'll keep trying. Just wish it would work. :)

Carol

Carol, what do the hips look like? You say the aren't doing anything but are still on the bush? No swelling?

You might be right about temperature having an influence on hip development - maybe someone with more experience could comment - but as far as I am aware, fertilization takes place within about 6 hours after viable pollen comes into contact with the mature stigma.

They're green, and there's no swelling. Hmmm...6 hours....well...it probably didn't work then. I've tried over years with fresh pollen. Didn't work then either. But it really could be the cold weather. I wore a sweater outside today.

Thanks for the help. :)

Carol

Carol, I also used frozen pollen for the first time this season. Some took, some didn't. A couple that looked like they had taken, showed some swelling but have aborted. When I opened them there were no seeds. I still have some hips on the bushes pollinated with the frozen pollen so it does seem to work. I plan on collecting and freezing again this year.

Sharlene

Yeah, I have 2 freezer bags full of pollen from last year (in pill containers). I think they're supposed to be good for 2 years at least. There are still 2 out of 3 hips that may turn out to be viable if they get some prolonged sun. It may be too late already though.

Good luck with your hips!!!

Carol

Hi Carol, part of the problem may be the conditions under which you are trying to pollinate. Generally, if the heat and sun aren't conducive for bees to be active, pollination isn't as successful. Nature's systems work together. If it's warm and dry enough for the bees to be out doing their things, pollen usually takes for me. If it's too wet or too cold (even far too hot), pollinating often fails. I considered freezing pollen, but decided it was quite a bit more work and involved than I cared to engage in. A friend shared with me his results using two year old Zorina pollen he had simply kept in a small jar on top of the micro wave in his kitchen (West Virginia, so it's warm and humid then warm from his furnace). Of course the older it gets the fewer results he finds, but the seeds which have germinated have shown influence from the pollen parent, so it seems possible you may be able to store the pollen out of the freezer for quite a long time.

For the past two seasons, I've been collecting what I want to use as soon as they begin flowering. I spread the anthers on plain white paper on the dining room table where they are safest as we traditionally eat in the kitchen at the breakfast table. In this climate (Zone 9a, 9 miles from the Pacific Ocean at about 270' elevation; chilly, damp to wet nights; breezy, sunny days from the mid sixties to mid eighties and brilliant sun with high UV once the fogs burn off), I've kept pollen out on the table for six months and have gotten germinations from them showing influence from their genes.

Perhaps it's been too cold/wet for pollinating? Perhaps the pollen hasn't defrosted sufficiently? If it's possible, you might try pollinating under glass or plastic where you can more easily control the temperatures and how wet the blooms are when you pollinate. It could also be the varieties you're trying don't create very fertile pollen and/or are incompatible with the seed parents you've selected. There are crosses I have attempted for many years and have fought me tooth and nail each time I've tried them, but the pollen has worked on other seed parents and the initial seed parents have worked with other pollens.

Hmmmm...that's good advice. Lots to think about.

I chose parents based on their ease of pollination, but maybe they don't go together well. I also chose my 3 earliest bloomers, so the hips would have time to ripen. The problem is we don't usually have roses until almost the middle of July. The ones I chose had flowers (one or two) in early July. There were only 3 roses that had early enough blooms.

I think you're right about the weather. It is cool and rainy for most of July here. Really, really rainy. Darn.

I'm going to refer back to what you've written when I try again next year.

Thanks so much for all your detailed thoughts. :)

It just may not be possible for me to hybridize here. But..it doesn't hurt to keep trying.

Carol

You're welcome, Carol. I hope it helps! Supposedly, seeds are mature after about 110 days after pollination. That would push harvest off until late October through mid to late November. I guess that's too late for your climate? Perhaps keeping your seed parents under plastic cover to trap some heat and protect from rain may help? If it's possible in your situation. Good luck!

It might not be too late. But we will have freezes by then, just not the killing frost - hopefully. But there is no swelling of the hips. I think they're sterile.

The plastic cover may help next year. Some wool fabric with plastic around it may be helpful???

Thanks!

Carol

Some don't swell for several weeks after pollination. It depends upon the genetics of the seed parent and the amount of water and heat available. The hip is a piece of fruit, like an apple, peach or even an orange. Too little water and it won't reach the full size potential it may have had it received enough water. Some varieties make slender hips while others are fat and thick. If the seed parent is setting hips by itself, you can tell what they're supposed to look like and whether the conditions are suitable for it to set hips. Something else that's sometimes used is to mix pollen. If you're using species pollen, which may not produce many fertile seeds with the seed parent, if you also have some self pollen or some from another very fertile modern pollen parent mixed in, it's possible there may be some seed from the species pollen carried to maturity along with the modern cross. The more vigorous seed will encourage the plant to carry the hip to maturity where the species pollen may not have. I know it sounds strange, but it has worked. It's going to be more difficult determining if any resulting seedlings are actually crosses of what you want, rather than selfs or crosses from the other pollen used to create the seeds to carry the hip to maturity if the pollen you really want to use isn't very distinctive and different from the seed parent or the other pollen, but if you were using very different pollen (like a species or something highly characteristic and different from the others) it will be easier to determine if what you have are actually crosses of what you want. I hope that came out right!

roseseek - that's an unusual idea! I would never have thought of that. I really like the idea of knowing what the parent is. I think next year I will try one or two with the pollen all mixed up, and try the rest normally, then I'll know for sure which method is the best. Thanks!

On other fronts, all of my hips have aborted except one which I'm sure will abort soon. BUT!!! My Night Owl has a very swollen hip at the bottom of the bush. The bees must have gotten to it (or it self-pollinated?). Now all it has to do is ripen. I'm glad I didn't find it before or I would have dead headed it. Yay!!!

Carol

Congratulations, Carol! Instead of mixing all the pollens, if you take a little of the seed parent's pollen and apply it to its stigma, then apply the pollen you want to use on that same stigma, the self pollen may help the plant retain the hip until it's ripe. Then, you'll know the results have to be one or the other.

Well, thank you, but I don't lay claim to originating the idea. It was shared with me by Ralph Moore. Chances are, someone else shared it with him, and, his feeling that knowledge, like money and manure, is worthless unless spread around, led him to share it every chance he received. Now, it's yours!

Yes! Ralph Moore share it with you. That man knew what he was talking about. Thanks so much!

Carol

You're welcome! I hope it helps! I can't vouch for how "arctic hardy" they may be, but if you just have the hankering to raise some seedlings, I can share some seeds with you if you think your Agriculture Department might let them across the border. If you're interested and would please investigate what would be required to pacify them, we can give it a go.

Thanks, but I'm too unknowledgeable to do anything like that LOL. You are very kind, and I know I would like the resulting offspring of your hybridizations. But, doing anything to get them here is above my paygrade. :)

Carol

You're welcome. I don't know what, if any, fees the Canadian government may want to allow them entry, but postage isn't a whole lot of money. Think about it and if it strikes you as something you'd like to play with later, just let me know. Thanks.

I've been reading this, and keeping up with it. Thanks for sharing the information Kim! I'm sure going to apply it to my own Hybridizing :) I'm sure I am not the only person you have helped that's been reading :)

I'm glad, Alana. Good luck!

:)

Carol

Yes thanks Kim for the tip

You're welcome, I hope it helps!