Marvin or Kolbe, no real question in my opinion.

Upon further review, it appears from the cross section that the WS Premium casement has portions with more of a roll form cladding design than extruded. Hmmm.

Oh please..Thats not true weather shield doesnt use anything roll form. Their product was redesigned in 2013 and was extruded before that even ..their products are running full force with quality control ..trust me i know or i wouldnt sell the product..i carry over 20+ manufacturers and its up there with Loewen Kolbe and Marvin ..extruded alum standard 2605 finish great glass packages..why are you being quoted Premium over Signature? We stopped selling Hurd when Sierra Pacific bought them because we were sick of getting calls about service only to find the warranty voided because Hurd went bankrupt again and some new entity purchased them and kept the name..now theyre strictly Sierra Pacific but no thanks. H3 is their entry level product similar to a Plygem Mira or Windsor Pinnacle.

Never mind got my answer...push out casements..

OK, forgive with me, I'm not a window pro, just a homeowner trying to figure this all out...

First pic is Marvin Casement. Definitely more wood and a noticable gap between the extruded aluminum and wood (which I'm assuming is a good thing).

Second is WS Premium. Less wood in the window construction (doesn't seem noticable when installed). But I note the alum is in direct contact with wood, which I see in roll form windows...why isn't this a negative and inferior design to Marvin?

I agree the WS is a seemingly attractive option, that's why they are in the running. Great options, sizes, 2605 standard, good price. If the product line is new as of 2013, how has it performed this far? Any issues for anyone? Lack of track record is a concern. Should it be?

My apologies i didnt realize it was your comment i thought it was someone trying to give you bad information i glanced too quickly and dont want to seem rude...i see what your saying about the exterior cladding in the Marvin window and my response is this..as a dealer, every window company has a warranty meant to protect them not you..with that said both companies warrant against wood rot for 30 years because they know that water isnt getting to that sash..if you leave those push outs open way too much in rain with an all wood sash then yea you may have issues. But most people dont. Regarding the gap its poor design only if that aluminum sweats bad and it doesn't on the .050 thickness ...if the Marvin dealer pointed that out to you its just a story in my opinion a selling tool..just like i would say marvins nailing flange is an applied piece of crap and weather shields is a rigid integral nailing fin that is part of the frame..so which will hold the window in place better a flimsy flap applied or an integral (part of the frame) rigid nailing flange..when the wind blows which one do you want holding in your window..which design in that case is better?

Ok in my honest professional opinion regarding the 2013 redesign. Every window company got on board with a good better best scenario with their products..if you look at most of them now they all have a ton of product lines with options varying on each and a better price point on down the line. When there new products came out I was selling to a customer in Washington DC who builds in Great Falls, Mclean, and Arlington VA which are some of our wealthiest areas here..he was happy until the new product caused problems on two jobs right off the bat which were fixed but he was burnt out right away and still bought from me he just bought Hurd H3 instead then never looked back. Now we dropped Sierra Pacific/Hurd so Im out..no matter what i say it doesnt matter and he isnt interested in my other product lines like Plygem etc. However the honest truth is this and I equate it to the software industry or Iphones..why do you suppose the Iphone sends an update out ..to work out the bugs..fix problems..and they are Apple..anytime you launch a new product there is potential for issues that need fixed..thats 4 years ago and like i said above its running top notch and business is solid. I lose jobs alot on price to Windsor Pinnacle and Jeldwen mostly but what are they really buying..entry level clad product basic down and dirty windows with no specialty stuff and thats fine I will keep losing because we sell products we believe are solid and have value not just the big name that people notice. So good luck with your decision. If you dont go push out casements have them requote it in Signature Series and youll save yourself more money..thats if your doing prefinished white interior only and not a special stain grade wood species. What options are being quoted?

Also if i were doing the job and you were really interested in the Weather Shield product I would tell you to look at that 4 panel slider in their Contemporary series with the thinner profile stiles and rails..its way more glass and if you are facing a lake then you would have more visible glass and view..And Ive priced both premium and contemporary series doors and they are practically the same. Too bad you arent in my area id take this job and give you advice for the windows and doors an architect would never know...like taking that 12ft 4 panel out of there especially if it has an unobstructed view to the water.

Yes, we are considering contemporary if we go with WS. I've been told the quality and price are on par with the Premium series.

What would you do instead of a 12ft, 4 panel sider? You can't just tease like that! We've looked at several alternatives and this seems to be the best fit for aesthetics and budget. We are replacing an existing 2 panel slider flanked by double hungs, so we are already reframing the opening and going from 6"8" to 8' tall.

If you are working with a budget and a look then you are on the right track ..my suggestions were that if you are reframing the opening you could look at a multislide door stacking panels but something like that would definitely take the cost up about 3k. However you could could recover that difference by eliminating some push out casements in places where you can afford to. Always some ways to make it different but I like the fact you are doing what you are it sounds like an interesting project with many openings.

Didn't weathershield also file bankruptcy and/or have some major reorganization? Not a fan of the product. Sold and installed a few over the years by request and it never failed to have issues. Definitely not on par with the top wood windows in my view. Based on the original list, Marvin and kolbe would be my choices

The Shield family and SNE (their family company) owned several companies and have gone bankrupt, dropped names, changed brands. Not 100% sure what they did to warranties but the answer to your question fridge is yes.

Thanks folks. I'm leaning towards Marvin and Kolbe after reading through these replies. We'll be raising our young family in this house for the next 20+ years and I want to give myself the best shot of not having to mess with the windows/doors again. If that means spending a bit extra today, so be it.

It sounds like I cant go wrong between Marin and Kolbe, so I'll take a deeper dive into the features, etc of each to make the decision. Anyone have an opinion on whose sliding door has better features? Who makes the most interesting push out casement (we'll probably do retractable screens)? Those seem to be the biggest 2 styles in our package. The initial bids had Kolbe a bit cheaper, but our contractor is more familiar with Marvin.

cmon millworkman.. you shouldnt just spew stuff you arent very informed about. Especially if you want to sound like an independent professional. They have not went bankrupt and I will keep this discussion short.. show me and the other folks on the board the source to that statement. SNE was their vinyl line and they laid off those employees and moved operations.. they are getting out of vinyl and fiberglass hence Beechworth which is standard business moves. Focusing on a few product lines to play in the high end market of wood clad products. Bankruptcy, Dropping names, and changing brands no way. They did acquire Peachtree and dissolved it but I dont think acquiring companies is the same as what you are saying

Since you love Loewen so much maybe you should mention that about them they got crushed after the 2008 bubble too before getting the company back .. you can read about that here http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/business/loewen-window-firm-all-in-the-family-again-214109231.html

Just a suggestion if you are still searching for manufactures. Bieber Windows. The have wood with aluminum clad and were priced a bit cheaper than some i looked at.

Christinaatqwd, you mentioned that you moved away from sierra pacific because they weren't honoring Hurd warranties. Is weathershield honoring peachtree warranties? Not sure what their policy is, but an internet search shows a pretty steady supply of ticked off homeowners that would suggest that they aren't. What about the weathershield vinyl windows that they manufactured and shut down the plant? What about the fiberglass product that was sold? Is beechworth taking on those warranties? I'm unsure if there have been actual bankruptcy filings, but certainly there have been plant closures, shutting down of entire product lines, and voiding of warranties. Doesn't exactly sound like a company where things are going swimmingly.

Haven't even mentioned Vetter Windows which they also owned at one point.

Closing the loop here...We ended up going with Marvin Ultimates. Thanks for everyone's help and opinions.

Good choice Blake, that's a great window.

Blake5982 - great choice, I have them as well. They perform wonderfully in my very cold climate. They are beautiful to look at too. There is one thing I would warn you about. After my Marvin Ultimates were installed, I realized I was no longer able to hang blinds inside the frame. The way the Ultimates' interior frame is made is too shallow to hang blinds. You can only hang blinds above the window frames which doesn't look that neat. Had I known this beforehand, I would have discussed it with my windows contractor, and perhaps he could have ordered them a different way, or installed them a different way, to allow enough depth to hang blinds inside the frame. If you think you will be hanging blinds inside the window frames, discuss with your contractor in advance.