Software
Houzz Logo Print
sashac

FIREplace carpenter won't finish job!

7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago

We have a dinner party in 5 days with 26 people. We are going to be dining in our living room, in front of the fireplace. We hired a carpenter back on Halloween, to install a shiplap "chimney", new mantel and fireplace surround. I told him that I wouldn't hire him if he couldn't get the job done by Dec.

1. He said that was "no problem"

Fast forward to today, Dec. 3. I'll add a photo below to show you our progress. He was here for ONE HOUR on Saturday, the agreed upon deadline for the job to be finished. All he did was install the plywood surround so my husband and I could tile it.

Now he's sick with flu and vomiting.

What do you suggest we do? He has 2/3 payment ($1k) of ours. I need to contact him and give him some sort of ultimatum. Just not sure what I need to ask for. Any help would be great appreciated.



Comments (45)

  • 7 years ago

    I don't think plywood is remotely acceptable in this situation. Has he cashed the checks?

  • 7 years ago

    this is the "backer board" for the tile. I paid via Venmo :(

  • 7 years ago

    Call it a lesson in planning. Go ahead and have your dinner party. If your guests are friends I'm guessing they are there to chat with you versus ogle your fireplace. Put a smile on your face, turn it into a Charlie Brown fireplace, and resolve your issue with the man when he is well and won't infect you.

  • 7 years ago

    Don't rush this for the sake of the party. This is a permanent installation, and you don't want a rush job that looks bad for the next decade just for the sake of this one party.

    Even if you could get it done in time, you would not be able to use the fireplace because the mortar and grout can't be exposed to heat until they are fully cured--days at least. It seems to be a gas fireplace, so you might get away with a little flame, but certainly not much and not in a wood burning fireplace.

    And, obviously, next time, get more lead time.

    sashac thanked tatts
  • 7 years ago
    put up some peel and stick tiles if it will make you feel better for the party_ just don't use the fireplace until it's done. or move a piece of furniture in front of it for the party.
    sashac thanked Kerry Blossom
  • 7 years ago
    I’m confused about what he was supposed to do for you. Y’all were going to tile the surround yourselves? But shiplap was supposed to go where? Anyway, bottom line is it won’t be done in time. Accept that and have fabulous food and a beautiful table and tell the funny story of the vanishing carpenter— your guests have probably all been in a similar situation and will sympathize. And, really, you don’t want someone with flu coming around you before a party. So, you still need him to finish something? Be nice but don’t pay another dime til he’s done. If he doesn’t finish, your options are limited as it’s a small job and not likely to worth the hassle of small claims court. However, if he is not paid, he may be able to put a mechanics lien on your property, which means you can’t pass clear title, which could interfere with any sale, so any resolution with him should probably include a waiver by him of any such lien.
    sashac thanked Sam Gorson
  • 7 years ago
    If he’s sick and vomiting I wouldn’t let him near my house. Let him recover, prep for your party and worry about it later. Things happen. It shouldn’t ruin your party. Is it code to have wood so close to the firebox? I would have used hardibacker instead.
    sashac thanked Susie .
  • 7 years ago

    Well, you know what one dinner table topic will be.

    sashac thanked partim
  • 7 years ago

    Thank you all. I really don’t care much about getting it done before at this point. I guess I’m wondering what my options are as far as payment/expectations.


    My friends already know about the hooligan-ism of this guy so it will be a funny conversation piece!

  • 7 years ago
    The problem is “You paid him too much” up front. He has your money, and if he is really sick, you don’t want him anywhere near you or your house until he is well, which won’t happen until after your party.
    I don’t believe that ordinary plywood is the best support for tile, so I am guessing he doesn’t know what he is doing. An expensive lesson. I doubt that $3000 would cover materials and labor for a competent worker.
    sashac thanked felizlady
  • 7 years ago
    Please check building codes on fireplace surround. Probably not plywood.
    sashac thanked abb_ann
  • 7 years ago

    When did you initially contract him out to do the job? What date was he contracted to start the job? What exactly was he contracted to do (details)? Etc.? Almost every single person whom we've dealt with throughout the years has come up with one excuse or another during the process (they typically work on multiple projects at the same time to secure their livelihood) and 'being sick' is usually their go to reason.

    Since he's already been paid 2/3 of the payment, my approach would be nice but firm (as opposed to demanding/aggressive). Not because he doesn't deserve it, rather so that he eventually either comes back to finish the job, or pay you back what is owed so you can find another party to take over.

    sashac thanked Jora
  • PRO
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    It's highly possible he is sick. Tis the season of flu. Avoid getting germs in your home. It will work out later.

    In the meantime, have a great holiday. Next year is close enough to resolve it ;)


    After it's done, have another celebration party and your guests will be more amazed at the transformation, because they saw the true before & after.

    sashac thanked Business_Name_Placeholder
  • 7 years ago
    Please look into the application of plywood as backer for your tile. For reference your fireplace installation instructions will set product that needs to be used such as a cement backer board. In addition to fire safety a backer board is stiffer preventing cracked tile and grout caused by flexing possible with plywood.
  • PRO
    7 years ago

    Get a quart of Bin primer, a quart of white satin paint, , nail up some garland or xmas stockings ( if that applies) and set a deadline for him of 1/15/19. My heavens.

  • 7 years ago

    Install concrete board over the plywood. You cannot install tile directly onto plywood because it is not dimensionally stable. If you put tile directly on top of plywood, it will chip and break. To install the concrete board, apply tile adhesive to the back, then press it down against the plywood.

  • 7 years ago
    Do you have a written contract with specific terms and conditions? If you don't, then you can try to work with him. Perhaps the threat of poor online reviews could persuade him. Then, there is the sad reality that he may not be sick. He could have decided that he doesn't want the job. I would try to negotiate a refund minus materials and his labor, and find someone else.
  • PRO
    7 years ago

    Wood and fire. What could go wrong? I think he may not be the man for the job regardless. Do you have the specs for your gas insert? That determines the prohibited zone for combustible material.

  • PRO
    7 years ago
    Nothing wrong with a plywood subframe, it does need overplayed with a tile backer for the tile to stick( because of the oils in plywood). And as long as all the wood is covered by a solid surface it is fine, heat doesn't cause fires sparks do.
  • 7 years ago
    I see you’re getting some conflicting info so I’m not sure how you’re going to pick who’s right and who’s wrong put I can share my personal experiences. First, everyone gets sick and if he’s a one man crew that’s obviously a real problem but doesn’t make him a bum. Second, plywood can be used as a tile base. Backer Board is a relatively new product and plywood was used a lot before that. My entry way tile is on ply, over thirty year old and not a cracked tile or broken grout line. I did use a special bonding paint however. That being said, third, a fireplace surround is not a floor and will be subject to heating and cooling cycles a floor would never experience. Plywood and tile will expand and contract at very different rates which will most likely cause problems like popped or cracked tiles. Fourth, you haven’t said if you checked combustible material clearances from your fireplace manufacturer. If wood gets hot enough it will catch fire, no spark required. That’s why wood stoves don’t have plywood heat shields. Finally, I like Jan’s short term party paint plan. None of that really helps with your contractor problem but a party inconvenience is nothing compared with burning your house down.
  • 7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    let me just say, 10% up front is all that is required by law. 2/3 is robbery. do you think he's used that money for materials? nope.

    tell him you'd like a refund, minus whatever he used for his time and that plywood. do you have his contractors ID number? If he has one, and refuses you, file a complaint w/the state contractors board.


    did you pay him via Venmo, before he came out to the home? or after? and what's wrong w/a check?

    do you have any type of contract? written invoice for materials, anything?

    and you really should have cement board instead of the ply. you don't want to put tile directly on plywood. as stated above, it's not sturdy enough and the wood sucks out the moisture in the thinset.

  • 7 years ago

    Unless that's a zero clearance gas insert or electric, there should be no flammable material within 6" of the firebox. That means cement board should be used. (Even regular sheet rock is combustible because of the paper.) Putting cement board over the plywood does not change that clearance. Putting tile or stone over plywood does not change the clearance. The concern isn't sparking; its that over time combustible materials will dry out and spontaneously combust.

  • 7 years ago

    And there is an additional clearance for the mantel depending how far it sticks out. I don't recall the minimum, but it is more than 6" above the firebox. You need to read the specs for that particular insert to determine a safe design that is code compliant.

  • 7 years ago

    Phone call to a company that installs wood burning stoves and get a referral for a competent workman. Pay for an on-site consult. Reassess your options.

  • PRO
    7 years ago
    What does the cement board attach to? Wood 2×
  • 7 years ago

    Metal or brick

  • PRO
    7 years ago

    I built the entirety of this library, notice the granite step fireplace surround. Guess what the sub frame is? I will alarm every homebuilder that their fireplace wall need to be steel studs or masonry for an insert. To boot this is a wood burner.

    sashac thanked None
  • PRO
    7 years ago
    last modified: 7 years ago

    What state are you in? Not all states have laws regarding percentage deposits like California does (10%). I'm in New York and there is no maximum amount of deposit that can be charged, only that a schedule of payments must be outlined in the contract.

    https://www.dec.ny.gov/lands/5341.html

  • 7 years ago

    “And as long as all the wood is covered by a solid surface it is fine, heat doesn't cause fires sparks do.

    That statement is 100% false.


    How Stuff Works: Fire



  • PRO
    7 years ago
    Let's look at the situation, you have plywood covered by an inch of cement and tile at least 8 inches away not taking direct impact from a flame. What do you expect the temp of the wood is? Probably not high. Equivalent = put your hair dryer on a piece of wood until it ignites, let us know when your hair dryer fails first. And how do these wildfires start?? A spark. 100% truth
  • PRO
    7 years ago
    Maybe the heat will cause the gastanks in cars to suddenly ignite( never happened) but what will SPARK plug
  • 7 years ago

    It will totally depend on the manufacturer's specs. which vary in materials and construction. Ours was installed after an existing masonry fireplace was removed. The unit comes with long metal brackets that are used to screw the sides into the studs out from the unit. The bottom has built in clearance. The sticker on the front of the unit said use only non-combustible materials on any surfaces touching the sides or the front of the unit.

  • 7 years ago
    Matt you do beautiful work. Using another car analogy. The brake doesn’t fully release causing friction. It doesn’t cause problems around town but on a road trip the heat builds until the aluminum rim ignites. No spark involved. I hope your luck continues to hold. You have no idea what’s happening under your beautiful granite. Of course then neither do I.
  • PRO
    7 years ago
    If your brake doesn't release then your vehicle pulls to that side and slows without braking . Any person with common would conclude something is wrong. Children not so much.
  • 7 years ago
    Matt not if it’s a semi truck. I’ve seen it happen more than once.
  • 7 years ago
    I agree that painting and decorating that plywood would be fun and look great for your party :). We have just had this stone wall and hearth built and it’s on top of plywood, metal lathe and cement... BUT the fireplace placement and pipe placement was determined by the requirements set by the wood stove and pipe manufacturer and state codes...
    sashac thanked Andrea Lane
  • 7 years ago

    I think you should insist that he come to the party and prove that he is sick by puking on the guests

    sashac thanked mramsey
  • 7 years ago

    I think you should find out his favorite places to advertise and if you need some leverage to get your refund you should definitely threaten to use those places to give a bad review - WITH photos of his unfinished work. Then if the whole thing goes South after that report him to the appropriate legal places associated with builders as described by a previous poster. The bottom line is he gave you a finish date, and did not finish. If he can somehow prove he had the flu, you can decide to forgive his timeline - or not. I agree with others that he may very well be fibbing about being sick. So, let him prove it. Put the burden of proof on him. He STILL gave you a finish date. His reviews and word-of-mouth business are EVERYTHING to him.

    You can also tell him you will be plastering his name and promised finish date upon YOUR unfinshed fireplace for all your 26 guests to see and remember! That might get his attention right there.


    As for the plywood issue...

    I gotta say, I would be very hesitant to put a fireplace behind it, depending on the fireplace manufacturer's recommendations - which I know nothing about.

    But I DO know the peeps sayin, "heat doesn't cause fires sparks do" must be talking super old school, because heat actually DOES cause fires!


    And as for the tile, no way.

    Gotta have cement backerboard under that tile. The wood WILL change shape and cause tiles to crack and pop.


    Good Luck and Bon Appetite!

    sashac thanked Jeri
  • 7 years ago

    Jeri, are the first two paragraphs of your post sarcastic? Serious, not rhetorical, question.

    Joyful holiday season, everyone!

  • 7 years ago

    Well, the dinner party was a week and a half ago.

    OP is a phantom poster, has not returned to the thread since the day of posting.

    Hiring someone for a project on Halloween with a project completion date of the first week in December is cutting it a little too close, more so in that OP intended to do the tile work themselves. Thanksgiving gets in the way of getting stuff done. And, where I live, a lot of contractors are hunters. So there is deer season. And duck season. And goose hunting. Toss in a 9-5 working spouse and some kids down with the flu and the best laid plans can go to hell in minute. We have our own personal schedules that don't always mesh with the rest of the world.

    sashac thanked ci_lantro
  • 7 years ago

    ^^^^

    We have a dinner party in 5 days with 26 people. We are going to be dining in our living room, in front of the fireplace. We hired a carpenter back on Halloween, to install a shiplap "chimney", new mantel and fireplace surround. I told him that I wouldn't hire him if he couldn't get the job done by Dec.


    1. He said that was "no problem"

  • 7 years ago

    ^^^^^


    We have a dinner party in 5 days with 26 people. We are going to be dining in our living room, in front of the fireplace. We hired a carpenter back on Halloween, to install a shiplap "chimney", new mantel and fireplace surround. I told him that I wouldn't hire him if he couldn't get the job done by Dec.


    1. He said that was "no problem"

  • 7 years ago

    UPDATE:

    he finished the job, after the party. He clied to get dizzy so he had another guy along to do all the work on the ladder. I didn’t make a fuss as I didn’t feel like having a guy on my floor with a broken neck. I simply think this job was over his head.


    I went ahead and painted the surround to look like marble until we can find the perfect tile. Took someon’s Advice to prefers samples from TileBar.com


    I learned a lot from this situation. Thank you all for your input - I truly appreciated it!