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Tile Lippage and Contractor Recourse

5 years ago

I have tried the credit card test to look at the tile lippage for my bathroom floor install, and there are multiple spots where it takes 2 credit cards to meet the adjacent tile (some places 2 credit cards isn't even enough to reach the top of the adjacent tile). This seems excessive to me. The tile are 12" x 24" porcelain with 1/4" grout lines.


From what I have seen online, the max lippage that would be acceptable is 1/16". I also have notice that when I set a new, flat baseboard in the middle of the wall, the middle of the room's tile is a high point. The baseboard is above the edge tile in one spot by 3/8".


My contractor has stopped responding, and it doesn't seem like he is going to fix this. Is there any recourse? I know he is for sure insured with State Farm, and I am trying to find if he is Bonded (first time to have any work done - learned a couple lessons). I am wanting to fire him, but I wanted to see if there is recourse to get him to fix the tile floor first. I'm hoping to not have to tear it out and redo it.

Comments (12)

  • 5 years ago

    I am attaching some pictures, since that will better show it.






  • PRO
    5 years ago

    According to the NAHB Residential Construction Performance Guidelines, a 1/16" lippage standard would apply to tiles smaller than 13" x 13". More lippage would be expected with larger format tiles, particularly if they are not rectified.

  • 5 years ago

    They are rectified tile (forum ivory porcelain tile). Surprisingly, the shower walls that were done by the same tile layer have less lippage than the bathroom floor does (mosaic tile for the shower floor).


    I guess, would you deem the job acceptable (from the pictures). Pretty much the whole floor has 1-2 credit cards worth of lippage.


    Also, the top pictures show how the tile "peaks" in the middle (how there is a gap on both ends of the baseboard. Would that be acceptable? The tub is also supposed to sit in the middle, which makes me think that it, likewise, will have the ends higher off the ground than the middle.


    For reference, the labor for this job was $6,000 (I have not paid him the full amount because the job is not complete). Additionally, in the receipt for the tile materials they purchased a leveling kit (which was not used).

  • PRO
    5 years ago

    Hi, Jeff,


    I'm not judging the quality of the installation--only providing one quality standard for lippage. You'll need to assess the quality against whatever standard you deem appropriate.

  • 5 years ago

    Can you take room shots so we can see the size of the job and the size of the tiles?


    How much did you pay for subfloor preparation. What used to be on the floor before the tile? Do you have before/during/after shots?

  • 5 years ago

    I am attaching 2 pictures from slightly different angles. From what I have read online, it looks like it should have been 1/3 offset instead of 1/2 offset for 12" x 24" tiles (I never specified a pattern). The floor is 173" x 83".


    The subfloor is wood (second story bathroom). Hardie backer board was screwed into the wood. I wasn't given a breakdown of price for different things. The quote was $6,000 for demo and tiling of the shower and floor (labor only). I do not see any standards referenced in the contract.


    The flooring before was a different tile. I attached a picture I could find of it.


    In Texas, there is an Implied Warranty of Good Worksmanship, defined below:

    Implied Warranty of Good Workmanship: The Implied Warranty of Good Workmanship provides a warranty to the owner that the construction, repair or modification of existing property will be performed in a “good and workmanlike manner.” “Good and workmanlike” means the quality of work must be equal to the work performed by someone “who has the knowledge, training, or experience necessary for the successful practice of a trade or occupation” as judged by someone “capable of judging such work.”


    I am currently searching whether "good and workmanlike manner" means following national standards (ANSI). From what I have seen, "workmanlike" means that it will follow the standards.





  • 5 years ago

    How did he build out the shower floor? He used Hardie Backer for the base? What else did he use and how did he waterproof the whole magilla?

  • 5 years ago

    The floor has a grey, thick plastic membrane covering the floor and the seat, although I realized after that they didn't replace the grey membrane from the shower prior (re-used this membrane). This membrane comes probably 4" - 6" up the walls. I don't think (fairly certain) they never pulled this up, so I'm not sure what is underneath it.


    There is also a bed of mortar/cement/similar substance put down that slopes slightly down to the drain (shower floor). The walls of the shower are new Hardie Backer board that is screwed to the studs with taped and mudded seams (I think it was mudded with some thinset) and then painted with green AquaDefense.




  • 5 years ago

    I'm not seeing anything egregious. But then again that is really hard to see from photos. Did they flood-test the shower pan? Is there a slope on the bench? Is there a slope on the wall wall cubby?


    You can do a quick check with a leveller with a bubble. The slope is critical. The flood test is the BIGGEST test that is done with showers.

  • 5 years ago

    I was not home before they put in the mortar/cement bed, but I do not think they did. Is it possible to block off the drain and do one after the fact? Filling it, letting any water absorb into the mud/tile, and then filling it again a few hours later?


    There is a slope on the bench, but it doesn't seem like much, if any, on the bottom of the niche. The niche was a purple plastic niche purchased from a store and then cut into the wall and tiled over. There are lips around the plastic that go against (inside the shower) the hardieboard.


    Overall, I have already learned that I will need to micromanage any work that is being done on my house.

  • PRO
    5 years ago

    "Overall, I have already learned that I will need to micromanage any work that is being done on my house."


    No, you need to vet the contractors you hire more throughly. Any customer of mine who tries to micromanage my job will be given his deposit back.