I’m also randomly curious if there’s a ’night setting’ or red numbers on machine displays, to keep bright lights from disturbing anyone who’s sleeping nearby.

Might be best to buy an LG and slightly adjust the water level up. The Towels cycle on LG machines is fantastic, though! You likely won't miss all the water in the Sanitize or Allergiene cycle. Those both perform 3 rinses with higher water levels.

You can remove the Speed Queen FL from your short list. It does not have the capacity, internal water heater, Allergen cycle, nor water level you want. It is also quite noisy, so forget sleeping in an adjacent room while it is running unless one is a deep sleeper. All that aside, I am happy with ours. :-)

edited to add --- The HOT setting is whatever comes out of the tap and your water heater setting. SQ does not dumb down the HOT.

Miele and Bosch residential are all compact. Are younsure you need huge machines for a family of five? We use Miele W1 and are a family of 13.

You'd have to invest in a commercial front load washer.

Either hard mount (bolted to the floor) or soft mount (not bolted).

Pump drain or gravity drain.

Electrolux, Dexter, Speed Queen, Maytag, Wascomat, Continental etc.

I believe only a commercial washer would allow you to be able adjust the wash/rinse water levels and temperatures.

Miele residential upper models allow adusting the rinse water level and wash water level. Rinses are always cold.

After my SpeedQueen front loader imploded at 7 years, I bought an LG. As they come, the water level is insufficient, my wife complained that whites were not as white as before. I changed the water level - it's well documented how to on YT - first by one turn, then by 1-1/2" turns and now it is great. Whites are white again and it uses significantly more water than as standard. The LG comes with everything else you want.

Thank you everyone! I forgot to include that I’d like to avoid LG and Samsung based on:

1) personal use at friends and family (used different models at a few people over the past few years; they all barely washed with water and have chewed up clothing and made them look worn out because the clothing was slapping against each other with almost no water to agitate in. Also physical stains like mineral deodorant never washed out! They came out looking the same as when I had put them in. I had to wash those shirts by hand each time, which actually got the deo off. Same thing happened with minor stains)

2) spoke with a local appliance repair place that’s been in business for decades. I asked which brands come in the most for repair and he told me..LG and Samsung.

I’m waiting to hear if the landlord will even consider Miele, based on price, if not, is there a top-5 list of FL machines that are highly recommended overall? 🙏🏻

Your asking for performance, reliability, low price. You get to pick two under $1000-1200. If you want them all (as the best shot at them) then you have to pay. Just the way the world is now. It was a race to the bottom on price. Manufacturers either chased price or reliability/performance.

Where younare may determine hownmuch your landlord will contribute. If in a space constrained high rise environement, stacked miele/bosch with no vent requirement would be attractive.

If in a suburban/rural area most landlords want to spend as little as possible. You would be better served to buy what you like with your money and take it with you when you leave.

Ask yourself this: are you going to hate doing laundry if you dont have machines that meet your requirements? If yes, then buy what will make you happy. Laundry is a never ending chore. If you dont really care and just want something that washes and dries and costs you little to nothing, then go with what the landlord picks.

My father has rentals. He buys a cheap top loader and matching vented dryer. They are units he would NOT personally own. They work and two tenants were fine with them. The third bought their own compact laundry and put them in the bathroom instead of the basement. Whatever. Dad ran some bleach through the top loader and dried it out. It sat for a couple years and the next tenant used them.

Only you can decide what you will be happy with.

" ... because the clothing was slapping against each other ... "

That's how frontloaders are intended to function. The clothes are lifted and fall/slap against the surface of the drum, and also rub against each other to an extent, to shift out the soil and stains. Too much water causes the items to float instead of lift and slap, which reduces cleaning performance. The Delicate cycle (also Woolens and Silk and other such specialty cycles if the machine has them) purposely fills with more water to reduce the rubbing and slapping forces.

I once washed several lightweight curtain panels in a circa-2006 Whirlpool frontloader. I figured the Delicate cycle would be appropriate. The whole load didn't rollover even once throughout and wash and rinse periods, just floated and wiggled a bit in the pool of water. I found undissolved powdered detergent in the folds when done. I ran the load again on Normal, *much* better results with the lower water level, the items rolled repeatedly and no detergent residue.

@luna123456 Thanks. I clarified I was waiting to hear from landlord re his budget, so I’m not looking for the cheapest (I know that quality is paid for :) ). While I wait, I was hoping to narrow models down to a ‘top 5’ overall that people are happy with.

I enjoy doing laundry, even though it’s on the other side of our apartment complex and is a pain to walk to 3x per load (initial loading in, switching to dryer, taking out from dryer), in all weather, so anything inside the actual apartment will make it easier- but only if it doesn’t ruin our clothing (like previous LG, Samsung, and Whirlpool have). So yes, I’d love some perfect machines, but also realize that I may not get the machines I want because the landlord has to weigh in. My husband and I don’t have the budget to pay for Miele right now on our own, so while I wait for landlord, I’m hoping for other people to hopefully suggest options based on what I posted initially:)

@dadoes Point taken :) I think I saw you mention the curtains in another laundry thread, and I’ve definitely been keeping it in mind. However, we wash the usual towels, bedding, kids’ clothing etc. Things that need enough water to work with the surfactants in detergent to get dirt and sweat floating off :)

It appears that some people claim both washers and dishwashers don't work because they're using useless detergents in them. As CR writes:

"Our tests of dozens of laundry detergents show that there are real differences from one formula to the next—and that some detergents barely clean better than running a cycle with water alone." -- Laundry Detergent Buying Guide

In CR's tests, there was no relationship between water usage and washing machine performance (i.e., appliances that washed well didn't use more water).

I wouldn't trust consumer reports beyond anecdotal opinion.

I dont think think there will be a top five. what is your budget? If you know that then a recommendation at that budget could be made.

For compact laundry it is really just Miele then Bosch in the USA. There are others, but they will be outliers. Samsung, Electrolux, Whirlpool, LG all have compact laundry as well.

For full size laundry LG and Whirlpool (and all the brands made by them) have some of the lowest repair rates in yhe first year of ownership. There will be some compromises, but those are the best brands. Look for models that have onboard heaters, ”allergy” cycles which usually means an extra rinse or higher water rinse.

If possible try to buy from an independent reseller that has their own repair department. If buying an extended warranty try and buy it directly from the manufacturer. Miele sells 5 years of coverage. If any problems you contact the manufacturer. Third party warranties should only be bought from the reseller if they also are the company doing the service with their own in-house technicians.

A single service call usually pays for the entire cost of an extended warranty.

@wdccruise Washing performance and cleanliness is based on years of me using different machines and detergents (and speaking to chemists), while experimenting. Water-amount is definitely a huge, huge factor.

@luna123456 Budget is determined mostly by landlord, but a top-5 in different price brackets would rock :) (I know, that list probably doesn’t exist yet).

I haven’t had great experiences with LG and Samsung personally. I spoke with a local repair place who also said to stay away from them.

I don’t need compact in specific, as there’s a side room in the apartment that has ample width. I just can’t go further than 30” in depth.

More than enough water to thoroughly wash bedding, is my main concern.

Onboard heater is next.

I guess I should give up on washing big blankets in my own machine right now and leave that lowest on the list.

Thank you.

@Andrea I sgree with your approach to water Andrea. The only machine I hsve come across that give you the option of a deep wash are Speed Queen TOP LOAD MODELS. They have around 3.2 cu ft but this still allows for a lot more clothing per load than compact front loaders. As mentioned, you can use as much hot water in the wash cycle as you want without the machine controling the temp. The key to that is making sure the pipes to your washer can be flushed of cold water before starting the machine; similar to how many folks do before running their dishwasher. (you might check to see how far your water heater is from your laundry space). Speed Queen Top Loading models are rated at the top for reliability and no one beats their INCLUDED factory warranty. While I agree that Bosch and Miele front load models are great machines (they have 240 volt water heaters built in), they are not much bigger that a toaster oven inside and they often need to run much longer cycles than a top loader. Families go through clean clothes at a fast rate so you want to think of how many loads you would need to run to get it al done. Current Speed Queen top loaders are the closest thing you will find that comes close to the robust machines that your grandparents might have used. Best option for buying any appliance including laundry is a local retailer that can provide service as I find this a better long term approach vs. getting them from an online retailer. Hope this helps and good luck with whatever you select.

@HU-16168550092 Thank you for all that input! The landlord will only allow a front loader, and no top loaders. Otherwise the TL SQ sounds great!

Is there anything almost comparable to Miele in terms of onboard heater, and sufficient water depth- that has more room in the tub (other than LG/Samsung)?

Funny this is my second LG. The first being in the condo we sold after 6 years and now the one in my house that is almost 5 years old. None of the issues you're talking about.

Just for the record, there are other brands of toploaders that offer a deep fill option. The often-recommended Maytag (home "commercial") model MVWP575 that previously had choices of half-fill or full fill was recently redesigned to now have choices of Low, Medium, High, and Deep Fill -- model MVWP586GW. Here's a video review done by an independent appliance store.

@cpartist I WISH I had your experience :)

The Electrolux ELFW7637 ($1050 at Lowes)and LG WM4000 ($950 at Best Buy) have on-board water heaters but do not allow you to control the amount of water.

Although someone on the past forums here made a vague mention that SQ front loaders use more water than aversge (whatever that is) , I have nothing concrete to verify that even as someone who is a SQ fan. I do think there is a spec that most washers have that rates how much water they consume per load which is called a ”Water Factor”. Since you are limited to front load models, this could be highly relavent in finding a machine that uses more water than most. What is not clear to me is if this water factor is measured when running a Normal cycle or one such as Heavy Duty or Whitest Whites. These variables matter when trying to compare apples to apples..

Water and energy ratings are based on the designated Normal cycle (for both toploaders and frontloaders), so Normal is the most restrictive on temperature and water usage.

Our 15-month old SQ FF7 FL washer does not appear to use any more water for washes and rinses than our Miele W4842 did. in fact, the Miele had a higher fill for rinsing on the Perm Press cycle than other cycles, making it my favorite cycle for almost everything.

Miele is the only brand, outside of commercial, that offers a water plus option to increase wash and rinse water levels. Water plus requires the use of the Miele app to select it as an ”extra” for some cycles.

Max rinse level can also be enabled which always uses the maximum amount of water on rinses. This is great for big loads, towels, bedding, etc. Its questionable to bad for small loads. Small loads tend to have clothes floats and not be grabbed by the paddles during rinsing. You learn which options to use and when and it just becomes automatic.

For a stuffed full load of bath towels, its water plus enabled and extra rinse.

Bosch can be ”tricked” to add more water by turning the machine off and then back on during fill and it will add extra water. Not sure if they fixed this ”bug” in newer models, but my wife used it a lot when washing cloth diapers. This was on an older axxis model was24460uc. These older models had brushes in the motors and those only lasted 3-4k hours. I got sick of replacing brushes and then motors. Switched to Miele that used brushless motors and do NOT miss that task.

The very expensive ($2100+) Speed Queen FF7 has neither an internal water heater nor a way to increase the water level set by the appliance.

I have read the opposite, that LG has the fewest repair calls. Check out Yale Appliances blog. They have great info and reviews.

@Kendrah: "I have read the opposite, that LG has the fewest repair calls."

Based on its subscriber survey, LG front-load washers have the highest predicted reliability. But it really doesn't matter because the OP is unlikely to find any front load washer that meets her requirement to be able to increase the water level.

@wdccruise There are ways to adjust the inlet-valve on many machines, and raise water level. I was hoping to find a machine that didn’t require that

@luna123456 That was extremely helpful!! If we end up with either of those, thank you in advance!

I was disappointed to learn here that LG no longer has Water Plus, as it does on my 2009 machine. The level without it was so low that I programmed my custom load to always use this feature. Knowing the washer will not last forever and liking to be prepared, I browsed and found that some GE models have a Water Plus feature (not on all and not on all cycle choices). Here's a paste from an online manual:

"More Water (on some models) This option adds approximately 3 gallons to the wash and rinse portions of the cycle. If the option is selected before the cycle starts, the water will be added from the beginning of the wash cycle and later to the rinse. If the option is selected during the wash portion, more water will be added at this point and later to the rinse. Likewise, if the More Water option is selected after the wash portion has completed, the washer will add more water to the rinse only. If wash and rinse have completed, the More Water pad will no longer be active."

The GE GFW550 and PFW950 do allow more water to be added but their predicted reliability and owner satisfaction ratings based on CR surveys didn't allow either to be recommended.

And FYI, GE’s ( Haeir’s) laundry appliances are no longer made in the US anymore. Production was offshored (once again) to China.

@HU-16168550092: "GE’s ( Haeir’s) laundry appliances are no longer made in the US anymore."

So what?

I am hoping our 2017 SQ TL lasts for another 6 years or so. The prospects of trying to figure out what to replace it with look bleak. Our last LG FL had the Water plus feature which I used frequently. We have a a WH dedicated to the kitchen and LR, so I keep it set high, and I get very hot water when I need it. Buying a machine that does not use true tap would not be high on my list unless it indeed had an internal heater. I prefer a washer that will use enough water to wash and properly rinse without having to add several more rinses. And like Cavimum, I just don't want a washer that I have to use apps to control and get maximum use of. I wish there would be one manufacturer who would offer quality manufacture, capacity of 4.0 or greater, and use a sufficient amount of water. I believe in conserving our natural resources, so I want to be mindful of that, but I do want a washer which will do all I desire it to and not take an hour and a half to complete a cycle.

@HU-16168550092 That’s helpful to know; likely means the quality went down :/

Haier bought GE major appliances division in 2016. The large facility known as Appliance Park continues to operate in Louisville KY and assemble many of the brand's products. There are other facilities in Alabama, Georgia, South Carolina, and Tennessee. Some items are made in China and Mexico.

All American Made - Where Are GE Appliances Made?

"That’s helpful to know; likely means the quality went down"

The manufacturing location tells you nothing about the quality or reliability of an appliance...or most anything for that matter.

I think I've narrowed down my options to a handful of machines. All seem to have internal heaters (Electrolux, Maytag, Whirlpool) but while doing research, I haven’t been able to find the temperatures they heat up to. Any ideas where I can find this info listed- without having to wait on hold for ages when calling each company)?

..actually, do all Maytag, Electrolux and Whirlpool FL machines have their pump filters in inaccessible places?? Seems Whirlpool and Electrolux need to be pulled away from wall and back panel removed. Maytag needs top panel removed (forget it if you have a dryer stacked on top :( )

Access to the pump trap on a frontloader typically is from the front but that depends on where the pump and trap is positioned inside the machine. Models that don't have a trap-door to reach it require that the entire front panel (and usually also the control panel) of the machine be removed for access. The top panel must come off first to remove the front on all models as far as I'm aware, not specific to Maytag. There's one compact model on Electrolux's website that has a trap-door.

Some may have openings on the bottom through which the pump trap may be reachable but that can be a challenge for the obvious reasons. Some brands early in the re-introduction of frontloaders had a separately-removable toekick panel for access without removing the entire front but all the brands seemingly have revised to a one-piece front panel.

Speed Queen’s FL models have easy front access with just one small panel an two screws.

Miele drain and recirculatiom pump trap access is a front flip down door and simple hand screw cap. No tools required.