Thanks Patricia! Those are lovely spaces. I’m having a hard time figuring out where that would work in our space. Do you think the current proposed layout will work? I’m not sure we would like a galley kitchen as we really want seating for 2 in there. Thx!

Adding a future layout with added dimensions. Hope this helps! Additional dimensions are included on the 2 specific proposed layouts. But since the whole pantry/mudroom/ half bath are not in here yet, I just included main dimensions of the larger space . Hope that makes sense.

The harsh reality I see in the pics and drawings, is the house looks to be muddled from DIY design and probably DIY construction inside and with additions. The elephant is the original corner fireplace remaining as a huge feature to design around. I also see hints of things that could be problematic beyond design, but not enough info.

But realize, stating that is not to knock you down, but noted to become part of the remodel equation - whether to keep it muddled, or make the house make sense to what most people consider "making sense?" A complete rethinking, or moving partially toward something with caveats?

It seems that swapping the Kitchen and Dining can work here, but the fireplace still makes it muddled. I would try to scheme out how to incorporate it better with the swap (as a fireplace can make sense in a Dining Room). The Entry and the Master wing has little information, so I am not sure of opportunities there.

Either way, I would not focus on, say, the door style of a new Powder Room as in your other thread. That is the cart before the horse. Start at the big picture - the concept of the house, it's adjacencies, how you flow through it, and work your way towards the intricacies of each room.

I am going to address only what little red flags I see in your proposed plan, given what you describe for your living situation. I'm going to believe you about your DIY skills and cost slashing therein ;-) I don't have any problem with your fireplace. You have a groovy 70s build and it's going to show a little bit.

Dont' do an angled corner by the fridge if that's what I'm looking at- not very useful and looks dated.

Note that a midprice counter depth fridge is going to be deeper than 24" in almost every case- a quick perusal of Lowes' offerings shows actual depths around 29-32". So that you have plenty of room while using the fridge, I'd shorten your island on the fridge side by 6" (take it out of one of the 27" drawer stacks, possibly swapping it with the trash cabinet as that will make the trash a little easier to access instead of directly behind when you are working prep between sink and stove).

The 36" behind occupied seating is really too tight, even for a 2 person home. Again I'd shrink the island 6" to allow 42" in that passageway. You'll be able to slide past a seated person pretty easily then. Mock up the spacing with chairs and table by a wall if you're not persuaded.

In the pantry, do reconsider one or both pocket doors. They are slower and awkwarder to use than regular doors, you cannot put anything in/on the wall they are inside of (including shelf brackets) and it seems like they get left open 95% of the time anyway! I wonder if plain open doorways would be more practical.

It looks like you've put a lot of thought and personalization into your plans and they look pretty decent to me!

Thank you 3onthetree! Excellent points. And yes, the house is definitely unique and is desperately needing some cohesive style! I like unique and quirky but do want it to make sense. I would love feedback on how to do that. The entry needs work and that’s on the list for a future project… after kitchen/laundry. I guess my first priority is function. I just want to have a good functioning layout and flow. While working with what we’ve got, and making some big changes. We plan to do all of this in stages. Kitchen won’t happen for at least another year. But we want to start with laundry changes this winter and that means nailing down the overall layout. Hope that helps!
Also to mention, the master wing will only get a bathroom reno in future and some cosmetic updates. It was an addition around 1999 so is disjointed. This house has a crazy weird layout! Trying to improve it! Any other ideas? Any other questions I can answer? Or photos? Thanks!!

Thank you Julie! Really appreciate the feedback! I was thinking an angled shelving or something like this to leave enough room where the fireplace sticks out. Or a shallower cabinet. Or just something decorative on fridge panel.

Good point about pocket doors. They are awkwarder. (my new favorite word). I was thinking about a sliding barn door on the mudroom side. But we could consider no door but feel like it won’t be as pretty enough 🤪

And I’ll look into counter depth sizes and also see if we can recess a bit.

Re: the island, are you thinking make less than 36” deep? I was wondering if we could get custom cabinets less than 24” deep so we can still have the 12” overhang. Do you know? Or did you mean something else? Thanks again!

When you mention the master bath, I see the need for more space. And I see space in the open area between the bedroom and the garage. Since the primary was a addition, is there a basement under or what is the structure?

This project is certainly better for an architect or person with design talent to be able to be on site and produce an adequate as-built. A note about "muddled" - I don't think any reasonable person ever desires to have a muddled design. It only arrives there after beginning as "custom" touches, which are then implemented by people who don't know what they don't know. Muddleness cannot be masked by a style, like looking rustic or a long history of the house.

The reason I ask about the Entry and Master wing is all this inefficient space:

How does all this space play with the circulation? How does your proposed thoroughfare through the middle of the Dining Room (current Kitchen) work with this? How does the fireplace, which was surely within a former Living Room, stand as an isolated object within a circulation space? Is there any space here for a Dining table?

Other questions, like what is outside between the Master wing and Garage? How do guests arrive at the Porch and Entry with the angled Master wing? Where is the pool? Which way is North? What view is along the current Family Room, where is the driveway and garage orientation?

What knowing some of the questions above leads to, is conceptual creativity without being handcuffed by the existing muddled plan, exploring what the house can give you, like:

You need a better brain trust. That means an actual architect. Not some software guy paid by the builder. Even if you DIY, that is going to be incredibly expensive, and end up awkward, with bad resale return. Put the effort and money into a different house, that is already bigger.

I don’t think there is anything wrong with DIY. My whole life my dad was redoing something in our home or loving us to a new home to redo it. We also did a major a major renovation without design support. We have now also been a part of building a new home, I won’t say we did it as we didn’t but now that I have worked with someone who has design expertise i can say it is the superior way to go, even if just for a consult or layout and flow ideas. I agree with above that those with design experience bring to the table things the average home owner may not have thought of and are worth considering. If I were the OP I would see if I could engage a designer for a space plan, consultation on how to improve flow, even just a list or very basic layout of ideas if that was all that was needed. Do all the work yourselves, it sounds like a passion project, but get the layout right.

I completely agree about some DIYers. The internet tells them how so they think they can. We are not those DIYers. We are experienced. My husband was an electrician and works in construction. And we do plan to seek professional advice. I, just starting here.
But thank you Old Time Restorer… I was feeling that!

But you guys have made me think about our space a little differently. So have 3 options now. Option 1 and 2 swap the kitchen and dining as I originally planned. Option 1 doesn’t require exterior and window changes. Option 2 does. But if worth it, we would consider. Option 3 is keeping kitchen and dining in current locations. We still aren’t sure we want that but am considering and would love thoughts on overall layouts/ floor plan including laundry, mud and bath. In all options, I removed the front powder room. That’s TBD but wanted to leave it open.
Thanks all!!

Option 3 makes far more sense to me. Come in Tue garage and through mudroom with groceries and kitchen is right there. Dining and living back to one another which is nice after a meal to move to a seating area.

Would you please indicate the load bearing walls on the "existing house" plan? Red marker would be good.

Thanks WestCoast! I’m seeing this might be a good option. I just had my heart and mind set on the kitchen being in the dining space.. so need to think through it. But that’s what’s so helpful posting here.
And Apple pie.. great question. We don’t know yet! We will work with a professional before we do anything! But for now I’m assuming we can make any of these work. If we need to add a large support beam or keep a post, we will do that.

The Office is still too big. For all the smaller accessory spaces, when you have progressed to the level of playing Tetris, what happens is you get something to fit and you feel success, but those wins distract you from the big picture. You're still in a tunnel of just Kitchen/Dining swap/no swap.

DIY construction is of no concern to design. It's the DIY designing - some get it and some don't (including commenters) - you see some that are successful or on the right path and needs a small push over the top, and some that either can't grasp or just don't care about design. It also depends on the type and complexity of their project. But the little window to the world for someone coming to Houzz to begin with, should mean they desire a better design, and there may be instances where they can get that outcome from the back-n-forth with commenters.

3onthetree: I get what you are saying. I will consult a designer. Also, my office is big but I love it! My view while I work… and the sunset views from our dining room too.

Offices can be huge. But it's the proportion and heirarchy of spaces that are successful in a good design, and here it is oversized compared to the Kitchen/Dining. The next occupant of your house might say "let's swap the Kitchen to here because there is so much space."

Yes I get your point! I just don’t think it would work as a kitchen. But let me think 🤔

Also we plan to stay in this house for a long time. If we survive our first winter 🤪

Any ideas of how to use the office for kitchen would be appreciated. The ceilings are quite different (btw current office and dining) and I think the current office is pretty removed from the living room… but am trying to think how it could work. Thx!

Of the 3 options you posted i would lean towards a modified version of #1. I just don’t think too many people want a dark kitchen area, and a formal DR that doesn’t get a ton of use (but would greatly benefit from the ambiance of that fireplace) feels like the best option to park there. I would focus your plan between the garage and kitchen space so that there’s more of a through-line, however. So to the left of your door servicing the garage, start with a bench/ coat hooks, then continue to have a reach-in pantry on that side, but a small hall separating it from perhaps a tall cabinet/ broom closet facing it, all in easy reach of the main kitchen area directly adjacent (I really don’t think you need access to the dining room from this mudroom area). I am also wondering whether it might make sense to sink your run of cabinets on the wall shared with the office into the office space itself (ie just borrow the width of your cabinet run from the office which hopefully wouldn’t interfere with the office’s bank of windows). This might be you a few more options relative to island size and/or additional storage.

Thanks Old Home Restorer! The problem with the current dining room is that the ceiling is all wood with tongue and groove with beams. So can’t really extend that space. But I have come up with another option. I will share shortly. Would love your thoughts on it!

You all have me rethinking things and consider how best to use the space. Thank you!
So, although I loooove the views from my office, and it makes me sad to think about giving that up.…it might make sense..
So I’ve drafted this option using my office space as the kitchen. It’s bigger, would have a wall of windows and great views. Plus when we re-do deck, we could build the deck to connect to the kitchen and swap some windows for a slider. We would need to change the back wall window to over the sink and higher, but we could do that.
And I think I’ve come up with a decent plan for the pantry, laundry, 1/2 bath and office while not changing any more windows and keeping plumbing on the garage/ outside wall for venting. I wanted the other back window in the laundry, not pantry, so hopefully this works.
I would love advice on if this option/layout is best. (And yes, i know the weirdest thing is still that middle fireplace but we’ll see about removing it.). But would love to get your thoughts on overall plan and if this is the best spot for the kitchen. Note red are windows. And re: walls, unless it’s solid gray, it’s open.
Thanks all!

I think this is the best of the bunch personally but I would take put the fall windows in the kitchen and add a big slider or door Thats allows you deck access from the cooking space

Yes I was thinking we could do that in future when we re-do deck. Thx! Does the layout overall makes sense? It’s not a huge pantry or laundry but I think both are big enough for our needs.

Hi all! How about this option? I think I like it. Not sure anymore. Would love some critiques! Please and thank you :)

I think it looks like a great option, and whichever route you take will be a massive improvement. But…. I’m still stuck in the past with Option 1, and grieving the loss of that fireplace’s utility. I can appreciate the benefits of a larger kitchen (and the bright, view-filled kitchen/dining combo), but there’s just something about your original plans for kitchen/dining placement that feels tighter to me (ie less sprawling) and prevents that entry/fireplace/ circulation area from feeling awkward or warren-like, if that makes sense.

So if there’s any part of you that I still open to Option 1 schema, here’s a slightly modified version of it that I edited with my thumb on my iPhone. What I like about this variation is that it gives you great views of the backyard (thru the kitchen) the moment you come in the garage, and it borrows from the office’s square footage to give a few more feet to your kitchen, laundry, and ability to have a full 5 x8 bath if desired. The laundry seems big enough to potentially do multipurpose (maybe laundry and office?) if desired in the event you wanted to use the office as a den.

I guess I’m stuck on the prospect of dining next to a fire! Going further on a tangent here, am also wondering if you could create a little courtyard off the dining room with ‘green walls’ (plants growing up trellises) to improve the view with French doors to access the space from the DR….

Thanks! That could work except for pushing out the kitchen due to the ceiling. See attached. But I’ll map out something similar with the same kitchen footprint. And I love the courtyard idea but unfortunately it’s raised up a bit and has a AC unit there. But at least there’s a window. Thx!

Forgot to attach photo… see ceiling in current dining room. Potentially kitchen in the above Old Time Restorer option. I just don’t think we can extend the kitchen unless we change the ceiling.

Here’s a new option per your suggestion Old Time Restorer. Thoughts anyone? Thanks!

I already gave my thoughts upthread - just want to say now, if you work at home in that office full time or nearly, and don't cook a ton, and you know wonderful windows in the office give you a great quality of life.... don't convert your office into a small windowless room in the middle of the house! Kind regards from one who needs green views to feel whole.

Thanks Julie! That is so true. I’ve been thinking that too. I plan to retire in 5 years so trying to think long term, but that’s a LOT of hours! So started to think that the room we use the least is the dining room, hence this latest option.

In the other versions, with the office moved, it would be small. But it does have a 5ft wide window. Plus another big window across the hall which is why I have the French doors which would be glass.

But yes, definitely thinking about where we spend our time. Thanks!! And what do you think of this latest layout? Any red flags or changes you’d suggest?

You’re probably right about the ceiling. And truth be told, that ceiling (plus the large windows) is a big part of why I love the idea of your kitchen being there— it will immediately give your new kitchen a ton of character in which to build from. And, even if you were to figure out a workaround in which to push the cabinet footprint into the office, it likely would make for a darker countertop space, and, assuming that’s a load-bearing wall, create a bunch of engineering headaches/ expense! You already know my bias but I think you’ve got a few great concepts to choose from!

Thank you Old Home Restorer! Yea I love that room. I just need to see how do-able it all is.
And I just realized I have been calling you the wrong name! No idea why other than just being tired. My apologies!

We’ve completed several first‑floor remodels in Washington with layouts very similar to what you’re planning — switching the kitchen and dining for better light, adding a mudroom/laundry, and incorporating a half bath. Your proposed layout makes sense: keeping the kitchen near the living space and windows will improve flow, and the walk‑through pantry from garage → mudroom → kitchen is a smart solution we’ve built before.

For budgeting in Washington State, here are typical ranges we see:

• Kitchen remodel (switching rooms, new cabinetry, appliances, finishes): $35,000–$60,000

• Laundry + mudroom with utility sink/dog wash + storage: $15,000–$30,000

• Half bath addition: $8,000–$15,000

• Wall demo and reconfiguration with engineering support: $10,000–$20,000

Smaller stages (like drywall, painting, or flooring) often fall in the $2,000–$10,000 range, so you can phase the work as planned. We’ve found that keeping the island seating tight for two works well, and placing trash at the end of the island is fine as long as prep space is near the sink.

Overall, your plan is solid — we’ve done it, and it works. The key is phasing: start with laundry/mudroom + bath, then move into the kitchen/dining swap. That way you spread costs and keep the home functional while remodeling.

Thank you so much Israel GC! Much appreciated. I also came up with this similar option but with counter height windows in the kitchen… so more usable kitchen space. We’re not sure we want to do that but we wanted to at least consider it. Any thoughts on this? Thanks!

Israel GC, thanks again for the cost estimates and your advice on staging. That’s exactly our plan! Especially since we’ll do most of it ourselves and it will be expensive. Thanks again!

Hi and happy holidays all!
Amy thoughts on these variations? Thanks!

I’m not sure if we can do the 3rd option here as we would need to remove a load bearing wall. I know it’s possible but may not be ideal for budget! But wanted to get thoughts. Thx!

There isn't enough information to get good advice. Options shown are mostly slight variations of each other. So it is at the point where professional drawings and a review of the existing property would be needed for someone to help arrive at an optimal design.

@3onthetree this thread is full of info. They are doing this DIY

DIY build has nothing to do with DIY design. There is not enough info as I have already commented on specifics, certainly not for a professional to design.

Interesting variations— I like the addition of a bench and carve-out of a pantry and closet space from the office. I like Option 3’s ideas for the kitchen/dining space in isolation, but taken as a whole I think your plan would feel a little chopped as you move through the main floor spaces (and I like the idea of semi-open views to the kitchen from the dining: entry area). Between Option 1 & 2, I’m partial to #1 but only because I would like seeing views to the backyard the moment I came into the house from the garage (one of my favorite features that I miss from our first home was being able to see through the house to the back door/ backyard upon entering the home).

Hopefully some other designers/ pros weigh in on your ideas and plans for execution here!

Whoops— should have said I’m partial to your #2 variation, not #1!

Thanks Old Home Restorer! I really appreciate your input! And do you think it’s ok to go around the corner to the pantry? And better to have range or fridge on the bottom wall in kitchen? Thanks!

Also, Old Home Restorer, I kinda like this variation too for the light. The new kitchen has floor to ceiling windows facing south so lots of great light and views! Thanks for thinking of that. Really helpful.

Re: kitchen— I know there are folks on this forum who eat, breathe, and sleep kitchen design— unfortunately I’m not one of them LOL! I know I personally wouldn’t be bothered by the pantry around the corner, esp considering it’ll be easy access when carrying groceries in from the garage, and directly adjacent to bench and counter space for unpacking groceries (i should maybe say here— we live in a 1928 home with a kitchen built for that era— so our small pantry cupboard is around a corner and down a step with overflow down in the basement).

I do have a couple of tiny suggestions re: Variation #2, however. Although angled walls sometimes read “peak 1980s” (and may complicate your DIYing), I’d consider using one for your pantry/office wall. Reason: I think it will make the office space feel more intentional, whereas having floor to ceiling windows around a hard corner illuminating a closet nook may look like an afterthought. I also don’t think this would lose much in the way of functionality for your pantry space (which I’d also try and incorporate a pocket door if possible). And in the event you decide to convert the office to a den or bedroom down the line, you’ll also have some more usable wall space for a TV or dresser.

Random thought that just occurred to me— thinking about the possibility of using the office as a bedroom someday (whether for aging in place, guest bedroom, or future resale)— you may want to consider a variation that swaps the bathroom and laundry areas. This would allow for the bedroom & bath space to function as a main floor primary suite if & when desired.

Thanks Old Home Restorer! Appreciate the ideas!
Thanks for the ideas re: pantry wall. Although great idea, unfortunately I don’t think I can switch the bath and laundry bc of the window along that wall. It would make a really big bathroom that’s not needed. We already have a first floor primary suite. But I’ll play with it. Thanks!!