How often do you DIY/hire a professional?

12 years ago

Where do you draw the line from having it become a DIY project or needing to hire a professional? Yes, it depends on each project, but everyone has a different point where they need the extra help.

Share your stories with us and let us know about your last project. Did you hire a professional or did you DIY? What about your next project?

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PRO

Leo Dowell Designs

12 years ago

last modified: 12 years ago

OK I am sure I will ruffle some DIY people's feathers here. Most people do not have the experience or expertise to do what all of the trades provide, besides the exposer to products and installation methods necessary to end up with an award winning project.

Now there are some very talented people out there who can put together exactly what they want, but that is not the norm.

I have been in the luxury home design business for over 40 years now and I can tell you that it is still difficult at best even for me to pull hundreds of different products together and make sure the Architectect, Builder, Landscaper, Cabinet Maker, Roofer, Electrician, Tile Installer, Stone Mason, Plumber, Trim Carpenter, Painter and many many others work together to pull off the dream.
I am usually contracted only after the home owner or several other professionals have not been able to pull all of these parts together.

I am working on a residential project right now, where the home owner was their own general contractor. They beleived they could save a ton of money by ordering all of their materials themselfs and hire the subcontractors. Here is a little of what happened. First they located a stone supplier in Miami who convinced them he could order Mexican Carved Limestone and save them money. $60,000 latter the stone was fabricated but still sitting in Mexico. The distributor was no where to be found and the stone quarry had never been paid! Since I order stone on a regular basis I was able to track it down and get the true story. Yes they lost the money!

Next they hired a custom cabinet maker who assured them he was more than capable of supplying their elaborately detailed cabinets. One year after receiving his requested deposits, he informed the client he was going out of business, and he had spent their money, another $50,000. Yes they lost their money!

Now you might say these people have more money than good sense, but I see this same thing happen on some level every day. Everyone is an expert these days, just ask them! When you start a project you will be told no problem, no problem. When it does't start to turn out right, you will be told it can't be done the way you wanted it to be. There are a thousand things that can go wrong on a project from the size of a grout joint to floor material thickness not being taken into consideration when designing the house.

Part of the problem these days is everyone only specializes in their on own area of exspertise. But the consumer thinks everyone will visualize all of the parts for the total concept. NO THEY WILL NOT! To state the obvious most (not all) are only interested in selling you what they sell with out requard to any of the other parts. Why you ask? Because it is easier, less work, less responsibility, faster. I am not telling you anything you don't all ready know.

It is my exsperience that the you need a second set of experienced eyes who understands the level of details you think you are going to get, and knows how to make it happen. How someone could pull this off with no experience or even with a different level of experience, GOOD LUCK! This morning I started off correcting details on the job site with MY Tile Installer, next I went to MY cabinet maker to explain some more details and have a prayer meeting about the dead line, next stop by MY wrought iron fabricators to answer questions on a vintage style stair rail based on French Details.

We have a saying in the business, "you are what you have been exsposed to". I don't know what business you are in, but if someone told you they could take over your job tomorrow, what would you tell them? I don't repair my own car or fix a cavity, or do my own books, but I do know how to create every inch of a luxury house and how to deal with all of the problems that will come up. It's what I call "Putting Out Fires. We do all day every day.

I am just saying.............

Leo Dowell Interiors

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Comments (95)

User
12 years ago
I totally appreciate the range of responses here, from those that call in the pros as they are not able, capable, or willing to do much more than thumb paint chips.... to the seasoned high end professional used to dealing with the top end jobs.

I'm somewhere between being forced to do it myself; able to handle most of it (yet); and where I know I can't or it's not worth the what if it's not right; to call in the pros and eat ramen for a few months, as I outlined in earlier posts.
PRO
Leo Dowell Designs
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
I am not saying everyone needs to run out and hire a designer. But I have always told clients to buy a few nice pieces with a long term plan in mind so in the end it works. A few quality items are better than a house full of junk. Two of my reupholstry shops are now spending most of their time repairing new furniture where the payments haven even started yet! I will not name the furniture stores but you know who they are. The name if the game these days is just make it look good the buyer doesn't know the difference.
HGTV is not helping, it is misinformation, and misleading.

I was asked to preview a celebrities furniture line several years ago at the High Point Furniture Market in North Carolina. The showroom was a major furniture manufacturer. When I entered I asked so you are manufacturing this? They said well......No. It is made by a company in Vietnam and then we relable it. Then I asked so the TV celebrity is designing it right? They said well.........No. She has hired several furniture designers in New York to do that, she just signs off on it.
I said I am in the wrong business!

Buyer beware.
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vp82254
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
Leo, I, as an ardent DYIer, find your attitude a bit arrogant, self serving, and pompous. There aren't too many of us here that can afford to have an unlimited celebrity budget like your "clients". Many people are suffering during this current administration and can't afford to hire top of the line contractors, much less regular contractors and need to budget and cut cost whenever and where ever. It would be nice to hire help and not worry about the bottom line like your "clients" but we're all not that lucky and even if I did, your attitude would most certainly kill the job. lol
Suellen Valetta
12 years ago
We have a good friend who is a general contractor, so if we get stuck we have someone who will help us out.
Our new wood floors and master bath remodel were done by him with minor help from us.
diyher
12 years ago
you are right about the poor quality of furniture these days. Last good piece of furniture we bought was 1990. The only thing wrong with it was we had cats that scratched the heck out of both the couch and love seat. Having it reupholstered cost more than to replace another set for something like $1,500 at the time. That was about 1999/2000. We already had to replace that couch because it broke beyond repair, bought another set 2 years ago, forget what we paid then, already 1 year after we had it the material is worn more than a couch my Mom had for 30 years. With only 2 people in the house?? that's ridiculous.
If you pay 1-2 thousand for a piece of furniture, it should last minimum 10 years before any problems occur.
I did a search a few months back and saw all the name brands we all think are well known good furniture, all are coming out mass producing crap.
vp82254.. just an fyi, it's not the current administration that caused the financial crises, companies doing major layoffs started in 2007, my husband and I were a part of that within 6 months of each other :-/
earnedmygray
12 years ago
Some of the professionals' comments stated here are why I hesitate hiring them. They insult their clients.
sartarehare
12 years ago
I'm lucky that my son is an electrician who has done a little bit of everything or can refer me to somebody who can do what I need- on the side for less $$, and my husband does plan review so has access to architectural and building/materials advice everywhere he turns. And he's quite handy. So between the two, we usually only source out for things we really don't want to do (cost doesn't add up to time taken off work for project) or something we really can't do like cut a window into the side of the house. We also hire for finish work, drywall (who wants to do that?), flooring.
User
12 years ago
Well, Naomibook, you can speak with your pocketbook when hiring. If they rub you the wrong way enough, don't hire them.

If they have the quality I need and I can afford the price, I can live with it for the nonce; if I have to.

Though, that said, my budget doesn't always allow the luxury of me hiring out. Or bartering. Or whatever else needs doing.

That is the other side of the coin here at Houzz. this is networking on a scale rarely seen. And once posted, the internet never forgets. If you don't believe me, look up something called The Wayback Machine, it's not just off a cartoon.
smarterthandog
12 years ago
I tried to do some touchup brick pointing and it looked terrible! There are some skills that look easy, but require some artistry and experience.
sartarehare
12 years ago
I should always read ALL of the comments before posting so that I don't have to re-post, but Leo..... you deserve a re-post.
While I love Houzz, design is NOT rocket science. You're not contributing to the common good of society with design work. In fact, you appear to be propping yourself up with arrogant statements, which typically indicates some sort of personal or professional deficit in my line of work. Perhaps you should check yourself next time before you really give that firm you work for a bad rep.
User
12 years ago
Before you guys run him off, I'd love to see Leo's feedback on some dilemma discussions. Maybe give him a chance to help some of us that don't have his experience? Unlimited budgets can be as challenging as a shoestring budget. Limitations provide parameters which can often be very useful. We need to be learning from each other not ruffling respective feathers.
rinked
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
[grabs popcorn and reads on]
User
12 years ago
And then the next two after that.......
User
12 years ago
And the one that was posted while I reported the preious two.....
charleee
12 years ago
Me too
PRO
JudyG Designs
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
When we were first married, DH was a DIY’er. He did a pretty good job and I was always pleased with the results. Fast forward many years and he isn’t doing anything much, to speak of.

We are going to look at a house tomorrow and that could be the next project. We have been talking about downsizing and moving closer into town where we could walk to the village. The house has great potential (from the on-line pictures) and is in the area we would want to be. All renovation will be done by our builder and his team. My job will be the interior design.

Once DIY was fun and necessary. Now, not so much….and, it is like the 30 year warranty, we don’t have those years to work on it. : > )
diyher
12 years ago
fyi, crazyhumanlady's Facebook account was just as crazy :)
diyher
12 years ago
Judy, that is why I am doing as much as I can right now in my very late 50's. I don't know what life will be like in the 60's, but I'm sure climbing a ladder won't be the same as it was even 5 years ago :)
User
12 years ago
Amen! 10 years ago I could climb a ladder wear high heels. Now, no ladder and no heels! 'Nuff said!
sartarehare
12 years ago
No offense, rngp, but Leo isn't really offering advice. He hates DIY. He comes off as someone who isn't happy unless it's all done professionally. I wish I could relay some of my son's stories (electrician) working with "professionals" here on Houzz. The designer stories are the best. Anyhow, I only work with folks who come highly recommended, don't waste tons of my time and stick to what I am paying them for instead of vocalizing their every opinion (unless it is code/safety related).
User
12 years ago
None taken sartarehare...but I was hoping that Leo would get involved with the Houzzer community in a way that would be beneficial to all concerned. People often live up (or down) to what is expected of them. Leo's expertise would be beneficial to all on here and I think we might could be good for him as well.
rinked
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
Crazy who? Must have missed something.. Or not. All these emotions flying around here. Off to bed for me, have to DIY (no, do it myself) tomorrow.
printesa
12 years ago
Nothing is impossible, but the problem is that there are only 24 hours in a day. So, with that in mind, if a project would take too long to finish, then we hire someone to do it.
diyher
12 years ago
printesa :) my kitchen is taking 3 years as money allows lol sometimes you do what you have to do when the big bucks aren't coming in like they use to in the corporate world.

As for Leo, he is dealing with different clientele, so we have to keep that in mind. He wouldn't hire someone to do work for his client that has only been in the business for 1-2 years.

Here is what Leo posted (I am not saying everyone needs to run out and hire a designer. But I have always told clients to buy a few nice pieces with a long term plan in mind so in the end it works. A few quality items are better than a house full of junk. )

He is right about getting a few quality pieces instead of a house full of junk. I've learned to be patient and buy something with more quality up to what I can at least afford by saving, rather than wasting money on cheap things just to have it this week. Cheap things in reality are more expensive if you have to keep replacing them.
printesa
12 years ago
diyher, I know what you mean. My husband picked up the hobby of woodworking. It took 2 years to finish a bench:) He could have made it in a weekend, but since we both work full time, well,,the problem with the 24 hours in a day always shows up:) The kitchen that we have is fine, but I want at some point to change it (it's too traditional for me, but the budget and time has to be considered, so we'll wait).
As for buying furniture, I totally agree. We've been in this house for 7 years. I can say that we bought almost all the furniture we need (we had nothing when we moved in,,just a mattress). Slowly, we bought furniture. Each piece was pretty pricey, but like the Italians say, I'm too poor to afford a cheap pair of shoes:)
Marilyn Wilkie
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
We have DIY'd just about everything for the last 33 years. We did hire a carpenter for our 2010 kitchen to install a skylight and some other things. My husband is one of those Jack of all trades that learned a lot from his father and through the years by doing things. He is a stickler for doing things right and is confident, even with electrical work, tiling, drywall and plumbing. Our income is not tremendous and part of doing things ourselves has been based on that. We haven't minded spending vacations working on projects together. But now we are both over 65 and tire out more easily. We recently hired someone to sand and refinish all of our hardwood floors and paint the interior of our latest house. I'm glad we did.
PRO
Connie Elaine's Draperies
12 years ago
As I read through the comments in this discussion, I see so very much self-pride exhibited in individual projects and accomplishments. I also see recognition of individual limitations in regard to skill, time, or desire. We may consider ourselves DIY, but we are also professionals and masters working with other professionals and masters to accomplish our visions. That is when we hire (and converse with) other professionals. For those of you who have been doing your own projects for up to 33 years--you are masters. Several of us mentioned age as a reason not to do so much ourselves. Please recognize the knowledge you have to offer so many others who are involved with their projects, but lack the learning and mistakes and setbacks that many of the rest of us have experienced.

We have all heard that 10,000 hours does a master make. I think Robert Green, the author of Mastery, makes better sense when he writes, "People who are engaged with the subject of their field can learn more in three years than those who are going through the motions can learn in ten."

I am rambling now. In a nutshell, keep up the great comments!
PRO
Leo Dowell Designs
12 years ago
Ryan thanks for you comments. I come from a family who always worked very hard to have what they had. They were do it yourselfers, they had to be. Coming from that background is what got me into the business. I come from an appreciation of the worker, because I don't think anyone is any better than anyone else, no matter how much money you have. For several years I stopped telling my stories about the rich and famous, because nobody was interested. And it seems more and more these days the people who are struggling to make ends meet blame the people who have figured out a way to have more.
My wife always tells me I should think twice before I say anything. I tell her if I do that, I will forget what I was going to say, LOL. If some people here think I am telling my stories because I hate DIYS, they are mistaken and don't know me. I choose to comment to you guys just because you understand the value of the person who actually does the work. I have learned everything I know form working in the field with workers sharing information with each other.
PRO
Leo Dowell Designs
12 years ago
MGP thanks for your words also. You hit the nail on the head in your first comment. People use to just talk to each other and share their experiences. They didn't turn against you for telling a story. They just talked.
PRO
Leo Dowell Designs
12 years ago
Diyher Thank you for reposting what I said. I would be happy to offer some design suggestions to people if I can share something to help.
Ryan Fitzgerald
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
Leo, I'd love to read your inputs on design, as you are obviously well experienced. I didn't mean to attack you in my previous post, and hope it didn't come across that way... I just meant I didn't think your stories weren't benefiting the conversation at the time...
Thank you for your change in tone, and we definitely are in agreement on the furniture front. :) As far as celebrity endorsements go- I have actually learned to try to avoid them. It seems when it comes to boots, kitchenware, furniture, just about anything.. celebrities are not pitching you the good, solid products, they're just slapping a pretty veneer on something that will help line their pockets. Chances are we have different tastes on style, but you don't always need to spend a lot to buy something that's made out of solid hardwood. :)
Edit: I'm not calling all celebrity endorsements junk.. I'm sure there are good ones out there. Just in my experience, I have usually been able to find better options for my needs.
PRO
Leo Dowell Designs
12 years ago
Sartre...what can I say to change your mind? The common good of society, that is a deep one. I have spent a lot of time thinking about that in the past years. What we end up doing while we are on this planet is not always in our control, but for whatever reason, we end up doing what we do. I have never pretended to be something I am not so my contribution to society I realize will not much difference one way or another when God takes me. But our homes are where our memories are made. Figuring out life's problems with your Mom or Dad in the kitchen, sitting on the front porch with a family member, first kiss, teaching your kids to cook, this is who we are. Our surroundings are one of life's rewards for our work while we are here of course along with our families and health. I do think the world would be a better place if our world leaders would meet in a kitchen somewhere instead of those ivory towers. But that's just me.
I do think that we were out here to touch other peoples life's . We control how we make them feel.
PRO
M Squared Builders and Remodelers
12 years ago
I think it's sad that so many people think that doing house hold projects are easy and anyone can do. Then you try and do it yourself and realize that you were completely wrong and settle for a sub par outcome. There are many excellent contractors out there who are willing to go above and beyond for homeowners willing to pay for it.
Pulling a tooth out is easy but would you try it yourself?? Of course not. What a lot of people don't realize either is that it is illegal for you to do most household projects without the proper license and insurance. Please do us all a favor and hire a professional next time!!
adamcarlos
12 years ago
That's depend on complexity of the task, I had tried my hand in painting, refacing. But for installing countertops, flooring and similar stuff prefer professional help.
User
12 years ago
Leo, I am so happy you responded and have shown more of who you are as a person and a designer. Please check the "advice" discussions and contribute as much as your time allows.

My home would most certainly make you and most Houzzers cringe a bit because I tend not to follow the rules. I know most of them but a lot of them bore me so I frequently bend them to the point of breaking. But, as you say, it's where I live, laugh, cry and love. Even my mistakes make me laugh and that's a good thing.

If you don't mind, I will "follow" you so that I can glean as much wisdom as possible from what I expect will be invaluable input. Thank you for adding your voice to this wonderful conversation called "Houzz."
User
12 years ago
Oh dear, no "follow" button. Oh well, I will continue to check periodically so that I can learn more about a subject I love.
santoslhauper
12 years ago
xmerk44x, I find that there are few, rather than many, excellent contractors. I also don't think that quality should be hostage to price. In the past, I've worked in the countertop business and cabinetmaking/kitchen remodeling business. While it is true that it is not 'easy', it is also not building rocketships. And I worked for companies that did quality work (and one that didn't) and they didn't charge an arm and a leg. It simply wasn't that much harder to do a good job than a crappy job.

Quality is an attitude, not a skill learned over repetition. Speed is what you get with practice.

Once someone's skill and experience allow them to do the quality work the first time, without too many delays they are certainly a better drywall guy (or whatever) than I am. I appreciate another person's talent and skill (assuming it is greater than mine, which is no longer a safe assumption these days). There is no doubt Leo Dowell is a better interior designer than I am. I'm not competing with him or equating my design skills with his when I choose to do my own work.

As for licensing, you will find many times that a licensed electrician for ex. is the owner of the business, not necessarily the electrician actually doing the job. The licensed person checks off on the work most of the time, but not always. For electrical work, I research code, maybe consult a licensed electrician, and then have him check the job.
PRO
Drummond House Plans
12 years ago
I am also a designer and I call pros for everything but design. With 3 children, a dog and busy life, I don't have time for DIY projects. I am good at what I know (design), but for the rest, it is more profitable for my wallet and quality of life to leave it to the pros!
sartarehare
12 years ago
Okay Leo, truce. Perhaps this is just one of those times when the written word can be misinterpreted easily. I agree that your experience is a great addition to the Houzz community. I also certainly feel (like many responders) that most people bite off more than they can chew and realize too late. I learned that in my first home. We ended up needing to pay for re-work after many DIY didn't work out. We were strapped for cash and thought we could do it. But we've had many years to learn what we can and cannot do and fortunately have many resources at this point that we didn't have before.
I am reminded of a time in my first home where we decided to strip the paint from our 1920s brick fireplace. There's no way the cost to hire out for that would have ever been worth all that labor. We got it done (years of paint layer) and it ended up being the focal point of the living room and something we were quite proud of (everybody said it couldn't be done without sandblasting). But my husband said he would NEVER do it again.
PRO
Leo Dowell Designs
12 years ago
Thank you sartarehare, Truce. I agree, sometimes the written word is missing the real intentions and you can read all kinds of things into them. Especially the way I express my thoughts, LOL. When I talk about projects with big budgets, believe it or not I only mention it because it usually is unbelievable to most people that even the rich can loose a lot of money on their projects too. There are many many mistakes that can add up during the construction process. And most if them are hidden or the consumer is not even made aware if them. It is rewarding for me personally to share some of what I have learned the hard way. Not to show off how great I am, but just because I care about the end results.

Your Loyal Servant
Leo
unruli
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
80% or more of what we've done in this house is DIY and most was done by myself as my husand is not the handy type. Putting in a structural beam for a Long section of load- bearing wall that was improperly supported by a previous owner (three 2x6s is not going to hold up a 24' span for long) and upgrading service to 200 amp is not in my skill set.

We're now on a short time frame to get this house on the market so we hired a GC with good references to cover some items that could be more quickly completed by a pro. Mistake. We actually fired the drywall guy.....the work was awful and INCREDIBLY slow (2 doorways took eight days, but of course he never arrived before noon and never worked past 3). My drywall skills are adequate, but the amount of repairs I had to do on this guys work was astounding.

Now we're in a situation where an ice dam we've been fighting this entire Michigan winter is melting in the warm-up and we have major, major water damage to a large section of the front of the house. I don't have the time in our schedule to deal with is and I'm worried about hiring anyone with the experiences we've had.
Mark
12 years ago
last modified: 12 years ago
Any electrical work or plumbing we hire professionals to do the work.

A lot of the mill work in our home I have installed myself. I have designed many architectural features in our home but are usually to time consuming for me to do myself so we have a professional carpenter follow my plans and then install the work.

Any painting that has to done in the home we do ourselves.

As far as flooring we will hire professionals to install that as well.

I can upholster so most items in our home are usually done by me, but the odd time we will get a professional to do certain pieces if I am not 100% certain that I can do it myself.

As far as drapes and pillows etc. we rarely find anything we like so we both can sew and usually do all our own accessories like that. In fact we have been looking for a leopard print that would suit the decor in our bedroom but we couldn't find anything, but just the other day my better half found a pullover top done in a soft gold and off white leopard print that is going to be perfect for the room. The only other time we hired a professional to make a pillow for us was when we had Edmond ( he use to sew for Candice Olson on Devine Design ) makes a pillow for a keepsake. This is the pillow.

PIC_7806_crop.jpg · More Info
jacksonbeth
12 years ago
We only work with local electricians here in Pinellas or Hillsborough, so finding someone in your area is key. For example, we only use http://www.hoffmanelectrical.com . Once you find an electrician you can trust, you will have an electrician for life!
PRO
Clear Lighting and Electrical Design
12 years ago
“If you think it is expensive to hire a professional to do the job, Wait until you hire an amateur.”

-Red Adair
PRO
Itrimit
11 years ago
There are things you know,things you know you don't know and things you don't even know you don't know. To somehow think you can duplicate the work of skilled tradesmen that take years to study their trade and the properties of the materials they work with by taking a 2 hour course at a box store is the height of arrogance and stupidity. The results I've seen have been something less than amateurish and actually devalued the residence but I guess it's as they say ignorance is bliss.
cabingirl13
11 years ago
Both of us work on elevators (installation- modernization- service- repair) so we know how to install or fix just about everything. Elevator constructors do the work that all the other trades do so we have years of "on the job experience". We do our own electric work and plenty more things. My husband also went through auto body school therefore he knows all about painting, metalworking etc. He has always been a DIYer as he very rarely trusts anyone to work on "his" stuff. We have done all sort of various DIY projects in our house and the hubby has completely transformed the polebarn (insulation, electrical, install gas heater, lighting, new windows). Thankfully we have the tools and knowledge to do the basic and most advanced jobs.

We have hired people to install carpet, pour concrete, re-roof the house, most of this was done simply because we don't have the time to do it ourselves.
User
11 years ago
My husband can / will do small wiring jobs (rerunning cable, etc) and is a great painter, and landscaper. But as we get older, he's letting a lot of the smaller jobs go to the contractor we found. I am totally DIYER challenged, but I make a great assistant!
User
11 years ago
I meant larger jobs! Brain no think...need coffee...
feathercd
10 years ago
I learned a good lesson when I remodeled my master bath, I drew up what I wanted, (I am happy with my design and the look of it) but I hired the wrong person to do the work, I've had to have many things redone. I didn't have the experience to know mistakes where being made. So when I wanted to remodel my kitchen, I went to a kitchen designer. I could not be happier with the results. I had selected tile and colors, she added design elements, relocated the door to the garage, giving me more working space . She helped me in selecting a contractor. Two of the best decisions I ever made. I would of had nice kitchen if I had done it, but with with the designer I have Wow kitchen. And most important a kitchen that works! Also a kitchen that had all the work done properly. I will always use professionals!
lsmatthys
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I only hire out when special equipment is needed. This is our current project:

http://lindamatthys.wixsite.com/home-improvement/

How often do you DIY/hire a professional?

Comments (95)

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